Strangely, Bernie is catching on

[tavernier]

without much name recognition.

My facebook is flooded with Bernie references from ppl I hardly know.

I'm sitting at the very conservative Elks club in Florida and ppl are talking about Bernie, passing on his credentials to other members.

I'm neutral and just an observer, but I'm surprised at how the word about him is spreading.

I will vote for our Dem candidate, regardless, but I have to admit that Bernie is gaining recognition with no help from the msm.

[virtualobserver]

1. Viral word-of-mouth

It is even more effective with twitter and facebook.

Bernie will really rise when we reach the tipping point.

[RoccoR5955]

22. It's even more effective than TV ads!

Let the Kochs waste their damn money, we have the people, and the people, united, shall never be defeated!

[FlatBaroque]

2. That is WHY they are afraid. n/t

[fbc]

4. +1 exactly.

Those political ads generate a lot of revenue.

[erronis]

142. Which just goes back into the pockets of the filthers (filthy rich)

Up and down the M$M food chain they are co-owned by people (corporations) with a lot of the same protoplasm.

[aspirant]

3. The Florida "Keys for Bernie"

The Conch Republic was the historical beginning of the Sanders Revolution

[tavernier]

15. I'm a Conch.

Tavernier.

Are you my neighbor??

[aspirant]

38. "Cheese Burgers in Paradise"

and Go........ Conchs for Bernie

[Stardust]

118. Really? Well, kudos to Conches! From the southernmost tip of our country, you've started

a revolution!

[JackInGreen]

5. My experience aswell

In the oddest damned places, shafts of light.

[tavernier]

7. I know!

I even had a guy at the Elks approach me after I expressed my interest in the candidate and say, "I have a Bernie bumper sticker on my car." It tickled me that he looked around first and sort of whispered it. It's like a guilty secret! 😄

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

6. Strangely? Not at all. Bernie is a down to earth, authentic, trustworthy champion for the less fortunate. Not surprised he's soring in the polls.

[tavernier]

8. Strangely only because people seem to like

feeling that they are part of this private club that is in "the know". 😄

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

21. gotcha

[elana i am]

9. i think so too

and i don't think mainstream media and traditional polling is catching on to it because i think the paradigm shift (that began with obama) toward online news sources like huffington, reddit, twitter facebook and snapchat etc. is reaching completion. i follow that isidewith.com polling on twitter. i search twitter every day for "isidewith" to see the results people are posting. one thing that stands out to me consistently - neither clinton or trump is the most popular result for people taking the poll. the front runners are sanders and rubio. and most telling of all is that bernie sanders is running away with it. by my observations, the aggregate results are sanders, huge gap, clinton, rubio, huge gap rand paul, ted cruz, huge gap, a few for bush, omalley and santorum, i think i've seen one trump and one jindal. that's pretty much it.

there's a huge disconnect between online and what you see on broadcast news shows. aside from the sunday morning pol shows, you don't see much of sanders. but he's all over the internet. i also think the traditional phone polling methods are somehow becoming distorted. it's true that online polls aren't reliable because they can be hacked. but i don't think the phone polling is getting the true story anymore either. it doesn't make sense to me that an asshole billionaire reality tv buffoon can be so far ahead in the polls. does. not. compute.

the only thing i can't figure out in all of this is the traditional phone polls. why is it the low-info igits are so greatly outnumbering those with reasonable responses? because trump is not a legitimate choice. at all. and how is it that clinton is polling so well when she has such high unfavorables? is it the damn inevitability meme?

[Unknown Beatle]

37. "one thing that stands out to me consistently - neither clinton or trump is the most popular result

for people taking the poll."

That's just it, the MSM would have you believe that both of them are going to be the candidates for their respective party. The propaganda machine is in high gear right now by brainwashing the populace into believing that we have no other alternative but Jeb and Hillary.

The PTB are frightened of a Sanders candidacy.

[erronis]

144. Agree about the disconnect in polling - it's always been an exact "science"

And the flaws of sampling with these new media included make it even harder to figure out the horses' positions.

I'd really like to see some post-mortems done from these recent polls versus what actually happens. Of course "what actually happens" can be rigged too...

[erronis]

145. And let's hope that the peoples' communication lines aren't cut

This thing called the internet was built using US taxpayers' $s. The politicians, corporatists, telcos, etc. would all love to rein it in and only spew what the PTB want us to see.

The net neutrality fight is just the first salvo. I'm sure there are already some more subtle attacks going on right now.

[whatchamacallit]

10. Must be why we're back to the divide and conquer bullshit... K&R

[Juicy_Bellows]

11. Things tend to catch when Bernt! Nt.

[George II]

12. You're confirming what people (and some polls) have been saying....

....he's attractive to conservatives.

That's scary.

[MrMickeysMom]

16. That's not scary… That's bullshit

That confirms nothing but what you might want it to be.

My best friend tried to find a venue for Bernie Sanders in Sarasota, where it may WELL be the bastion of Republicanism… but every place was stuffed with persons from all walks of life… What does that tell you about the Republican party that you shouldn't be able to figure out by seeing who's running, and what scary shit is running out of their mouth. It also tells you that people are getting really disappointed with the choices we seem to produce for Wall Street and General Dynamics every four years

Think!

[Enthusiast]

126. Huge +1!

[Luminous Animal]

19. Why most conservatives are secretly liberals

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/monkey-cage/wp/2014/03/06/why-most-conservatives-are-secretly-liberals/

It is a good article. I highly recommend you read it.

