New Yorkers File Emergency Lawsuit To Give Voting Rights Back To 3.2 Million People

[Uncle Joe]

(snip)

More than 3 million people — about 27 percent of New York voters — were registered outside the Republican and Democratic parties as of April, and are therefore ineligible to vote on Tuesday. A significant number of voters, including many named in the lawsuit, say their party affiliation was switched without their knowledge.

Westchester County voter Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez decided to check on the status of her voter registration last month, after hearing about problems in Arizona’s primary. She was dismayed to discover that, despite being a registered Democrat since 2008, her party affiliation had been changed to unaffiliated. She is now unable to vote for her preferred candidate, Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-VT), in the primary.

(snip)

Nelson’s organization, Election Justice USA, was founded in recent weeks — specifically after some Arizona voters waited in five-hour lines to cast ballots.

“Many of us were watching with some horror at what was happening state by state with voter suppression issues coming up,” Nelson said. “As we looked ahead, beyond Arizona, we began to hear an increasing number of reports of mysterious voter party affiliation switches happening.”

The group set up a website asking New York voters to submit information about their mysterious party affiliation switches, and received more than 300 responses. The plaintiffs named in the lawsuit were chosen from that group, and Election Justice USA has a group of people looking to determine why voters’ information may have been switched by the state.

“We have a team of professional data analysts and statisticians who are working on metadata analytics to see if there are any discernible patterns that may suggest causal connections — where could the problem have started?” she said. “It’s a little too soon to tell.”

(snip)

“The Board of Elections, not voters, holds the voting records and should be responsible to prove a voter’s ineligibility, rather than putting this burden on the voter,” Blaire Fellows, one of the lead attorneys filing the lawsuit, said in a statement. “As it is currently structured, the statute places an onerous and excessive burden on the voter to prove their eligibility. It requires securing a court order, which takes time that many New Yorkers simply don’t have.”

The problem could impact elections outside of New York. Nelson said her group has received reports of the same issue happening in other states, including California, Pennsylvania, and Kentucky.

(snip)

http://thinkprogress.org/politics/2016/04/18/3770355/new-york-voting-open-primary-lawsuit/

[geek tragedy]

1. affidavit ballots are the proper way of dealing with this.

they fill out the ballot, and then they check the records.

open primary is not physically possible at this point.

[elleng]

3. and hopefully such affidavit ballots will actually be counted.

[geek tragedy]

5. provided the person's registration status checks out, absolutely nt

[Dragonfli]

19. Based on the same compromised data, that "accidentally" lost them, how reassuring, not /nt

[seabeyond]

27. Out of ALL the Democrats registered, isn't it amazing ONLY Sanders affiliations were changed?

[Dragonfli]

37. Not as amazing (or equally so) as when the day and weeks after His campaign was shut out

of the database, nearly all of sanders supporters "suddenly" began receiving Clinton campaign emails.
Someone got their hands on a list

[seabeyond]

38. Sanders STOLE data, it others fault. Supporters do NOT register and it is Clinton's fault. Pathetic!

[Dragonfli]

42. That is a lie and you even know it, but will most assuredly not admit so /nt

[seabeyond]

43. No. It is not.

[Dragonfli]

47. Goodbye propaganda machine ignored person, I will miss your famous insults to others

They were kinda funny in their own special way, but alas you are invisible (or will be as soon as I get to that button directly after posting this.)

[seabeyond]

63. Silliness. His people stole, and they were fired.

[zazen]

114. uncritically accepting a woman because of her gender demeans feminism

You are better than this.

I am certain that if Andrea Dworkin were alive today and she had to cast a vote, it'd be for Bernie. She and other radical feminists understood that some of the most anti-female persons out there could be women--usually white, middle-class, educated women who had a chance at some credibility in a male-dominated establishment and who never had to live in poverty or sell their ass on the street--who would never again "have so much credibility in their lives" (as C. MacKinnon said).

Clinton's policies have hurt hundreds of thousands of women and as POTUS that number will only grow. It saddens me how blind you are to this.

Stop. It. And. Wake. Up. We don't need another Maggie Thatcher.

[seabeyond]

115. WTF?...

[pantsonfire]

202. How do you know Clinton's campaign didn't do the same?

The firewall was down, access from both sides was possible...

[seabeyond]

206. When are you going to stop hitting your wife?

[pantsonfire]

207. I would never have a wife since I like men.....

....what's with the nasty comment?

[bkkyosemite]

105. Exactly and I was one of them.

[Enthusiast]

182. How does that help the voter that has had their party affiliation tampered with?

[Dragonfli]

9. They are carefully placed n a file cabinet that bears a striking resemblance to a paper shredder

Just kidding, they are mostly just ignored. They are a placebo to calm the disenfranchised.

[elleng]

18. Right.

Here we go again.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bush_v._Gore

[Aerows]

144. I know

Dammit.

[Uncle Joe]

6. That's only the tip of the iceberg insofar as New York's voter suppression acts are concerned.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=7764912

[geek tragedy]

11. I live here. The most onerous part of it is the early switching deadline.

That probably should be moved up to match other states.

But I have zero problem with requiring someone to join the party if they want to help govern it.

[Uncle Joe]

20. No early voting, no same day registration, no out of precinct voting, no preregistration.

Why does New York work to make voting so difficult for their citizens?

[R. Daneel Olivaw]

26. Perhaps NY doesn't want the well-informed to vote.

[Uncle Joe]

28. Logic seems to dictate that. n/t

[NobodyHere]

191. The well informed should know about registration dates.

[R. Daneel Olivaw]

196. DNC Debbie couln't have said it better.

Three cheers for byzantine rules and the disenfranchisement of voters everwhere!

[geek tragedy]

34. a whole bunch of reasons

1) our state government is a horrid, dysfunctional mess that can barely handle bread and butter issues. Election reform is just not something that has a strong lobbying effort behind it. Our state senate is usually controlled by Republicans which makes things worse. People will make noise about this, and then no one will do anything about it afterwards. Independent voters are not engaged with the process.

2) the records systems are based on ancient technology, as are our voting systems. Our voter records are kept on paper by precinct. The voting machines in my precinct are the kind with the huge lever you need to pull.

