The biggest issue with our country - GERRYMANDERING

[LynneSin]

Gerrymandering is the reason our country is in this mess. Every 10 years, after the census, Congressional seats are re-aligned for the states and new congressional districts are drawn. For most states (I think there are a few exceptions) they State Government is allowed to create the congressional districts.

I wrote this post back after the 2012 district to highlight just how bad Gerrymandering is. These were the election returns in Pennsylvania, a moderate state that had been heading blue but had a Tea Party takeover in 2010.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10021956300

President:
Obama (D): 2.93 million votes
Romney (R): 2.65 million votes

Senate:
Casey (D): 2.94 million votes
Smith (R): 2.45 million votes

Aud General:
Depasquale (D): 2.73 million votes
Maher (R): 2.55 million votes

Attorney General:
Kane (D): 3.13 million votes
Freed (R): 2.31 million votes

Treasurer:
McCord (D): 2.87 million votes
Vaughn (R): 2.41 million votes

Those were the 5 statewide races that PA voters voted on in 2012. Just looking at those 5 elections it was a day of champions for Democrats. Even with all the shenanigans the Republicans tried to do with that heinous voter ID bill, Democrats still won with strong returns for all the state wide votes.

And yet out of 18 house seats the democrats only won FIVE of them. BUt look at the overall vote for PA House:

All Democrat House Candidates: 2.72 million 2otes
All Republican House Candidates: 2.65 million votes

It's not just Pennsylvania - it's all states and yes some of the states, like California, it's done in favor of the Democrats. However the majority of the Gerrymandering issues are in GOP states.

I've been doing more reading this year and far less posting and the one thing I have found common across the intertubes is this - We need to vote these bums out in 2014.

Well here's the issue - we can't.

It's just nearly impossible especially for the US House. The GOP has done enough Gerrymandering out there that will ensure that they keep the US House in their control for a long long time even if the majority of the people are voting Democrat. And that means we're going to see more and more bickering like the current Government shutdown.

In the end it's not the people that are being represented. Clearly in 2012 Pennsylvanians wanted to let Democrats run things but Gerrymandering forced them to elect GOP for 13 of their 18 Congressional seats. Texas is a mess and thanks to the Supreme Court the rest of the South will soon fix their congressional seats to ensure even less democrats are elected to house seats.

We need to fix Gerrymandering. There are some states out west that now Gerrymander to Bi-partisan committees but in a nutshell if you live in a state with more than one US House member there's a good chance your state is Gerrymandered. And if your state is Gerrymandered there's a good chance you're stuck with your US House member until he/she dies, retires or gets caught in a massive scandal (although that hasn't stopped Michelle Bachmann from getting re-elected).

End Gerrymandering - let the people voice who they want as their elected officials by power of the vote!

[DFW]

1. Gerrymandering......without which:

We would have no Republican House, no Speaker Bonehead, no need for fearing government shutdowns, and reason for every major legislative initiative since 2011 to have been blocked.

It is indeed a major evil, stifling our country, and strangling off our national oxygen.

[Yupy]

2. The Big Question: HOW???

[LynneSin]

3. Well we may be stuck until 2022 but....

If we can get some Democrats back in as Governors then perhaps they can help push thru some Anti-Gerrymandering laws within the state.

[redstatebluegirl]

26. State Races Are Most Important Right Now!!!!

Sorry I keep beating my drum

[JBoy]

10. In Canada, electoral districts are determined by an independent commission

overseen by Elections Canada, an independent, non-partisan agency of government. Elections Canada also run all of our elections.

Electoral boundaries are adjusted every 10 years following a census. The commission reviews the census data, and first determines the number of seats per province (based on population). They then propose revisions to electoral boundaries (figuring out how to add any new seat(s). Public hearings are then held, and further adjustments may be made to ensure al the districts are logically consistent. These changes are usually pretty minor (take a little off the north, add some to the east..). The final plan then comes to Parliament for approval. I can't ever remember any controversy in whatever the result was.

As a result, gerrymandering isn't much of a problem in Canada. You can look at an electoral map and see that the boundaries make geographical sense. They're fairly regularly-shaped blocks. Boundaries are typically municipal/regional boundaries, rivers, major roads, etc.

