There’s clear evidence that Bernie actually won the Massachusetts primary,

[dixiegrrrrl]

which the corporate media and official vote count gave to Hillary. Analyst Richard Charnin has examined pre-election polls and post-election exit polls, both showing Bernie substantially ahead of Clinton prior to the voting. In a phenomenon we have seen elsewhere (most notably as George W. Bush “beat” John Kerry in New Mexico 2004), Bernie won all the precincts with hand-counted paper ballots but lost all the ones with electronic voting machines. Exit polls significantly “outside the statistical margin of error” are the international gold standard for determining election fraud. If the U.S. held the same standards as the European Union, the government would be conducting investigations for election fraud not only in the Massachusetts primary but also in the Missouri, Illinois, and Ohio primaries.

Despite the claim that Hillary Clinton “won” the Iowa and Nevada caucuses, there’s clear evidence Bernie was the rightful winner in both states.
In Iowa, Clinton’s “victory” apparently turned on six coin tosses, all of which she allegedly won.

In Arizona we saw a re-run of Ohio 2004, where left-leaning Democratic urban areas were stripped of precincts and short-changed on voting machines and back-up paper ballots, resulting in long lines and thousands of citizens being deprived of their vote. African-Americans in Cleveland, Columbus, Toledo, Dayton, and Cincinnati waited up to seven hours and more to vote in 2004, causing mass disenfranchisement that helped give Bush Ohio and a second term in the White House. In Arizona this year, thousands of citizens were also robbed of their vote due to the elimination of precincts, machine shortages, and the failure to provide back-up paper ballots. Many were handed provisional ballots which regularly are discarded and never counted.

According to investigative reporter Greg Palast, hundreds of thousands of potential voters are now being stripped from the registration rolls in key swing states, including Ohio. Palast, whose work is strictly non-partisan, broke the major stories in Florida 2000 showing Gov. Jeb Bush had disenfranchised tens of thousands of registered voters (in an election decided by 537 votes) using a computer program allegedly showing them to be ex-felons (they weren’t). This year Kansas secretary of state Kris Kobach, using a computer program called Interstate Crosscheck, is doing the dirty work. This program allegedly tracks down people who have voted twice (none actually have) and denies them their right to vote. Palast says the names indicate a heavily African-American and Hispanic constituency being disenfranchised, which would have a significant impact on the presidential race, but also on Congress, governorships, state legislatures and more.

http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/is_the_2016_election_already_being_stripped_and_flipped_20160404

[brooklynite]

1. Point out any State where Bernie Sanders challenged the results of a "stolen" election...

[MADem]

4. This is getting really sad. I've never seen anything quite like this. nt

[Bread and Circus]

59. Perhaps you weren't here in 2004?

[MADem]

75. 2004 was NOTHING like this. NOTHING.

Even 2008 with the PUMAs is nothing like this.

There are a lot of people here who just don't have the interests of the party at heart at all--they are, in essence, TOS violators. They think there is a critical mass of people who will go along with destroying our party--they're wrong.

Not cool.

[LuvLoogie]

80. And when they lose, they will go back to doing jack shit about anything.

Perpetual complainers with no interest in building consensus or even pushing a broom.

[Major Hogwash]

85. Yes it was.

You just don't remember it that way.

[MADem]

86. I liked Dean, and I liked Kerry. I was ready to vote for either.

People were not as rude, they didn't name call, they didn't resort to personal insult and invective like they're doing now.

[Major Hogwash]

88. Holy mackeral, you actually don't remember!

Or maybe you never knew --

How Dean's supporters were smeared here and called Deaniacs as if they were crazy, as they were ridiculed constantly until most of them were driven off of DU!!
And the ones who remained were purged just a little bit before the DNC took place that year.

That was epic history at DU, and there is no one that can claim that crapola didn't take place here.

Maybe you don't remember how Kerry's supporters were mocked and called Kerryokies, supposedly because they were viewed as only 'echoing' Kerry's positions on the Iraq War, among many other issues!!!

"They didn't resort to personal insult?"
Holy Moses, man, I have no idea what you were reading at the time, but it sure as the world wasn't what I was reading here at the DU back then!!