3) higher turnout dilutes the power of the party machines; but

4) on the other hand, if you had same day registration the Democratic machine could really get away with a lot of mischief by meddling in other primaries--they could encourage people to sign up for independent parties on paper in order to take those parties over, or they could even meddle in Republican primaries with not many voters--some Congressional Districts will have very, very few Republicans in them.

[senz]

52. A New Yorker gave a partial explantion

here: http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=1707792

Was enough to horrify me, but maybe I'm just a fuzzy-headed idealist.

[Uncle Joe]

72. Thanks for the link, senz, I'm of the mind

said poster has been consumed by cynicism.

Cynic, n: a blackguard whose faulty vision sees things as they are, not as they ought to be.

Ambrose Bierce

http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/a/ambrosebie136467.html

Railroad Refinancing Bill[edit]

The Union Pacific and Central Pacific railroad companies had received large, low-interest loans from the U.S. government to build the First Transcontinental Railroad. Central Pacific executive Collis P. Huntington persuaded a friendly member of Congress to introduce a bill excusing the companies from repaying the loans, amounting to $130 million (worth $3.7 billion today).

In January 1896 Hearst dispatched Bierce to Washington, D.C. to foil this attempt. The essence of the plot was secrecy; the railroads' advocates hoped to get the bill through Congress without any public notice or hearings. When the angered Huntington confronted Bierce on the steps of the Capitol and told Bierce to name his price, Bierce's answer ended up in newspapers nationwide:

My price is one hundred thirty million dollars. If, when you are ready to pay, I happen to be out of town, you may hand it over to my friend, the Treasurer of the United States.[14]

Bierce's coverage and diatribes on the subject aroused such public wrath that the bill was defeated. Bierce returned to California in November.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ambrose_Bierce

Peace to you.

[senz]

120. You may very well be right, Uncle Joe.

Cynicism, to me, suggests something deadened about a person. We see a lot of it in the Hill camp, sadly. What gets me is when they sneer at our ideals.

Thanks for that bit of Bierce's wit and some history I hadn't been aware of. Corrupt politicians doing favors for big corporations is nothing new, alas. I love Bierce's response to "name his price" -- very Berniesque!

[Uncle Joe]

121. I thought so as well.

Have a good night, senz.

[senz]

163. You too, Uncle Joe.

[democrattotheend]

87. At least they keep the polls open until 9

That is the one pro-voting thing I can think of here. Most states close at 8 or earlier, making it harder for people to get home in time to vote.

Also, I will say that we don't have onerous voter ID requirements. I have voted in NY twice now in 2 different places and have never been asked for ID. I did have a pollworker tell me I was in the wrong place in 2014, at around 8:56 pm, and then after I asked to fill out a provisional ballot they looked again and it turned out I was in the right place.

[appalachiablue]

166. Rotten and corrupt..Too many immigrants, PoC,and liberals in NY for the Establishments.

[seabeyond]

30. Out of ALL the Democrats registered, isn't it amazing ONLY Sanders affiliations were changed?

I will ask you, since you are a pretty honest dude.

[geek tragedy]

36. I don't think there's any kind of systemic bias--most registration issues

are voter error, but certainly our awful election records systems lead to errors as well.

[seabeyond]

39. I have read every one investigated has been explained voter error.

[geek tragedy]

55. yep, people see someone claim something on reddit and believe it's true

and it's Sanders supporters who are more likely to go on reddit and complain about this sort of thing, and then it gets forwarded by other Sanders supporters, etc.

[seabeyond]

69. I was dealing with this yesterday, on FB. Thousands I tell you. I read the article, 200.

200 complaining they wanted to vote Democratic but didnt do what they needed to vote and now whining.

[noretreatnosurrender]

62. It Was Voter Error

Congratulations that's exactly what the Republicans claimed about Florida voters in 2000.

http://spectator.org/articles/52839/voting-error

[dchill]

160. Plus, their chads were hanging.

Unforgivable.

[appalachiablue]

175. That's the conservative position alright: it's your fault you're disenfranchised by a rule

requiring you to change voter registration LAST OCT, 2015--months before candidates and debates were finalized. It's your fault you got a subprime liar loan from fraud banksters; it's your fault you're not wealthy; Democrats lost elections because of you voters, not because we had crummy candidates and ran lousy campigns....on and on, it's endless!

[Silver_Witch]

184. +1000

[brooklynite]

60. ...and isn't it amazing that Sanders hasn't filed a single complaint?

Other than joining in on the AZ lawsuit that the DNC and Clinton filed?

[seabeyond]

66. Joining... Joining the law suit AFTER DNC, and Clinton file. Waiting for others to do the work. Nt

[Fantastic Anarchist]

124. May I ask why you do not like Sanders?

Serious question. Is or are there certain policy/policies of his that you don't like?

[floriduck]

106. Thanks, Uncle Joe.

This information is very disturbing. It seems like state after state just finds a way to screw voters over.

[appalachiablue]

162. 2nd. This election fraud is growing & seriously dangerous to citizens & our broken democracy.

K & R. Thanks for the post Uncle Joe. This is unjust, suspicious and stinks!

[Octafish]

49. William Rehnquist salutes you!

Operation Eagle Eye

[blm]

2. Classic Caging - a GOP standard. Only now are more people realizing how really

effective the GOP's bag of voter suppressing tricks has become. They have been doing this to Democratic voters for many years.

[NWCorona]

16. +1!

[seabeyond]

41. Doing what? Having a closed primary so Democrats pick the GE candidate?

[blm]

48. No - I'm talking about the voters dropped from the rolls, unaware it was done

to them and not by choice.

[TMontoya]

51. Do you have proof?

Where is the evidence of this? And internet complaints don't count.

[blm]

54. GOP has practiced caging for decades. Surely this isn't the first you heard of it?

It was also exposed during the hearings on voter suppression after Bush v Gore.

[seabeyond]

64. The NY voting commission has been able to identify every complaint as a legitimate voter error.

That matters. We should know before accusing.

