Bernie is NOT Obama

[MaggieD]

The hubris of people thinking that because Obama beat Hillary (barely) that Bernie will beat Hillary is astounding.

It's like you're totally unaware that he can't seem to garner ANY appreciable support from AA, Latinos, Women, and LGBT people. Spare me the anecdotes of your next door neighbor who is black or Latino or a woman or gay.

The minority vote is a monolith in the Dem primary contest. You simply cannot win without them. Not only does Bernie not inspire us, he comes off as clueless about our issues. And every time you pretend MLK would have endorsed him (when MLK never endorsed ANY pol), or you ignore Bernie's previous anti immigrant rhetoric, or you pretend he was some sort of champion for LGBT people who never heard shit from him as they strived for marriage rights, you PISS them off.

Let's be real - Bernie AND his supporters killed any chance for AA support when he walked off in a huff at Netroots and then repeated it in Seattle. And then Bernie's worst enemies (his supporters) dissed the shit out of AA as a result. It was bad enough that he spent his whole career in congress IGNORING these folks (and I was one of the group he ignored, so I know the feeling), but his campaign and his supporters sealed the deal with these episodes.

Forget it. Stop fantasizing that you can a) win without the support of minorities - you cannot, or b) that he is your Obama. Not even close. You just sound silly running that meme, IMO.

[Bread and Circus]

1. You sound scared. Why do you keep posting shit like this over and again.

We get it, Bernie is a longshot. It's almost like you have to prove it to yourself.

[MaggieD]

4. I'm disgusted - not scared

We are here on DEMOCRATIC UNDERGROUND where the main pastime seems to be smearing Dems rather than helping them get elected.

[JonLeibowitz]

35. Primary battles often pit one Democrat against another.

[MaggieD]

62. Not this nasty shit

I don't think Bernie supporters actually grasp how insulting every major Dem voting group is ensuring his loss.

[JonLeibowitz]

64. I can't speak for others.

And I would encourage you not to either. I will explain why I think Hillary is the wrong candidate to lead the democratic party. But your attempts to paint me with a broad brush are not helpful.

[highprincipleswork]

90. How about treating Bernie supporters fairly as well?

To a lot of us, Bernie Sanders is clearly the best and most truthful, most authentic candidate to come along since, well, Bobby Kennedy.

Others of you may disagree, but there's got to be some reason why so many of us think he's just completely fabulous.

We can easily see how he can best represent so many of the groups you mention. But, if you don't see it, that's fine. Just keep in mind that there are those from say Black Lives Matter that have had much more positive things to say about Bernie than Hillary.

We're all going to hopefully work together to ensure a Democratic President, so you're right in that we should remain civil to each other. But to fight for our candidate, to put their message out there strongly/vigorously, even to point out the weaknesses in the opponent, that should be expected.

Now, if we could just get decent debates at decent times and make sure that everyone knows the candidates thoroughly, that would make for a more unified party in the end. Because the amount of juryrigging that has gone on leaves a very sour taste in the mouth of anyone who is not cocksure that Hillary is the anointed one we have all been waiting for.

Notice, that's about the DNC and the patently obviously biased scheduling of debates, losing tons of opportunities to make the news. Although, if Hillary wants a unified party after she wins (if that actually happens), she really should remove the traces of smelly juryrigging that her former campaign manager DWS has put into place.

C'mon, if you're really that good, prove it. Let the others be fully known and yourself to be fully tested.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

165. Well

To a lot of us, Bernie Sanders is clearly the best and most truthful, most authentic candidate to come along since, well, Bobby Kennedy

The martyred Bobby Kennedy chose one of the most heterogeneous constituencies to represent and not one of the most homogeneous constituencies to represent in the Senate.

Robert Kennedy made fighting poverty a centerpiece of his career:






Robert Kennedy broke bread with Cesar Chavez to break his hunger fast:







Robert Kennedy addressed a predominately African American crowd the night of Dr. King's assassination to inform them he had been killed:

What has Bernie Sanders ever done that places him in such rarefied company as the martyred senator?

