The Pope is so popular around here in GDP.

[boston bean]

Never knew he had so many big fans here.

The leader of a religious institution that discriminates against women, LGBT, and helped shelter and protect child molesters.

Blech!

[cantbeserious]

1. As Deplorable As A War Hawk That Will Subjugate The 99% At The Request Of The 1%

eom

[Bread and Circus]

2. I like Pope Francis, I think he's awesome. Perfect, no... but there is a lot of good there.

[boston bean]

3. And there is a lot of bad there.

[Bread and Circus]

4. He's human. It is expected.

[dogman]

8. And all that occurred under his leadership and direction?

[boston bean]

11. Much of it is occuring under his direction.

[Armstead]

103. And if the Pope met with Clinton?..."He's a Saint!"

[think]

5. Hillary fans hate Pope Francis even as he champions the poor. We get it.

[boston bean]

6. And as he thwarts the rights of women and LGBT. We get it that Bernie fans don't give a shit about

that.

turn about is fair game.

[think]

19. You're the one mocking the pope. Keep it up. You've shown how low you Hillary supporters will go.

[boston bean]

25. I mocked the POPE! To the guillotine with me!

[think]

35. Bernie speaks on global poverty & you vent contempt. Hillary makes millions speaking to corrupt bank

and you cheer it on.

Goldman Sachs admitted to crimes of defrauding their customers. The CEO of GS personally held fundraisers for Hillary in 2007.

The company you keep speaks volumes about a person.

[boston bean]

37. I vent contempt for a good reason.

You might think it not so important. But I do. deal.

[think]

49. How about some contempt for Goldman Sachs and the banks that are violating the law with impunity?

OR is that a bridge too far?

[boston bean]

50. How about some from you?

Or is that a bridge too far?

[think]

56. This Pope isn't perfect on the issue of women's rights and LGBT issues but he's moved the church

to better positions on those issues. I don't expect to agree with the Pope on every issue nor does Bernie Sanders.

Bernie went there to discuss global poverty. And you choose to ignore the global poverty issue and dump on both the Pope and Bernie instead for other issues.

Overall this Pope has been much more progressive than his predecessor and has been bold in pushing progressive views.

Still the Pope isn't stealing from the American people like Goldman Sachs and then spending that money for speeches from Hillary.

Hillary prefers the money and has no regrets taking it from crooks.

[dsc]

79. No he hasn't

It is one thing to say you think his opinion on other issues deserves praise but quite another to tell us bull shit stories about him moving the church at all on these issues, he hasn't.

[think]

84. Pope Francis: Who am I to judge gay people?

Pope Francis: Who am I to judge gay people?

Pope Francis has said gay people should not be marginalised but integrated into society.

Speaking to reporters on a flight back from Brazil, he reaffirmed the Roman Catholic Church's position that homosexual acts were sinful, but homosexual orientation was not.

He was responding to questions about whether there was a "gay lobby" in the Vatican.

"If a person is gay and seeks God and has good will, who am I to judge?"

Read more:
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-23489702

Please find me any other Pope that has made such a statement.

[dsc]

88. that is his opinion not the church's which the church has made abundantly clear

they are still firing teachers who have the audacity to get married to same sex partners to cite but one example. He hasn't move the church at all and he could do so tomorrow. He could decide to be infallible and say gays shouldn't be fired for getting married but he hasn't.

[think]

89. You are correct. He hasn't done enough. But to say he hasn't made efforts to change the system

isn't true. He's getting a lot of flack for making the steps he's made by right wing Christian types.

Pope Francis agitates conservative U.S. Catholics

A senior American cardinal in the Vatican says that under this pope, the Roman Catholic Church is "a ship without a rudder'' and the faithful "are feeling a bit seasick.''

Philadelphia Archbishop Charles Chaput complains that a recent Vatican conference called by Pope Francis produced "confusion,'' adding, "Confusion is of the devil.''

A group of conservative lay Catholics say they felt "betrayed" by a preliminary report from the conference that proposed a more welcoming attitude toward gay men and lesbians....

Read more:
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2014/11/01/pope-francis-catholics-americans-culture/18263293/

[apcalc]

114. A pope that's more progressive

Is saying something.