[blm]

67. As long as GOP caging is countered, which is what matters, imo.

Thanks for the input on NYEC identifying the causes.

[seabeyond]

70. A bunch of others that did not register to vote Democratic in the Democratic primary do not get a

rule change. This has nothing to do with GOP, but a bunch of entitled snowflake that want to now mess with our primary and use it to attack and smear Clinton and our Democratic Party. I am NOT ok with that.

[TMontoya]

4. Good luck with that

The primary is not going to be opened. Maybe next time pay attention.

[basselope]

13. Damn, straight. Get your ID if you want to vote.

[Matt_in_STL]

14. Pay attention to their voter registration being changed without their knowledge?

The brilliance you have provided here today will be a shining beacon to all, saying to them, "look at me, I don't know what the hell I am talking about."

Congratulations on continuing to set this standard with every post you make. I applaud you.

[rhett o rick]

15. What a typical response to learning of cheating. The victims should "pay better attention."

Funny how none of these glitches cause harm to Clinton and the Establishment. But Clinton supporters believe, "win at all costs, the ends justify the means."

Well the Rich Fat Cats will have their day but sooner or later we will throw them out along with their minions.

[Fantastic Anarchist]

126. According to Bill Clinton ...

We just want to kill the bankers ...apparently, we are just a bunch of would-be murderers.

[appalachiablue]

172. Righto, like HC said 'people shouldn't have signed those home mortgage loans', Their Fault!

Friend of Wall Street by God. No it wasn't the banks, investors, regulators, rating agencies, mortgage cos., realtors who were all pushing subprime loans and profiting....Riiight!

[hellofromreddit]

59. Why are you so opposed to black people voting?

[bettyellen]

155. Disgusting allegation that they are promoting racist policies.

Shame on you.

[2banon]

96. You're so right. People should realize that voting is something akin to a casino, after all.

Specifically the Roulette table. They should be paying attention to the button the spinner has his thumb on, before they cast their chips.

Indeed, pay attention people! And by the way, people should also remember they don't really need to be participating at all.

It isn't even their constitutional right.

How often are we reminded, this isn't a real democracy, it's a "Republic Democracy" meaning the Landed Gentry is in charge here, it's their choices which get counted..

All you peasants are only here to put on the biggest dog and pony show ever on display, every four years... so quit your whining and just please move along.

Get how this works now?

Good, your welcome.

[Fantastic Anarchist]

125. Some people's registrations were changed because of the ...

...hurricane (I forget the name), where Cuomo let people vote at any presinct. According to one lady, there was an affidavit you had to fill out, and I think you had to affirm your registration. There may have been confusion in that regard. I don't have or know all the details, so take from it how you want. I read that today, but can't recall the source.

[Marrah_G]

187. How can you not be concerned about voting issues?

You realize that it is ALL candidates that lose voters because of this. The loss of people's right to have their voices heard is very important.

I realize you are new here, but voting rights has ALWAYS been a huge deal here on DU.

[FlatBaroque]

7. I am not a judge, but this will be thrown out because voters have no "standing"

The party owns the process. That's my guess.

[senz]

57. From what I've been told, this is true of New York.

One more reason why we need a serious revolution in this country...

[Art_from_Ark]

83. Why would voters have no standing

if their party preference was changed without their knowledge?

Isn't the New York State Board of Elections, a state government agency, the final authority in the process?

[Duppers]

92. Yes. Thanks, AfA, for pointing out truth.

[FlatBaroque]

119. I think that is where this question hinges

whether the state party or the BOE would have jurisdiction. In any regard, the lawsuit is a very good thing because even if it does not succeed it helps identify the institutional corruption baked into party politics.

[Zira]

143. +1

[bkkyosemite]

111. You have a right to vote as a United States citizen that should come above any party rules.

[FlatBaroque]

118. I agree, it should, but the system is rigged in many ways

and we need Bernie to expose the fraud and implement changes.

[pacalo]

8. Thank you, Uncle Joe!

[Uncle Joe]

10. It was my pleasure, pacalo.

[Dragonfli]

12. K&R for needed exposure /nt

[Hoyt]

17. Yep, the election board identified all the Sanders' supporters registered as Dems and switched them

to Independent, GOPers, Green, or something. It's rigged.

[Dragonfli]

22. They tend to focus on the most populated area, so no, not all, there is a distinct pattern,. /nt

[ScreamingMeemie]

23. This... it happened to my daughter in Kissimmee.

[Uncle Joe]

24. Whatever they did or didn't do, the democratic process isn't high on their list. n/t

[Hoyt]

33. It's called Democratic Primary for a reason. Not hard to understand. Well, for most people.

[Uncle Joe]

50. Well if you're stating that the Democratic Primary isn't democratic, I concur. n/t

[CajunBlazer]

86. No we're saying that Independents, Green Party memebers and Republicans...

... can't vote in our primary. We have no need to be "democratic" and let enemies of the Party vote in our private nomination process. If you don't like, you will just have to get over it.

Most of the independents who vote for Sanders are too liberal to be Democrats and members of other parties, ain't going to happen.

[Uncle Joe]

94. Be sure to pass this message to them in the general election, that's a major winning argument

for entropy.

No we're saying that Independents, Green Party memebers and Republicans...... can't vote in our primary. We have no need to be "democratic" and let enemies of the Party vote in our private nomination process. If you don't like, you will just have to get over it.

A new analysis of long-term trends in party affiliation among the public provides a detailed portrait of where the parties stand among various groups in the population. It draws on more than 25,000 interviews conducted by the Pew Research Center in 2014, which allows examination of partisan affiliation across even relatively small racial, ethnic, educational and income subgroups. (Explore detailed tables for 2014 here.)

