At the risk of alienating some of you good folks......

[Red Mountain]

I first posted this in the Sanders thread. Perhaps it merits a broader view?

http://www.newsobserver.com/opinion/op-ed/article80314017.html#1

It’s not hard to see that the Hillary Clinton forces are becoming impatient. Bernie Sanders acts like he didn’t get the memo. He continues to add surprising wins to his totals, looking to fight on, as the national convention approaches. Gigantic, fervent crowds greet him at every venue, as if they fail to realize he’s thought to be dead. Politics, in 2016, marches to mysterious drums.

I, for one, will be surprised if this changes. Traditional electoral etiquette may suggest it’s time for Sanders to fold his tent, declare fealty to the Clinton cause and deliver his passion-driven disciples to the former secretary of state for deployment. I’m not sure he can bring himself to do it. If he does, I’m even less certain they’ll listen. He may walk to the endorsing platform alone.

The first reason is obvious. Sanders and Clinton have dramatically different visions of politics.

More at link.....

Gene Nichol is Boyd Tinsley Distinguished Professor at UNC-Chapel Hill.

[jeff47]

1. This nicely describes why many Clinton supporters "just do not get it".

However, I suspect few of them will "get it", even after reading this.

[upaloopa]

26. There is nothing for us to get. We have our point of view that I could

say you don't get.

The majority of voters have endorsed Hillary. That seems to be what you don't get.

[jeff47]

31. Why are you here?

You've repeatedly declared you do not need us nor our votes. So what's the point of this post?

[kerry-is-my-prez]

42. Opaloopa? Or Hillary Clinton? People here on this site? Many supporters here, including me have

repeatedly have said we need/want your votes. Just because a few people here (who do not represent Hillary or her campaign) say things like that I wouldn't take marching orders from them....

[upaloopa]

49. You don't represent Bernie supporters. You represent you. Most Bernie supporters will vote for

Hillary in the general. You sour grape people can do what you want. There aren't enough of you to matter.

[cui bono]

47. Yes, there is. History will show you what it is.

Hillary supporters are on the wrong side of history. You think this is just about two candidates but it is so much bigger than that. You must see it, it must be denial, because it is obvious who has the fire and who is waking up the people. This isn't about that person though, it's about their message. It's about how he has shown the people we don't have to live with a big money corporate candidate after all, we CAN have the govt beholden to the people. We just need someone who is willing to do that to step up to the plate. Well one has. Many more have for other positions. Many more still will.

The people are tired of crony capitalism and thankfully they've been shown we don't have to deal with it if we continue the good fight against it. Hillary and her supporters are in the way of that happening. They are slowing down progress. They are for continuing things just the way they are at a time when the people are hungry, desperate for change. As with all struggles for equality and fairness in the world, history will show this to be true.

.

[chwaliszewski]

51. Spot on!

+27

[840high]

60. I like that +27

[chwaliszewski]

61. It's what I donate to Bernie.

[nadinbrzezinski]

2. Thanks, good read

[Ohioblue22]

3. He's doing a hell of a job losing to hillary

[Red Mountain]

4. That's part of the point of dragging it out....

[Cobalt Violet]

18. she's doing a hell of job getting caugh lying and gettin indicted.

[Ohioblue22]

41. Lol

[cui bono]

48. That's all you got out of that? Again, showing that winning is the only thing that matters to some.

.

[Hoyt]

5. Big tractor pull crowds, that don't show up at polls. What's with that?

I didn't go to McGovern, Carter, Clinton, Kerry, Obama, Clinton, etc., rallies. Didn't have time, and didn't need to hear yelled stump speeches, music, etc. But I voted, as did a lot of others.

[Hoyt]

25. Yeah, all of Berners losses have been conspiracies. Doesn't make me wonder, except about

Berners themselves.

[Bluenorthwest]

23. If people did not vote for him, why has he won every State in this region by good margins?

70,000 people showed up for Obama rally in my State when he was running, they also voted for him and he won, remember? Largest candidate crowds in history belong to Obama, who won. Because people go to rallies then they vote. Sorry that bothers you so but it is insulting when you discount the entire Pacific Rim, Oregon, Washington, Hawaii and Alaska are all with Bernie so far. Next comes California. So he has won all of those states because no one shows up to vote for him?

We have honest election systems here. What do you have?

[oldandhappy]

6. He has not been obedient!! Yippee!!

If she gets the numbers, he can withdraw as she did four days after the last primary. She took time to negotiate SoS. She has nothing to give Bernie so maybe he will up grade his convention spot. And you are absolutely right about his followers being independent minded also, smile.

[Joob]

7. There have been a lot of things we have done in this country, "Traditionally", That wasn't right.

Believe it or not, This Election is about Fighting the Corruption in our elections, that's what it's about, and that's what'll be told in history books. Hillary, no matter what, even if she wins. Will not come out of this looking good.

We are fighting corruption, not Hillary.

Will we learn that when we determine the nominee?
After during the election?
Or once it's all done?

Idk, but I'm fighting for, before, as any sane person would. I foresee what's going to happen Freewill remains.
No, I'm not clairvoyant. I just don't turn a blind eye to what's actually happening.

