Bernie Sanders : Secretary Clinton Agreed To Do A Debate In California!

[Bernie93]

[link:

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[Uncle Joe]

1. Kicked and recommended.

Thanks for the thread, Bernie93.

[longship]

2. I knew she would do that.

She's no dummy.

All the better.

I am beginning to get more comfortable with this primary, in spite of the rather childish behavior occasionally extant in this group.

Bernie and Hillary are both doing okay.

But I am really worried about Trump. And I am hoping that we have a candidate who can beat him in November.

I already cast my vote for Bernie, here in MI.

My advice to you all. Choose wisely. And yes, I am going to stay out of the corners here.

BUT FUCKING VOTE LIKE OUR FUTURE DEPENDS ON IT! (Because it likely does.)

My best to you.

[underthematrix]

3. So according to Bernie this is why he has a pathway to NOM

national and state polls
won most recent contests
win over superdelegates

DELEGATES is the only way to the nomination - the ONLY way

I want to change the rules to open up state contests to independents who not members of the DEM which is why they D as independents

Poor Bernie

[still_one]

6. It isn't going to work out for him

[underthematrix]

9. He's stoking the flames of resentment and i understand why they would fall for it.

He's a US senator but the pathway is a lie because the dem party doesn't select it's presidential candidate on the basis of polls. It's based on DELEGATES!

The more resentment he stokes, the more likely it is he will lose superdelegates instead of gain them.

[Herman4747]

69. Nor, for that matter, for the entire country....

...exchanging Obama for something notably worse.

[Herman4747]

71. Hey, Bernie, you ought to know by now that Hillary's...

word means NOTHING.

[2banon]

4. nicely done Bernie

[Joob]

5. Anytime. Anywhere.

Honestly, I mean, I just believe.. that this is the most important job in the world.
It's the toughest job in the world.
You should be willing to campaign for every vote.
You should be willing to debate anytime, anywhere.

The beauty of this, is if she doesn't debate, further proves she's a liar.
And honestly, I mean. She made some good points.

[underthematrix]

10. Actually it just proves you're more gullible than you should be

[Joob]

11. How am I gullible? She clearly said this.. Did I misinterpret what she said?

Or am I gullible for even considering what she said.

[Joob]

14. She's the one who said that she should work for every vote...

She must have "evolved" on that. Regardless, does not make me gullible. It would only make me gullible if it wasn't true or I heard it from somebody else and didn't confirm it.

Bernie isn't fueling his campaign on anger... He literally says "Love Trumps Hate" in all his rallies..

As for resentment and distrust of the government.. I agree with him on that, he's addressing what I also think is wrong with our Country. Wall street and corporations should not have a HAND in politics. They will put Profits over people. Profits over our environment. And no, it won't be profits for our country. it will be profits for themselves.

It's not his fault they have their hand in our government. These issues NEED to be addressed.

The only gullible person here is you if you think there's nothing wrong with our current government.

[.99center]

66. Your post proves that there isn't much of a difference between Trump supporters and Hillary's

No matter what she say's, or how many positions she takes, you'll have an answer for her behavior. If anybody dares to question his bullshit, you resort to bullying them! You call them gullible, ignorant millennials, bro's, and any other name to insult their intelligence. Like Trump's campaign, the joke isn't his critics, the joke is you and anyone blindly being led by a con artist.

[frylock]

91. More gullible? By taking Mrs Clinton at her word?

[arcane1]

101. Correct that Record! Break those Barriers!

[barrow-wight]

7. There's just no point. He cannot win.

[newrevolution]

15. He can if Hillary suspends her campaign right before the convention

which I suspect she will have to.

[barrow-wight]

16. How do you figure that?

[Fla Dem]

65. James Comey is a Republican, whom Pres Obama foolishly appointed as FBI Dierector

to appease the Republican congress. If you don't think he isn't being influence by Republicans both inside and outside government, you've got your head in the sand.