The share of independents in the public, which long ago surpassed the percentages of either Democrats or Republicans, continues to increase. Based on 2014 data, 39% identify as independents, 32% as Democrats and 23% as Republicans. This is the highest percentage of independents in more than 75 years of public opinion polling. (For a timeline of party affiliation among the public since 1939, see this interactive feature.)

http://www.people-press.org/2015/04/07/a-deep-dive-into-party-affiliation/

PRINCETON, N.J. -- An average 43% of Americans identified politically as independents in 2014, establishing a new high in Gallup telephone poll trends back to 1988. In terms of national identification with the two major parties, Democrats continued to hold a modest edge over Republicans, 30% to 26%.




http://www.gallup.com/poll/180440/new-record-political-independents.aspx

[CajunBlazer]

102. I think that it is perhaps time form a new party

Perhaps moderate Democrats and Republicans along with moderate independents should get together to form a new party - we could call it the Centralist or Third Way Party. We would far out number both those we left behind on the far left and the far right.

The only way those folks could come close to our numbers would be for all of the fringe folks from the left and right to join together to form yet another new party, perhaps called the Radical Party. (Do laugh; remember the Horseshoe Principle - those two extremes have far more in common than they have differences.) Of course, that would never happen and the Centralist Party would rule.

Now that would be fun!

[Uncle Joe]

108. If the Democratic Party doesn't evolve with the times, that will be the inevitable result.

Incrementalism when the world is burning isn't moderate, that's RADICAL to the point of being dangerously oblivious to reality.

[CajunBlazer]

132. LOL!

I really did laugh out loud. Why is the "revolution" still born. Oh, I know, because only radical have the intelligence and foresight to show the way. Only you guys are never wrong and I guess there are just too many of ignorant to convince this time around. Oh well, better luck next time. Guess we will have to settle for incrementalism for the next 8 years.

[Admiral Loinpresser]

138. Many of us will not be here in 8 years.

We will be Greens or Imdependents or maybe the Working Families Party. Parties without such a disproportion of assholes. The only way I give the Democratic Party another chance is if Bernie is the nominee.

[CajunBlazer]

149. I don't doubt that for a minute

Some Sanders fans have gone that way already and are only back on DU to support Sanders. However, it is frustrating to live on the political edge.

[Admiral Loinpresser]

151. It's much more frustrating to live in a fucked up country. n/t

[CajunBlazer]

152. Well, the country's state is strickly in the the eye of the beholder

But it it is frustrating to live in a fucked up country, it is even more frustrating to live on the political edge in a fucked up country.

[Admiral Loinpresser]

157. The country's state is reflected by the disgust of the electorate. n/t

The leaders in the respective parties are two filthy rich lying pigs with the combined worst net unfavorables in polling history. That is tens of millions of disgusted beholders. People get that the whole system is rigged. I'm glad that your life is so comfortable currently that you don't get it, yet. Good for you.

[CajunBlazer]

165. Nah, most of that comes with both the left and right upset that they aren't winning.

It is these elements which have polarized the country and elected Congressional representatives who feel they won't get reelected if they try to compromise and govern from the center for the good of the country.

It is what it is.

[Admiral Loinpresser]

167. The far right is winning. Neoliberalism, racism and corruption have polarized the country. n/t

[CajunBlazer]

170. You're so far left you believe that...

...that everyone to right of St. Bernie is a conservative. I'm surprised you find him liberal enough to support.

[Admiral Loinpresser]

173. Bernie is mainstream, as is his platform. Both parties are to the right of the public.

That's why Bernie dominates the GE polls and Annie Oakley doesn't.

[appalachiablue]

177. Pushing the new weekly 'radical, far left and even 'anarchist' meme boogeymans

Last edited Tue Apr 19, 2016, 09:42 AM - Edit history (1)

is useless and absurd given the clear and extreme distress and decline this country is in. The neoliberal centrist era is waning, what the Majority is rightfully opposing, if that isn't crystal clear.
Major systemic changes reflecting the will and needs of the people must be addressed, and our democracy cannot be further dismantled. If it continues, then necessary action by the people will take the course it always has throughout history, to end tyranny and move forward for justice and progress. That is America's proud heritage.

Yet more and more, fascism is seeming the preferred system which is very dangerous as we well know from it's destruction and defeat in the 20th century. With the rise of fanatic extremist candidates like Trump that possibility is appearing again and must be stopped. This great country that was born in revolution and defeated British oppression is now in serious trouble, and yet will prevail. We have that unique history, have been through many struggles and the nation's survival is certain I have no doubt.

[Fantastic Anarchist]

131. The far Left has little in common with the far right.

I hope you were being sarcastic on that point. Couldn't tell if your general point was what was sarcastic, or that specific point, so I just wanted to address that.

[CajunBlazer]

137. Nope, I wasn't be scarcastic at all

While the far left and the far right are at opposite ends of the political spectrum, they much in common. Political scientist have done a lot of study in this area - you can look up the Horseshoe Principle or Horseshoe Theory

From Wikipedia, "The horseshoe theory in political science asserts that rather than the far left and the far right being at opposite and opposing ends of a linear political continuum, they in fact closely resemble one another, much like the ends of a horseshoe." The are similar not in what the believe, but how they think and act.

Some of my personal observations: Both the far left and the far right tend to believe that only their belief system is right and everyone else is wrong. Both groups often attempt to silence those with whom they disagree. Both groups tend to be more enthusiastic and will go to greater lengths to achieve their political objectives than political moderates. Both groups tend to believe that the political system is stacked against them and they are more apt than other people to believe in conspiracy theories. They both want to see sweeping changes to their desired system of government and they both look down on incremental changes.

One other thing, both the far left and the far right are loath to admit they are in anyway similar to their opposite numbers on the other political extreme.

[Fantastic Anarchist]

139. Funny thing about the Political spectrum.

Is that it is not, in fact, linear.

[Admiral Loinpresser]

140. If only there was a far left in the US. n/t

[Fantastic Anarchist]

141. Excellent point. nt

[CajunBlazer]

145. Just observe how the far left Sanders supporters behaveie here and other sites on-line

And you will see what I mean.

[Fantastic Anarchist]

156. I have been observing.

And I see no difference of some of their behavior and some of their devout Clinton supporting counter-parts. The actions of a few do not really define the group as a whole, but if we did use your logic, then Clinton supporters also have much in common with the far Right, which, of course, is absurd.

There is no horseshoe on a properly constructed two-dimensional political spectrum. One that has two axes to account for economic and political positions; and to account for authoritarian vs. libertarian political alignment and social relations.