I quit posting here because of it.
I started my first account here clear back in late 2003, and by April of 2004, I had had enough of the asparagus casting that was taking place here on a daily basis, that I just walked off.

[MADem]

90. It was a KERFLUFFLE compared to the shit hitting the fan these days.

There were far fewer trolls back then than there are now--those accounts went dormant and sprang to life again eight years ago, and again during this campaign season, many of them. And I suspect many of those trolls made a few spares in case they got bagged.

There was less personal insult, we had moderators back then, and they stepped on shit that got out of line.

It's nothing like the mess we see here, today.

[Major Hogwash]

91. I don't know, my fan smelled pretty bad back then.

And a lot of well-meaning people were tossed off of the DU yacht during the Kerry cruise.
A lot more were thrown overboard after 2008 when Obama became President.

There was a lot of shit being said about other DU members here back then, moderators or no.
Surfing the net back in 2008 was like looking for a safe port to pull in to that didn't have racists posting all over it.

But, life is too short to complain about the situation for very long.
Once the stench gets too much, it's time to move to a new shithouse.

[CorkySt.Clair]

99. What's funny is so many Dean supporters

Can't stand the guy now.

I just love the fickleness of some. It's endlessly entertaining.

[revbones]

101. So it's feckless to not like it when someone sells out? Good to know. nt

[CorkySt.Clair]

102. ...

[revbones]

103. Nice! Way to really substantiate your claims. Kudos. nt

[jonestonesusa]

95. No interest as usual in addressing the content of the OP

That the differential between exit polling and vote totals is the international standard for triggering fraud investigation. Simple fact.

[MADem]

97. No interest--as usual--in indulging in fantasy conspiracy theories. nt

[jonestonesusa]

105. Welcome to American exceptionalism.

Voter fraud, suppression, influence buying and corruption do not happen here. Please respect our dismissal of the possibility of any fraud due to the fact that the desire for wealth and power simply doesn't affect our squeaky clean political process in the USA, especially not the Democratic Party.

Please ignore any news from the Arizona primary too, or from Kansas and Wisconsin vote suppression tactics, or any evidence suggesting that the Voting Rights Act is still needed. We are happy with our current, highly reliable processes. And, please don't read any history related to the presidential elections of 1876, 1896, 1960, 1972, 2000, or 2004, since the tinfoil hat society gets riled up about fraud when their small minds look back at those events.

I think I have captured your point of view accurately, no?

[MADem]

106. That would be "no." nt

[eridani]

93. You will in November if Clinton gets the nomination and in AZ and other states voter suppression--

--is still going on.

[Dem2]

27. I actually feel a little bit sick to my stomach when I read an O/P like this.

Nobody actually believes this sort of tin-foil-hat stuff, do they?

[brooklynite]

30. As I've said before, it boils down to a believe that no REAL Democrat would vote for Clinton

...so of course, she MUST be stealing the election if she's ahead.

[Dem2]

34. I have to assume I'm being mocked below

where a poster seems to repeat your theory as stated?

[ThePhilosopher04]

31. I 100% believe it.

Makes too much sense and jives with the enthusiasm and turnout for each campaign around the country. Hillary shouldn't be close to Bernie.

[Dem2]

33. Seems the 1st reply to my post nailed it

You're not joking. I feel even more sick. You can't possibly believe what you're saying.

[ThePhilosopher04]

92. I 100% believe what I'm saying. It is fact.

I know it happens and you know it happens. We live in a world of make believe, starting with so called "free and fair elections."

[CorkySt.Clair]

100. Don't feel sick

Just point and laugh. Best way to handle it.

[roguevalley]

40. its happened before, why not now?

[Dem2]

45. Is that a scientific argument?

Show me facts or chill out.

[roguevalley]

50. first of all, piss off. Secondly, check out Bush v Gore.

[Ferd Berfel]

67. Apparently some people either think the eVoting Machine hacks

magically went away (they didn't) or are too young to remember or just don't care.

The DNC never tried to fix those problems. Ever wonder why?

