Why didn't Sanders release his delegates?

[sufrommich]

http://www.denverpost.com/2008/08/24/clinton-to-release-delegates-to-obama/


Clinton did in a primary that was a lot closer.

[democrattotheend]

1. What good would that do?

Almost all of them would vote for him anyway.

[sufrommich]

3. It's going to create more drama and divisiveness. That's why

she released them in 2008.

[speaktruthtopower]

7. Right..

if he releases them and they vote for him anyway.

[democrattotheend]

21. In this case, I think not having a roll call would do more harm than good

Most of Hillary's delegates in 2008 were big donors/party insiders who have been to conventions before and had a stake in going with the party's nominee if they wanted to remain relevant.

Most of Bernie's delegates are first time delegates, not big donors or party insiders, and will probably be more upset/act out more if they feel their voices are suppressed.

Even in 2008, many Hillary delegates and supporters were upset that she released her delegates and shut down the roll call. Some of them felt cheated. I don't think it's in anyone's interest for Bernie delegates to feel cheated.

Just let the process play out the way it was designed to play out. Hillary has more delegates and will win, so I am not sure what people are fretting about.

[merrily]

37. we have to fret because nothing Sanders does is ever good enough for DU. After Bernie's

speech last night, Shumer looked like the cat that ate the canary. He was thrilled. He said "Now, I know we'll win" or words to that effect.

So, of course, this morning, we're looking for the next bad thing about Bernie.

[tblue37]

38. Bernie was great last night. He is going to work hard for the GE, including

campaigning for progressive down ticket candidates.

[merrily]

40. Sure, but this morning, he's a problem again. It never gets old, either.

[cyberpunk]

71. ++

[Demsrule86]

46. I don't think so...having bad behavior during a roll call would be worse. NT

[Lil Missy]

65. It would show he's a good sport and a team player, instead of

a sore loser. He set the example for what we're seeing now.

[leftofcool]

2. He asked for a roll call vote and it was granted.

[Orsino]

55. Yep. Letting them vote at the party's convention makes them Democrats...

...with one fewer excuse for not getting aboard.

I know revenge fantasies die hard, but when the Daily Show used "Submission Accomplished" as a tagline for the RNC, it was a joke. Why should Dems not treat people with respect who cared to show up?

[MoonRiver]

4. Hope springs eternal.

[bigwillq]

5. Clinton is still going to be the nominee regardless.

I am fine with him not releasing. I would be fine with him releasing. Maybe they made some kind of deal.

[geek tragedy]

6. I don't see the harm, his delegates need to see

that roll call happen in order to be convinced he got outvoted.

I don't understand the mentality, but apparently a lot of his delegates still think he could be the nominee.

So, there needs to be some kind of process for them to, well, process reality.

[sufrommich]

9. Hillary stopped the roll call vote in 2008 in the spirit of unity.

She literally called for it to be stopped midway through the vote.

[geek tragedy]

13. He may do the same thing tonight.

I have zero problem with Sanders, he's fighting to bring his supporters along. I don't envy him.

[democrattotheend]

23. Doing what Hillary did in 2008 might backfire

The type of delegates Bernie brought are very different from Hillary's 2008 delegates. I think they will cause more ruckus if they don't have the chance to vote for Bernie. Better to let things play out and hopefully they will see that as impressively far as Bernie came, at the end of the day Hillary got more votes and more delegates.

[geek tragedy]

27. Probably. As I noted above, the need to see the vote

through is greater for a lot of Sanders delegates, who are likely new to the process and for whom it hasn't sunk in that Clinton is the nominee.

[tblue37]

39. Precisely. nt

[avaistheone1]

8. I think it is being done to honor Sanders, and then

the delegates will be immediately released.

I have seen this done before in numerous conventions.

[backscatter712]

17. This. n/t

[scheming daemons]

10. Let his delegates have their vote. That's the way the process should work.

Hillary is ok with it..... It will allow her to pick the state that "puts her over the top".


I'm guessing she'll pick Pennsylvania.