[dchill]

164. No worse than the mainstream Clinton supporters.

Specious, at best.

[CajunBlazer]

146. Is Sanders not far enough left to suit you?

[Admiral Loinpresser]

150. Sanders is a mainstream candidate, not far left. That's why he dominates the GE polls. n/t

[CajunBlazer]

153. Hell, you are so far to the left that you have disappeared over the edge.

[Admiral Loinpresser]

158. Universal health care and an end to perpetual war. Crazy ideas indeed. Unknown throughout the world.

[CajunBlazer]

159. Maybe you should pray...

...OH! That's right, you probably don't believe in prayer.

[Admiral Loinpresser]

161. Neither does Annie Oakley. n/t

[Silver_Witch]

186. Exactly n/t

[Generic Other]

110. For comparison

William Henry Chamberlin | Soviet Russia: A Living Record and a History

"...about one person in every hundred in the Soviet Union [was] a professing Communist. There [were] over 2,000,000 members of the Union of Communist Youth, an organization with less severe,entrance requirements than those of the Party. For it [was] no easy matter to gain admission to the ruling Party in the Soviet Union. Workers [were] preferred above other classes of the population as candidates for membership; but even a manual worker, the aristocrat of Soviet Russia, [had to] obtain two recommendations from old Party members and pass through a period of six months' probation before he [might] be admitted to full-fledged membership. For peasants, employees, and intellectuals a larger number of sponsors and longer periods of probation [were] required. Members of the classes disfranchised under the Soviet Constitution, merchants, traders, priests and ministers of religion, private employers of labor, etc., [were] naturally disqualified from belonging to the Communist Party."

https://www.marxists.org/archive/chamberlin-william/1929/soviet-russia/ch03.htm



RULES RULES RULES to exclude, marginalize and disenfranchise. Sad.

[Fantastic Anarchist]

133. Soviet Union was anything but communist.

There is a great, though quite long, study entitled What was the Soviet Union? Towards a Theory of the Deformation of Value Under State Capitalism. (This was part IV of the critique; all parts are included at the link).

It's a very comprehensive analysis of the social and economic relations that existed in the State that transcends both Marxist and anarchist perspectives, and refutes and goes far beyond Trotsky's "Degenerated Workers' State" analysis.

It really is a fantastic read, if you have several hours to kill.

[Generic Other]

142. I feel like the Democrats took a page from their playbook where excluding voters is concerned

I personally find the shenanigans with votes to be problematic in a democratic state.

[All in it together]

117. What! I guess Franklin Roosevelt was too liberal to be a Democrat too.

Independents aren't our enemies, unless you want to shrink the party.

Many Indies want a party that's not so Corporate, and that should be the Democratic Party.

[appalachiablue]

176. Read you and yours Loud and Clear. And know what, tomorrow I will decide if I will

Last edited Tue Apr 19, 2016, 02:29 AM - Edit history (1)

vote for HC IF she obtains the nomination based on whether these 3.2 million New Yorkers' voting rights are immediately restored, effective tomorrow. Also many other issues surrounding her policies and behavior, and the undemocratic, corrupt actions of the DNC and the corporate, conservative, and anti worker direction of the neoliberal Democratic Party for 25 years.

For 40 years I've been a loyal Democrat and voter but This is it. Wide open. Past time to work for a better, progressive future. If the party continues this corruption, sham and will not change, so be it. I'm done.

[Silver_Witch]

185. Yeah wouldn't want any freaking liberals

In the Democratic party now would'ya!

You shame our party. I have been a democrat for 40 years WE are the leberal party! We believe in peace, equality, freedom and a "fair shake for everyone".

[Zira]

147. Are you missing the voter fraud all over the US?

I've noticed a whole lot of Clinton supporters support suppressing the vote in their win at all cost for their bought out corrupt candidate. These are NOT Democratic values and the people all for preventing people from voting should re-register as Republicans because ultimately that's what these pro Regan, Pro TPP, Pro voter suppression people are. Are you one?

[Hoyt]

190. What alleged suppression adversely affected Sanders compared to Clinton. I'm against

any kind of voter suppression, have been since the 1960s when I got old enough to see Blacks were blatantly prevented from voting.

But it is not voter suppression to say non-Democrats can't vote in the Democratic Primary. It's a Democratic Primary, why should disruptive Republicans or anyone else who hasn't supported the Democratic Party be allowed to vote in the Democratic Primary?

[Zira]

197. I guess you're missing all over the country where DEMOCRATS can't vote in the primary.

What ever. I expect I'll be going back to common dreams and likely becoming an active member of JPR.

Hillarians are driving me off this site. I can't stand the active refusal to see corruption or the support for all out corruption.

Good luck with the dem party after they disenfranchise hundreds of thousands of previously registered Democrats in NY. There will also not be enough polling places or ballots in an attempt to suppress the same day vote. Keep it. you own it. I refuse to be part of it.

I bet the people who are against corruption, leave it. And the people who don't care about corruption will stay no matter what but will never have a majority in American elections again.

Ciao.

[Hoyt]

198. I would be sorry for you to leave, truthfully. But, it does not appear you have been supporting DU

or Democrats but a month or so.

[Zira]

199. I've been a Democrat since 1987 and only voted Dem and I am sorry I donated to DU.

My month here showed me a side of dems I didn't know existed.

I belong on CommonDreams where I came from - an actual progressive site with liberal values.

Plenty of people here have liberal values, but there are too many Neocons. They wouldn't survive on CD.

Since I arrived here - the day there were massive pro Reagan threads and supporting him and Clinton on gays and HIV, I keep seeing stuff like that come up.

Honestly, all the pro tpp posts 2 days ago did it for me, too.

Anyway, your site. Keep it. The support of the DNC no matter how much corruption is something I cannot do. I have to call out the corruption because I've always been a real Dem. Only a liberal progressive Dem.

[Hoyt]

201. Well, if you have always voted Dem, you were unlikely to have been prevented from voting in primary.

Too bad the others who are complaining were not long-term Democrats.

[Straw Man]

194. You're missing the issue.

It's called Democratic Primary for a reason. Not hard to understand. Well, for most people.