[Dem2]

71. So you got nothing

except an ad hominem attack, which I assume is a reaction to realizing you have zero evidence to back up your post.

[dixiegrrrrl]

41. Will this do?

https://pivotamerica.com/bernie-sanders-wins-nevada-caucus/

[Renew Deal]

48. He didn't challenge it. That's a state Bernie stole

So there's a load of hypocrisy in your response

[frylock]

63. Oh, please do enlighten us as to how Bernie "stole" NV.

[SoLeftIAmRight]

89. you are silly

...

[CalvinballPro]

2. This conspiracy obsession cheapens your side more than anyone else. nt

[MADem]

5. Between the conspiracies and the constant victimization, it's getting to be a bit absurd. nt

[CalvinballPro]

14. Sorry, but "absurd" is a word for delightful Britcoms. This behavior is pathological at this point.

I'm completely agreeing with you, really, but I thought that phrase up and thought it was too funny to pass by.

[MADem]

17. I was trying to be kind!

[Joob]

6. I think the better question is why does it always surround Hillary? nt

[geek tragedy]

9. because a lot of conspiracy loons are also Hillary Haters

Just like Obama draws the wrath of a lot of conspiracy loons

[Joob]

16. What's your take on Hillary receiving huge donations from lobbyist bundles?

Explain it for me please, maybe I'll have a change of heart and understand.

[geek tragedy]

20. do you understand what bundling is?

Oh, welcome (back) to DU.

[Viva_La_Revolution]

39. all of DU understood this was real, before the pod people moved in and stripped their memories

I wish i was joking

[mattclearing]

42. I remember.

When it was perceived to be a Rove/Republican thing, it was taken seriously, but now that it might be affecting primary hero worship, it's suddenly beyond the pale.

[dchill]

52. Yep. +1

[CalvinballPro]

61. They've taken over nearly every former liberal news site that has a comment section.

The biggest question now to me is, do we get them back once this primary is over and all these libertarians can stop pretending to be progressive, or have we lost our news sites to the trolls forever?

[noiretextatique]

46. Like Hillary blowing up at a Greenpeace activist?

In a deflection fail? I think Democtats should be concerned about fair elections, even if Hillary is the supposed favorite.

[CalvinballPro]

62. I think you should be concerned that you don't understand that participating in a democratic

election does not entitle you to a victory. You have to earn it by building the coalition with 51%, something your side repeatedly fails to do.

No participation trophies here, special snowflake.

[reformist2]

3. Election fraud doesn't happen in the US. No! In the Democratic Party??! NEVER!!!

[geek tragedy]

7. No, there are only conspiracy loons making shit up about Massachusetts.

http://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/election-2016/primary-forecast/massachusetts-democratic/

Clinton was ahead in the polls, and she won the state.

[Punkingal]

12. And Bernie was ahead in the exit polling election day .

[sabbat hunter]

18. no he wasn't

both pre primary day polling and exit polling showed HRC winning.

[Punkingal]

29. Here you go...

https://richardcharnin.wordpress.com/2016/03/02/ma-primary-unadjusted-exit-poll-indicates-bernie-won/

[Herman4747]

96. It's possible that some Hillary voters were...

..too deeply ashamed to tell an exit pollster that they voted for Hillary. So they refused to take part in polling, with the result being that Bernie wins the exit poll results.

[mythology]

69. Which doesn't cover early voting

But linking to an admitted conspiracy theory website as "proof" is silly.

[Politicalboi]

8. Time to stick fingers in ears

And sing LALALALALALALALALALA

Hillary doesn't care if she won under these circumstances. She even had her husband suppress the vote in Ma.

[Uncle Joe]

10. Kicked and recommended.

Thanks for the thread, dixiegrrrrl.

[dixiegrrrrl]

44. Wow..I am quite surprised by the comments which reject the idea of election fraud

even after all the news about it lately., esp. about Arizona denying so many voters by switching their party affiliation.

[noiretextatique]

47. It's really quite pathetic and telling

Probably from the same people who blame Nader and ignore the voter purge.

[Zorra]

98. I expected it.

"The DU right wing will do its best to convince you that vote manipulation through electronic voting is virtually impossible."

