37,600 People: Sanders Won the Debate

[Fawke Em]

Sen. Bernie Sanders raised $1.3 million in the first four hours after Tuesday night's Democratic presidential debate began, according to his campaign.

The campaign said the Vermont independent received more than 37,600 individual donations during that period and the average contribution was $34.58.

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/sanders-raises-1-3-million-off-debate-performance/

Hillary can have her pundits. Sanders will take the people. 10 or 15 pundits still have only one vote. So do 37,600 people.

[hrmjustin]

1. Good for him but Hillary still won.

[Scootaloo]

7. Then why are none of the proclamations of her winning based on her responses?

Every last one boils down to "well, she looked presidential, so she won!"

She had great style, no argument from me. But substance is more important than style, regardless of what fashion columnists turned pundits want to claim

[NCTraveler]

8. People are talking about her responses all over the place, including here.

Quoting her and discussing it. Where are you that you don't see this happening? I mean it is literally happening here. Seeing things like you have typed out here give me a much better understanding as to how people come to their thought process. They simply don't look at what they don't want to see. What you are saying they aren't talking about is being talked about on every democratic blog, network tv, newspapers across the country, and funny enough, on the exact board you are posting on.

[Scootaloo]

12. I'm looking at the op-ed pieces

It's a constant stream of how Clinton looked. Very bland, general paeans to her. There are a few quotes penciled in, but not examined. No cases built around them, it's "she said this' and then back to how "poised" she was.

And most of the "discussion" here on Du takes the same form as hrmjustin has delivered - "Good for him but Hillary still won." Assertions without substance, blandishments without reason.

if you're satisfied with some skinny gristle, good for you. I prefer meat.

[NCTraveler]

16. Then you must be amazingly selective in your sources.

There are op-ed after op-ed pieces posted even here that go completely against what you are saying. Don't be afraid to open links that might go against your worldview. Would you like for me to post a link to a du op that contains an op-ed discussing Hillarys comments directly. I have no clue how you aren't seeing them. They are all over the place.

Every one of our candidates delivered "meat" last night. And it is being discussed today.

[Scootaloo]

24. Nope, I'm clicking all the articles coming up on DU

I'm not saying Clinton didn't provide anything of substance. i'm saying that the media pieces I'm seeing are all about "style," basically declaring that she won because she was "poised" rather than substantive analysis of her responses. Every last one reads like it was written before the debates, conclusion pre-ordained, and the only impact the debates had was to give a little penciling-in on the margins.

And no, not every one of ou candidates delivered last night. Webb was trying to be Rick Perry, and Chafee... "I didn't know what I was voting for because it was my first day sicne I was appointed to replace my dad"? Ouch. OUCH!

[NCTraveler]

31. lol. nt.

[frylock]

60. I would like to see that op-ed, please.

[kenfrequed]

18. Agreed

Most of the pundits seemed fixated on the style or polish of her debating skill and have said almost nothing about the substance of the debate or which candidates words resonated more with the American public.

Of course the internet polls are flawed but they would have to be absurdly, wildly, exaggerated for Hillary to have somehow won in the eyes of the American people in general.

I don't know what the pundits based her "win" on.

[pennylane100]

13. Yes, people are talking about her,

but you would have to be tone deaf not to admit that they are also talking about Bernie. I think she do fine at the debate but I also think that Bernie was great. Also, Bernie got added points for refusing to pile on the criticism about her email and said that we need to talk about real problems.

[NCTraveler]

15. "you would have to be tone deaf not to admit that they are also talking about Bernie."

I agree. But what you say here has nothing to do with the post I replied to. They were dishonestly claiming that no one was talking about her substantive comments, just appearance and personality.

I was personally surprised by Sanders last night. While I won't go into a lot of detail, as it would simply cause an argument, he exceeded what I thought he was going to do by far. He was excellent. No part of my reply, or the post I was replying to, was referencing Sanders. If you want my opinion on Sanders, I just gave you the basics of it. Of course they are talking about him and I would never infer or insinuate that they aren't.

[Dustlawyer]

41. People, "...simply don't look at what they don't want to see." Could agree more!

While every candidate has strengths and weaknesses, the top donors for Hillary being Wall Street banks is a lot to overlook. Still, many are not having a problem doing so.