The problem here is that people's registrations were changed from Democratic to unaffiliated without their knowledge. That's the allegation, anyway. If this is true, it needs to be addressed.

[Hoyt]

200. That's right, it's an allegation. Further, if NY Democrats favor Clinton, then it has hurt her more

than Sanders if in fact someone changed the affiliation other than the voter. I too think if the allegation proves correct, it needs to be corrected. But, the implication, the day of the primary, is that Sanders is being treated unfairly. I've heard enough of that junk.

What I would like to see is someone who can show they were listed as a Democrat, say in November or December, who is now listed as unaffiliated. That would prove a lot. So far, we supposedly have people who can't prove they were listed as a Democrat saying their affiliation was changed. I'm skeptical, but open to proof but still don't believe Sanders is being treated unfairly.

[Straw Man]

205. It doesn't matter who it hurts.

It has to be corrected. The primary result won't be valid until is is.

"New revelations have lent support to the group's allegations: WNYC reported Tuesday that over 123,000 Democratic voters in Kings County—a.k.a Brooklyn—had mysteriously disappeared from the Board of Elections' records since November of 2015. (The deadline for New Yorkers to change party affiliation was October 9, the earliest in the country, and the deadline for first-time voters to register was March 25.)"

--http://www.commondreams.org/news/2016/04/19/emergency-lawsuit-highlights-voter-frustration-new-york-primary-process

[seabeyond]

32. Isn't it totally amazing how they were able to identify ONLY Sanders supporters to do this deed? Nt

[NCTraveler]

68. They really think that?

With all I read I'm pretty sure I would have come across something so serious.

Or is this one of those "Twitter Revolution" things?

[Marrah_G]

188. This is not about Sanders or even about Democrats- This is a about people not being able to vote

What the hell has happened to DU? This site used to care deeply about voting rights.

[randome]

21. There may be some problems needing to be addressed but much of this is hyperbole.

It should be up to the Board of Elections to prove someone ineligible? How would that work? Anyone can walk in off the street and cast a ballot in a closed primary? That doesn't make sense. But it would be good to know how some voters' affiliations were changed. It will be disappointing to some to discover it isn't some nefarious plot from Clinton but let the chips where they may.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]The truth doesn’t always set you free.
Sometimes it builds a bigger cage around the one you’re already in.[/center][/font][hr]

[Dragonfli]

25. Over 60,000 "lost" voters is hyperbole? Really that's what you're goin' with? At least it's funny

And that is just in Brooklyn.

[randome]

29. This morning it was hundreds. Then thousands. And now 3.2 million.

I'm saying it's best to deal with this without rancor and with an open mind.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]The truth doesn’t always set you free.
Sometimes it builds a bigger cage around the one you’re already in.[/center][/font][hr]

[Dragonfli]

40. 60,000 Fewer Democrats in Brooklyn and No Clear Reason Why

Yet, even as the candidates lavish love on Brooklyn, a WNYC analysis of state voter enrollment statistics found that the number of active registered Democrats dropped there by 63,558 voters between November 2015 and April 2016. That translates into a 7 percent drop in registered Democrats in the borough.

No other borough in New York City nor county in the rest of the state saw such a significant decline in active registered Democrats. In fact, only 7 of the state's 62 counties saw a drop in the number of Democrats. Everywhere else saw the numbers increase.

http://www.wnyc.org/story/democratic-voter-rolls-drop-more-60000-brooklyn-presidential-primary/

This shit adds up.

[bettyellen]

154. No- it is 3.2 million in the entire state who did not register as Dem or Republican......

A huge number that probably prompted this gambit hoping they could open the election to al those people.
How could we do that and let the GOP hold a closed primary? That shit is crazy.
The 30K was voters falling off the rolls in Brooklyn- and it is a higher than normal percentage but so has real estate turnover in the last 8 years. They will have to figure out what's up with that.
There haven't been many proven people who's parties have switched. The majority who made that claim so far were shown to have missed their deadline.

[CajunBlazer]

31. Why should the Democratic Party allow Independents and Republicans to vote in...

....their primary. We have the freedom to chose our nominee anyway we see fit. The Democratic Party is a private organization. If you are not going to join our organization, why should we let you vote in our nomination process. The New York rules are designed specifically to prevent non Democrats from coming at the last minute and crashing the party. And those rules work great. :laughing:

Name one private organization other than a political party which allow outsiders to vote in their elections. If you don't like the rules in your state, to another state whose rules you like better. If you don't like any of our rules, join another party.

Or here is an idea, pay attention and register as a Democrat in time to vote.

[NWCorona]

44. Why limit the closed system to just the primary

And not in the general?

[CajunBlazer]

74. I don't believe your are totally clueless

The nomination process is a series of private contests used to chose the candidate of a private organization. The political parties could still chose their candidates in smoke filled rooms if they wanted to.

The general election is a public election to chose the President of the United States so all registered voters are of course allowed to vote.

[NWCorona]

76. I know that

I just think it's odd that independents can be belittled and then be expected to forget about it in the general.

[CajunBlazer]

81. Most of those independents who vote for Bernie are too liberal to be Democrats

They are members of the radical left who will vote for Jill or not vote at all if Sanders is not the nominee. Moderate Independents would never vote for a Socialist. As far as I am concerned the far left can either vote for Hillary or take the blame if either Trump or Cruz win in November - I am sick and tired all of the political radicals in this county - both on the far right and the far left. They are much more alike than they are different. Ever heard of the Horseshoe Principle?

[beedle]

97. Too liberal for the Democrats?

If that is even close to true, then Independents and those Democrats "too liberal" for the high and mighty 'keeper of the Establishment' should really start their own party and put the Democratic party out of its fucking misery.

[CajunBlazer]

98. They did start their own party - the Green Party

And their best year was 1990 when Nader got 2.74% of the vote and helped give us 8 years of George W. Bush. At that point they ceased to be a factor because people don't want to make that kind of mistake again. Hence the saying, "Third parties are like bees; when they sting they die."