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=6403910

[dixiegrrrrl]

104. ahhhh....yes.....I had forgotten 'cause I usually do not post in Primaries area. n/t

[TheBlackAdder]

11. Let it go, Sanders did. It can't be healthy to harbor this, since there are no investigations.

.


The illusion of democracy, in America, is an institutional control mechanism to make the powerless feel they have power.


.

[geek tragedy]

13. there's also no evidence of any vote fraud in Massachusetts, and no need

for an investigation.

[TheBlackAdder]

19. HRC outplayed Sanders, with powerful help from the Kennedy's and last minute local campaigning.

.


If she lost MA, she would loose the entirety of New England, since RI and CT were wavering before the MA election.


My daughter is active in the Dems up there, as a neutral, visiting both campaigns and meeting both HRC & SBS.

She said it was a fair win.


.

[geek tragedy]

25. Yes, indeed, she crushed Obama there in 2008, and he had Kennedy's endorsement,

so it's not exactly a state where she's unpopular.

Bernie Sanders did very well to keep it that close, considering the strength she had shown there.

[noamnety]

51. How would a person even go about investigating this?

My understanding is there is no way to verify the vote. So what would an investigation actually consist of?

[geek tragedy]

55. a massive forensic investigation of every polling place in Massachusetts

with zero leads.

investigations do not occur unless there is somewhere to start, i.e. some reason to believe there was wrongdoing

[roguevalley]

43. let fraud go. That's how we got Bush

[TheBlackAdder]

53. Prove there was massive fraud in MA that would account for that much of a vote gap.

.


For this one, SBS lost. In other races, that's different.


.

[think]

15. Richard Charnin's blog for those who'd like more information on his conclusions:

MA Primary: Unadjusted Exit poll Indicates Bernie won

MAR
Richard Charnin
Mar.8, 2016 (updated for AAPOR link)

Late changes to the MA Democratic Primary exit poll indicate that the election was likely stolen. As always, the exit poll was adjusted to match the recorded vote.

Sanders led the Unadjusted MA Exit Poll Gender crosstab (1297 respondents) by 52.3-45.7%. The poll was captured from CNN at 8:01pm .

Clinton led the adjusted exit poll (1406 respondents) by 50.3-48.7%, a near-exact match to the 1.4% RECORDED vote margin. But her 50.3% share was IMPOSSIBLE. The proof is self-explanatory: How could Clinton gain 114 respondents and Sanders just 7 among the final 109 exit poll respondents?

Clinton won by 51-49% on electronic voting machines from ES&S, Diebold and Dominion. Sanders won 68 hand-counted precincts by 58-41%. He won 250 of 351 jurisdictions and had at least 58% in 110. ...

More:
https://richardcharnin.wordpress.com/2016/03/02/ma-primary-unadjusted-exit-poll-indicates-bernie-won/

[geek tragedy]

23. exit polls are reweighted to account for turnout in precincts.

raw exit poll numbers are almost always off.

This is basic stuff, except for charlatans like Charnin and the easily duped.

As far as paper ballots vs machines, correlation is not causation--higher population density districts tend to rely less on paper ballots and that is where Clinton does best.

[CalvinballPro]

24. Exit polling is optional, which means not every voter took part in it.

What matters more to some people is their vote. So if Bernie "led in exit polling" it just means his voters were more inclined to fill out a post-ballot survey than Clinton's.

[Tarc]

21. The "coin toss" meme was debunked quite awhile ago.

Coin-Toss Fact-Check: No, Coin Flips Did Not Win Iowa For Hillary Clinton

[dixiegrrrrl]

58. So Truth dig is in error then?

I had thought them a reliable source.
If not, tis good to know.

[jillan]

22. After Florida in 2000 & Ohio in 2004 - I will never ever trust the voting system in the USA.

Nothing is ever done other than forming a committee.

[brooklynite]

36. If it makes you feel better -- nobody in Ohio believes the voting machines were rigged in 2004

I know the Party Chair; I know elected officials and candidates; I know campaign managers. NONE of them say it happened.

