What, if anything , did the Clintons do about the Confederate flag in Little Rock when they were...

[Smarmie Doofus]

... in charge?

Near as I can tell... it's not there NOW. ( A state flag with a blue star representing the confederacy IS still flying however.)

Was the "stars and bars" already verboten by the time they took power?

Also... there seem to be a lot of civic events... even now... involving tributes to confederate heroes and "giants" of the plantation south.

Some of them seem to take place on the grounds of the capitol. Even now. And presumably therefore in the 80's as well.

Did the Clintons ( either one of them) have anything to say about any of this? If so..... what was it?

[hrmjustin]

1. Was Hillary governor of Arkansas?

[Smarmie Doofus]

2. You answer my question. Then I'll answer yours. n/t

[MADem]

5. Some questions do not merit a response--the fact that they are asked at all

gives one every answer they could possibly need.

You, apparently, have trouble distinguishing between men and women with the last name of Clinton. You are also unclear, apparently, about presidential election law in the United States ... or something.

[Smarmie Doofus]

12. I honestly have NO idea what you just said.

Take a deep breath and ... I don't know... reword it.

[MADem]

15. Why don't YOU take one of those deep breaths and ... I don't know ....

try reading. It's an easy sentence, not complicated. Fifth grade level, tops. A smart fourth grader could figure it out with no trouble at all.

You're getting a little pushback on this ill-articulated thread of yours for a reason. The fact that you don't appear to be able to tell a governor and his prerogatives of office from his spouse is a bit troubling. It suggests that you believe politicians are equivalent to ancient royalty, and that conveys an unfortunate impression, particularly here on a message board where people are expected to have a bit more understanding of the political process than the average individual.

[Smarmie Doofus]

27. OK. You're in a pout. I'll get back to you when you calm down.

Jeeeeeeezuz.

"I think you said the wrong thing." ( The Boys in the Band, 1967)

[MADem]

41. Oh, no, no, no--you're looking in a mirror, there, sport!

This must be memorialized--it's hilarious, and apropos of nothing save flopsweat desperation:

Smarmie Doofus
27. OK. You're in a pout. I'll get back to you when you calm down.
View profile
Jeeeeeeezuz.

"I think you said the wrong thing." ( The Boys in the Band, 1967)

Yeah, you sure did say the wrong thing!

That pout of which you speak is formed on your very own trembling lips! And the one who needs the chamomile tea ain't me, either!

It's rather OBVIOUS that you didn't expect quite so much pushback in this thread, I'm sure! Every other poster is telling you where you've gone wrong, and the cavalry quite sensibly isn't coming to your defense, because even they know a bad argument when they see one.

Poor you--this thread was a bit of a bridge too far! You really, really wanted some traction, and all you got was some bad gas in your general direction!

Here ya go:

[JustAnotherGen]

52. As of this typing

414 views

51 responses

1 rec

Says it all! That Sanders supporters are not having this! And that's. Good thing.

[hrmjustin]

7. I was in grammar school when Bill Clinton was governor so i have no idea if he flew the flag or

addressed it.

Nor do I kniw ih Hillary Clinton address the issue.

[Smarmie Doofus]

13. Ok. So you don't know because you were too young.

Apparently you aren't very curious either, but that's another issue.

BILL Clinton was the governor in the 80's. Rodham-Clinton was the governor's spouse.

[hrmjustin]

16. Well Bill Clinton is not running and Hillary had no authority to do anything about it.

If Clinton flew the thing i am not suprised. A politician pandering to a demographic to win an election o0is nothing new.

[66 dmhlt]

24. Clearly YOU are not so DAMN CURIOUS either ...

Otherwise you would have looked up the info you "want" rather than just post something in order to foment discord.

What a waste of time!

[Smarmie Doofus]

31. I did look it up.

I found the info I described in OP.

I found further info hard to come by.

Thought that DU might be able to clarify.

We have an expression in NYC. (The south and Arkansas, of course, has it's own.) :


I touched "the third rail".

[MADem]

42. Yeah....you were "concerned." So concerned you couldn't get Google to work!!!

And that wasn't a third rail you touched.

You might want to wash your hands....

[MADem]

3. Really! And what did Mayor Sanders do about it up in Burlington?

So long as we're bringing spouses into the mix, what did his wife do about it in her hotshot job running a college? Did she ban the flag on campus? If not, why not?



Such an obviously pot-stirring OP...!

[riversedge]

8. who needs

paid Republican/fox opposition research think tanks when they have DU?? Save them money by just clicking on DU.

