Activists Urge Clinton Campaign to Challenge Election Results in 3 Swing States

[AmericanMan1958]

Zeynep Tufekci ‏@zeynep 18m18 minutes ago
Wowze. I've not looked into this myself. But if Halderman says there should be an audit, there should be an audit.
Could this be way Trump is saying leave Hillary alone and No Special Prosecutor?

Hillary Clinton is being urged by a group of prominent computer scientists and election lawyers to call for a recount in three swing states won by Donald Trump, New York has learned. The group, which includes voting-rights attorney John Bonifaz and J. Alex Halderman, the director of the University of Michigan Center for Computer Security and Society, believes they’ve found persuasive evidence that results in Wisconsin, Michigan, and Pennsylvania may have been manipulated or hacked. The group is so far not speaking on the record about their findings and is focused on lobbying the Clinton team in private.

Last Thursday, the activists held a conference call with Clinton campaign chairman John Podesta and campaign general counsel Marc Elias to make their case, according to a source briefed on the call. The academics presented findings showing that in Wisconsin, Clinton received 7 percent fewer votes in counties that relied on electronic-voting machines compared with counties that used optical scanners and paper ballots. Based on this statistical analysis, Clinton may have been denied as many as 30,000 votes; she lost Wisconsin by 27,000. While it’s important to note the group has not found proof of hacking or manipulation, they are arguing to the campaign that the suspicious pattern merits an independent review — especially in light of the fact that the Obama White House has accused the Russian government of hacking the Democratic National Committee.

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2016/11/activists-urge-hillary-clinton-to-challenge-election-results.html

[kydo]

1. I posted the same article. We rock. But yes I thought the same about the orange man

I don't think he wants anyone really looking at the election. And if he put her on trail it probably would. So for his con to win the election to work there can't be an audit or anything. Also more then likely unless it turned into a kangaroo court she would have beat the charge and that would make orange man not happy.

[AmericanMan1958]

2. Yes I seen we did.

I was thinking about deleting mine.
But I feel there is some merit behind Trump motives.

I just posted in General Discussion; Have you heard of GAMERGATE

Please check it out. My son is a gamer and was telling me about something strange going on.
Please check it out. Would love to know your opinion on the matter.

[kydo]

4. don't delete

better chance more people see it

and I will check it out.

[SickOfTheOnePct]

3. So where is the rest of the data?

Which counties? Were these counties that Obama won or lost before? What was the percentage of votes he received before?

This just smacks of desperation, IMO.

[AmericanMan1958]

7. On twitter there is some data being share out of Wisconsin.

More votes counted then ppl voted.
It has been the buzz all afternoon.
I don't know how to post screen shots in DU.
I find it almost impossible to prove true voter tampering.
Was more commenting on the sudden change in Trump's position of Hillary's being investigated.
Could this be what they are fear.

[KewlKat]

8. do you have a twitter link? or something?

thanks

[AmericanMan1958]

11. This is a different link, but shows what I was speaking to.

https://twitter.com/ElectProject/status/801084482153512960?lang=en

Was this afternoon I seen the original post, will continue looking for that post.

[KewlKat]

12. i'll check out your link and post if you find the other.

thank you.

[AmericanMan1958]

13. Thanks

[AmericanMan1958]

16. Here is the main Link

Looks like the WI college students found this..
They are all a buzz. Even if it is much to do about nothing
Great to see young activist taking action.
https://twitter.com/LatishaOrtiz54/status/800794295515000832?lang=en

[SickOfTheOnePct]

25. Yeah the county corrected the returns

The correct numbers are on the county website.

[AmericanMan1958]

28. Thanks

I seen that, the students are pissed.
Upset they change numbers after errors were found.
People aren't going to trust the outcomes of elections if this keeps up.

[SickOfTheOnePct]

30. But there isn't any reason for them to be pissed

I'm guessing they've never worked an election, but I have - many of them, and it's always the same. The polls are closed, poll book counts have to be reconciled with voter card counts, ballots counts are being added, etc. Then, usually within 30 minutes to an hour of when the polls close, you have to call in the first returns to the county's central election office. Those numbers then get posted as unofficial results.

Being human, being tired and being in a hurry, mistakes sometimes happen; numbers are transposed when they're called in, or when they're written down, or when they're posted, people are looking at rows of numbers and put a number on the wrong row, etc.

It isn't anything intentional, but mistakes happen. Unfortunately, way too many people take the unofficial results, potential mistakes and all, as gospel, and then when mistakes are found and corrected, the cries of "CONSPIRACY!" start.

[KewlKat]

14. Interesting. In that twitter link I found the following -

Matthew Aubrey
‏@mmaubrey7

@ElectProject @techman01 just called the govt accountability board of Wisconsin and they said a recount is in progress. This # 608 261 2028



so is WI already recounting? and is it for the entire state? or just certain counties.....think we call that WI number tomorrow and find out exactly what they are recounting.


also saw this -
:large

[DFW]

5. I wish she would, too

If for no other reason than to expose any wrongdoing this time around, and give Tramp even less of a genuine mandate than he has now, which is just about zero.

[athena]

17. Elections matter. Every vote should count.

If Hillary and the Democratic Party don't demand a recount or an investigation, how can we urge anyone to vote again? Many people already don't vote because they don't think their vote would make any difference. If there is a suggestion that the election has been hacked, and no one does an investigation, there will be even less reason to vote, and we will be handing over the elections to the most extremist nutcases, who are more likely to vote than the average person.