In Ideology in America, Christopher Ellis and James Stimson describe a striking disjuncture. When identifying themselves in a word, Americans choose “conservative” far more than “liberal.” In fact they have done so for 70 years, and increasingly so since the early 1960s.

But when it comes to saying what the government should actually do, the public appears more liberal than conservative. Ellis and Stimson gathered 7,000 survey questions dating back to 1956 that asked some variant of whether the government should do more, less, or the same in lots of different policy areas. On average, liberal responses were more common than conservative responses. This has been true in nearly every year since 1956, even as the relative liberalism of the public has trended up and down. For decades now there has been a consistent discrepancy between what Ellis and Stimson call symbolic ideology (how we label ourselves) and operational ideology (what we really think about the size of government).

Looked at this way, almost 30 percent of Americans are “consistent liberals” — people who call themselves liberals and have liberal politics. Only 15 percent are “consistent conservatives” — people who call themselves conservative and have conservative politics. Nearly 30 percent are people who identify as conservative but actually express liberal views. The United States appears to be a center-right nation in name only.

This raises the question: why are so many people identifying as conservative while simultaneously preferring more government? For some conservatives, it is because they associate the label with religion, culture or lifestyle. In essence, when they identify as “conservative,” they are thinking about conservatism in terms of family structure, raising children, or interpreting the Bible. Conservatism is about their personal lives, not their politics.

[arcane1]

26. Stop it, you're ruining a good smear!

Just kidding, it's a lame smear

[Luminous Animal]

27. I am. So please rec this OP

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1251494135

[arcane1]

29. Already did :)

[Ken Burch]

25. Not if he gets them to vote for liberal or even radical policies.

Bernie is turning conservatives into supporters of egalitarian, anti-bigotry progressives democratic change. By you that's a BAD thing?



Besides, your candidate is married to a guy who was sold to the party as "attractive to conservatives"-and unlike Bernie, THAT guy spent most of his time in office kicking workers and the poor and poc in the teeth...with your candidates unquestioning support.

[arcane1]

32. To be fair...

You are assuming the poster is not being disingenuous

[winter is coming]

35. How can someone who's "too far left" be scarily appealing to conservatives?

Is Bernie's evil twin also running?

[LondonReign2]

36. It's scary...to Clinton supporters

[kenn3d]

56. Well you needn't be scared ... But yes, I think quite many

poor and formerly middle-class conservatives, main-stream "republicans", and libertarians, and independents, as well as lots of "everyday" (HRC) democrats will hear and resonate with Bernie's message in much the same way that so many struggling and working-class Americans of all political persuasions already are. Hillary's handlers are still nervously counting potential delegates and electoral votes in specific states, attempting to calculate and re-calibrate her "inevitability coefficient" as her polls decline and they discount the prospects of her losing some of the early primary states, ... And all the while Bernie is methodically gathering converts by the thousands in all 50 states of the union each and every day by day.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/05/08/1383415/-Bernie-Can-Win-w-poll
These polling trends continue moving consistently in the right direction with plenty of time yet before the primaries.

Who knows, maybe you'll join the revolution too.

[beam me up scottie]

99. You're not scared because Bernie's "attractive to conservatives",

you're terrified that he's more attractive than Hillary to liberals and progressives.

When you compare their records she's not nearly as liberal as Bernie and that's why you keep trying to associate him with the right.

If you can't find anything positive to promote your candidate tear down the other guy - Swift boating 101.

[Enthusiast]

127. Precisely.

[beam me up scottie]

131. I wonder if this scares George too:

Hillary Clinton’s Mega-Donors Are Also Funding Jeb Bush

[Enthusiast]

133. It scares me!

But probably for a different reason.

Thank you, beam me up scottie.

[Qutzupalotl]

147. Math is your friend.

If the conservative votes R and the liberal votes D...that's about where we are today.

But if the conservative votes D, taking a vote away from the R...that doubles the D's advantage.

[tomm2thumbs]

13. It's simple. Truth wins.

There are polls.
And there are movements.
Which would you rather be a part of?

[Juicy_Bellows]

40. Damn fine custard. Damn fine.

Excellent point.

[hedda_foil]

44. Yes, truth wins out, but much more so when the truth favors real American values.

Bernie is in the right place at the right time.

[Cleita]

14. I'm finding the same thing at my normally conservative gym. eom

[Chipper Chat]

17. I predict a significant crossover republican senior vote for Bernie in the General

if he wins the primary.

[winter is coming]

34. +1. n/t

[zentrum]

20. And no help

….at all from the Democratic Machine. Debbie et al.

[canuck eh]

23. The first thing Bernie should do when heś nominated, eh

is reassign DWS to the remotest part of Alaska near the Yukon and have her set up a campaign office there. Might even attract a Inuit or two.

Then have Bernie select the best possible person that does have the pulse of the Revolution and make sure that pulse is continued - as in staying on top of what the 99% wants.

[Ken Burch]

24. What did Alaska ever do to you, buddy?

We don't want DWS up here...her very presence would melt the rest of the Arctic ice.

[canuck eh]

28. I said the remotest part..

Away from civilization - surely you got a spot somewhere, eh?