[JDPriestly]

114. I don't think that Hillary supporters realize how insulting and alienating Bernie's supporters

insures that they will not support Hillary in the GE and how that can hurt her chances.

She is going to be very difficult to actually elect. In fact in my view she is unelectable. I have otherwise liberal friends who are not on DU who believe obviously false but very damaging rumors about her and Bill Clinton.

What we write on DU is nothing compared to the stories about her that are believed by so many that are circulating.

She polls well among voting Democrats. But that is not just her base but pretty much the limited group that will vote for her.

Hillary's fans do not realize that she is not the candidate who can win. Bernie is. His rise in popularity, his positives as opposed to her fall in popularity from her starting numbers and her negatives -- not trustworthy being the biggie -- mean she will not do well in the general election even if she wins the primary.

And the facts about her pay for speeches and the donations to her family foundation are pretty troubling and will cause her even more trouble as time passes.

This primary struggle is about the chance to win in 2016. Many of us disagree on who can win in 2016. I think Bernie has a far better chance than Hillary. He is honest and straightforward. He has over his life moved if at all from left to right. Hillary on the other hand has moved in every direction depending on the political wind.

The flaw in the OP is that it ASSUMES (I love all caps -- easy to read) that Hillary will be the candidate in 2016. That assumption is premature and quite possibly false. It is improper to tell supporters of another candidate to just shut up based on the assumption that a pre-ordained candidate will win.

The similarity between this primary and that of 2008 is that we have Hillary, the assumed candidate anointed by the party bosses, and we have Bernie, who draws the enthusiastic crowds and is loved especially by young voters. Who will win? We shall see. But it cannot be assumed that Hillary will really win. She was the party favorite in 2008 and she lost.

Bernie is the likely candidate in my view. The primaries are not yet over.

If I were a Hillary supporter, I certainly would relax and not post flame-bait on DU. It is not going to pay off for anyone. If Hillary does win, the Hillary supporters will have so insulted the Bernie supporters that Bernie supporters will not vote for Hillary.

I for one will vote for all other Democrats on my ballot, but if Hillary is the candidate, I cannot in good conscience vote for her. I have no confidence in her as a leader. I have no confidence in her ability to distance herself from donors and those who have paid her for speeches and the in-crowed in D.C. and govern for the rest of us. I think her economic populism is phony as anything, that she is actually much more of a hawk than she wants us to believe and that she is in the bag for Wall Street without even admitting it to herself. I also think that she secretly supports the TPP in that with just a few tweaks not involving doing away with the disastrous trade courts, she will announce if elected that the TPP is now OK. It won't be, and our economy will deteriorate if she signs it.

Feel the Bern! The only candidate with common sense and the courage to strongly condemn the TPP agreement is Bernie Sanders. He is the only one who is sincere about it. He has the judgment and foresight that Hillary lacks.

Vote for Bernie in the primaries.

[Douglas Carpenter]

131. I don't think they care. Yes, there are some pro-Bernie people who are over the top. But compared to

the utter sliminess of some of the most ardent Hillary supporters - that's nothing.

I think the reason why they are so filled with hate is a sense of the entitlement of establishment power and a fear that the Democratic Party might be forced to be influenced by those outside of establishment power. Although this sort don't seem to care at all about issues or their candidates political history, voting record or even current positions on issues - they are wed to establishment candidates and anyone who disrupts their establishment is like a juvenile delinquent disrespecting the school master.

They are psychologically incapable of imagining a world without these kind of power arrangements. However, I'm sure if Hillary or whoever the establishment candidate suddenly announced that they now support single payer healthcare and publicly supported tuition-free four years of college education for every U.S. Citizen and major cuts in military spending they would in one second and without any cognitive dissonance whatsoever be awestruck at the wisdom of establishment power. Just as they were so outraged over Killer Mike invoking the legacy of Dr. King in his endorsement of Bernie but could not imagine anything wrong with the official website for Hillary using a cartoon image of Rosa Parks.

