Given some of the anti Pope talk, let's extend the conversation on religion a bit...

[tk2kewl]

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2007/09/hillarys-prayer-hillary-clintons-religion-and-politics

Through all of her years in Washington, Clinton has been an active participant in conservative Bible study and prayer circles that are part of a secretive Capitol Hill group known as the Fellowship. Her collaborations with right-wingers such as Senator Sam Brownback (R-Kan.) and former Senator Rick Santorum (R-Pa.) grow in part from that connection. "A lot of evangelicals would see that as just cynical exploitation," says the Reverend Rob Schenck, a former leader of the militant anti-abortion group Operation Rescue who now ministers to decision makers in Washington. "I don't....there is a real good that is infected in people when they are around Jesus talk, and open Bibles, and prayer."

...

Unlikely partnerships have become a Clinton trademark. Some are symbolic, such as her support for a ban on flag burning with Senator Bob Bennett (R-Utah) and funding for research on the dangers of video games with Brownback and Santorum. But Clinton has also joined the gop on legislation that redefines social justice issues in terms of conservative morality, such as an anti-human-trafficking law that withheld funding from groups working on the sex trade if they didn't condemn prostitution in the proper terms. With Santorum, Clinton co-sponsored the Workplace Religious Freedom Act; she didn't back off even after Republican senators such as Pennsylvania's Arlen Specter pulled their names from the bill citing concerns that the measure would protect those refusing to perform key aspects of their jobs—say, pharmacists who won't fill birth control prescriptions, or police officers who won't guard abortion clinics.

Clinton has championed federal funding of faith-based social services, which she embraced years before George W. Bush did; Marci Hamilton, author of God vs. the Gavel, says that the Clintons' approach to faith-based initiatives "set the stage for Bush." Clinton has also long supported the Defense of Marriage Act, a measure that has become a purity test for any candidate wishing to avoid war with the Christian right.

[bkkyosemite]

1. If it looks like one and talks like one and joins like one..........well........

[tk2kewl]

2. there is only one candidate in the race that won't mix religion and government

Last edited Sat Apr 16, 2016, 08:47 PM - Edit history (1)

[Duppers]

3. And that is fact!

Hillary's involvement with "The Family" is also scary.

[tk2kewl]

4. her supporters ignore this while simultaneously attacking the Pope

talk about cognitive dissonance

[rhett o rick]

5. Their comments about the Pope visit are Jr Highish. nm

[nolawarlock]

6. The Vatican is a foreign nation ...

... will Bernie be seeking a tacit endorsement from Putin next?

[tk2kewl]

7. Good one! Who's raising campaign funds in foreign nations?

Clinton campaign taps ex-Goldman Sachs partner for Asian fundraisers
https://www.rt.com/usa/339324-hillary-clinton-foreign-fundraisers/

[nolawarlock]

13. I don't agree with that either. n/t

[tk2kewl]

8. and btw...

do you support Hillary in her endeavors to push conservative faith-based legislation?

[nolawarlock]

12. Not even remotely.

But that's part of my overarching point. People are so focussed on the immediate needs of their candidates that they're not looking at the whole picture. There isn't a single candidate who fits my ideal. There are aspects of Hillary I don't like either, but I like even less of Bernie. And both are worlds better than anything the Right has to offer and I'd vote for either in November.

As bad as faith-based legislation is, and the way that it basically funds already tax-exempt religious groups is wrong. However, I am far more concerned about the attempt by massively wealthy and powerful religious institutions using their clout to override the will of the voter. And, in this case, we aren't just talking about Religion. The Vatican has its own embassies and a seat at the United Nations. This crosses into very dangerous territory, both in terms of religion and in terms of international relations.

[mythology]

24. Obviously he'll be after the coveted Kim Jong-un next

This is silly. Sanders was there as part of a conference. Whatever you think of his participation in it, I can't imagine most people wouldn't find it cool to get to meet the Pope. And this one is better than most popes. Sure he's not perfect, but he's made some significant steps on some positive things likes doing away with some of the overt trappings and on poverty. Yes obviously the Catholic church has some views I find backwards on women and reproductive rights among others.