[L0oniX]

31. Maybe she could spend some time with Palin.

[Art_from_Ark]

117. Send her to Chicken

That's pretty remote.

https://www.google.co.jp/maps/place/%E3%82%A2%E3%83%A1%E3%83%AA%E3%82%AB%E5%90%88%E8%A1%86%E5%9B%BD+%E3%82%A2%E3%83%A9%E3%82%B9%E3%82%AB+%E3%83%81%E3%82%AD%E3%83%B3/@64.0846436,-141.8028276,4z/data=!4m2!3m1!1s0x5149fae514bf64b7:0x1a987994b8764694

Or maybe Attu-- that's even more remote

https://www.google.co.jp/maps/place/%E3%82%A2%E3%83%A1%E3%83%AA%E3%82%AB%E5%90%88%E8%A1%86%E5%9B%BD+%E3%82%A2%E3%83%A9%E3%82%B9%E3%82%AB+%E3%82%A2%E3%83%83%E3%83%84%E5%B3%B6/@52.8778412,172.9374751,10z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m2!3m1!1s0x58483ec0ee503b47:0x3e241e18f518c2fd

[Ken Burch]

165. We could let her run a meth lab in Wasilla, I guess.

Pretty much the same job she's doing now, when you think about it.

[hedda_foil]

47. Luckily, the best possible person for the job is a fellow Vermonter!

Yes, I know Howard is supporting Hillary now. I think it's because he saw that as the price for a cabinet spot after being out in the cold so long. And it didn't look like anyone, with a chance of winning was about to challenge the coronation at the time. Of course that is strictly my opinion, so take it for what it's worth.

[L0oniX]

30. This is starting to piss off all the right oligarchy fans.

[Fawke Em]

58. Ain't that a pip!

Love it!

[bravenak]

33. I predict tears around here when he loses.nt

[RobertEarl]

39. If he was to lose

The whole country will suffer. He's the best we ever had the chance to be president. People are noticing him.

[bravenak]

41. Oh well. The way his supporters keep attacking black people means he WILL LOSE.

Us black folks are already suffering. Your turn!!

[panader0]

42. In all sincerity, since I don't come to GDP very often,

how do his supporters attack black people? I guess I must have missed it.

[bravenak]

45. It is constant.

Constant critisizing our intelligence, telling us that money will fix racism, going into hysterics about how our activists are rightwing plans, refuse to listen to why bernie is failing with black voters (his supporters, they make him hated by shit talking black people) constantly telling us we should be grateful to him for all he's done, refusing to allow us to teach THEM about racism. Constantly telling our educated asses to EDUCATE YOURSELVES!!! Assuming we need them to explain things to us. And always always, day after day, night after night attacking black activists. They seem to think they can be rude and nasty and condescending and paternalistic and somehow, black peopke will vote for him after being bullied into it.

[aspirant]

49. "telling us money will fix racism"

How do you feel about "Reparations", "Head Start" funding, WIC and SNAP money programs?

[bravenak]

52. How do you feel about them?

White folks get more of that stuff than we do.

[aspirant]

55. Reparations?

If money is irrelevant, name 5 Social justice reforms that would FIX racism tomorrow.

[bravenak]

60. I have gotten ZERO reparations.

And I do not answer to you. You are not my master. Cannot believe you think you can talk to me like that and get anything out of me.

[aspirant]

64. I ask a simple direct question,

if money doesn't fix racism (your opinion) are you for or against Reparations?

[bravenak]

66. Since it will never happen, I don't worry my beautiful mind over it.

[lovemydog]

94. You name them. Go!

....

[aspirant]

103. Bernie says that social and economic are "parallel" and I say intertwined

"Clinton said." "By that I mean, there are some who say, 'Well racism is a result of economic inequality.' I don't believe that."

So if you believe racism is the result of Social injustice, you name them.

[lovemydog]

107. I asked you to answer your own questions.

What do you think of reparations? And: "name 5 Social justice reforms that would FIX racism tomorrow." I think the quoted question was rhetorical but I'm not sure what point you're trying to make. Please explain so I understand. And, what do you think of reparations?

I vehemently disagree with you that social and economic justice are intertwined. Racism in the United States is uniquely American, rooted in the founding of this country, continuing through slavery and Jim Crow to the present day. I think it's disturbing that anyone would suggest that the two issues of racism and economic inequality aren't separate issues. Sure, sometimes they converge. Sometimes they are intertwined. But they are separate issues. A well-to-do unarmed black person is much more likely to be shot by the police. The entire criminal justice and prison system is racist to the core.

I believe in economic justice. I believe wealth inequality is a huge problem in this country. I'm a democratic socialist. I supported Bernie up until I started facing this notion from his supporters here, that racism and economic matters are 'intertwined.' And some of them like you keep arguing this point. I don't even understand why.

Now I'm undecided. I still may vote for Bernie. But I'm also bummed out that so many of his supporters keep insisting they are 'intertwined.' I don't even understand why they keep arguing the point. They are two different terms with two different meanings. To me it's like insisting that pizza is 'intertwined' with pineapples.

Your questions in this post to which I'm replying, I don't understand them. Hopefully I've explained why, here in my post. That's why I'm asking you to answer them. Hopefully I'll understand a bit better what points you're trying to make.

[aspirant]

116. It's a simple question:

Do you think economic Reparations are good or bad?

Or do you agree with Hillary, "Clinton said. "By that I mean, there are some who say, 'Well racism is a result of economic inequality.' I don't believe that."

"sometimes they converge" and your post #8 in LA's thread "I don't throw either issue in the closet. They are both important to me." after seeing a list of BLM's economic demands

If you feel that both are important and Hillary doesn't believe that, why don't you understand the question?

[Beartracks]

157. Thoughts from someone leaning Bernie...

I don't see the issues as intertwined; rather I'm coming to see them, as wasvsuggested in another post, as "parallel" but frequently intersecting eachother.

Racism most definitely exists independent of economic equality, in that, as you point out, even well-to-do blacks are still targeted by, well, racists who only see skin color.