[sufrommich]

12. I think it will be New York. nt

[scheming daemons]

15. I think she'll want a "swing state" to have the honor. PA, FL, OH, MI, VA, or NC

Just my guess.

[fun n serious]

11. I wonder why Hillary was not HONORED in this way 2008?

[sufrommich]

14. She didn't want it. Unity was more important than

being divisive.

[NurseJackie]

20. Priorities vs vanities.

[avaistheone1]

29. It isn't divisive.

It is a convention tradition in circumstances like this.

[fun n serious]

59. I don't remember her needing to be cradled like this....

[avaistheone1]

61. It isn't cradling. It is a small gesture.

HC didn't start a mass youth movement either. The roll call is a tribute to all the young supporters as well.

Hillary made her choice and can't cry over spllt milk now.

[fun n serious]

63. I don't think Hillary is the one who is crying,,

and yes... 2008 was a movement. She had more than 13 million votes in 2008

[scheming daemons]

16. It was her choice. She decided to be the good soldier.

[democrattotheend]

70. She was

Her name was placed into nomination and many voted for her, until she came out and shut it down. It was a magnanimous gesture but one that I don't think Bernie should try to replicate. Hillary's delegates were mostly party insiders who see the convention as just for show; Bernie's delegates want to see the democratic process unfold. Even in 2008, some Hillary supporters felt cheated by the roll call not getting to play out.

[Attorney in Texas]

19. It behooves us all for the Sanders delegates to see that they are part of the selection process and

not isolated from the process that chose Hillary.

Sanders speech was effective last night in part because he took his supporters on a journey from the history of his campaign, through the process, and culminating in how the next step in the movement requires defeating Trump and electing Hillary.

The roll call is part of that same process. Allowing the Sanders delegates to see how they are part of the process that chose Hillary helps a higher percentage of Sanders supporters transition to Hillary supporters.

[bettyellen]

22. Except a few are in a fantasy world where they don't realize it is over...

And we are catering to their foolishness, basically.

[Attorney in Texas]

31. This is part of the process to bring them from that fantasy world to the real world. Those few who

do not make the transition are probably better characterized as Green Party members who had a Democrat-curious fling this summer. In the end, the Green Party will total between 3% and 5% of the vote. It happens every election cycle. There is no cause to panic about it.

[bettyellen]

73. If you're merely Dem- curious, you should learn before making the leap to delegate? Just a thought.

[Attorney in Texas]

74. Sometimes the newly converted have the most fervor

[bettyellen]

75. I don't think delegates should be dabbling a bit.

[Attorney in Texas]

76. Democracy is not always predictable. The Republican nominee is a bit of a dabbler

[avaistheone1]

25. Hear ye. Those young folks are the future of the party

and of our country. That roll call is the right and decent thing to do.

[democrattotheend]

26. I agree with you

Based on my conversations with some of the Bernie delegates, I think any effort to short-circuit the roll call, even by Bernie himself, is likely to backfire. Let the process play out as it is supposed to. I am tired of this mentality that the convention has to be a perfect infomercial for the nominee. The parties' efforts to make their conventions like that is what causes the media to go stirring up/exaggerating drama.

[sufrommich]

28. Do you understand why Hillary stopped the roll call halfway through it?

The vote would have been much closer that it will be this time around and she opted not to show the country a divided convention.

[bluedye33139]

32. But she's a Democrat

Hillary Clinton has been a Democrat most of her adult life, and she cares about the future of the party.

[auntpurl]

67. BINGO.

[Attorney in Texas]

34. Hillary's '08 supporters WERE the establishment. They did not need to see confirmation that they

were part of the system.

Also, there was not an email leak that gave rise to Hillary's '08 supporters feeling skeptical of the system.

There are goals accomplished by the roll call in '16 that were not present in '08 and so it makes much more sense in '16 than it did in '08.

[Bluenorthwest]

41. And yet she was permitted to let that vote roll on to the point that she stopped it.

This year we have not yet gotten to that point but some seem to think they know the future. I remember 2008.

[NCTraveler]

24. I find this to be admirable and think it will help bring about closure.

Their voices will be heard at the convention. I like that. I also like what Clinton did.