But not much.

[Cassiopeia]

77. Did you feel this way about Hillary

prior to 2013 when she stood directly in the way of LGBT rights?

[boston bean]

81. Did you when Bernie did in the state of VT in 2006?

[Cassiopeia]

85. I know.

It's so hard to say you were ok with anti LGBT stances when your candidate was pushing them, especially when your bashing another for the same things your candidate spent decades giving speeches about.

[boston bean]

86. I was always for LGBT rights. I realize our dem politicians are all johnny come lately's.

[Cassiopeia]

145. I guess that's ok for all but one.

[boston bean]

146. One seeked out the POPE in 2016 for political purposes during an election.

[Cassiopeia]

147. Ah, continuing the thoroughly debunked bullshit lies.

It's what Hillary and her surrogates do.

[boston bean]

148. Per you maybe.

[beam me up scottie]

95. Bernie didn't stand in the way, he never opposed marriage equality.

He said it was too soon to try to pass legislation in Vermont and he was right, it would never have been successful. He never said lgbt people shouldn't be allowed to marry and be definitely didn't say "marriage is a sacred bond between a man and a woman".

Do not try to smear his record because you can't defend Hillary's. At least don't pretend to know about lgbt rights and then use a debunked talking point like that.

[boston bean]

96. Oh yes he did. You need to have some education on that. I'm not willing to educate you on it.

But you can google it.

[beam me up scottie]

98. I know it's not true and so do you, that's why you won't post a link.

Here, I'll save you the trouble, debunked:

You're welcome!

[boston bean]

100. It's a fact.

[beam me up scottie]

104. Yeah, saying that doesn't make it any more true, especially when that's all you have.

[boston bean]

113. That aint all I have. I'm just not your educator.

[beam me up scottie]

117. That is all you have, actually. You're obviously not anyone's educator, thankfully.

Because I said so isn't an argument. For someone who knows all about lgbt rights that's pretty sad.

And you didn't even watch the video.

[boston bean]

118. Thankfully, is right. It's hard to educate some who won't learn.

[beam me up scottie]

121. Said the person who refuses to watch the video and has no facts just an opinion..

[boston bean]

122. I refused to watch a video? Can you see my computer screen or something?

Or are you a clairvoyant?

[beam me up scottie]

125. I can tell time, the video is longer than the one minute it took you to respond. Try again.

[boston bean]

127. You said I refused to watch a video. How do you know that?

[beam me up scottie]

130. Did you watch it in one minute? No? Thanks! Have you watched it yet?

[boston bean]

133. How do you know whether I watched it or not? And then say I refused to watch it.

Is that your own personal video uploaded and you know my IP or something?

[beam me up scottie]

135. Because it takes longer than one minute and it debunkes your untruth.

No one in their right mind would watch it and still use that talking point, it would be ludicrous.

You're welcome!

[boston bean]

136. Is it your own video? Do you have control to know when it was viewed and by whom?

There is no other possibility.

[beam me up scottie]

138. That's what I thought, again...

[boston bean]

139. Here comes the graphics. I know I best someone when that's all they got.

have a good one!

[beam me up scottie]

140. Lol, you keep believing that, it's adorable.

[boston bean]

141. I am adorable.

[polly7]

151. No, not really.

[boston bean]

154. Love that post! Thanks for sharing! hahahahaha!

[Kentonio]

7. I'm far, FAR from a friend of the Catholic Church, but..

When they finally get a leader who focuses on the core tenets of Christianity of helping the poor and most needy, that's something that is worth supporting. If your position is that you have to vehemently oppose any group that doesn't 100% conform to your way of thinking, then you're just engaging in a pointless purity war that you will never ever win. That doesn't mean we should ever compromise on what is right, but it does mean we should engage people we disagree with and try and find familiar ground to move forward in a common direction.

[boston bean]

9. The core tenants of discriminating against women and LGBT... OK.

[Kentonio]

24. There are no core tenets discriminating against LGBT.

There are very long term interpretations of certain passages that are used to discriminate against LGBT but there's no core prohibition that I've ever seen. There are a lot more sections enshrining discrimination against women, but there are also a lot that were used to support slavery and we know how that turned out after public opinion moved substantially.