For its part, economic inequality most definitely impacts blacks disproportionately, keeping more blacks in poverty and making it harder to improve their circumstances, even between generations. In a way, economic inequality is a useful mechanism for racists (and "the system&quot to keep blacks "in their place " -- to wit: Step 1) Don't hire blacks, cuz racism; Step 2) Look down on blacks because they're unemployed and poor. Getting more blacks to move up the economic ladder cannot be a bad thing... plus, for what it's worth, maybe that would help many whites to finally regard black issues as mainstream.

Furthermore, reducing economic inequality among poor whites should serve to mitigate (over time) the kind of desperation that makes them susceptible to conservative racist dogma which convinces them to blame their misfortunes on persons of color.

I know, this isn't very scholarly; I'm just typing out loud on the fly. But I definitely see the two independent issues of racism and economic inequality as impacting eacthother, kind of feeding off eachother to an extent. Both must be addressed, the sooner the better.

================

[MADem]

54. Head Start? WIC? SNAP? You do realize those are "low income" programs?

Why are you asking a black woman whose income you know nothing about how she feels about programs for low income children?

What do those programs have to do with 'racism?' There's no race requirement to avail oneself of that help. So what is this "fix racism" shit? How about "fix nutritional deficits in American children, from Appalachia to Hawaii and points between?"


It's 'sounds' like you're under the blatantly false impression that these assistance programs are for black people by the way you marry them with 'reparations.'

Talk about TRUE COLORS!!! You let it all hang out there. Ugh. Offensive! Not even subtle! If that's not what you meant, you'd better jump on that bike and start back-pedaling in a hurry.

I'll bet you'd have a helluva time finding a black or hispanic child on WIC/SNAP in VT or ME....

spirant
49. "telling us money will fix racism"
View profile
How do you feel about "Reparations", "Head Start" funding, WIC and SNAP money programs?

[bravenak]

61. .....

[MADem]

69. I am really in WTF land, here....

No wonder that candidate is having a hard time selling his ideas to anyone with a little melanin.

A fella gets known by the company he keeps.

Damn!

[bravenak]

75. Some of them are trying very hard.

The ones who aren't don't really care if he wins.

I wish I could get a secret message to him. The. He could instruct his friends on how to help him by being quiet.

[MADem]

83. Maybe too hard. Makes me wonder! nt

[artislife]

136. I just want to wreck the place

When some of our supporters go off on these effing tangents.

I know there are racists in Hillary's camp, too. But they seem to be smarter about it.

I keep coming back to the fact that the internet allows all types of thought to be exposed. If I click on a MSM or Yahoo newstory, I am going to feel downright suicidal at the state of race relations in this country.


IRL, the people I have met and those sending the Bernie posts have not been at all racist, so the experience if a lot of fun.

I get how this site can turn of PoC to Bernie, so when I see these posts I just keep going back to the candidates themselves and the issues.

There are a lot of good supporters, but the sting is always much more memorable.

[bravenak]

139. They are sometimes fakers.

Not real supporters. Just here to do damage. Just my opinion.

[artislife]

143. They have done a good job...nt

[1StrongBlackMan]

146. I'll drop this here ...

I was told just this morning (by an ardent Bernie supporter) that the recent reporting on disparate attitudes (between white and Black) regarding treatment by Law Enforcement is a Clintonian plot to pit poor whites against poor Black to benefit the 1% (despite the fact the survey has been run every year for the last 30+ years) ... and I was "pretending" and "playing a game" for addressing the issue. (or maybe that's just what I thought I read ... find the thread and correct me if I misread it.)

But, at least he/she didn't call me a "race-nagger!"

[artislife]

148. I see it, too

Either their lives are so segregated and they actually really don't see it, or they see it and dismiss it or worse....they don't give a flying eff.


I posted before on this. My family is half white and half Native American and Latino. My two brothers don't look like brothers. One was stopped by the police in Texas and jailed for a week without being charged. The other was stopped by the police, he argued with them and got a higher fine. And let go.

One brother is easy going and just tries to mind his own business and the other fights for the rights of all.


In real life I had to listen to a woman I like, a republican say that we should give up on Africa. And she meant it. She stopped when she looked at my face. But she was thinking "What a bleeding heart liberal."

Arrgghhhhh.

[aspirant]

63. Low income = economic injustice

"know nothing about" People with any level of income have opinions.

"marry them with reparations" You're subjective opinion, there was no ceremony involved in making a list and showing that economic assistance programs aid the AA community nationally with no racial bias

"TRUE COLORS" do you believe in reparations?

How do you start to fix racism if you don't put forth economic programs with no racial bias?

[MADem]

65. You said it, you own it. You tied those programs to "reparations" in your subject line.

Most WIC/SNAP users are white. Don't double down--it doesn't get better if you do.

Ugh.

[aspirant]

72. These economic assistance programs do not contain racial bias (racism),

it includes all races no matter what state you are in.

I can include anything I choose in a list of economic justice reforms including Reparations.

BTW, are for or against economic reparations?

[MADem]

84. So why did you put them in a list with REPARATIONS at the top of the heap, and

ask the question you asked of a black woman, as though she was looking for/had used those services?

smh.

You don't even see it!

Reparations are a pony--they aren't going to happen, so why even try for them? You'd have to prove your heritage and your family presence in USA prior to 1865 (good luck with that, since record keeping was sketchy and no one was given the dignity of their own name), and plenty of black people didn't show up on these shores until much later. Might as well ask me if I'd like to take a trip to the moon.