Both Hillary and Bernie did well, and relatively speaking, all did well compared to the Republicans. Whoever wins the Democratic primary will beat the tar out of the best the clown car offers up. All candidates spoke intelligently about the issues and foreign policy, while the Republicans cannot speak one intelligent sentence. Bernie is right, we need to debate the Republicans during the Primaries as well, though I know it won't happen.

[hrmjustin]

9. Well i think that is all a matter of opinion.

[Scootaloo]

25. Maybe you ought to start phrasing your opinion as opinion.

[hrmjustin]

30. Well i thought that was a given it was my opinion.

[Fawke Em]

26. Nope.

Even Google says Bernie won.

For the non-Hillary Rodham Clinton, non-Bernie Sanders Democrats participating in the first debate on Tuesday night, there was one goal: Get noticed. A look at the candidates being searched on Google during the debate shows that one candidate managed to do that.

Bernie Sanders.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2015/10/13/the-candidate-breaking-through-in-the-democratic-debate-bernie-sanders/

But, you keep following what the corporate media tells you, OK?

[hrmjustin]

32. Are you sayong I can't think for myself?

[Marty McGraw]

65. Oh... my....

Just Razzin'

[ProgressiveJarhead]

27. Of Course She Did

That is the oligarch's narrative. She is easy to package and market. Even is she loses-she wins.

[hrmjustin]

33. Oh good God!

[Bubzer]

50. Just like Trump.

[Marty McGraw]

67. Is she a loses?

Sorry PJ, I just thought I needed to be an equal opportunity offender since I did the same to hrmj above.

just makes me remember so long ago when teachers would erase all off a chalkboard but leave one small tiny mark left over to make ya go nutz for the rest of the session.

[Marty McGraw]

69. of course, though

to make it known; I do live in a Glass House.

[Jester Messiah]

63. Hee hee. Sure she did.

GG li'l buddy.

[hrmjustin]

73. Good bye.

[Jester Messiah]

78. See ya!

[JDPriestly]

80. Actually, Bernie won, and well before the debate began.

The issues discussed? Those were Bernie's issues, the ones Bernie has been raising for years.

The leader of the group? Bernie. This was most clear in that famous moment when Bernie rescued Hillary from the questions about her ridiculous e-mails. She had a canned answer ready and was making sure she remembered how to say it correctly, when, whoosh, in that darkest moment, and at the risk of writing this is a bit of an overly dramatic way, a knight in shining armor appeared to rescue her -- Bernie Sanders.

Let me say -- let me say something that may not be great politics. But I think the secretary is right, and that is that the American people are sick and tired of hearing about your damn e-mails.

In that moment, he showed what a great, gracious, caring guy he is. It wasn't that Hillary lost in that moment. It's that Bernie Sanders proved that he could make himself a winner while helping Hillary. That's what Bernie is about. Winning to help the American people.

The other great moment in the debate was also a Bernie moment when Bernie, in response to Clinton's admission that she had been representing Wall Street in 2007 at the time that foreclosures skyrocketed and the banks were already showing signs of their impending failure, said this:

In my view, Secretary Clinton, you do not -- Congress does not regulate Wall Street. Wall Street regulates Congress.

(APPLAUSE)

And we have gotta break off these banks. Going to them...

Finally, in terms of analysis that Americans feel in their hearts is true and know in their hearts is supremely unfair and wrong:

SANDERS: Let us be clear that the greed and recklessness and illegal behavior of Wall Street, where fraud is a business model, helped to destroy this economy and the lives of millions of people.

(APPLAUSE)

Check the record. In the 1990s -- and all due respect -- in the 1990s, when I had the Republican leadership and Wall Street spending billions of dollars in lobbying, when the Clinton administration, when Alan Greenspan said, "what a great idea it would be to allow these huge banks to merge," Bernie Sanders fought them, and helped lead the opposition to deregulation.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2015/10/13/the-oct-13-democratic-debate-who-said-what-and-what-it-means/

(All quotes at that link.)