But would also like you to support your allegation with a link to Comey's statement.

FBI Director
September 4, 2013
President Barack Obama

United States Deputy Attorney General
December 9, 2003 – August 15, 2005
President George W. Bush

United States Attorney for the Southern District of New York
January 7, 2002 – December 15, 2003
President George W. Bush

Born James Brien Comey, Jr.
December 14, 1960 (age 55)
Yonkers, New York, U.S.
Political party Republican
Alma mater College of William and Mary
University of Chicago
Religion Roman Catholicism

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Comey

[TheBlackAdder]

79. Just another Neville Chamberlain, huh?

[Fla Dem]

94. No Pres Obama is not a Neville Chamberlain. However, as the good man that he is,

I do feel he went out of his way at times to try to get the Rethugs on board and give him some support. Just like he kept on Bob Gates, GWB's defense secretary.

[frylock]

92. Was Comey being influenced by Republicans when this happened?

Gonzales Hospital Episode Detailed

On the night of March 10, 2004, as Attorney General John D. Ashcroft lay ill in an intensive-care unit, his deputy, James B. Comey, received an urgent call.

White House Counsel Alberto R. Gonzales and President Bush's chief of staff, Andrew H. Card Jr., were on their way to the hospital to persuade Ashcroft to reauthorize Bush's domestic surveillance program, which the Justice Department had just determined was illegal.

In vivid testimony to the Senate Judiciary Committee yesterday, Comey said he alerted FBI Director Robert S. Mueller III and raced, sirens blaring, to join Ashcroft in his hospital room, arriving minutes before Gonzales and Card. Ashcroft, summoning the strength to lift his head and speak, refused to sign the papers they had brought. Gonzales and Card, who had never acknowledged Comey's presence in the room, turned and left.

The sickbed visit was the start of a dramatic showdown between the White House and the Justice Department in early 2004 that, according to Comey, was resolved only when Bush overruled Gonzales and Card. But that was not before Ashcroft, Comey, Mueller and their aides prepared a mass resignation, Comey said. The domestic spying by the National Security Agency continued for several weeks without Justice approval, he said.

"I was angry," Comey testified. "I thought I just witnessed an effort to take advantage of a very sick man, who did not have the powers of the attorney general because they had been transferred to me."

<more>

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/05/15/AR2007051500864.html

[Fla Dem]

112. Who knows what or who influenced him, but it's telling that his biggest outrage

seemed to be that Card and Gonzales were going around him.

"I was angry," Comey testified. "I thought I just witnessed an effort to take advantage of a very sick man, who did not have the powers of the attorney general because they had been transferred to me."

Could be he was only protecting his turf.

I'll give him credit, it was a bold move and the right one for whatever the motive.

[Fla Dem]

61. Keep believing your pipe dreams. Oh and the tooth fairy is real.

[SFnomad]

8. At this point, we know who the nominee will be ... there really is no upside to Secretary Clinton

doing another debate with BS. Once it becomes official on Jun 7th, it's time to move forward and prepare for the debates with tRump.

[bvf]

13. Nothing becomes official until the convention,

all the wishful, constant, and tired insistence to the contrary notwithstanding.

[barrow-wight]

18. It's not about official.

It's about the fact that he has such a remote chance to win, there's no reason for her to treat him like he's even in the race. She's already pivoted to the Ge.

[bvf]

21. Carefully read #8 and my response at #13.

Here. I'll try to help you:

Once it becomes official on Jun 7th...

See that word there? The one I've been nice enough to bold, so that you wouldn't miss it this time around?

Please, read things before you respond to them. I have nothing but faith in you, but you really must learn to apply yourself.

[barrow-wight]

97. I was responding to "Nothing becomes official until the convention"

I am not disputing this. I am simply saying it isn't relevant. However condescending you choose to be to me, with one of your responses to me already having been hidden, it's not going to change my point which is ... there is such an infinitesimal chance that Bernie Sanders is ever going to be the nominee, that it seems rather a time waster for Hillary to debate Bernie when she should spend her efforts against Trump.