I say this as an atheist, and someone who frankly despises the history of the Catholic church by the way. Just painting the Catholics as an enemy is a very shortsighted strategy, and one that just makes Catholics more likely to cling to the old ways. The only viable strategy is to embrace what common ground we can and encourage them to interpret the bible more generously and kindly.

[boston bean]

26. I didn't say anything about individual catholics, did I?

good try though.

Meeting with the leader of that hate, is something that deserves to be discussed and opinions to be vented.

[Kentonio]

33. How you deal with the head of a religious organization..

Has huge implications for your relations with the members. You can't treat a man they consider gods representative on Earth with disdain and just expect them to still engage with you.

With previous popes I've thought a lot more like you do because they really have been very aligned to Catholic dogma, but Francis (although I don't and never will agree with him on a lot of things) at least signals an attempt to move the CC in a more human, gentle direction and if we don't applaud that effort then how exactly can we ever expect change?

There will never be a magic moment where it goes from what it is now to what we'd like it to be, that's always going to be a journey that takes time, so how can we not support them in starting that journey?

[boston bean]

34. OH YES I CAN! LOL

[Kentonio]

36. Well you can, but you'll just be doing the equivilent of banging your head repeatedly against a wall

And then complaining each time that it still hurts. Have fun.

[boston bean]

39. LOL, most of the regulars of the catholic church agree with me, not the fucking pope.

at least here in the USA.

[FlatBaroque]

10. Your preferred candidate is an ethically challenged corporate tool who

could not inspire a hungry monkey to eat a banana.

[boston bean]

12. And yours is a one who would buddy up with a guy who leads

the charge against women and LGBT.

[beam me up scottie]

42. Until recently your candidate led the charge against marriage equality.

So I think he and Hillary would have much more in common.

[nashville_brook]

15. that made me literally laugh out loud

so true.

[Hiraeth]

13. Ye, who is without sin, may cast the first stone. Rock on, bb.

[Buzz Clik]

30. Wait, what?

[Hiraeth]

144. .

[Gregorian]

14. At least Clinton isn't discriminating: she's willing to poison EVERYONE'S water.

[SidDithers]

16. ...

Sid

[boston bean]

22. +100

[panader0]

17. This is not so much about the Pope.

It's about all of the HRC crowd who said DEFINATELY that it would never happen.
HRC meets with Kissinger. Vacations with him too.

[redstateblues]

18. Great to see so many DUers get religion.

It's a far cry from all the disparaging remarks here on DU when the Pope was installed. Praise the Lord!

[beam me up scottie]

20. I could care less about the pope, but watching the perpetually poutraged get pwned?

Priceless.

[boston bean]

23. Owned by what? Disgust he and his supporters think this is something good and helpful?

[beam me up scottie]

31. Oh I'm loving this, trust me. Sneering and taunting us for a week,

when y'all didn't think Bernie would meet him you thought it would be fun and now that he actually did you've changed your tune. Now we're OUTRAGED by the pope!

Bravo!

[boston bean]

32. You love it your guy meets with such an individual, ok. And what tune did I change? I think your

memory may be failing, or your making something up.

[beam me up scottie]

38. My guy never agreed with him about the "marriage is a sacred bond" crock.

And he's not the one who recently said he'd be willing to compromise on abortion so I have nothing to be ashamed of.

Spare me the drama, I've been speaking out about the pope and the church for years, Bernie's meeting was never about women's and lgbt rights until just now.

How convenient that people finally found their long forgotten indignation.

[boston bean]

41. He says the POPE is a "beautiful man". Sorry, I'm not willing to over look

the really bad parts about his views, like you and Bernie.

[beam me up scottie]

43. And what did Hillary say about the Reagans? And when she sucked up to Rick Warren?

Like I said, spare me the strawmen and selective outrage, save it for someone else. I'm not buying what you're selling.

[boston bean]

45. My selective outrage??? LOFL! Look in a mirror.

[beam me up scottie]

47. Yes, where were you when Hillary praised Nancy? And went to Saddleback church?

Because I've been here all along speaking out against religious bigotry, mine isn't selective at all.

[boston bean]

48. umm, you aren't stalking me well enough, I suppose.