Sanders knows his future is limited. Eight years ago that was not the case for Clinton. Two completely different times and situations.

Many of the Sanders delegates behaved admirably yesterday without giving up their values. A small group were absolute scum. We can't lump them all together. People on the floor with the mindset of our good friend Armstead should be recognized this year. It is personally important and I believe a necessary part of this years convention.

[Inspired]

78. This!

[kestrel91316]

30. Because he knows the BoBs won't sit down and shut up

without him throwing them this bone. They get to yell and scream as the vote gets counted and then when they see that he lost by vote they will have zero justification for saying one more damned thing.

I think he's smart by doing this.

Disclaimer: I am a huge Bernie supporter but I acknowledge that he didn't win the nomination and so Hillary gets my support against Trump now.

[highprincipleswork]

33. Unity? Surrender on your own terms is what you want, I guess. How about a little give and take?

You don't get to dictate what other people do. And if you'd like them on your side, in the end, it would be good to have a little mutual understanding.

That's what apparently has been happening between Clinton and Sanders camps, and I applaud it. The man earned almost half the vote, and under difficult circumstances.

I thought, in balance, yesterday was a wonderful coming together, despite the glitches. Hope the convention continues to be an inspiring, uniting, uplifting event.

[frazzled]

35. Because he wants to hear his name called out 50 more times

That's it. For all the good it will do.

[democrattotheend]

45. More importantly, his supporters want to hear it

Having talked to many of his delegates and seen the way a few of them acted last night, I think nominating Hillary without placing Bernie's name into nomination would do a lot more harm than good.

Bernie gave a hell of an endorsement for Hillary last night, he texted and e-mailed his supporters not to protest on the convention floor, and he went around to delegate breakfasts today urging them not to boo on the floor. Will anything he does ever be good enough for you?

[frazzled]

52. As Bertolt Brecht wrote

We all make the bed we must lie in
And tuck ourselves into it too.
And if somebody kicks that will be me, dear
And if someone gets kicked that will be you

Bernie Sanders created his monsters step by step throughout this year, and they have taken on lives of their own. They are not few in number, and they are his elected representatives. He owns them, he must live with the consequences. An eleventh-hour text to behave is too little, too late. It took him an entire month after the end of the primaries to appear with the duly elected nominee, during which time he continued to stoke the flames of a "contested" convention and promise the continuation of the "revolution." He never conceded the election; he never released his delegates to make up their own minds. So no, I'm not satisfied right now. I feel sorry for him for having spawned our own worst enemies and being to weak to bring them back from the brink.

[democrattotheend]

54. If he had endorsed a month ago, it would not have helped

It probably would have made things worse. The way he did it, he was able to maintain credibility with most though obviously not all of his supporters by showing that he didn't just roll over and instead fought to get her on board with some of his ideas before giving his support. That gives him a lot more credibility as a surrogate on her behalf.

Besides, I am sure if he had endorsed a month ago you would have still complained that he didn't say the exact right words or had the wrong expression on his face or maybe even wore the wrong color tie.

[pangaia]

60. You clearly know nothing,

absolutely nothing about Bernard Sanders.

[tblue37]

36. He realizes he has to let the deadenders have their moment. If he tried to push them

without letting them cast their votes, they would go nuts and refuse to get on board. Better to let them have their say, because he knows it won't prevent her nomination.

It is a delicate high wire act, and he is doing a great job with it, both with last night's speech and by acknowledging their desire to cast their votes and have them heard, especially after the email leaks have them thinking that many Bernie voters' concerns were not heard during the primaries.

I started watching conventions at age 14 in 1964. Back then during the first roll call the delegates didn't necessarily vote for the one that everyone knew would win.

Hillary will win. She has the delegates. But the Bernie voters, at least most of them, will now leave the convention without feeling they were steamrolled by not even being allowed to officially state their preference once on the floor.

Believe it or not, this acknowledgement, which will have NO effect on the nomination outcome, will go far toward folding most Bernie delegates into the GE for Hillary.

[floriduck]

42. Holy Shxt, I can't believe this is even an issue. WTF?

[Motley13]

43. They are going to raise a ruckus

no matter what, probably less if the delegates get to vote for him, otherwise, they will say the fix is in again.