[bvf]

99. Right. Cue the next spasm of OPs

insisting that it's over. I give it two--maybe three--days, tops.

That always cracks me up, as do some other things.

[barrow-wight]

100. It is over.

[bvf]

105. No, it's not.

[barrow-wight]

106. Yes, it is.

[bvf]

110. No, it's not.

[barrow-wight]

111. Yes, it is.

[Arazi]

114. Nope

[barrow-wight]

115. Yep

[bvf]

117. No, it's not.

[barrow-wight]

118. Lol

[bvf]

119. Lol.

[SFnomad]

20. On June 7th, Secreatry Clinton WILL BE the presumptive nominee

No matter home much your stamp your feet, pout and pretend she won't be ... it won't change the fact that she is. At that point, she will completely move past the primaries and will focus on the general election and their presumptive nominee ... tRump.

[bvf]

22. I'll take that as a retraction of #8 on your part.

It's good that you did that.

As to your post proper: Nope. She won't.

Stamp your feet, pout, and pretend.

The answer's still "Nope."

Get used to it.

[SFnomad]

23. You can take it any way you want ... but I have posted NOTHING that is a retraction of #8

On June 7th, it will be official, Secretary Clinton WILL BE the presumptive nominee. Nothing is going to change that.

There is no upside for Secretary Clinton to do another primary debate ... none.

She will be moving towards the general election ... as she should.

You can pretend otherwise, but you will only be fooling yourself.

[bvf]

27. Nope. You're back to stating a falsehood.

Nothing is official until the convention, and there will likely be no presumptive nominee before then.

Sorry. Go ahead and stamp your feet some more, but that's the way it is.

[SFnomad]

33. When Secretary Clinton has the majority of pledged delegates and the vast majority of Superdelegates

she WILL BE the presumptive nominee. Back in 2008, Barack Obama became the presumptive nominee on June 3rd, the day he clinched the majority of pledged delegates as well. And he was in the EXACT SAME situation that Secretary Clinton will be on June 7th ... clinching the majority of pledged delegates with enough committed Superdelegates for a lock on the nomination.

Of course, those that prefer #BernieMath won't let reality interfere with their fantasies. How is BS doing on getting Superdelegates to subvert the will of the people? Last I heard they were switching ... from BS to Clinton.

[bvf]

39. Superdelegates vote at the convention.

There is absolutely nothing to commit them before then.

You know that, right?

[SFnomad]

51. There is nothing to stop Superdelegates from committing before the convention, you know that, right?

And when they commit, they are counted as if they have voted ... and when a candidate clinches the needed delegates (including committed Superdelegates), they are then called the presumptive nominee. That's the way it happened in 2008 ... that's the way it's going to happen in 2016. You can pretend all you want, but it isn't going to change the facts and it's not going to change reality.

[thesquanderer]

67. Super Delegates have no legal way to commit before the convention.

They can state their preferences and opinions as much as they want, but they are not bound until they actually vote at the convention, and there is nothing preventing them from changing their mind as much as they want between now and then.
They can intend, but there simply is no procedural mechanism for them to commit ahead of time.

[Demsrule86]

72. Once they committ

a smart candidate drops out as it is pointless...of course who knows what Bernie will do.

[frylock]

93. Bobby Kennedy was assassinated in June.

Nah, Bernie is smart to stay in the race. You never can tell what might happen.

[bvf]

84. Thank you. n/t

[SFnomad]

87. You can deny reality all you wish ... once Secretary Clinton has the majority of pledged delegates

and she already has the majority of Superdelegates committed to her, she will be considered the presumptive nominee. The exact way that Obama was on June 3rd under the EXACT SAME circumstances. It doesn't matter how much you stomp your feet and keep saying that the Superdelegates haven't voted yet ... it does not matter.