But why do so many Clinton supporters feel the need to blast this?

[longship]

9. "The Family"

Does Hillary put her fundamentalist religion above ethical issues?

I don't want to see any Family members anywhere near the White House.

[tk2kewl]

10. thank you

[cantbeserious]

11. HRC - Duplicity Is As Duplicity Does

eom

[bvar22]

14. "The Family" is a fundamentalist cult.

One of their beliefs is that RICHES are bestowed by god as a sign of his favor,
and that (Riches) is a sign that they should dominate the World.

The "C Street" "Family" is even creepier.

[msongs]

15. are you referring to the vatican? nt

[tk2kewl]

16. did you read the op?

this is about Hillary's religion-infused politics, and the cognitive dissonance of attacking the Catholic Church while at the same time giving Hillary a pass. you just help to substantiate that.

[Kalidurga]

29. Have you seen any evidence that one reads beyond the headline ever?

[Dragonfli]

20. I elaborate with a link as well, below on exactly that in post #18

http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511756479#post18

[CharlotteVale]

17. And she has the gall to claim she cares about women. The Family

is so creepy and anti woman. Hillary's joining with them to push legislation making it easier for fundie freaks to discriminate against women is beyond disturbing. She's such a fucking phoney.

[tk2kewl]

19. Hillary Clinton:

Again, I am where I have been, which is that if there's a way to structure some kind of constitutional restriction that take into account the life of the mother and her health, then I'm open to that. But I have yet to see the Republicans willing to actually do that, and that would be an area, where if they included health, you could see constitutional action.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2015/09/29/hillary_clinton_i_could_compromise_on_abortion_if_it_included_exceptions_for_mothers_health.html

[CharlotteVale]

22. Yes, she's such a staunch feminist...willing to sell out abortion rights for

political gain.

But then, there isn't anything she wouldn't sell out!

[redstateblues]

26. So you prefer the Vatican's approach to women's and LGBT rights?

I didn't think so. Bernie's whole trip was political-Why else would he meet with the leader of an anti gay, anti woman institution that has covered up thousands of cases of child molestation. Bernie's answer is to break up the big banks? Watch Spotlight

[CharlotteVale]

27. Except Bernie would never sell out my right to control my own body.

He'd never conspire with the church to write anti woman legislation the way Hillary did with the creepy Family. As he did at Liberty U., he would stand up unequivocally for women's and gay rights. Hillary is the one who defended a child rapist, not Bernie. I don't like the Catholic Church, but Bernie was at the Vatican to do good, not to hurt people the way Hillary hooked up with the Family to do.

Plus, Hillary obviously has no problem with the pope's position on those issues since The Clinton Foundation invited him to their big party last year, lol. That kinda puts the kibosh on your argument.

[beam me up scottie]

31. Well said!

And up until recently Hillary and the pope agreed on marriage being "a sacred bond between a man and a woman".

Since Bernie never opposed marriage equality they really should think twice before using the religious argument.

[CharlotteVale]

33. Thank you! Hillary made a calculated decision to use the Family to

get ahead...I really don't think she has any core convictions on anything whatsoever, she just takes what she thinks is the most expedient path to her goal of enriching and empowering herself at the expense of others.

Her behavior is utterly indefensible so watching it bite them in the ass is very entertaining.

[tk2kewl]

35. no. I prefer the Vatican ' s approach to poverty and wealth inequality

[Dragonfli]

18. Yes let's do, Hillary's CULT brand of Christianity is very political, very Dangerous, and very real

I realize some are claiming that Pope Francis of the Catholic Church should not involve himself in our politics, but he isn't, and as most everyone agrees, should not be.

The same can not be said of Hillary's religious leader and the cult he runs whose core message by the way is the antithesis of Pope Francis' regarding a moral economy and the idolatry of money and whose policy is to specifically and intentionally involve themselves in our politics.

Let us take a closer look at her Religious leader and it's brand of "Christianity" now shall we?