[MADem]

28. Really! And by their poorly - articulated words we shall know them!

Q. What have we learned today, class?

A. That the wife of a governor is like the Queen of a state! She can issue decrees about things like flags!

[hrmjustin]

9. This forum is the I hate Hillary Clinton forum now.

[Smarmie Doofus]

14. I asked a question. n/t

[hrmjustin]

20. And your question says when they were in charge.

He was not her.

[Smarmie Doofus]

22. So neither she nor he had anything to say about the flag at the time. Yes?

Is she prohibited by some kind of state law from speaking out as a private citizen?

[hrmjustin]

23. No but it is unrealistic to expect the spouse of a candidate or elected official to challenge

Thier spouses policies.

[Sheepshank]

35. As a citizen did you speak out publically about the Confederate flag 20 years ago?

I'd love to read the article or see the video. Or is it just now that it's hit a boiling point do you want to retroactively hold only cetain politicians responsible somehow?

[MADem]

29. Ain't it just! And the quality of hatred is nothing short of hilarious!

We're really in "Is our children learning" territory with the level of American History and Civics knowledge we're getting from some of these angry posters...!

[FSogol]

38. Doubling his numbers every month! Let's see, he's at 33% now, in 7 months when

the Iowa Caucus happens, he'll be at: 42,618,442,977% WOOT!

[Sheepshank]

46. "What make you think WE hate Clinton?"

I wonder, who is this "we" you are speaking on behalf? Surely it isn't the Bernie group that post hate after manufactured hate threads all day long?

[zappaman]

51. Welcome to DU.

Again.

[MADem]

65. It's all silliness....! Don't let it bother you!

When people get bitter, and angry and lash out, or invent stupid "what ifs" that require the thinking reader to lobotomize themselves and disregard basic elementary school history lessons, you have to just ask yourself why they would do such a thing? Could it be that they have no confidence in their chosen candidate? Could it be they feel that the only way for their "team" to win is by sabotaging/putting down opponents? Could it be they are so desperate that they would engage in bridge burning commentary that marks them as intolerant, even though they know they will live to regret their intemperate behavior?

DU doesn't mean a thing in the big picture--this site has never represented the mainstream of Democrattic Party thought or action. If we'd gone by DU popularity standards in 2008, Kucinich would have been finishing up his second term instead of cashing his Fauxsnooze Punching Bag - Sellout Checks!

When people get mean, just give 'em a giggle...they probably need one.

[Bonobo]

70. If it is, I guess it means something. Maybe you need to consider what it does mean. nt

[Dawson Leery]

26. Why didn't Bernie do anything about he abundance of firearms?

Seriously.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

44. Were there any confederates in Burlington?

[MADem]

45. Were--or ARE--there any confederate FLAGS up in Vermont? Or flag SELLERS...hmmmm?

Inquiring minds want to know!!!! Smoke 'em out of their holes, now!!!


https://books.google.com/books?id=LfWdaR9wHEEC&pg=PR9&lpg=PR9&dq=confederate+flags+burlington+vermont&source=bl&ots=UPkXrWsqZY&sig=Ksrhie4Nq4W6Vy6x3q8ALwxv9WU&hl=en&sa=X&ei=UfqWVdGOGczs-QH3_rXoBg&ved=0CDQQ6AEwBA#v=onepage&q=confederate%20flags%20burlington%20vermont&f=false

[wyldwolf]

80. bernie totally should have known about that vendor and shut him down!

[MADem]

82. Indeed! He's in TROUBLE NOW! This could be a BIG PROBLEM for him!!!!

He'd better WATCH OUT! The latest, influential and totally accurate and representative poll of Chickenpluckers and Pigfeet Picklers suggests that his numbers are in SERIOUS FREEFALL!!! Oh, the Huge Manatee!!!!!!



Ah....DU silliness!!! So much of it, so little time...!

[Igel]

4. Lots of demands for purity and litmus tests.

Not a pleasant thing to watch.

The litmus lichen's going to be endangered by the time the primaries actually roll around.

Next up: A demand for FOIA records to show that when Hillary was the White House there were no Paula Dean recipes used.

[hrmjustin]

11. Hillary is responsible for everything that has gone wrong in this nation.

Don't you know that?

[Sheepshank]

36. We are ready for that...."thanks, Hillary"

[polichick]

6. Well, Hillary worked up a nice accent.

[JustAnotherGen]

10. Not a Clinton supporter

But to me - it doesn't matter.l

It took nine people being slaughtered in a Church for people to say - this isn't right. I'm not going to hold that against the Clinton's anymore than Wison being a man aka bigot of his time or Truman belonging to the Klan.