She will not become the official nominee until the convention, but she will be the presumptive nominee on June 7th.

[thesquanderer]

88. I'm not denying reality

You and I are basically in agreement about the likely outcome, i.e. "She will not become the official nominee until the convention, but she will be the presumptive nominee on June 7th." I agree that that is, by far, the most likely scenario.

But if anything in Hillary's campaign goes off the rails between now and the convention (like Bernie getting 70%+ in California or Hillary getting indicted... NEITHER of which I expect to happen, but both of which are not existentially impossible), then the super delegate "commitments" mean nothing. Less even than Hillary's "commitment" to a California debate in May.

So saying that you can't count them as certain until the convention vote happens is not denying reality, it's describing reality.

[thesquanderer]

70. re: "there really is no upside to Secretary Clinton doing another debate"

Last edited Mon May 23, 2016, 12:41 PM - Edit history (1)

I agree... it is unlikely to do anything to help her, and there is some chance it could hurt her (if she stumbles). She's in a pretty safe position at this point.

But the question is also, do you only do the debate if you see a good possible upside to doing it? Or is it sufficient to do it simply because it is what you agreed to do?

[SFnomad]

89. The last thing Secretary Clinton wants is to have her own Rick Perry "ooops" moment n/t

[pmorlan1]

102. There Really is No Upside to Sec. Clinton Doing Another Debate?

You don't think it would be an upside if she actually keeps her word? Wow.

[SFnomad]

104. No, I don't. The Democratic Primary is over. There is no reason for Secretary Clinton to do a

Democratic debate. All a Democratic debate could do now is hurt her. She should be getting ready for the general election debates, because they will be here soon enough.

[Tavarious Jackson]

19. Ignore

is where Bernie needs to be.

[tk2kewl]

24. what other promises that Hillary has made do you suppose she has no intention of keeping?

[Tavarious Jackson]

25. Bernie broke his promise of not going negative.

Now he is saying Hillary is the lesser of two evils and he is inserting himself in a house race in Florida.

[tk2kewl]

26. nice deflection

so do you think she will flip on TTP? minimum wage? bank regulation?

[Tavarious Jackson]

29. No on Minimum wage and bank regulations.

If you look at what she did as senator you will see she did propose to regulate banks before the crash. Minim wage, Bernie plan is not much different. He isn't for $15.00 right off the bat. TPP. IMO is a good thing. I do not see TPP as bad.

[tk2kewl]

30. do you know what ISDSs are and how they work?

Do you think we need more of that or less? No TTP! No more trade deals written by banks and corporations PERIOD.

[tk2kewl]

38. what about SS? do you really think she will "strengthen" it as she claims?

[Tavarious Jackson]

40. Absolutely.

I believe her and I trust her. You should too. Take an honest look at her record.

[tk2kewl]

42. believe me I have

And her husband's record ad well

you do know that Bill was poised to privatize SS with Newt, right?

[Tavarious Jackson]

43. I do know he was a great President

some people will never be happy. Some people look for issues to be unhappy about.

[tk2kewl]

47. which Bill Clinton accomplishments do you cite in your claim of greatness?

[Tavarious Jackson]

52. Economy, jobs, surplus

.. appointed the most diverse cabinet in history! Many things.

[tk2kewl]

56. bubble economy that collapsed almost as soon as he left office

Surplus by slashing social spending.

by the way... do you have an answer to my question about Investor-State Dispute Settlements?

[Tavarious Jackson]

96. To be honest

I have not weighed the pros and cons regarding ISDS. I will look into today and give you my opinion.

[tk2kewl]

86. so no opinion on ISDS?

i can only assume you approve or accept these trade deals without knowing what they are about

[pinebox]

32. It's funny how Hillary supporters say Bernie doesn't help the down ticket

yet here he is, doing just that with DWS opponent lol

[Else You Are Mad]

28. If he 'went negative' as you say...

He would have received more MSM recognition and would have more than likely defeated Clinton by now. Which I think he should have done.