[beam me up scottie]

53. Don't flatter yourself. You're backing a candidate who agreed with the pope until recently.

Don't try to shame me by associating Bernie with the pope, it's not going to work.

[boston bean]

55. You keep on stating what it is I do here. What else am I to think.

Believe me I don't think any attention from you as a form of flattery.

[beam me up scottie]

59. Said the op with absolutely no trace of irony after smearing Bernie supporters.

Keep digging, this is hilarious.

[boston bean]

63. I smeared Bernie supporters. I made an observation.

A true observation, considering the push back I am receiving from MANY, including you, here.

[beam me up scottie]

67. LOL! You accuse us of something and when we object that proves our guilt?

Oh do go on...

[boston bean]

69. I objected to the support the POPE receives here. Some are willing to overlook

the really bad parts, in favor of some political strategy.

I like the pic of Tina Turner, that displays perfectly exactly what I am doing reading your posts and responding to them.

[beam me up scottie]

71. No you object to the support Bernie recieved for meeting him.

Like I said, selective and convenient.

Tina would love the drama.

[boston bean]

72. And you support it. I don't. I don't know why that seems to bother you so.

[beam me up scottie]

73. How do you know what I support? Prove your claim or admit you made it up.

This should be good, I'll wait.

[boston bean]

75. You seem to take great offense to my writings here.

People can read what you wrote just in this thread and make up their own mind. I don't need to prove anything. You have done so yourself.

[beam me up scottie]

76. Oooo! Pulled it out of your butt it is! Thanks for playing!

[boston bean]

78. I enjoyed it. Thank you for playin!

[beam me up scottie]

80. I'm sure it felt good!

[boston bean]

82. It felt fantastic!

[Bluenorthwest]

57. Hillary on Rick Warren/Ron and Nancy Reagan:

"It's another example of the way in which this church is not measured by numbers. Yes, the numbers are big, they're certainly impressive. But it's measured by your impact. It's measured by the meaning that you give to lives here within this complex and so far beyond its boundaries. And the commitment that you demonstrate both to our faith in God and to doing His work here on earth is exemplary and that is one of the many reasons that I wanted to be here today.

You know, Rick has helped so many people with his lessons for a 40-day spiritual journey. But he knows those 40 days are just the beginning. "
http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/ws/?pid=77080

" It may be hard for your viewers to remember how difficult it was for people to talk about HIV/AIDS back in the 1980s and because of both president and Mrs. Reagan — in particular Mrs. Reagan — we started a national conversation, when before nobody would talk about it, nobody wanted to do anything about it, and that too is something I really appreciate with her very effective low-key advocacy. It penetrated the public conscience and people began to say, hey, we have to do something about this too."

I could post the video, but you and all of her supporters are willfully overlooking both of those comments. And you know, Joe Biden was with Francis all over the US weeping and grinning and touting his faith. Hillary says she's the continuation of Obama/Biden. Her endorsers in Congress, such as Pelosi, fawned over Francis when he came to DC. All of them did, and DU fawned along with them.

Reagan was the villain of those times and the fact that Hillary wants to erase that history is unacceptable. Stop overlooking it.

[boston bean]

60. What have I overlooked. You better be prepared to provide some proof.

Cause you aint going to find me saying one kind thing about Rick Warren.

Yet, you continue on with this tactic.

[JTFrog]

101. +1 n/t

[redstateblues]

21. Watch the movie "Spotlight"

[DisgustipatedinCA]

27. It must really suck to support such a flawed character. The self-delusions and machinations

would eventually drive a person over the edge.

I'd rather be on the side that loses and be able to live with myself. But I'm a liberal, so I'm used to losing.

[BainsBane]

155. I see no high road here

Failure to consider the mountain of evidence that shows Bernie does not live up to his own claims may make it easy to live with yourself, but you do so at your own expense. The irony is you references "self-delusions and machinations" in the midst of an event where the candidate you suggest is so superior misrepresented his visit to the Vatican and his encounter with the Pope. So much so that the Pope was compelled to defend his own integrity against charges he was playing favorites in the elections of a sovereign nation.

If Bernie's actions with the Pope don't constitute a political machination, nothing does.