The Greens have never won an electoral vote in their history. In 2012 Green Party candidate Jill Stein reach a new high for the Greens since the Nader debacle pulling down 0.36% of the vote. The totally unqualified physician who has never run anything bigger than her medical practice is the Green's nominee again. (By the way, Green Party insiders in each state chose delegates to their national convention where the nominee is chosen. There are no elections - now that's democratic.)

Who knows, a whole new generation has come of age since 1990 and others may have forgotten the Nader fiasco. Maybe Jill will get somewhere North of 1% of the vote this time. Of course if she won (of course she certainly would never expect to win) she would be totally clueless on how to proceed. She could probably find her way to Washington, but not much else.

[rjsquirrel]

134. You mean 2000 right?

1990 wasn't even a presidential election year.

[CajunBlazer]

148. You're right!

[Admiral Loinpresser]

169. Gore won. I know that because I'm an actual Democrat. n/t

[CajunBlazer]

171. Yea, I noticed that you weren't out there on the fringe like some people.

[Admiral Loinpresser]

174. The fringe is populated by the pro-corruption wing of the parties and their unpopular candidates. n/

[Fantastic Anarchist]

135. Too liberal?

His policies would be considered moderate core values if the party from the 40s to the 80s. They're only too liberal to the Third Way faction of the party that has embraced the neo-liberal economic policies that Reagan and Thatcher were quite fond of.

Also, Sanders enjoys quite a broad and diverse group of support from Independents that would surely be beneficial in the General Election. Not sure if you realize, but it's not just the far Left that supports him, but middle-of-the-road working families, too

[Silver_Witch]

189. I am sorry

But you want the democrats to have be a "private organization" with the right to pick our candidate any fucking way we want to I.e., smoke filled room. And then you want us to be able to blame others if our candidate losses.

No sir. You pick her, she losses YOUR fault. Pick bad candidates who lose in the general election and if that person losses because the stink on them is so intense no one can morally vote for that candidate then it is the DNC's fault and they can just wait for the next round of elections.

Not referring to any specific candidate at this point. Just saying you made this cake with your ugly THEY ARE NOT LIKe US pitch and you have to eat it. No blaming us in the party who have been excluded by those of you who say we are too liberal! Or balking it on independents that you didn't court during the primary.

You lose in November YOUR fault!

[CajunBlazer]

192. Only fools would vote for candidates that have absolutely no chance of winning...

... or sit on their hands and not vote and allow someone like Trump and Cruz to win. But I have long since learned that seemingly intelligent people can be fools.

Such foolishness us unlikely to adversely affect me directly and maybe won't affect you either. I can only speak for myself, but I am secure financially and since Republicans practices tend to favor people like me, I might even prosper more under a Republican President, a Republican controlled House and Senate and a very conservative Supreme Court - financially at least. I would hate their social polices and rulings, but chances are they wouldn't affect me directly.

What is sad is that with Republicans in absolute control of all three branches of the federal government, those that would be most affected are those who can least afford it and are least able to defend themselves. Once the Republicans are in power you can forget about a single payer health system because they will even destroy Obama care. They will cut back on Social Security and programs which help the poor and cut huge holes in the social safety net.

To me the essence of a progressive is that we put the needs of others on an even higher priority than our own needs and desires. With all the talk of voting ones conscious, I can't imagine a true progressive not doing everything in his/her power to keep the Republicans from taking over. I know that you will try to blame it all on those who didn't accept Sanders, but does is make any difference who is to blame if we didn't do everything in everything in our power to stop it.

The analogy I would use is that of a damn breaking. Others may be responsible for the damn breaking, but can't simply sit back and watch people drown in the resulting flood if we have a chance to help them escape because we are playing the blame game instead acting to save as many as we can.

[imari362]

178. ...

[BlueStateLib]

75. Why not an unified primary with no parties and then the top 2 have a run off

[sadoldgirl]

88. If it is private, then let the party

pay for it in the form of closed caucuses.

If the state pays for the primary from the taxes,

then you have to go to open primaries, because

the taxes don't just come from Ds or Rs.

[sadoldgirl]

90. Because it is tax money that pays for primaries.

Are you saying that only Ds and Rs pay taxes?

[bkkyosemite]

112. laughing...this is about those who were registered as dems and they were unlawfully changed on

their registrations...are you even paying attention...

[progressoid]

180. Speaking of paying attention. Didja even read the OP?

A significant number of voters, including many named in the lawsuit, say their party affiliation was switched without their knowledge.

[Sheepshank]

204. it was a vague statement included to hopefully give the agenda and the filings credence

was there a valid and verifiable number of un-requested switching of party affiliation ever supplied...even a percentage? The switching, this is problematic I agree, but we have no idea how many and switched from what to where? it's all so vague.

[Punkingal]

35. I am all in favor of people being allowed to vote, no matter who for.

[brooklynite]

45. 12 hours before voting starts...can you say "symbolic"?

[NWCorona]

58. Yeah I can't see how this can be worked out in time.

The affidavit approach is the most practical but it's down to the wire right now.

[Tarc]

46. Perhaps the OP needs to read the cited article completely...

In comments to ThinkProgress, New York state Board of Elections spokesperson Thomas Connolly confirmed that he had been receiving regular complaints about allegedly manipulated voter registrations — specifically complaints that party affiliations had been purged.
But Connolly also said that each complaint he’s followed up on has been due to a mistake on the voter’s part.
“I’ve yet to come across [a voter registration] that’s been maliciously changed,” he said. “There’s always been a legitimate reason.”

[Uncle Joe]

53. What makes you think I didn't read that?

[Tarc]

99. The fact that you think 3.2m people are being disenfranchised?

More likely than not, it is their own error on unawareness of how and where to register.

[Uncle Joe]

100. If 3.2 million people in one state are being disenfranchised, the SYSTEM is a clusterduck. n/t

[Tarc]

101. They aren't

[Uncle Joe]

103. If they can't vote, they're being disenfranchised, the PTBs in New York have done everything in

their power to make voting more difficult.

Even North Carolina has cited New York as reason to make their own rules more restrictive.