Let's look at the facts.

1. (And this one is big for us Democrats) The Republicans have chosen a so called "Anti-Establishment" nominee)
These are people who vote Republican. On The other side of the spectrum of Democrats.

Yet we also want the same thing, Anti-Establishment (well about half of Democrats at least and x2 Independents)
(opposite sides wanting the same thing is huge, btw.)

2. Bigotry is easily dismissive in 2016 Corruption is not.

What this means is we won't allow it. For instance, a law somehow got passed about the bathroom thing with transgenders. Are people agreeing with it? Sure.. Not as much as the people disagreeing with it though. Much more there. And it's cost the state. These kind of things won't happen again because of people like Bernie Sanders, who tell people to stand up. That law will go up in flames like the people who defend it. It not only is hateful, but it does not make sense. If they want transgender men out of the bathroom so much, how would that work for a woman who identifies and looks like a man? Completely illogical. People don't tolerate things like this, well the majority. And Bernie helps raise awareness to keep this Bigotry in check, WITH the people. Not just by himself.

What I'm getting at is, in this day and age, Bigotry is easily identifiable. And especially because of Bernie's Political Revolution, waking up people to politics, it's going to get shut down even more in the future, regardless if Bernie is President.
Can't put people back to sleep so easily. However, corruption passes by with ease in this day and age. Take Hillary for example, people still vote for her.

*Now at the same time, people vote for Trump, but remember, he's under a disguise as "Anti-Establishment"

A lot of people place their faith in the government currently running, I put my faith more into people

[pacalo]

8. Mainstream media is being IGNORED by the masses.

Gigantic, fervent crowds greet him at every venue, as if they fail to realize he’s thought to be dead.

[kerry-is-my-prez]

43. Some of us just aren't fervent. I don't believe in organized religion or in worshipping ANYBODY.

I did go vote - which is what should really count.

[Doctor_J]

9. Dems who aren't satisfied with a corrupt, conservative Wall Street hack haven't given up yet

Oh, the horrors.

[libodem]

27. May I quote you?

This is epic.

[Doctor_J]

28. Be my guest. I'm a Democrat for a few more weeks anyway

A 40 year marriage is coming to an end. I can't take the abuse any more.

[brush]

30. Be careful of the door on your way out.

[Doctor_J]

32. You're lucky. If Mrs Clinton goes to jail before Nov, you can just vote republican and get the

same policies as you would have with Hillary. For those of us who don't want corruption, right wing government, and corporate/big money rule, choices will be meager.

[brush]

33. Yeah, yeah! We've heard it all campaign — Hillary is a republican . . .

yet her and Sanders voted the same 93% of the time.

You support him.

I support her. I would, however, vote for him if he won.

I suspect you would never vote for Clinton once she wins, and make no mistake, she's going to win.

That's the way it is.

And again, watch that door on your way out.

[libdem4life]

34. Yes (if) she waltzes into the White House with Republican money.

Just guessing but perhaps breaking another glass ceiling. Bernie sends real emails to real people to give starting at $5. What a schmuck, right?

[brush]

38. I told you I'd vote for him if he wins.

However, since you bought up the donations, it's questionable, IMO, for his campaign to keep asking for donations when they know there's no way for him to win the nomination anymore.

[libdem4life]

39. Not at all. Crystal balls don't tend to be politically viable.

Flame away, but Ms. Clinton has a habit of doing and saying dumb things. And tedious at seems, there are still unresolved issues oustanding. Many supporters understand this. I wouldn't invest much more than opinion at this time.

[brush]

40. Math is politically viable though.

Last edited Mon May 30, 2016, 01:38 PM - Edit history (1)

[libdem4life]

44. Too much power given to Math.

The FBI hopefully could care less about Math. Math tells us that 30,000 emails were deleted. That surely does not end the story as, astonishingly, they are being recovered.

There's a difference as to how Math plays out.

[brush]

45. First of all, the FBI doesn't indict. Secondly, there was no criminal intent, so no . . .

indictment is forthcoming from the DOJ.

[libodem]

35. Understood

[

[SMC22307]

10. The NC GOP tried to shut him down...

Gene Nichol has released a statement on the Board of Governors' vote to close the UNC poverty center. "An impressive array of foundations and private donors has stepped forward to assure that the work of the center, if not the center itself, will continue and markedly expand."

http://www.newsobserver.com/opinion/op-ed/article12479222.html#storylink=cpy

It's good to see him not mincing words re: the Clintons.

Sanders is potently ideological. He has pressed the same economically egalitarian agenda for decades. He runs to do something, not to be it. If someone else could trigger a populist revolt as effectively, he’d likely have given way. I doubt he’s “berned” to be president. He has, though, I’m sure, longed to help create a different kind of society. Forever.

....

She’s one of America’s leading globalists, until, reportedly, she’s not. She hawks international pipelines until she’s horrified by them. She votes for war, then declaims for peace. She demands mass incarceration until she’s appalled by it. She’s Wall Street’s best friend until she detests it. She sells the Lincoln bedroom and embraces super PACs, as she commits to strain money out of politics. It’s a different approach.