That and the fact the OP is eluding to a complete about face of the denunciations of the Pope and Catholics more generally that have been common on this site for years. Clearly many here have no problem taking positions diametrically opposed to those they did just a few months ago. And your response is to insult someone who makes that observation rather than considering the contradiction.

[Buzz Clik]

28. Bernie has blessed Francis and forgiven his sins.

[boston bean]

29. LOL!

[HooptieWagon]

40. Looks like 'Vaticangate' will be good for another week of twisted knickers,...

...poutrage, and butthurt. I'll be enjoying the meltdown. Stick around for the second act...The Indictment....mucho epicness to come.

[Bluenorthwest]

44. What DU have you been reading for the last year? I've been a large critic of Francis on DU while

the bulk of DU, including many of those currently grinding about Bernie meeting him, lauded him as a perfected being, the new leader of the Democrats. His visit to Congress, a place of politics, was celebrated on DU by most everyone, in DC Joe Biden was in tearful awe, Nancy Pelosi was breathless and Boehner was a river of tears over Francis. His visit to Philly was huge news on DU.

What's different today is that all the Hillary people who were making daily OP's about the glory of Francis are now acting like they despise Francis. Of course some of them have made an issue of Bernie not being able to 'relate to the faith community' as well.

So in the past, Francis had way more fans here. Because all of his fans from Hillary land are denying him three times today.

The posters who loved him so who today use him as a punching object in politics are fairly naff in my view.

[boston bean]

46. I LOVE THE POPE?? Get real. And I will voice my opinion, regardless of your

disingenuous framing of my views.

I aint responsible for all of DU, deal with that.

[Bluenorthwest]

65. Oh please, I did not say YOU I'm addressing the DU Hillary Camp, and there are specific persons but

I'm not going to call them out for you. Everyone here knows who they are. And everyone here can read that you are attempting to evade what I said to you by pulling his faked up prop out of the drama box. My words are clear as bells. No one said you were responsible. Jesus H Fuck.

[boston bean]

68. Jesus H Fuck is right. Your words, not mine.

The cognitive dissonance you have on display here is nothing less than fantastical and mystical all at the same time.

[Bluenorthwest]

70. Do you think making personal insults is a clever substitute for defending your position?

I think it's cheap, shoddy and mean spirited. Your OP is a bogus assertion, Francis has been wildly popular on DU and in the Party his entire tenure. He is less popular today because Hillary people are 'distancing themselves' from him, after having spent months lauding him as the savior of all things progressive.

But go head and insult me again. Jesus H Fuck.

[boston bean]

74. Insult you? wow! LOL

[beam me up scottie]

54. ^^^THAT RIGHT THERE^^^

[redstateblues]

61. And conversely, plenty of folks here on DU

Who fiercely spoke out against the Pope and the church are now lauding him as the Saviour of the planet because he allowed Bernie to use him as a political prop

[Bluenorthwest]

66. I have not seen that and you offer no examples so I don't belive you. Hillary folks say crazy stuff

So does Hillary:

[randome]

51. It's ridiculous on both sides, as is Sanders' claim to have seen a 'radiance' surrounding the Pope.

That's an example of Sanders pandering. Clinton does it, too, because, in case anyone hasn't been paying attention, they are both politicians.

DU has become an excellent study on unwarranted assumptions, herd mentality and boundless expectations. Neither Clinton nor Sanders will 'save us' and the Pope is still just an old man in a dress.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]I'm always right. When I'm wrong I admit it.
So then I'm right about being wrong.[/center][/font][hr]

[Kip Humphrey]

52. Hillarians throw Pope Francis under the bus! Yeah! Keep that up!

please.

[20score]

58. There's at least one contemptible person in this thread,

a truly horrible person. But it's not the Pope.

[BillZBubb]

62. Another prediction comes true: Hillbots will now attack the Catholic church!

That didn't take long. And it was an easy prediction.

[CorkySt.Clair]

64. Bernie or bust

All is forgiven if one likes Bernie.

[jmg257]

83. I think he's against corporate whoring too. So there is that. nt

[matt819]

87. Well done.

Condensing 2,000 years of policy, principles, religion, conflict, and more into just a dozen words or so.