[Adrahil]

44. Rumor was, he was going to...

But he reconsidered after the childish outbursts yesterday. He decided, I think to let the Berners have one final cathartic moment.

His delegates really WANT to cast their ballots for him. I think it's silly, but I get it. Let 'em cast their ballot. Then let's see if they move to support the nominee.

[democrattotheend]

47. I would want to if I were a delegate

I would not disrupt the convention the way some of them did - I was pretty upset about the disruptive ones myself. But I would want the chance to vote for him, just as many Hillary supporters wanted that chance in 2008. I know some felt cheated when she shut it down.

[Adrahil]

58. Well, I think it's pointless at this point....

... but campaigns are very emotional things. Bernie's more than most. I say let 'em vote. Let 'em have that moment.

[procon]

48. He's showboating, letting his supporters cling to the fantasy that they can still win.

Eventually the moment will arrive when Sanders announces that he is giving all his delegates to Hillary, and then all his passionate, but ill advised and hopelessly naive supporters, will feel betrayed and disillusioned by a political process that they clearly did not understand. Let's just hope they don't tear the place down in their rage.

[democrattotheend]

49. Nothing he does will ever be good enough for some of you

Despite him giving her a full-throated, well-reasoned endorsement last night designed to appeal to his supporters, imploring them not to protest on the convention floor, and going around this morning to delegation breakfasts telling people that it's easy to boo but hard to look your kids in the eye if Trump wins, you are still complaining about him and accusing him of "showboating". Unbelievable.

[PoutrageFatigue]

53. I know right? 'Unity for thee, but not for me'...

Really stupid and totally not helpful.

[procon]

57. He's a politician. He lost. I don't owe him a thing, yeah?

I have no sympathies if he's having problems controlling his own peeps now, none whatsoever. He made his bed, and now he has to lay in it.

[Gothmog]

50. Right now there is a roll call vote scheduled for tonight

[BobbyDrake]

51. Vanity and ego. nt

[Tatiana]

56. Sanders supporters need to feel their voices (and their votes) count.

I don't see a problem with this. Bernie supporters will realize that he simply did not have the votes to win. This will hopefully, for some, provide some closure and motivation to move forward.

[stopbush]

62. One might question the judgement of a candidate demanding yet another vote

on the world stage where the only seeable outcome is for said candidate to come up on the very short end of the stick. A glutton for punishment perhaps?

Whatever floats your boat, I guess.

[Agnosticsherbet]

64. Give them a chance to cast their vote for Sanders.

Release the pressure.

[Justice]

66. I am totally fine with the roll call vote.

[Paladin]

68. Enough coddling of these impossible-to-please Sanders people.

Let them have their damn vote tonight. Then let Bernie nominate Hillary. End of story.

[MyNameGoesHere]

69. I say let him keep them as a consolation prize

hell let them go first even, all of them. Just in one fell swoop do it, then we can move on to the real deal.

[JI7]

72. i think because some of his supporters would have not went along

Some of these are people who got angry over a black congress member talKing about civil rights.

[panader0]

77. He's keeping his word.

He said the campaign was going to the convention.
He's backing those who backed him.

[LonePirate]

79. It gives the Sanders delegates an opportunity to vote and be part of the process.

It has no impact on the outcome, so why not? It may not be ideal from a united front perspective but allowing them to have their votes counted is a viable bridge to build.

[VOX]

80. My guess is that it's to "offset" the Russian hack...

At least this way, every vote will have a voice. It's the fair thing to do, given the unprecedented situation.

[glennward]

81. They would allow him to. I think it would have made them even more angry with him. nt

[democrattotheend]

82. I agree

I remember a lot of Hillary's delegates were angry in 2008 when she released them, and those were mostly party insiders who understood that the roll call is usually symbolic.

Even if Bernie released his delegates, I can't imagine any of his pledged delegates switching to Hillary. Certainly not the ones I met. Most of his superdelegates are already going to vote for Hillary. So I don't see what good it would do for him to release his delegates.