[Sunlei]

4. republicans always have to cheat/game the system for votes.

[fredamae]

5. National Popular Vote

is the answer to Gerrymandering...Everyones vote would matter.
http://www.nationalpopularvote.com/

Vote by mail with paper ballots--

[Jim__]

7. Some swing states are trying to use gerrymandered districts to change the electoral college.

That is, certain states (swing states) would not throw all the electoral votes to omne presidential candidate but would allow each congressional district to cast its own independent vote. This could cause serious problems for Democrats in presidential elections.


From US News:

A handful of states—unsurprisingly, battleground states controlled by the GOP at the state level but captured by President Obama in the presidential races—are considering changing the way they allocate electoral votes, basing the outcome not on the popular vote across the state, but those within each congressional district. The winner-take-all system almost all states now have is surely not entirely fair, since someone who got 49.9 percent of the vote could walk away with no electoral votes. But assigning electors by congressional district is even less fair, since it would typically diminish the power of voters in big cities (which tend to go Democratic). In Pennsylvania, for example—a commonwealth Obama won by five points—the new scheme would have assigned Republican Mitt Romney 18 electoral votes, and Obama only five.

The national popular vote would not affect gerrymandered House seats, but it would address the potential issue with presidential elections..

[fredamae]

9. NPV is a start, anyway

Our democracy is obviously an "organic" thing that must be nurtured, by us, throughout time. It's like a garden-if you don't take care of it, monitor it, provide what it needs-it not only fails to flourish without our participation--it dies.

So many have forgotten that This govt-DC belongs to the People-we Are the government and when the GOP TPFascists say they "Hate Government-that It is the problem?"
They address each of us on a very personal level and it is "we" they hate and view as "the" problem, imo

[Rstrstx]

12. Didn't this come up about a year ago?

The Rs wanted to change states from winner take all to a district based vote. Which I guess wouldn't be too bad if they would do it for every state but no they just wanted to do it for blue states and leave the red states alone.

[fredamae]

13. Wow-I hadn't heard about that

They'll spoil everything and anything - they're simply totally against Us having Any control/participation in Our democracy.
No, this needs to expanded Nationally, All states, at least for the General...States ought to consider ending gerrymandering all together.
Both sides use it--so its a contest, we are the game pawns to be moved around at their whim and for their own personal gains-and I for one am really sick of it.

[Jim__]

14. Yes. That US News story is from January.

According to that story, they were targeting swing states. It would definitely be another attempt by republicans to frustrate democracy.

[muriel_volestrangler]

23. That only fixes the way the nationwide office - president - is elected

Are you saying that you want a nationwide vote for the House - people vote for a party, and then you get, say, 52% of the vote for the Democratic party, 43% for the Republicans, 4% for the Greens, and 1% for the KKK - and then you give them congressional seats in proportion? If so, do you bother assigning House Reps to areas, or do they all represent the entire country?

[fredamae]

25. No-POTUS Elections...

RE: Congress and local state elections--that should be up to the states--but I do believe Gerrymandering at the state level must be stopped and mid terms should Also be a Statewide Popular Voting System-by mail with a paper trail.

[rgbecker]

6. Using your numbers:

49% of voters elected 72% of the Congressional reps from Pennsylvania.

As the old song states: "There's something happening here
What it is ain't exactly clear"

http://www.sing365.com/music/lyric.nsf/Somethings-Happening-Here-lyrics-Buffalo-Springfield/528E570C1800DFA648256FB0000907B4

[LynneSin]

8. AND if Corbett and the GOP Republicans have their way

Those 49% of the voters could send a majority of the Electoral votes to the GOP even if the that candidate has far less than 50% of the votes.

Using the new system PA would love to impliment - Obama would have received 5 EV from PA with his 53% votes while Romney would have gotten 15 of the EV with his 47% of the votes (13 for each Congressional seat and 2 extra for winning the most congressional seats).

Nifty trickery!!!

[modrepub]

18. Not sure if even that would work

I live in the PA 7th. It's as gerrymandered as it gets in PA. Here's the map:



Note on the map that Obama narrowly won the total vote in this district. Meehan PA-7 won the 7th by over 59% to 41%. So I'm not sure if the Repubs plan would work as well as they hope and there may be a lot more vulnerable candidates in PA than we think.