[Deny and Shred]

54. Did you know Michael Connell or know Stephen Spoonamore?

Or anything at all about SmarTech?

[Major Hogwash]

64. Rigged? Hell, they weren't even available!!

I guess you didn't hear about the long lines of voters in predominately Black areas in Ohio trying to cast their votes where voting stations had limited voting booths?

[brooklynite]

74. Yes, that's exactly the point...

they kept stealing elections the old fashioned way; much easier than a conspiracy to rig voting machines involving hundreds of people who all manage to stay quiet.

[think]

79. That plane crashed a long time ago....

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/republican-it-guru-dies-in-plane-crash/

[Major Hogwash]

84. What do you mean? That wasn't the point of the OP at all.

You insisting that it has to be a conspiracy involving 100s of people who all manage to stay quiet is preposterous.

[felix_numinous]

26. Those that support corruption

and all their followers are outing themselves.

[geek tragedy]

28. those that believe conspiracy theories cooked up by charlatans also reveal themselves nt

[GoneFishin]

32. Two observations are all you need to know. 1) She will do anything to win. 2) She can't win without

cheating.

Of course she cheated.

She inexplicably jumped ahead by 20,000 votes during the very earliest 200,000 votes returned (a 10% lead), yet she couldn't increase her vote lead during the next 1,000,000 votes returned (stayed at a 0% lead). Shit like that doesn't happen in real life without some funny business being involved.

I would be curious to know when most of the returns from the electronic voting machines were released.

[KingFlorez]

37. Sure

[Babel_17]

38. K&R

Worth looking at, we can't afford for there to be any doubts.

[Live and Learn]

49. K&R nt

[MFM008]

56. yeah

Sanders has won every single state, all of them. All 50 states. HRC votes dont count. Every state was stolen.
Funny thing, people of color dont seem to like him, at all.

[Scuba]

57. The page must have been ...

911*** RAPID RESPONSE Strategy = Ridicule

[AzDar]

60. The Voters of Arizona know this to be true... Anyone who scoffs @ Election Fraud is disgraceful...

[Agschmid]

65. Total conspiracy theory, let's stop pushing these.

[dixiegrrrrl]

66. Tell it to Truthdig. n/t

[Agschmid]

70. I'd prefer to tell the person who thought this conspiracy theory was worth an OP.

[smiley]

68. k&r

[amborin]

72. i'll never forget driving home from GOTV in Las Vegas w/ some friends; exit polls had us elated;

then the ghastly outcome

[sadoldgirl]

73. It will become quite clear in the GE,

when after HRC lost the same deniers here will
claim : ELECTION FRAUD !

Thus let us remember those who are poopooing it now.

[RandySF]

78. She will win MA.

[cantbeserious]

76. Absolutely Correct

eom

[RandySF]

77. Oh boy

With all this tin foil, I should bought aluminum mining stock.

[TNProfessor]

81. Bernie really won Tennessee by 50%!!!!!!!!!!

[Godhumor]

82. Two things wrong right off the bat

1) Coin flips had nothing to do with the Iowa victory, none at all. Any article claiming legitimacy can't continue that idiocy.

2) Richard Charnin and his "methods" are quite literally a joke in the political analysis field. He is, to be frank, mana to those who seek to see conspiracy, and that is it.

Honestly, this obsession with showing "Bernie would have won every single state except cheating!" is just silly.

[snooper2]

83. your source isn't very good, find a real journalist for backup

[snowy owl]

87. Corrupt elections - esp. re voting machines - will come to nothing.

And with every election, we will hear stories like yours. Because the establishment doesn't care. Those voting machines re-elect them over and over.

[Betty Karlson]

94. Bill, Debbie, and Saint Hillary: there is not enough shame in the world...

[Zira]

107. how many elections is she going to steal by voter suppression.

I worry about NY.

[dixiegrrrrl]

109. Thanks for that reminder.

I remember now, when that happened, and of the suspicions about the crash, that the story kept changing, and, like the DC Madam, Connell had told quite a few people he was afraid of what Cheney and Rove might do to him.
Thank god for Democracy Now transcripts.