Still doesn't explain why you put that item in a list of services that are used, primarily, by white people.

[aspirant]

104. Economic Reparations and economic assistance programs are used to counter

economic inequality

"Clinton said. "By that I mean, there are some who say, 'Well racism is a result of economic inequality.' I don't believe that"

Are you for or against Reparations no matter the search time?

[MADem]

112. All those working white people and the disabled white people as well, who are the

greatest beneficiaries of those programs...? They certainly weren't dealing with racism on top of their economic inequality issues, were they?

I think I made my POV re: reparations plain. Why you lump them in with government programs to help working/disabled people bridge the nutrition gap is beyond me.

Or maybe it isn't really beyond me. You should quit while you're behind.

[aspirant]

119. Still unclear

Are you for economic Reparations or against the AA community receiving them no matter the time frame?

"dealing with racism" The programs have no racial bias(racism), all are open to apply and receive.

"lump them in with government programs" If Reparations are paid, it will be the government who sets up the distribution program. Why do you consider government programs lumpy?

Do you travel to the beyond?

[MADem]

120. I've been entirely clear. And you sure have, too. Not in a good way, either. nt

[aspirant]

121. Is it "a good way"

to deny the AA community economic Reparations because of time restraints?

[MADem]

122. You listed reparations at the top of a list that included gov't assistance programs that benefit

working and disabled people of all races. You injected a racial dynamic into this discussion that I found disturbing.

Now have a nice day.

[aspirant]

123. I listed things

horizontally, so there was never a top and also in random w/o any numerical suffixes

Reparations would be a Govt assistance program, unless you volunteer to pay all.

A racial dynamic was injected before I started responding

Why isn't denying the AA community Reparations "disturbing"?

[JustAnotherGen]

100. That did show that poster's beliefs

Didnt it?

Me - I think those are great programs and that's what I pay taxes for . . . To help the huge number of white Americans who take advantage of these programs. I really wish folks wouldn't bite the hand that feeds them.

[aspirant]

106. Are their any Black, Hispanic, Asian or Native Americans in these great economic programs

that benefit too?

[MADem]

110. Yes, I agree with you.

Further, the beneficiaries of those programs are people who are most often either working or disabled.

[bravenak]

115. So ungrateful.nt

[Fawke Em]

62. OK. You've pissed me off.

I wasn't going to do this, but I'm going to start collecting all the pro-Bernie stuff I get from PoC on other social media and prove you wrong.

NO ONE EVER said money would fix racism, but voting for the white queen isn't going to help you.

And I'm a white woman, but I'm Southern and I've grown up around more black people than most people in ANY OTHER PART OF THE COUNTRY.

You know... If you're idea of fixing racism is to vote for the oligarchy because she gives you lip service, then go RIGHT ahead.

I'm not telling you who to vote for. I'm telling you that I'm not attacking you!

Bernie has done far more for you than Hillary. Period. I'm sorry you don't see it.

[bravenak]

70. Please don't say 'no one ever said money will fix racism' it happens all the time.

People here write posts saying 'it's the money stupid!', when we discuss racism.

Bernie has not done a damn thing for my black ass. I do for me like I always have. Calling me an ingrate is fucked up and if you don't see that telling a black woman that some white dude from Vermont has done SO MUCH FOR ME, in a paternalistic crazy ass way is fucking strange and weird thing that you don't do to young white women, I don't know what to tell you, other that to show your most honest and outspoken black friend what the hell you just wrote to me. Talking down to me like that! I'm used to older white women telling me how fucking grateful I should be to some old white dude, while my fucking people are dying in the streets because they think I'm poor and his votes for poverty programs were my lifeblood.

Did this make you feel good to write to me? You ought to apologize before I start whipping out MalcolmX quotes about white liberals.

[aspirant]

73. Or....

MLK quotes about economic and social justice working together.

[bravenak]

74. Don't try to use MLK AGAINST black people. We'll just tell you about MalcolmX and white liberals.nt

[aspirant]

76. Was MLK's words

"AGAINST" or FOR "black people"

[bravenak]

77. They way he used them or the way others use them?

[lovemydog]

89. In the words of MLK: 'I'm sick of ignoramuses

using facebook and twitter memes to quote me out of context at DU, as a bludgeon against people who are familiar with my work!'

[bravenak]

159. Lol!!!

Damn that was funny!

[bravenak]

78. I got some quotes for ya! You all cherrypick.

http://www.afieldnegro.com/famousquotes.html

Btw: this is proof that you can find quotes from black leaders that are.... Questionable. That is putting it mildly.

[Fawke Em]

96. Do you know anything about Islam?

I do.

I asked you to try to explain Malcolm to me. You won't.

See, I know the Surah from his speeches. Do you?

[bravenak]

108. Why should I do anything you ask?

[lovemydog]

85. Yeah, Jesus said a lot of stuff too.

And far too many people take his words out of context and claim 'well, that's what he said!'

Try reading a whole lot more about what MLK said and the life he lived. Race was his primary issue.

You won't convince anyone familiar with his work otherwise. You will, however, make us continue laughing our asses off every time you do it.

[1StrongBlackMan]

153. You do realize that MLK was talking primarily about intra-class economic parity. Right? n/t

[AgingAmerican]

80. The only people who ever say 'money will fix racism'

Are Hillary supporters. I have never heard it come out of anybody else. That is because it is a made up strawman argument.

The whole notion is ridiculous.

[bravenak]

82. I see it all the time.

As a matter of fact, i get told it constantly. Because, you know, I'm black so I must needs these things explained to me like I'm six.