[muriel_volestrangler]

24. Obama would have won it in 2008, but in 2012, Romney won it 50.4% to 48.5%

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pennsylvania%27s_7th_congressional_district#Elections

http://blogs.rollcall.com/rothenblog/ratings-change-pennsylvania-7/

[Kablooie]

11. Poor Jerry Mander is going to be ribbed for this incessantly.

[mnhtnbb]

15. This is exactly what happened in NC.

The state actually went for Obama in 2008--first time voted for Dem presidential
candidate since Jimmy Carter.

All the Dems stayed home in 2010 and the Repubs in the State legislature took over.
Gerrymandered districts.

In 2012 MORE NC voters voted for Dem Representatives, but because of the gerrymandering,
the House delegation which had been split 7 Dem 6 Repub, became 9 Repub 4 Dem--EVEN
THOUGH MORE people voted Dem in House Rep races.


North Carolina provides a striking example. The state’s congressional vote and delegation had usually split closely in the decade since 2002. In 2010, for example, the House delegation was 7 to 6 Democratic. After the 2011 gerrymandering however, the results no longer reflected the state’s fairly even partisan split. In 2012, the Democrats won more congressional votes than the Republicans, 50 percent to 48.9 percent, but the new gerrymandering gave the GOP a 9 to 4 congressional majority.

http://blogs.reuters.com/great-debate/2013/07/14/democrats-its-the-states-stupid/

[Yupy]

16. This is such an important issue but I don't see much action on this matter

from the Democratic Party or any other group. I just hear and read info about it. If voting is a solution the issue is that I don't think I am willing to move to those crazy tea party states to make a difference with my vote and Having non GOP Governors will be as difficult as well, again, thanks the Gerry.

Is there any legal resources available for the Democrats or Independents to change this madness?

[former9thward]

17. You are ignoring the main problem.

The Voting Rights Act. The VRA requires majority minority districts. This means districts are drawn to make Ds at least around 70% in order to insure minority representation. So Ds get bunched together in huge D districts while Rs get spread around. Simple example: Let's say you have 300 people and you want 3 districts. Of the 300, 160 are D and 140 are R. One district is drawn with 70 D and 30 R. The other two are drawn with 55 R and 45 D. Two districts R and one district D even though Ds outnumber Rs.

[LynneSin]

19. But didn't the Supreme Court overrule that in their previous ruling a few months ago

http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2013/06/25/2212281/two-hours-after-the-supreme-court-gutted-the-voting-rights-act-texas-ag-suppresses-minority-voters/


If I'm correct the DoJ has no power to deny redistricting that is designed to eliminate minority strongholds since according to the Supreme Court this isn't an issue anymore.

[former9thward]

20. No, the majority minority districts were not contested.

The Rs love it because of what I posted. The Ds won't change it because of opposition from minorities.

[4dsc]

21. We lost in 2010 because we stayed home instead of voting

so this problem is one that we created by not voting in 2010. Too bad so sad now when looking at this in hindsight.

Maybe we'll learn by the time 2020 rolls around.

[LynneSin]

32. Correct but because we stayed home and didn't vote....

The Tea Party got control of many government right before the once-a-decade redistricting. This is why we didn't win back the house in 2012, because too many districts were made completely impossible to win. And this may be why we aren't going to win back the house in 2014 even with the negativity towards the Republican Party. I don't think there are 17 seats left in Congress that could be considered competitive.

[Dwayne Hicks]

22. Honestly

States have too much autonomy.

[GreenPartyVoter]

27. Agreed. We had a Green in the State House who had his district gerrymandered out from under him, but

he managed to get back in by moving to another district.

Of course money in politics, an outdated plurality voting system, and many other issues are also causing problems for our nation as well.

[lonestarnot]

29. Money causes the corruption in politics. Money allows the gerrymandering.

[GreenPartyVoter]

30. Money and an insane desire for power.

[underpants]

28. Couldn't agree more

Very well done post

[ffr]

31. Unless otherwise legally overturned, voter registration and GOTV

will be our only hope in overcoming gerrymandering and we have to do so, with Democrats in control of positions during the next census. What is that, 2020?