Similarly, pointing out the flaws in a primary opponent is not going negative.

[Tavarious Jackson]

34. It's a matter of opinion.

I disagree I think he is divisive calling the DNC and Hillary corrupt rigged, and "anointed." He lost fair and square. There was no rigging as he says. He has an obsession with everything around him being rigged. Somethings are corrupt and rigged but he takes it to a paranoid level.

There is no benefit to a debate for Hillary. He can NOT endorse her now, after calling her lesser of two evils. So.. What is the point of a debate? She has to put her energy on Trump. Right now! He is trying to get ground game in Ohio but so far Hillary is ahead in Ohio. It would be negligent not to pivot completely to the GE.

[pinebox]

31. Why do you want to ignore Bernie?

So you think the guy who fights for things like civil rights, universal health care, a living wage, free education, maternal leave, unions, holding corporations accountable, green energy, vets and has the #1 rating for being progressive should be ignored?

Are you sure you're on the right website?

[Tavarious Jackson]

35. Hillary has been fighting for those things. Look at her Senate record. nt

[pinebox]

36. This isn't about Hillary. It's about you wanting to ignore Bernie.

Please explain.

[Tavarious Jackson]

37. I did.

Look at my comments.

[pinebox]

46. I have but still why ignore someone who has fought all their life

for the average guy?

I don't care what side you're on, Hillary or Bernie, one can not deny Bernie's accomplishments. he has been there on the front lines (see marching with striking union members) his whole career.

[Tavarious Jackson]

48. I prefer a more aggressive marcher nt

[pinebox]

50. Such as?

[Tavarious Jackson]

53. Such as one who has been actually WORKING at those things and not just talking. nt

[Art_from_Ark]

107. Then that would be Bernie

[Demsrule86]

74. I now dislike Bernie intensely

He is not the nominee and that is a fact...so he hurts every cause he purports to support when he attacks the Democratic nominee...today his campaign guy said Trump is right about his attacks on Hillary. Sorry if I never see Bernie again after this is over politically speaking , it would be too soon. I will support nothing he is involved with...I am a liberal too. I have no idea who or what Bernie is.

[yourpaljoey]

41. Hill has not gotten this week's policy positions yet... funny thing is...

... Jo Biden is assigned to providing those -- and while they did finally
manage to wake him up, he does not know what year it is...
and he thinks the Dem nominee is... Nixon.

[beachbum bob]

44. primary is over and no further need for any debates or townhall....sanders just fooling his

supporters for more money so he can keep a microphone in front of him

[pinebox]

49. That microphone has been packing stadiums

and THAT is how you change the system. You get people to actually listen to your message and to participate in the entire political process.

[MFM008]

103. I agree

only because a debate waters her position down and seems like weakness.
I believe he will continue with the "lesser of 2 evils" crap.
I wouldn't do it if I was her.

[apcalc]

55. What good purpose

Would a debate serve, especially one on Fox ?
I can see nothing good.

[rjsquirrel]

57. Why should she bother?

Really it would be dumb strategy former since she already has the nomination locked up.


Hail Mary full of grace....

[LaydeeBug]

58. He is no longer viable, and hence, no need to debate with him. nt

[bklyncowgirl]

59. A "Donahue" style debate would be the way to go. We already know their stances on the issues.

The Donahue debate took place during the New York Primary in 1992--one of the nastiest inter party fights ever. Bill Clinton and then former, now current California Governor Jerry Brown were going at each other hammer and tongs, slinging mud and inuendo. It was expected that their last debate would be a slugfest of epic proportions.

Phil Donahue hosted the debate and was expected to act as a standard moderator--instead he said essentially "OK you guys, talk to each other about the issues facing this country--I'm just here to break up any fistfights. What followed was one of the most illuminating hours I've ever seen, two highly intelligent capable leaders talking about how they would address the nation's problems.