Americans want a president who is a leader. Bernie was the leader in this debate. He was the authority, the guide, the protector and the voice of wisdom on the stage. Most important, the take-away moments, the lines that Democrats will be talking about over the water cooler this morning were Bernie's lines -- and there was nothing planned about them. They were just the real, spontaneous, and in one case, uncensored Bernie.

Bernie does not need a team of handlers to polish his rhetoric and feed him good lines. He just needs people who love him and join him in getting the job done.

And that is why Bernie won the debate.

[restorefreedom]

2. fricken A! feel the bern!!

i can wait to see the gob smacked faces of the pundits when Bernie starts taking state after state.

[Nitram]

45. I'm not looking forward to your disappointment if Clinton wins.

This isn't an athletic event, it's the Democratic primary. I will support whoever wins. And take no glee in the disappointment of those whose candidate doesn't make the grade.

[restorefreedom]

53. i know the stakes here

I am pro Bernie. I'm not gonna take glee in disappointment of Hillary supporters if Hillary doesn't get the nomination. But I'm not gonna lie and say that I won't take glee in the gob smacked faces of the pundits who think they can predict everything a year out. Those talking heads need a little humility training.

[darkangel218]

3. Actions speak louder than any pundit words out there!

GO BERNIE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[DanTex]

4. I wonder what the other 10 million people watching thought.

[R B Garr]

17. Yes,and it's doubtful this was spontaneous

And not a coordinated effort like the Bernistas spamming the online polls. Last night I saw the CNN poll being spammed with Disagree votes before Clinton even spoke.

This is just more shenanigans and so phony. Thirty-something thousand is about what I heard for other online efforts so sounds like planned teamworlk. So PHONY.

[kenfrequed]

19. Huh...

I thought the talking point was that Bernie didn't have the coordinated operation to run a campaign needed to win. Now he has coordinated with tens of thousands of volunteers to spam every single internet poll?

Which is it?

[R B Garr]

28. Huh yourself. The so-called viewing parties were

Celebrated here for days Someone coordinated those.

And Lol at comparing internet spamming to "run a campaign to win." Really?

[kenfrequed]

42. And...

Somehow magically all that organizing is just going to disappear?

I still fail to see what your argument is.


You are just in attack mode right now. It's ok, we all get that way.

[R B Garr]

48. Lmao, right on cue. Not even funny anymore

It's just immediate pivot to personal attacks from the B fans which is obvious was your intention.

LOL at comparing internet trolling to "running a campaign".

[Lordquinton]

74. What's not funny is how every one of these threads

that I have opened has the first response being a Hillary supporter saying "No Hillary won"

If you want to talk concentrated efforts, let's start here at home.

[R B Garr]

75. I forgot that Hillary supporters are not to speak

The internet is only for Bernie's.

[Lordquinton]

77. Which is completely unrelated to anything I said

You claimed that Bernie supporters are somehow coordinating to flood every poll ever, I pointed out that somehow Hillary supporters are somehow getting the first reply on many of these debate posts with a "No he didn't, Hillary did" and often are unable to back it up with any sort of substance, (claims of just opinions, "Scientific" conspiracy, etc...).

Please keep talking, but remember that uncomfortable questions, or facts aren't attempts to silence.

[jeff47]

29. Whichever one is necessary at the moment.

Just like their candidate's positions.

[darkangel218]

23. Yeah right!!!

[R B Garr]

34. This from someone posting RW gtaphics

That slur Bernie and not even realizing it.

Lol indeed.

[darkangel218]

38. LMAO!!!!

Keep it up!

[R B Garr]

51. Oh, you're doing just fine on your own

[darkangel218]

52. I have nothing on you!!

[R B Garr]

55. Naw, you're doing fine

Funny to watch you post slurs about Bernie and not even knowing.

[darkangel218]

57. It was not a "slur", not in the least.

But you are taking care of what you're accusing me of doing.

Quite entertaining. Have a great day!!!!

[R B Garr]

58. I just responded to your post to me

Quite entertaining, indeed

[HerbChestnut]

5. Sums up the election so far.

Hillary gets all the attention, Bernie gets all the people.

[FlatBaroque]

10. as above so below. Good point, Herb. nt

[Nitram]

46. Bernie gets all the people?

What universe are you living in?