[Smarmie Doofus]

21. To ME it me it does.

I'd prefer to think she and or/Bill had the foresight/moral integrity/ to challenge what needed to be challenged. AT THAT TIME.

"Silence = Death" is a sort of catchphrase we were developing around here.... around the same period of time, interestingly enough.

Granted politics is complicated. So if she/he remained silent... it doesn't mean she/he/they are war criminals or racists.

But it does mean SOMETHING.

No?

[MADem]

34. If you want to go there, then I'm sure you wish Senator Sanders hadn't written some ill-advised,

misogynistic fiction about women, too....hmmmm?


And I'd really like to know why his first wife didn't STOP HIM from writing that stupid stuff, too! What was SHE thinking? Is that why she divorced him? Let's drag her out and demand answers!!!

Harrrumph! More for the irony-impaired. But now, let me get serious.


I'd say the points you are raising about "the Clintons" in Arkansas have about as much to do with the present day as that point I just raised about Senator Sanders and his crappy fiction-writing talents.


You're not doing "your" candidate any favors, here. You should quit while you're behind. Making false associations is a Rovian tactic, you see--and I don't recommend it. Because yes--that kind of thing DOES MEAN SOMETHING....it just doesn't mean what you're trying to convince DUers here that it means.

[JustAnotherGen]

37. Look - I'm a black American

This is a bigoted racist country - been that way in my 42 years - will be that way in my next 42 years.

We won big with Obama - and that has pissed a lot of white folks off.

They is pissed.

I'm more concerned about the asshole with the Johnny reb flag in his window a few houses down from me - today in 2015 - than I am about what Bill Clinton did as a Governor in a state far far away from NY when I was a little girl/teenager. We now know that guy down the street has a strong likelihood of having a gun and using it. And he's not mentally ill or a victim - he's just a bigot who can kill.

This discussion does not one damn thing for black inner city kids who got a piece of shit education and are now approaching adulthood without the basics to get through English 101.

So no. Come up with an apprenticeship or technical trade program that focuses on them - if SOS Clinton is against that - then I'll drag her.

I'm sick and tired of white folks only caring about racism when there's something in it for them to care about it.

When I see white middle class people pay an extra five bucks a year for a program that will not benefit for their college bound kids and not resent it? We can talk about the Johnny Reb flag as a tool to beat up Politicians.

I want solutions - not platitudes.

[99th_Monkey]

43. +100 nt

[Smarmie Doofus]

56. You're ALL over the place. Let's simplify:

If she did and said NOTHING ( apparently everyone on the thread is conceding this point, though they'd rather jump out the window then admit it directly ) about the Confederate flag flying over the capitol in Little Rock ....and the racism, slavery, treason, segregation and Jim Crow that it stands for.... was that a GOOD thing or a BAD thing?

And does it speak WELL of her or does it do the opposite?

Or does it do neither?

(Please.... just answer the question. GOOD thing, BAD thing. None of the above. )

Never mind what you consider "platitudes" , what you're "sick and tired " of , deficiencies of public ed., etc etc etc.

The thread... and the question before "the house".... is whether candidate Clinton ( or her husband-Governor) displayed any courage/foresight/morality/ leadership on this particular ( Again: the issue is the Confederate flag at the state capitol in Arkansas.) issue.

[JustAnotherGen]

57. Try this - not one fuck to give!

Pssst - I also heard she didn't attend the march in Washington!

If this is your biggest issue going into the next election - when we are at critical mass with our environment -

You live a charmed life! When I grow up - I want to be just like you.

Now stop using black people issues you don't give one fuck about as a battering ram against Clinton. Focus on her war vote - I am.

[Smarmie Doofus]

59. "We resort to ridicule when reason is against us." Look it up.

Bye.

[JustAnotherGen]

63. Yes - I ridicule unreasonable people n/t

[etherealtruth]

60. I love Jimmy Carter

I voted for him in 1980 (the year I turned) 18. I was proud to support him and proud to vote for him.

[okasha]

72. You may not have noticed,

but the rest of us have, that no one has demonstrated that the Confederate flag did in fact fly over the Arkansas statehouse while B. Clinton was Governor.

In other words, you're just flinging fictional shite in the hope some of it will stick.

[Smarmie Doofus]

73. Actually. You're COMPLETELY wrong. I DID notice:

>>>>Was the "stars and bars" already verboten by the time they took power? >>>>>

You can read, I 'll assume.