[AgingAmerican]

150. Links please

Thanks in advance.

[bravenak]

155. Lol!!!

Not today!!!

[MADem]

87. You need to open your ears. nt

[Fawke Em]

90. First, your black ass and mine

are both whipped from being women in a man's world.

If you think I'm talking DOWN to you instead of talking WITH you.. then... this... stop thinking for five seconds.






























And then this: I'm NOT telling you what to do or who to vote for so stop telling me the same. And I'll meet you on the Malcom X, sister. I have read the Qur'an and know why he came back and was killed. He challenged authority and lost.

[bravenak]

114. This is funny.

[zappaman]

151. Is that poster for real?

Wtf?

[bravenak]

154. I hope they were being funny.nt

[Number23]

163. It's hard to get mad anymore, isn't it? These people have lost their minds.

I think some of these people think they can actually OUT BLACK us.

They have fucking lost it. This shit has gone from being merely stupid and offensive to something else entirely now.

[bravenak]

164. It's like watching blazing saddles.

My sigline is getting a workout from all of this pure comedy.

They outblack us. Random 'PoC' appear from the mists. MLK quotes. My sister came to read it today because I had her dying over this shit. She is shocked and amused and everything else you can possibly be.

[onpatrol98]

166. Hilarious...that was hilarious...

Worth the lurk! Tomorrow, "Imma" go tell Michael Jordan how to play basketball...just for giggles. After all, I did just sleep in a Holiday Inn Express last night, yup.

[bravenak]

167. No shit!!!

They don't even NOTICE how they sound.

[lovemydog]

86. WTF. You're really pissed off!

I think it's funny because you're still not listening.

[Fawke Em]

91. Neither are you.

[lovemydog]

92. Want to explain it again?

[Fawke Em]

97. I'm not pissed

You are.

[lovemydog]

101. I'm laughing

at how many questions you've asked without bothering to say where you stand on any of them.

[virtualobserver]

79. It is about character and it is about love

When you look at Bernie's life story, what does it tell YOU about his character?

All of the other things that you are talking about are occurring because.... when most of Bernie's supporters look at him, they see a consistency of behavior in him that is almost never seen in politics.
That creates a deeper feeling than most politicians create. It makes people love him.

He has been working to help such a wide range of people over such a long period of time that it is baffling to them that anyone would be criticizing him. (Unless it is a die-hard Hillary supporter.... that isn't quite so baffling)

It is human to defend someone you love, but especially when you feel that the person that you love is being unfairly attacked.

Ultimately though, this is just all human noise.

As far as my life is concerned, I'm not much of a believer in what people say. I judge their actions.
So for me, the only way for a politician to "fail" with me as a voter would be for my examination of their life and voting record to reveal decisions that I disagree with or that it revealed aspects of their character that I objected to.

Bernie is sincere and he speaks from the heart and he cares about a lot of different issues.
I believe that he has tried to refocus since netroots....but Bernie is Bernie...
If Bernie ends up "failing with black voters", it won't be from lack of caring.

[bravenak]

81. I'm sorry but his life story does not make me feel the same way as you.

I am very hard to impress I guess.

People critisize president Obama ALL THE TIME. I love him most dearly but i do NOT go around trying to end each and every instance of critisism and try to force people to see him the way I do. I have watch him be disrespectec for YEARS, mostly by the same people who are so defensive about Bernie. I see a double standard and it looks ugly.

When I hear Bernie talk about the issues important to me, i hear a disconnect. I am not moved by it the way you seem to be. They way you are impressed with his record is nice, but since things are the way they are right mow as we speak, it does nothing. I don't give extra credit to people who do exactly what I would do. It's like when white people or politicians do anything that benefits black people we are expected to give them extra credit for doing so as a white person. To me that is racist. I give more credit to the black marchers than the white ones as they were in MORE danger. So many had ALREADY been lynched. So, a disconnect.

I think it is time for me to give up on saying anything.


He can care and care but we are tired of hearing how he cares MORE. Prove it then. Otherwise, people can keep saying it whike at the same time bashing our activists and calling us ingrates. That is why he is losing. Not because he does not care, but that he doesn'y know how to demonstrate it and the envirionment in his support is toxic to black individuals. Why would you trust they guy with the supporters who hate black activists if you are black? We'd be stupid to. We think they are following his lead, and if not, they need to start.

[virtualobserver]

93. I understand what you are saying.......

You have clearly expressed how painful all of this has been.

You are a better person than I though......During the 2008 campaign i DID go around trying to end each and every instance of criticism of soon to be President Obama and I did try to force people to see him the way I do. I even reached the point where I wrote a endless rant on Daily Kos criticizing what I considered to be racist elements in Hillary's campaign and criticizing her use of the "cling to guns and religion" line in one of her ads which I thought was incredibly out of line. I was so angry I stated that I wouldn't vote for Hillary in the general election.

So to move from that moment to hearing the depth of your negative feeling in this election about Bernie , it seriously diminishes my hope.

[bravenak]

111. I cannot hold onto every racial incident. It would give me a stroke.

[virtualobserver]

128. I understand.

I wish you well.

[Fawke Em]

98. What is about Hillary's live story you love, then?

Talk about WHITE privilege.

Dear Lord in Heaven.

[bravenak]

109. Who said I like Hillary? I don't. I have said that a bajillion times.

You must have just made that assumption based on something. I wonder what it was? Hmmm?

[RobertEarl]

43. That would make you happy?

For the whole country to suffer?

I don't see where the Bernie supporters are attacking black people. I see us supporting more and more equal rights- socially and economically. Our foes are the rich 1% who have been making financial killing off the backs of us all.