[Tarc]

104. Jesus tapdancing christ, stop using words that you do not know the meaning of

There is one very simple way to vote in New York tomorrow....

JOIN
THE
FUCKING
PARTY

If a New Yorker did not, then they made a choice not to. They were not disenfranchised.

[Uncle Joe]

109. The PTBs in New York have made that more difficult as well.

“The state of New York has no early voting as opposed to North Carolina that has ten days of early voting,” lawyer Thomas Farr said. “The state of New York has no same-day registration. The state of New York has no out-of precinct voting. The state of New York has no preregistration.”

It was a cynical defense of North Carolina’s law—North Carolinians don’t deserve to suffer because a state five hundred miles away has different laws—but it was still unnerving to hear a Southern state invoke a progressive Northern state to rationalize making it harder to vote.

The fact is, New York does have some of the worst voting laws in the country.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=7764912

When was the cutoff for registering in the primary, last October?

[Fantastic Anarchist]

136. And you take the State's word at face-value?

I mean, it kind of makes sense that the BOE would blame the voter than address a possible systemic malfunction, whether by malfeasance or incompetence.

[Number23]

127. "each complaint he’s followed up on has been due to a mistake on the voter’s part"

Again:

each complaint he’s followed up on has been due to a mistake on the voter’s part

Amazing how buried that bit has been underneath all of the shrieking. It's so clear that everyone knows what's going to happen tomorrow and are just trying to gin up outrage over what will very likely be a very thorough, very LEGITIMATE spanking at the polls.

[polichick]

56. Can't wait to read about the patterns they uncover!

[restorefreedom]

65. this. nt

[senz]

61. Anonymous found a huge majority of modified registrations were Bernie voters

as I recall, this was for Arizona. They put the info in a tweet that became an OP a few weeks back.

So it really is imperative to trace all of this down to its origins...

[seabeyond]

73. AND they have been and have found that every instance has been voter error. Yea them. !!!

[Cobalt Violet]

113. It always seems to benefit one person.

[senz]

123. But if you dare to notice, you get called a "conspiracy theorist."

We're supposed to pretend we don't see anything.

[Cobalt Violet]

181. I've got most of them on ignore already. I don 't need to be bullied.

I don't need to be bullied because I can see the obvious.

[Travis_0004]

71. New york has a closed primary, and that part of the lawsuit should be thrown out

Don't like it, call up your legislators. Tough luck. Register today so you are ready for the next primary.

As for the people claiming they had voter registration switched, that is a valid concern, and they should be allowed to vote absentee, so it can be researched.

[LuvLoogie]

77. Hillary ate my registration!!

[randome]

79. And then she laughed about it! That monster!

[hr][font color="blue"][center]The truth doesn’t always set you free.
Sometimes it builds a bigger cage around the one you’re already in.[/center][/font][hr]

[RedCappedBandit]

78. It's interesting that Democrats think they have the right to demand progressives vote for them

in the general, but don't want to allow progressives who may not be registered with the party to participate in the primary process.

We really have no right to complain when people don't show up to vote in November when we don't welcome their input now.

[Uncle Joe]

80. That's an excellent observation, RedCappedBandit.

[DrDan]

82. if you wanted to vote, then why not register

[RedCappedBandit]

84. I am registered and already voted.

I assume others have their own reasons for registering with their given party, if any.

[jwirr]

85. Excellent point.

[Duppers]

95. ...

[Ferd Berfel]

89. 27% My god.

insanity . democracy destroyed.

Thanks to letting us know Uncle Joe.

[Duppers]

91. K & R

Please let this happen.

?v=1447189564

[DCBob]

93. Already the excuses are starting.

I can hear it now.. "We would have won had it not been for Hillary changing all our voter registrations!"

[bkkyosemite]

107. The cheating is happening in many states not just NY. Cheating, rigging...denial denial HRC Group.

Now if it was the other way around...oh my gawd.

[RandySF]

130. .

[Jitter65]

116. Yes..you knew it would be happening.

That said, there is no doubt that there will be some errors in elections. Almost all can be attributed to something non-intentional and if checked properly it will show the same kind of error for both sides. But the constant wailing about election cheating and dirty tricks and corrupt DNC and all that does nothing to help the Dems win in crucial down ticket contests. This is really what I hate about the BS campaign and many of his supporters. Destruction of the party and destruction of the reputations of good public servants is of no concern to them. Going back and pulling up old personal misbehavior of the a candidates spouse should be off limits. But Trump, Cruz, and Sanders campaigns seem to relish this insensitive and hurtful behavior. Bernie has not denounced it and that makes him as guilty as the nasty actors doing it. Hillary has and Chelsea have already been hurt enough over the years by the actual facts of Bills adultery but they are still a family with feelings.

Hoping Hillary has a big win tomorrow. Peace.

[amborin]

122. update here:

from The PRogressive Mind, on Twitter

[RandySF]

129. Verizon? Who's crossing the picket line?

[Capt. Obvious]

195. .

https://twitter.com/jordanchariton/status/722452495734321152

#NYPrimary lawsuit UPDATE: New hearing @ 2pm ET-Election Justice says if judge rules in its favor all prov ballots cast 2da would be counted

[RandySF]

128. 3.2 million people chose not to participate with either major party.

There was no complaining during the 2008 primary or any of the past statewide primaries. This is a move to make special exceptions to make up for the Sanders' campaign's oversight.

[amborin]

168. So, can Independents vote tomorrow after all? (assuming the lawsuit succeeds)

[brooklynite]

183. The lawsuit won't be decided today, so no...

[MFM008]

179. desperately seeking an edge?

Rules are rules.

Here in the WA state primary we had to turn away 4 voters for Hillary in our precinct because they came in within 30 minutes after 11 AM.
So their votes were not counted, even though they were there.

Rules are rules and you eat the results.
She lost our precinct by 2 votes, when she could have had 4 and won our district.

so nom nom nom nom.

[Zorra]

193. These voting irregularites almost always favor Third Way and Republican candidates.

Money and power in the hands of corrupt people can buy many things, and elections are one of these things. We're not gonna take it anymore.

Thanks, Uncle Joe.

[apcalc]

203. Will be interesting