[HerbChestnut]

49. This one.

If you've been playing attention, which I'm sure you have, then you'd know that people are consistently turning out by the thousands to hear Bernie speak. They're also donating to his campaign in droves unlike anything seen in the history of politics. This has been happening regardless of what the media says about him. That's the point I'm making.

[Nitram]

54. Put like that, I can see your point.

But why the need by Bernistas to continually overstate their case? ALL the people? Let's bring the conversation back down to earth for while.

[HerbChestnut]

56. It's just rhetoric.

[passiveporcupine]

76. You didn't mind Hillary gets all the attention?

[brooklynite]

6. 0.18% of the votes he'll need to win the Primary.

[workinclasszero]

11. Yup

Relax Bernie fans, you got this primary in the bag!

[Fawke Em]

35. Your newly-found trust in the corporate media is odd.

But, hey, if that's what floats your boat...

[brooklynite]

37. Maybe it's the fact that conservatives complain as much about the "MSM" as the liberals do...

Also, I tend to discount conspiracy theories where EVERY media outlet is in on the game.

[Fawke Em]

43. And I tend to view a whole picture.

Even if you take out Internet polling, Bernie won the focus groups. He got millions in donations from thousands of people. Google says he was the most searched candidate - even out-doing Trump.

The fact that a corporate-owned media would support a corporate-owned candidate isn't so much conspiracy as expediency.

[Nitram]

47. I believe the biggest mistake Bernistas are making is...

...assuming Clinton is a fully-owned subsidiary of corporations. Reminds me of the assumption during the cold war that socialists took their orders from Moscow. Clinton is and has always been a progressive who fights for the people.

[Fearless]

61. False.

Besides the fact that she was a Republican... And fought FOR Wall St... She still ain't progressive.

[Nitram]

72. Patently unfair. Clinton grew up in a Republican family.

She began to change her political views in response to the civil rights movement and the Vietnam War. By 1967 (almost 50 years ago!) she was supporting Eugene McCarthy's anti-war campaign. Following the assassination of Martin Luther King, Jr., she organized a two-day student strike and worked with Wellesley's black students to recruit more black students and faculty at Wellesley. I'm afraid you don't have a clue about Clinton.

[passiveporcupine]

79. From wiki

Rodham's early political development was shaped most by her high school history teacher (like her father, a fervent anticommunist), who introduced her to Goldwater's The Conscience of a Conservative,[17] and by her Methodist youth minister (like her mother, concerned with issues of social justice)

she hasn't changed much. Yes, she is a social liberal because of her mom, but still anti-communist and anti-socialist...in otherwords, like her daddy, a true capitalist. And I think she always will be at heart. And that is why, even when she tries to sound progressive economically, it comes out stilted and with qualifiers...like saying free college is OK, but the students still need to have a job to earn part of it. She just can't let anyone have anything for free (as if it is ever free). Gotta show how much you want it and how hard you will work for it.

Somehow the rich kids don't have to do that...they get to go to college for free and daddy pays for it. Wonder why it works for them, but not the rest of us?

[Nitram]

81. So you don't believe that people can change with experience?

No one can rise above their parent's biases and weaknesses? Clinton did so 48 years ago, as the record shows. To jam her into a little pigeon-hole called "capitalist" or "corporatist" is simplistic, narrow-minded and just plain wrong.

[passiveporcupine]

83. Of course people can change

But from what I've seen of Clinton, she hasn't. She has broadened her interest in social issues, but she still can't let go of her capitalist leanings.

[Fawke Em]

70. How is it a mistake?

I've heard her triangulated Third-Way speeches, I can see who has given to her campaign and I can see how she acts.

And, as a progressive - a liberal, even - I don't find Clinton to be very progressive.

[leftofcool]

40. Yea, that will win it.

Not.

[Renew Deal]

14. How many are first time donors?

[frylock]

62. It was my first time donating to Sanders' campaign..

Obama's campaign was the first that I had ever donated to.

[Snotcicles]

20. Think about that for a minute. Sanders average donation is around $30. Hillary's

average I think I saw it was around $250. so lets round it off to $210. That equates to a 7 to 1 vote advantage for Bernie. It takes seven, people/donors/voters to match one of Hillary's. So Hillary should have either raised 9.1 mil in those same four hours or had 5371 people/donors/voters.