What black people suffer is atrocious, but with Bernie in office and a similar congress, things can improve. The Clintons had a chance, and Obama has given it a go, Bernie will be even better.

[bravenak]

46. Seems like his supporters WANT to lose.

They think we need them more than they need us. They constantly lecture us.

Do I seem stupid to you? How come his supoorters seem to think they need to teach me things I already know? Because I'm black. I feel racism. I'd rather not join a group that constantly insults me and my intelligence. Constantly telling us black people how much better Bernie is than Obama. We will never like him better. Ever. Saying that gets a big ass eyeroll.

[RobertEarl]

48. Me too

People on DU insult me all the time. So what? And if I proposed the country needed to suffer even more, I would expect even more insults. Can't blame them for that type of reaction to that kind of ill-will, eh?.

You don't have to agree with anyone. This is a free country. You don't have to feel one way or another about Bernie, but when he wins the nomination, you kinda do have to support him, at least on DU.

As progressives we supported Obama. He won the election with all of us, Black, Whites, Asians, Hispanics all pulling together.

Some of us expected more from Obama. More progress. We recognize he has done a good job, maybe the best he could. Time will tell. Now we think Bernie will bring even more progress and do even better than Obama. There is nothing wrong with that hope for change.

[bravenak]

51. Ok. Then lose. I have accepted that he will lose.

When you guys do the autopsy, make sure to go back though my warnings. Because, it's not just on DU, his supporters are doing it all over. Even taking it upon themselves to 'educate' black academics constantly. It's funny really. When you tell people what they are doing wrong and they just go all 'Neener neener neener!! Pffft!! I'm rubber you're glue!!'

If you think this is just a DU problem, lol.

There are articles written by black journalists and bloggers and academics EVERYDAY about how they get harassed or talked crazy to by Bernie fans, even if they are just offerning up advice on how he could do better. See, you guys think he's perfect. We don't. Talking to us stupid just makes us say, 'Oh Hillary! Can we come back to you? Bernie's friends are mean and talk to us like we're stupid. Some of them are pretty racist too.'

Ahh well. Can't win for losing. We'll be fine with Hillary. We're survivors.

[RobertEarl]

57. None of us think Bernie is perfect

Oh, there may be a few, but we do think he is the best running.

Look, some of us voted for McGovern, even some for LBJ. We have watched a lot of crap go down. We have some experience and some of that is seeing the Clintons for 20 years. You want to discount all that experience and sell us on the idea that we shall never get better than Obama. Sorry, that is talking trash to some of us.

Question: You don't think Hillary can do better than Obama? Do you really think we will go backwards with Clintons, or make progress?

You stated that you want us all to suffer, and I got to tell ya, if you have been saying that here, I am not surprised you get insulted.

Again: You think Hillary can't make more progress than Obama? Yes, or no?

[bravenak]

59. I said 'your turn' like you will suffer this loss.

I don't think ANYONE can do BETTER than Obama. But at least Hillary listens to black people and so do her supporters. Bernie's supporters and he himself does not understand us at all. Thry don't even try to listen.

[RobertEarl]

68. That is your opinion

And that opinion appears ill-founded to me.

So you think we are going backwards after Obama. While the Bernie supporters are willing to work their asses off to see we make more progress.

Now we see why you personally are having such a tough go. You think we've peaked, we think we can keep moving.

[bravenak]

71. Prediction. It is my prediction.

[lovemydog]

95. As someone who agrees with Bravenak on this, I'll respond.

I don't think we'd go backwards with Bernie or Hillary or O'Malley if we get a good Congress. I don't think any of the three would be as great a President as Obama. Unless we get an amazing Congress. I think each of them has a great opportunity to be a very good President if we get a great Congress.

I think most people here in GDP place far too much emphasis on who will be the democratic presidential nominee, to the point of tuning others out or insulting other candidates or other posters here. I think that happens most prominently with Sanders supporters. Partly because they are very enthusiastic and sometimes their enthusiasm trumps common decency toward fellow posters here. Like the ones who have unduly trashed President Obama. And who unduly trash Hillary and keep ignoring or trashing O'Malley. I think they severely misunderstand that some people (many in fact) like their candidate just as much as some people like Bernie. As for the racism, yes I've seen it. It may not be overt. But the paternalism, taking down to people and asking bullying questions repeatedly, it's all over here. It's on this thread if you read it again.

It's without common decency toward fellow democrats or fellow democratic socialists or just fellow posters here.

Just my opinion.

[Fawke Em]

50. Even nice gospel-sounding singers love him.

Shhhh... just don't tell us Southerners they're from RUSSIA.

Seriously, this is a nicely-sung song.

[rhett o rick]

53. People are looking for an honest politican with integrity.

[Blue_In_AK]

67. I've been running into Sanders supporters everywhere.

[Aerows]

88. I was in a Taco Bell in

of all places, Mississippi, and people were talking about Bernie Sanders. Okay it was after I started talking about him, and I got a few liberals talking, so there it is.

If I can generate buzz in Mississippi, you can certainly generate buzz where ever you are.

[lovemydog]

102. Yes, that kind of thing happens tavernier.

A lot of the replies in this thread provide more anecdotal evidence.

No disrespect intended, but it's kind of funny to me how some follow it up with stuff that says this proves the truth will come out.

If that's the case, we'd have a Congress full of people as great as Sanders.

I'll keep fighting for those kinds of values.

But I'm not going to go as far as saying it's a fait accompli that the world is somehow going to vastly improve because some folks talked about Bernie at a Taco Bell.