But can you COMPREHEND?

And ....if you can't.... what exactly is the challenge here?

>>>>In other words, you're just flinging fictional shite in the hope some of it will stick.>>>>

What shite, exactly, do you imagine I'm "slinging"? ( Be precise. Otherwise.... don't accuse me.)

[okasha]

75. I'm so sorry that someone hijacked your accout

to produce post 53.

Thas where you( or an unknown hijacker) make a clear statement that a Confederate flag flew over the Arkansas Capitol building during B. Clinton's tenure as governor. Further information establishes that there was no such flag, and that the reference in post 53 is a fabrication..

Like I said, flinging shite and hoping it would stick.

[wyldwolf]

81. thank GOD we have smarty white liberals to tell African Americans what to be offended at.

Bless you Smarmie Doofus!

[bravenak]

66. Damn straight!

[99th_Monkey]

25. Me Too. Enough with these frivolous attacks on Hillary

Bernie doesn't do this, and doesn't want it done in his name either, no
matter how well-intentioned.

[JustAnotherGen]

39. Thank you 99th

Adding - it's playing games with peoples' lives and the threat against black Americans is real.

[Agschmid]

67. +1

[Raine1967]

69. +1 Thank you.

Reason in an unreasonable thread. (and when I say unreasonable. I don't get the reason for it)

[Sancho]

17. Why post what I suppose are "bashing" threads with easy answers?

In 1987, Bill Clinton signed Act 116 that stated “The blue star above the word “ARKANSAS” is to commemorate the Confederate States of America.”[5]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Arkansas

The flag of the State of Arkansas is a red field charged with a large blue-bordered white diamond. Twenty-nine five-pointed stars appear on the flag: twenty-five small white stars within the blue border, and four larger blue stars in the white diamond. The inscription "ARKANSAS" appears in blue within the white diamond, with one star above and three stars below. The star above and the two outer stars below point upwards; the inner star below points downwards.
The design was created by Willie Kavanaugh Hocker of Wabbaseka and selected from a field of 65 entries in a 1912 contest.

-----------------------------

Bill Clinton didn't have anything to do with the design though...and the "confederate star" was part of the old 1912 design, so the statement he signed was simply a reaffirmation of what was already 70+ years old.

Arkansas, like all Southern states still have various holidays, memorials, named buildings, and flags that commerate the Civil War....

[Agnosticsherbet]

18. Between 1978 and 1992, the Battle Flag was a beloved symbol of Souther culture

that was flown everywhere, and symbolized a popular and beloved show, "The Dukes of Hazard."

Even if a few white supremacists KKK Klowns used it as a symbol, nation wide the vast majority saw it as just a colorful bit of history or heritage.

Only since Obama became President, and virulent racism came out of the closet, has it become an issue. Only a political assassination and murder in a historic Southern Black Church has it forced people in power to consider its darker meanings.

Actually, I think that it is the nearness of the election that has given it any traction at all. The majority of those in power in the Republican Party know that defending that flag will end what they see is a good chance at winning the White House. That is the same reason that those in leadership in the party running away from Trump.

So Bill Clinton did not do anything because back then it wasn't an issue. Since HIllary Clinton was his wife, not elected to government, she had not power to do anything as divisive as trying to ban a symbol that near the entire south and most of the nation thought was just a piece of heritage.

[JustAnotherGen]

40. Plus 1000

[Smarmie Doofus]

58. So it is... or isn't .....an important issue to you *now*? In 2015.

BTW... it was also a "beloved" symbol of the Wallace third party ( segregationist) campaign in 1968. Believe me, in the North ( where Wallace was on the ballot, btw) it was quite clear what the symbolism of the Conf. flag was about.


>>>>So Bill Clinton did not do anything because back then it wasn't an issue. Since HIllary Clinton was his wife, not elected to government, she had not power to do anything as divisive as trying to ban a symbol that near the entire south and most of the nation thought was just a piece of heritage.>>>>>>>

Is there ANY circumstance that you can envision where an American politician would be well advised to DEFY the easy, sleazy pragmatic pandering of the sort you are describing?

BTW: NO ONE with a political IQ above 80 ever thought the flag was "just a piece of heritage.&quot At least, no one I ever met.) It *always* had MEANING. And it has meaning now. Hence the current push to de-legitimize it once and for all.

[Agnosticsherbet]

61. Blaming Clilnton for doing nothing when he was governor is a bullshit issue

At the time it wasn't an issue.