Please, Hillary, do something!

[red dog 1]

6. K&R...Thanks for posting

I posted a similar thread earlier today:

"NSA Chief Says Russia Hacked The 2016 Election - Congress Must Investigate" (Mother Jones article)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/12512619985

But, instead of "Congress Must Investigate"..the article title should have been "The Clinton Campaign & President Obama Must Investigate"
because if left up to the Republican-controlled Congress, there will surely be no such investigation, regardless of what Lindsay Graham has said.
(He's for such an investigation)

[SickOfTheOnePct]

9. Of course the headline is untrue

The NSA chief never said that Russia hacked the election.

But I guess it's a favorable narrative if one is looking for excuses for losing an election.

[KewlKat]

10. Per the article in the OP, it appears that the WH doesn't want us to challenge the election.

The Clinton camp is running out of time to challenge the election. According to one of the activists, the deadline in Wisconsin to file for a recount is Friday; in Pennsylvania, it’s Monday; and Michigan is next Wednesday. Whether Clinton will call for a recount remains unclear. The academics so far have only a circumstantial case that would require not just a recount but a forensic audit of voting machines.

Also complicating matters, a senior Clinton adviser said, is that the White House, focused on a smooth transfer of power, does not want Clinton to challenge the election result.

[JCanete]

15. Sure would have been awesome if Clinton and the media hadn't tied their own hands by

making it tantamount to sour grapes to question the legitimacy of an election. Given what's been going on with voter rights and tampering over the last fifteen years, I was pissed off that they would be so cavalier about making claims of election fraud laughable.

[athena]

18. It is Trump who did that. Not Clinton.

I know that people love to hate Hillary, but what you refer to was not her fault. It was Trump himself who did this, and the media went for the bait. He knew that the election would be hacked, and he knew that if he suggested that he wouldn't accept the result of the election, people would be outraged. He's the one who laid the trap.

[JCanete]

20. I watched the debates. Clinton did hammer Trump for saying that he wasn't

necessarily going to accept the results. She said it was a dangerous precedent about peaceful transfer of power.

[athena]

22. So it's her fault, not his?

Her fault for responding like a thinking person, her fault for going for the bait laid by a sociopath, her fault for not seeing fifty steps ahead?

This is just great. Trump hacks the election and lays a trap for everyone that makes it extremely difficult for Hillary to demand an investigation. And you blame Hillary.

Welcome to ignore. With that level of Hillary hatred, I suspect you won't last long here.

[JCanete]

24. I'm sorry, winner of the election or not. Trump is no effing mastermind. Clinton thought she was

going for the kill. Tell me the Trump you saw days after he won was a Trump that actually knew he was going to win this thing. He looked shell shocked. Everybody, including him, thought he was going to lose this thing and big.

Its her fault and the media's for EVER suggesting that questioning our election results is worthy of derision and scorn. It wasn't okay to do it just because she was sure she was going to win. The democrats aren't always the winners, and have actually been undermined by election fraud and disenfranchisement, so reinforcing the illusion of a fair and unbroken system was harmful.

[uponit7771]

19. They don't care we have a PrezElect who was sued for 25 mil for defrauding students ....

... I could give a shit what they think about anyone else.

[JCanete]

21. but they still affect public opinion. Democrats won't risk being bloodied this badly, even if they

should.

[TheLibIn615]

23. Question

When they say Hillary may have been denied 30,000 votes, does that mean that Trump would have also been denied a few thousand? Or are they saying that 30,000 votes altogether were purged, and each of them was for Hillary? Does that make sense? If the latter, I say that we really need to not be reticent about this and demand an audit.

Also, would this percolate downballot as well? It was a totally shitty night for us altogether and if Hillary were to actually pull this out then the disconnect between her victory and the failures of other Democrats would be astonishing.

Agreed with the general consensus -- if HRC thinks there is a case they need to tell the White House to go screw.

[SickOfTheOnePct]

26. I can't find where they've released any analysis

Looks a lot like wishful thinking on their part.

[mythology]

27. I think their argument is that she averaged 7% fewer votes in those

And that if those counties had averaged the same as other counties she would have won ~30,000 more votes. Which in theory would change the Wisconsin result. However, it's in isolation without context. How did these counties vote in past elections, what's the demographic make up of those counties? Without that information, it's hard to take this seriously.

It's an extraordinary claim, and instead of extraordinary proof, they've said they have proof, but won't show it. It's not exactly convincing at this point.

[TheLibIn615]

29. That's kind of what I'm thinking

I want this to amount to something, believe you me. If it did, it would likely be the biggest scandal in the history of American politics, and the GOP may never recover from it.

But, going back to Wisconsin, if the argument is that X number of votes were not counted, of which 30,000 belonged to Hillary, then that means that Trump only needs 3,000 votes in order to keep the state. I lived in the bluest part of Wisconsin for three years, and not even it was that left-leaning.

I'm also still suspicious based on what happened downballot. How could there be such a huge gulf between Hillary's numbers and the numbers of other Democrats?

That said, if the Clinton camp thinks they have a case, and a real tangible shot at winning, then obviously have at it. I'll be keeping my fingers crossed.

[Generic Brad]

31. Can we also get unicorns and rainbows with those recounts?

That's my way of saying "It's not happening". There will be no recount.