[font size='3' color="red"]Hillary Clinton's religion is the cult named "The Family" And her Pope is Doug Coe[/font]

Sen. Hillary Clinton has been involved with the Family since 1993 when, as first lady, she joined a White House prayer circle for political wives. Clinton has also sought spiritual counseling from the current head of the Family, Doug Coe. Sharlet argues that Clinton's longtime association with the Family has helped her forge working relationships with powerful religious conservatives such as Family member and anti-abortion crusader Sen. Sam Brownback of Kansas.

The Family nurtures the next generation of prayer warriors in suburban dormitories. Sharlet spent nearly a month living at Ivanwald, a dormitory in Virginia where sons of the Family are sent to immerse themselves in Jesus and clean the toilets of congressmen and senators.

The Family also runs a house on C Street in Washington, D.C. The C Street Center has housed a number of federal legislators, including Sen. John Ensign of Nevada. Residents allege that the center is just a cheap place to live, but as an Ivanwald brother, Sharlet saw firsthand that the center is a religious community. As far as the IRS is concerned, the C Street Center is a church.

Members will tell you that the Family is just a group of friends. As Sharlet discovered, 600 boxes of documents at the Billy Graham Center Archives tell a different story.

AlterNet writer Lindsay Beyerstein recently sat down with Jeff Sharlet at a Brooklyn coffee shop to discuss the Family.

Lindsay Beyerstein What is the Family?

Jeff Sharlet: It's an international network of evangelical activists in government, military and business. The Family is dedicated to this idea that Christianity has gotten it all wrong for two thousand years by focusing on the poor, the suffering and the weak.

The Family says that instead, what Christians should do is minister to the up-and-out -- as opposed to the down-and-out -- to those that are already powerful. Because if they can win those people for Christ, they win the whole deal. That's what this network is dedicated to. It includes nonprofit organizations, it includes think tanks, it includes various ministries.

Lindsay Beyerstein: Where did they get the idea that they should be ministering to the up-and-out? There doesn't seem to be a lot basis in Christianity for that view.

Jeff Sharlet: Two places. The founder of the Family, Abraham Vereide, would describe it as his "new revelation" that came to him in the middle of the night, very literally: in a vision from God in 1935 in response to the Great Depression and, more particularly, to a series of very successful labor strikes that he saw as challenging God's sovereignty. So, God comes and gives him this new revelation to say, "This is what I really meant"......

More

[tk2kewl]

21. thank you

[Dragonfli]

23. Your welcome, I am proud that so many of my peers here are well informed enough to know of

this organization and Hillary Clinton's very deep ties with them, I had a link to more in depth information (short of providing the book) to help dig deeper into it and how delusional it really is, including it's founders "vision" of an entirely different and new revelation as revealed to him by God himself.

Unfortunately for us all, I believe he was channeling whatever the opposite of Jesus and his teachings are.

Some branches of Calvinism do believe in the doctrine of the elect and that wealth is a sign that those with it, are so, because God is "blessing" them, while also teaching that the impoverished are poor because God is "punishing" them (so best not to interfere with his punishment).

However this takes even that twisted outlook and quadruples down on it, while also adding a belief that the wealthy are "ordained by God" to rule us all, and wraps it up with a nice bow in the form of a "new vision revealed testament", not unlike a more evil and greedy Joseph Smith type event.


Scary stuff, and any who follow it are scary people in my opinion.

[TexasBushwhacker]

30. And this

"The Fellowship believes that the elite win power by the will of God, who uses them for his purposes. Its mission is to help the powerful understand their role in God's plan."

How is this any different than Ted Cruz being "anointed by God" to be President?

[CharlotteVale]

32. Wow...it is absolutely NO different from Ted Cruz. Shudder. You'd think

he'd be part of it!

[TexasBushwhacker]

34. They have their standards - LOL n/t

[RoccoR5955]

28. Clinton has always said

that she stands by CONservative values. Why is this a surprise? She's no liberal, she's a progressive conservative. She makes progress on some humanist issues, but others are much more pro-conservative. Don't be fooled by what she says on the campaign trail. She will say anything to get elected.