I was a fervent Brown supporter and this debate did not change my support but for the first time I saw Bill Clinton as something other than a polished, blow dried type of candidate, a man with a deep knowledge of policy as well as politics. Mind you any warm feelings any warm feelings for Bubba vanished when a few weeks later a group of anonymous State Troopers went on TV accusing Brown of tolerating drug use by then girlfriend Linda Ronsdadt and perhaps sharing a joint or to himself. The Clinton campaign of course denied all knowledge of this attck--yeah right. For months I flirted with Ross Perot or voting Socialist Workers or Libertarian in protet but in the end decided to vote for Clinton largely because of what I saw in that debate.

If Hillary really wants to gain the support of Bernie's legions, this sort of debate might be a way to break through. It would also be a way to reintroduce herself to the general public. Let us see her depth of knowledge and a little of the grit she showed in those Senate hearings.

Would she do it? Probably not. She's too cautious and the upside, she wins California and puts Sanders away once and forever may not be enough to take the risk. Besides I see little evidence that she feels the need to do anything besides grind Sanders and his supporters faces into the dirt. Would Sanders do it? In a heartbeat, after all what does he have to lose?

So, think about it Hill and Bernie. Get out from behind those podiums and talk to each other before the people.

[LoverOfLiberty]

60. She absolutely should not debate him on Fox

And it is disingenuous to think that he should be able to unilaterally set the rules of the debate.

[asuhornets]

62. I hope she doesn't debate him ...it will change nothing...n/t

[workinclasszero]

64. So fox "news" and Bernie haz a sad eh?

No free publicity for broke ass Bernie's quixotic, dead man walking campaign.

And Fox haz a sad as well...their bagger vision of the moderators, Trump and Sanders ganging up on Hillary all night is totally not gonna happen.

[anotherproletariat]

108. You got it! nt

[Beausoir]

113. Yep. n/t

[rozdeep]

68. If she doesn't keep this promise, why should anyone believe she will keep any?

[COLGATE4]

75. Because most adults look at the circumstances before making

any judgement.

[still_one]

77. A debate's purpose are to inform people. People know exactly where each candidate stands

There is no need for more debates. They are a waste of time, and that fox news, the official republican network, wants to hold the debate, is not to convey any new information, but to create a circus atmosphere like they did with the republican debates, and try to divide the Democrats even more

[COLGATE4]

83. I completely agree. This nonsense about "how can you believe her

because she once said she'd debate BS in California?" rankles me, as if adults can't (and don't) change their mind constantly depending on changing circumstances. She's perfectly right to not agree to debate him in California for all the reasons you mention.

[still_one]

85. Absolutely Colgate, thanks

[Demsrule86]

76. Bernie promised to run a campaign based on issues

and has spent the entire primary in attack mode...so he has no right to say anything.

[MyNameGoesHere]

73. The presumptive nominee doesn't have to debate

the loser of the 2016 Democrat Primary.

[pdsimdars]

78. Hey, man, that Sanders guy really knows how to tell it like it is. Unafraid. Love it.

[3hummingbirds]

90. debate

Maybe he will remind neighbors to the South about fracking. Remember the methane leak in S. Cal?
She promised a debate in California so bring it on. Go Bernie.

[SidDithers]

80. Bernie should check the pledged delegate count...nt

Sid

[KingFlorez]

81. I recall when he didn't want any debates after New Hampshire

At this point, there is nothing left to debate. The time for that is over.

[tabasco]

82. Wow. Another whole debate to decide the potential leader of the free world.

[frylock]

95. I keep reading how people don't trust Clinton.

For the life of me, I can't understand why that is.

[AzDar]

98. Astonishing that there are people here applauding this...Someone who reneges on a deal is a LIAR

And not to be TRUSTED.

[anotherproletariat]

109. What do you want to bet he will still be whining about this a couple of years from now,

when someone does a 'where is he now' interview.

[bonemachine]

116. You know who else skips debates?

Donald Trump...