[turbinetree]

44. Your math ....................................

and this opinion says it all---------------------I like it a lot, and this is a very good point



Honk--------------------for a political revolution Bernie 2016

[Uncle Joe]

21. Kicked and recommended.

Thanks for the thread, Fawke Em.

[Eleanors38]

22. They can hold a debate in Vegas, but the analysis is still Beltway.

[Fawke Em]

36. What happens in Vegas, stays in the Beltway.

[darkangel218]

39. K&R!!!!

[Vattel]

59. On substance, Sanders won. On honesty, Sanders, Webb and Chafee tied for the win,

on style Clinton won with Sanders as a close second.

[Renew Deal]

64. Chafee lied about his Patriot Act vote

So I don't think so

[sigh144]

66. Hillary won easily.

She won easily, Bernie looked unprepared and quite frankly......I like him, but he will not be getting my vote in the primary.

I like him more than Clinton and believe his ideas are what we need.

But he would lose in a landslide...wake up people.

[Fawke Em]

71. Since he outperforms Clinton against the Republicans, he'll lose?

That makes no sense.

But, thanks for your "concern."

And, no, she didn't win. She didn't fall flat on her face, but she didn't win.

[Allen Mitchell]

68. My wife still uses AOL they all but appointed Hillary as queen!

My wife still uses AOL they appointed Hillary as queen!
http://www.aol.com/article/2015/10/14/clintons-debate-showing-may-spell-trouble-for-biden/21249041/?icid=maing-grid7%7Cie8-unsupported-browser%7Cdl1%7Csec1_lnk2%26pLid%3D-901242175
Clinton's debate showing may spell trouble for Biden

U.S. Vice President Joe Biden faced an altered political dynamic on Wednesday after Hillary Clinton reasserted her command of the Democratic Party race during a debate that may have left little room for him to run.

Clinton, 67, was widely hailed by analysts as turning in a nimble, effective performance on Tuesday night, perhaps easing the fears of some Democrats fretting that the flap over her use of a private email server while in the Obama administration was torpedoing her candidacy.

In doing so, she at once may have dampened calls for Biden to make a belated entrance into the race, while also blunting the threat from insurgent candidate Bernie Sanders, a 74-year-old U.S. senator from Vermont and self-described democratic socialist.

"If you're a Hillary supporter and you were worried for whatever reason, you should feel very good about yourself," said Rodell Mollineau, a Democratic strategist who attended the debate in Las Vegas. "This is the kind of debate that helps build momentum."

Sanders, Clinton's top rival among declared presidential candidates, was handed the opportunity by debate moderators to assail her over the email issue. Instead, he dismissed the controversy as trivial, drawing an ovation from the crowd and shoving the spotlight away from Clinton's most profound political weakness.

For Biden, 72, who continues to ponder a bid for the presidency in the November 2016 election, the evening served as a reminder of how tenacious Clinton, steeled by scores of debates in her 2008 presidential run and four years as secretary of state, can be as a candidate.

REACHING FOR PROGRESSIVES, MODERATES

At times Clinton seemed to be reaching out both to the progressives in her party more likely to back Sanders and the moderates who may prefer Biden.

She went toe-to-toe with Sanders over gun control, addressed income inequality, and advocated for more liberal family-leave policies. At the same time, she refused to go along with Sanders' call to break up Wall Street banks, reiterated her support of the Patriot Act, and said she would not hesitate to use military force if necessary, at times obliquely criticizing President Barack Obama's White House - and by proxy, Biden - for failing to stand up to Russian President Vladimir Putin and for doing too little with regard to the civil war in Syria.

"I think Biden probably has less room (for a bid)," said Brad Bannon, a Democratic strategist in Washington. "People had questions about how well Hillary can handle herself. I thought she performed very well."

The evening may have also exposed Sanders' limitations. As a candidate, he has made populist economic themes central to his campaign, almost to the exclusion of other issues. His discomfort on guns - his home state of Vermont is protective of gun rights - and with foreign policy seemed evident. At one point, Sanders loudly protested he is not a pacifist.

[Enthusiast]

82. Kicked and recommended a whole bunch!

Yay, Bernie!