....

In fact, concern for those at the bottom was standard Democratic fare until … the Clintons. They were triangulating, third way, deregulating, corporatist, New Democrats – famously “ending” big government, crushing welfare, demanding NAFTA, linking the party to a marriage with Wall Street and Hollywood that mirrored Republican economic policy and removed the interests of the bottom third from the American political agenda.

....

It’s understandably nauseating, therefore, for the Sanders folks to be told it is their obligation to make the nomination process easier for Clinton. When that includes lectures about the high ground, it is more than activists ought be asked to bear. I hope they come around. Trump both humiliates and endangers America. But if they don’t, it’ll be important to remember where much of the fault lies. Draining politics of its meaning, too, has its costs.

http://www.newsobserver.com/opinion/op-ed/article80314017.html#1#storylink=cpy

Thanks for posting.

[Doctor_J]

29. And now the DINOS. Amazing how often those two groups have the same agenda

[SMC22307]

46. NC's unemployment rate is higher than the national average... 5.4% I think.

UNC's Nichol, and Reverend Barber of Moral Mondays, have taken the NC GOP head-on. Teachers/education, joblessness, no Medicaid expansion, regressive tax policy, slashed unemployment benefits, etc. To hear members of Democratic UNDERGROUND toss out "sore loserman" at those dedicated toward making a more egalitarian society is sickening. And they're Hillary fans... imagine that! Be proud, folks.

[geek tragedy]

11. Gee, an author who hates the Clintons endorses Sore Loserism.

There is nothing the Sanders crowd can do to make it easier or harder for Clinton to win the nomination. She will clinch the nomination on June 7 regardless of how anyone on Team Bernie feels about it.

They can make it easier or harder for Clinton to defeat Donald Trump.

That's their relevance, just like it's our relevance.

[mac56]

17. "We can do this the hard way, or the easy way."

Good lord. Could you come across just a little bit more thug-like?

[geek tragedy]

19. Stating mattematical reality is "thuggish?" nt

[mac56]

21. "Pretty nice country you got here.

It would be a shame if anything was to .... HAPPEN to it.... "

[geek tragedy]

22. No one was threatening the country.

Just pointing out the nomination has already been decided, because most voting has already occurred.

[Bluenorthwest]

24. Basic reality: Nomination has not been decided, had it been Clinton would have claimed it as her own

which she has not done because she has no legal standing to claim it. Why is that? It is as yet not decided. Do you seriously think she or anyone else running for that nomination would hesitate to claim it when it was actually won? I sure don't. I have never, ever seen a candidate who hesitated. Have you?
What I have seen is Hillary Clinton explaining why she should stay in the race until June of 08, she said that no other candidate had ever been called on to drop out, she said that was historically unprecedented and only done to her, but her boosters sure as shit do it to Bernie. Hillary also of course invoked RFK to make her point all the more intense, I remember that. Don't you? She said it was wrong to call on candidates to drop out. But that's what you are doing, and that's Classic Clinton Double Standards.

[SwampG8r]

20. Sore loserism wow

Totally coopting rw terminology to push clinton.
I bet you were.big on sore.loserism in 2000 amirite?
Its midnight everyone pull off your masks.

[snagglepuss]

12. Terrific read. Thanks for posting. KnR

[Betty Karlson]

13. great article. Thanks for the link. eom

[senz]

15. The highlights alone speak volumes --

The Clintons are likely more responsible for the Democratic Party’s modern drift than any other humans

They looked hard at a traditional party commitment to low-income people, concluded it jeopardized their electoral fortunes and determined to abandon it

It’s understandably nauseating, therefore, for the Sanders folks to be told it is their obligation to make the nomination process easier for Clinton

[Scuba]

16. K&R

[libdem4life]

36. Hey...New talking point for the day. "sore loserism".

[QC]

50. Actually it's not a new talking point. It's about 15 years old.

[libdem4life]

53. Well, it is to me. I'm not even sure who that's about.

But it is surely there. I haven't seen it on this board before. Any way, it's bad manners.

[QC]

54. That's from the 2000 election.

The Republican talking point of the day, which is now, as so often happens lately, a Clinton talking point, was "Sore Loser! You lost! Get over it!"

Pictures of crying babies were also popular. Everybody's crazy right wing uncle was forwarding this to everyone in his AOL address book back then.

[libdem4life]

55. Thanks. I was mercifully not so engaged back then. Not so this time.

[QC]

56. It was an ugly time.

DU was founded in the aftermath of the stolen election, and at that time we opposed things like pointless wars, blanket government surveillance, efforts to circumvent FOIA, corporate welfare, and the like.

Clearly, a lot has changed.

[libdem4life]

57. Indeed. Time marches on. Seems to be getting a bit touchy

this time around, as well.

[tokenlib]

58. And considering that Gore actually won....it's a reminder to never give up...

...even when they tell you to....

[QC]

59. Good point. n/t

[Owl]

37. Excellent read. Thx!

K&R

[passiveporcupine]

52. Thanks RedMountain

great article.