Can't wait to see your thoughtful insights into world wars I and II, nuclear proliferation, the partition of the Indian subcontinent, the Renaissance, etc.

[cherokeeprogressive]

90. I TOTALLY understand the whiny butthurt posts this beautiful morning.

Whiny butthurt bullshit posts; They're what's for breakfast.

[boston bean]

91. Wow, you think speaking about women, LGBT rights and child molestation

is just whiny butthurting.. OK..

[cherokeeprogressive]

92. Alleve... Tylenol... Aspirin... whatever you normally take for aches and pains... take lots today.

[boston bean]

93. I don't need your prescriptions. I'm good, thanks.

[cherokeeprogressive]

94. Grit your teeth and deal with the pain then... but don't expect sympathy for the butthurt if

you refuse to do anything to alleviate that sting. I ain't impressed.

[boston bean]

97. I said I was butthurt. You said that, not me. Please at least try to follow along with your own

posting.

You are making a diagnosis and prescribing unnecessary drugs.

[cherokeeprogressive]

99. You don't need to say "butthurt". It's obvious even out here in the mountains of So. Cal.

So, yeah.

[boston bean]

102. I didn't say it, nor did I imply my butthurt.

LOL.

[cherokeeprogressive]

105. Keep it up. It's a pleasure to watch.

[boston bean]

106. What is a pleasure to watch. You playing doctor?

I don't find it pleasurable at all. Most probably won't either.

[cherokeeprogressive]

108. Diagnosis: butthurt. (gasp!)

I'm afraid it's terminal.

[boston bean]

109. Somethings terminal, that's for sure, but it aint my butt.

[cherokeeprogressive]

111. Here's something for you to fill out...

[boston bean]

116. Not relevant to me.

[cherokeeprogressive]

132. Here. I'mma let you have the last word. Just answer this post like a good butthurt person.

[boston bean]

134. Last word.

[beam me up scottie]

142. Well played! I'll have to remember that one!

[cherokeeprogressive]

143. The best part? She took the bait; hook, line, and sinker.

[apcalc]

107. Yup

[boston bean]

120. Justified.

[Armstead]

123. If so, fine.

No problem with actual intellectual and moral consistency.

[boston bean]

124. Then why don't you remove the intimation I may be a hypocrite.

[Armstead]

128. I just self-deleted the post. Happy?

I'm being honest.

[boston bean]

129. Yeah, I'm happy.

[Gomez163]

112. Just imagine if a bird landed on the Pope's podium. They'd make him a saint.

[basselope]

115. There ya go.. now you sound just like a republican.

[Gomez163]

119. I wonder if Bernie asked what the Pope did during the Dirty War

[apcalc]

126. Wake me up when the pope is a lesbian...

[polichick]

131. He's just marginally more acceptable than corporate "Dems."

[retrowire]

137. lol grow up.

Bernie with the Pope. Why so mad?

Honestly, what the catholic church has done is being repaired by Pope Francis. He's followed his faith much better and interpreted the scripture to benefit people more than it ever has before. Has the church done all those bad things? Yes. Has the church improved under Pope Francis? Yes.

Give credit where it's due. But I mean, since Bernie is now associated with the Pope, feel free to bash bash bash all you want. It says more about you than it does about others. XD

[LexVegas]

149. Bernie has so few positives in his campaign right now.

Let them have this one thing.

[Warren Stupidity]

150. What is amazing is the ginormous butt hurt

of Clinton campers over this. But do keep it up, when deep in a hole, dig deeper! Never surrender!

[TDale313]

152. Wow. Hillary supporters are really coming unhinged over this Vatican visit.

Not sure why they're losing their collective shit over this. It was a nice moment, he talked about things he's been talking about for years, had a quick exchange with the Pope. If they'd let it go, shrugged or rolled their eyes but basically ignored it? Would have been a half a day story. The backlash? It's why we're still talking about it. Seriously, get over it. No one not in the Hillary bubble is buying what you're selling.

[jillan]

153. The Pope just flew into Greece to rescue refugee children. Just because you do not agree with

everything a person does, does NOT mean you cannot also see the goodness they bring into with the world.

Stop being so small minded.