Argue about things happening now, now when we can do something about it, when people care about it.

Unless you've got a Tardis hidden somewhere, so we can all go back in time and try to convince people that it was an issue. there are a lot of things going on now that need our attention.

It is an important issue in 2015.
This is where we live and where we should stay.

[underpants]

19. Not worth taking up at the time. He had to be re-elected every other year

That would have been like swatting a hornet nest off a tree

[Agschmid]

30. Well this is a stupid OP.

[Hoyt]

33. Although not as strong as I would prefer, I'm satisfied with both Clintons

on their past regarding the flag.
http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/7638542

[zappaman]

47. They liked it cuz they are well known to be total racists who were also known to be anti-gay

And they ate kittens.
Lots and lots of kittens.

[JustAnotherGen]

49. I heard Bill Clinton kicked a puppy once

I also heard he wears a girdle.

And if either of those were true - If SOS Clinton wins the nomination - id still vote for her!

[msongs]

48. probably the same things obama did when he was younger nt

[99Forever]

50. I'm a huge Sanders supporter...

... and I'm not in support of this sort of attack on other Democratic candidates. The 80s were a very long time ago. There are numerous and current issues that seem more relevant to me.

[JoePhilly]

53. Hillary played the part of Besty Ross and made the first Confederate Flag.

[tymorial]

54. Oh come on.

This is getting ridiculous. We are talking about the flag today because 9 people were tragically and horribly murdered by a racist waste of space. It is appropriate for us to be discussing this issue. The confederate flags must be lowered from flag poles on public land and moved to museums where they belong. Questioning whether Bill and Hillary did anything to get rid of the flags when they were in Arkansas is preposterous imo. It is as preposterous as suggesting that confederate veterans be dug up and relocated out of VA cemeteries.

[Gman]

55. It drops my jaw wondering how anybody,

anybody at all can even try to hold someone accountable for some social issue with a standard that is now, and applying it to the culture of 30 years ago, and do it with a straight face no matter how dishonest it is.

[DustyJoe]

62. Amen

Now if some people could just use the same logic your post has
and change the 30 years to 154 years.

[ann---]

64. "The Clintons?

Only Bill was the governor. What does this have to
do with Hillary?

[dsc]

68. There apparently wasn't much to do

It wasn't put over the capital in the first place. In 1987, Clinton signed a law which stated that the flag had a star representing the Confederacy which it had since the 1920's.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Arkansas

In 1923, the legislature added a fourth star, representing the Confederate States of America. This fourth star was originally placed so that there were two stars above the state name and two below; this was to include the Confederacy alongside Spain, France, and the United States. Since this disturbed the other two meanings of the original three stars, the legislature corrected this in 1924 by placing the Confederate star above "ARKANSAS" and the original three stars below it, as it is today.

In 1987, Bill Clinton signed Act 116 that stated “The blue star above the word “ARKANSAS” is to commemorate the Confederate States of America.”[5]

In 2011, Act 1205 (formerly House Bill 1546) was signed by Governor Beebe adding some more details to the state flag. In the terms of colors, the red and blue used on the state flag is Old Glory Red and Old Glory Blue. The Act also stated that flags purchased by the Secretary of State must be manufactured in the United States.[6][7]

[Smarmie Doofus]

71. I knew if I waited long enough a non-crazed person would make his presence known...

... in this thread.

That's pretty much what I saw when I did my preliminaries.

So.... in a nutshell.... the Little Rock state capitol DID NOT FLY the "Stars and Bars" (a la SC, Miss, et al.) while Clinton ( Mr.) and Clinton ( Ms.) were in residence at Little Rock. Correct?

I know you're from the south ( or at least live there now).... so I'll defer to your greater familiarity w. the question:

Did the state EVER fly the "Stars and Bars" at the state capitol. If so... when did that end?

[dsc]

74. I live in NC now and lived in MS for a couple fo years

To my knowledge Arkansas never flew the Confederate flag over the capital. I can't find any news report suggesting it had. I do think the star on the flag is less egregious given that there are also stars for Spain and France on it as well.

[okasha]

76. The "Stars and Bars"

is the CSA national flag, not the more familiar battle banner.

[zappaman]

77. Hmmmm

[wyldwolf]

78. Hey Sanders supporters - is the author of the OP here to make you look bad?

[jberryhill]

79. Aw, c'mon, after leaving the Gov. office, they freed their slaves

Get over it already.

[zappaman]

83. What a spectacular fail this OP has been!

Well done!

[Sheepshank]

84. Just thinking the very same thing. Nt