I guess we'll have to wait and see whether he gets enough votes to get the nomination.

I think the struggle toward a better world will always continue. Regardless of who get the democratic nomination and the presidency.

I'm very glad that it does seem a lot of people are opening their eyes to how badly they've been screwed by bullshit trickle down economic 'theory.' Wealth inequality is a huge problem in this country. We must redistribute wealth back to the middle class and to all working people, especially the working poor!

[beam me up scottie]

105. Around here too, especially with blue collar workers.

He's gone from "Bernie who?" to "Hey I like that Bernie guy!"

Pass it around.

[Enthusiast]

129. No wonder. Trade deals are not popular with the blue collar crowd. And Bernie is pro-labor.

Bernie has been on the right side of the trade issue from the start. Once the American worker understands this Bernie will become more popular.

As far as I know, Bernie is far and away the best candidate on the trade issue.

[beam me up scottie]

130. A lot of these guys lost good paying jobs in the past two decades.

Many of them had to relocate to the south to take non-union jobs that pay much less.

The GOP wants working people to hate the poor, Bernie knows who the real enemies are.

Once they start listening they're hooked.

[Enthusiast]

134. Historically, the wealthy privileged have pushed this 'blame the poor' meme.

In this day an age people should have learned better.

[beam me up scottie]

135. It's easy to gin up hatred for others when people are scared.

While we're busy competing for crumbs the rich are laughing all the way to the bank.

[artislife]

160. Bad wages and the heat.

Boeing has lost good jobs to the right to work states.

Terrible when you lose jobs to another part of the country because they have been sold a bill of goods.

[beam me up scottie]

161. Yes it is.

The crooks who keep enticing corporations who refuse to pay workers decent wages and benefits to relocate to poor states by giving them tax breaks should be hung.

They keep getting rid of skilled workers and hiring temps only to get rid of them before they have to raise their hourly salary and offer benefits.

It's a win/win for greedy politicians and corporations alike and a lose/lose for workers.

[artislife]

162. This is how we are eating our young

and old, and in between.

We need to break the system.

[CountAllVotes]

113. Every Democrat I know is going for Sanders

Young, old and in-between -- all of them!!!

Its a .... SANDERSTORM!!!



& recommend!!

[Enthusiast]

125. Kicked

and recommended!

The media, the Democratic Party establishment and the establishment in general are firmly united in their goal of defeating Bernie Sanders. This should be obvious to anyone watching TV news media.

We should all be united in electing Bernie, regardless of party affiliation. Unless you are in that group with your heads in the sand ignoring grave threats to the nation and the general welfare of the citizens.

If you would have read a response to a Medicare petition I received from Senator Rob Portman you would be very alarmed.

We have to win and we have to win with the man willing to take on Wall Street supremacy.

[tavernier]

132. Is it just me or does Bernie

somewhat resemble Dustin Hoffman when he smiles?

[kenn3d]

138. What Fly Fisherman think

Yep, Bernie's all up in my social media too, (of course because I am a supporter).
But I also find a surprising level of interest in this early primary race in some of the most unlikely places. It's not only about Bernie, but it is clear that Bernie and his message are becoming widely known... and resonating with folks of all stripes.

http://forums.flyfisherman.com/showthread.php?12759-Ed-B-what-s-your-take-on-Bernie-Sanders

[Orsino]

140. Bernie don't coast.

He was a long shot, but his record and message beat all comers. Hope the nation at large will be permitted the choice.

[Attorney in Texas]

141. I don't think it's strange that Sanders is catching on. He's a top candidate espousing shared values

that define why we are Democrats and not Republicans, and he is very plainspoken about pursuing traditional liberal goals.

Under what scenario would that not catch on with Democrats and with everyone else who is not automatically closed-minded in opposition to the traditional Democratic platform? Maybe Sanders' voice would get drowned out if we had a clown-car primary, but -- fortunately -- our primary is not overfilled with washed up has beens, Fox News host wannabes, egomaniacs, failed executives seeking political redemption, TV show hucksters, neurosurgeons who mistakenly believe excellence in one narrow field implies competence in all things, etc. In any adult discussion of candidates (like the Democratic Primary and not at all like the Republican Primary), Sanders is bound to catch on.

I'm loving Sanders' campaign, and I'll happily vote for him in the primary and then I'll either vote for him again in the general election (I hope) or I'll happily vote for someone else as our nominee (probably Clinton, but who knows) in the general election. In my heart, I suspect that many Democrats feel the same way.

[tavernier]

149. Today Chuck Todd called it the

strongest republican field in 36 years.

So you must be mistaken. 😂 After all, he is a personal friend of Scarborough.

[Springslips]

152. Not many people have caught on to...

The fact that the MSM is not very powerful anymore. They themselves surely haven't. Social media and the web 2.0 have overtaken them. That's why I eyeroll at every thread here complaining about them and their coverage. It doesn't matter. The asteroid hit around 2008 and the once mighty dinosaurs of cable news and corp radio are now small birds; what they think are roar are tiny tweets that are muted out by much louder tweets by once buried mammals now playing in a new world all our own.

It is not 2004 anymore.

[d_legendary1]

156. Bernie is getting traction because he's telling it like it is

-People need a living wage

-The rich are fucking us over with wall street and outsourcing

-Police murdering AAs is a problem

And on and on and on. No double speak, no holding hands with Republicans, just the facts.

[hifiguy]

158. I've talked to several people in the last few weeks

who perked up as soon as I mentioned his name. It is happening, very quietly, out in the trenches.