I guess progressives and liberals are like the bad children making noise in the back of the class and silencing us is more important than not alienating us. If they succeed in alienating us - they will have someone to blame when they lose. But mark my word, since I have heard this all before. Within a few years they will completely rewrite history and claim that Hillary was a radical leftist who was nominated because the far left hijacked the party. So that is why she lost and that is why we cannot think of nominating someone outside of establishment power. And they will believe their historic rewrite and say it with a righteously indignant straight face.

[Juicy_Bellows]

156. I couldn't agree more. Nt.

[AtomicKitten]

196. Well said. Thanks.

[Kentonio]

149. I love this post

Op writes long post smearing Dem candidate, then says how disgusted she is at people smearing Dem candidates. You couldn't make this stuff up..

[mythology]

190. There are people of both Sanders and Clinton who go to far

And insist all the while that it's only the other side.

I'm happy to vote for any of the three candidates as I think they are all good.

[TheBlackAdder]

195. Half admit to working on the campaigns. Those users should have a "Sponsored Content" warning!

.


I've seen several posts where certain Multiple OPs/Day-ers admit working on a candidate's campaign.


These people should be flagged as having a greater than normal bias for one candidate over another.

The term "Sponsored Content" might be a little strong, as most campaigns would not agree to have these OPs generated on their candidate's behalf, but as a proxy they could be fine with them. Or perhaps a "Campaign Staffer for XXX Campaign" warning appear at the top of the OP? Who knows?


People who are campaign workers, should have a special symbol affixed to their accounts and posts identifying such!

They seem to be flooding the boards with a bunch of bullshit lately, trying to convince people who are mostly in their camp's bubble or on the other campaign's bubble. A lot of noise and most are deaf to it. The ones who remain neutral must filter though this bullshit, and it's starting to really suck!


.

[tex-wyo-dem]

182. So you're telling me as a Bernie supporter...

That I should just sit down, shut up and get on the Hillary bus; right?

Gotcha!

[pnwmom]

101. No, she doesn't. She sounds angry that people are comparing Bernie to the President.

And she is right.

On the one hand, BS supporters are constantly criticizing Obama for doing almost everything wrong. OTOH, they claim that because Obama beat Hillary, then Bernie will be able to.

[2pooped2pop]

158. I know, right.

It's hilarious but tiresome.

[Scootaloo]

2. Do you feel better now?

[MaggieD]

15. Think of it as friendly advice for the future

The next time you want to get behind a dark horse candidate remind your team that insulting and denigrating the tried and true Dem voters that decide the election is not in your best interest.

[cui bono]

28. Oh really?

Is that the advice you post over at the Clinton Cave to your fellow Cavers?

[bravenak]

41. I watch folks try to police the sites others post at with equanimity.

It also shows what type of controlling people they are.

[cui bono]

50. absolutely NO idea what you just said and what it has to do with anything but...

mmmkay...

.

[bravenak]

55. Yeah right.

[bvf]

91. What?

[bravenak]

92. You don't find it funny? I do.

[bvf]

96. There's "funny," and there's meaningless.

I watch folks try to police the sites others post at with equanimity.
It also shows what type of controlling people they are.

This is meaningless.

[bravenak]

98. It means much and more.

[bvf]

103. Yeah, whatever you say.

[bravenak]

104. Finally!

[bvf]

108. Uh, huh. I see. OK, then. Excellent. Cool. Bye, now.

[bravenak]

110. Much love!

[Capt. Obvious]

136. You just don't understand genius speak

[bvf]

169. That must be it.

Yep, right up there with Stephen Hawking, although I've never known him to lapse into a weird schoolgirl patois.

[MaggieD]

67. Yes, really

You cannot win a Dem nomination by insulting literally every major Dem voting group. It's about as fantastical as the rethug belief that they will win over AA voters by telling them how they are all dependent on welfare when there are many more white people on welfare than AAs. People know insults and BS when they hear it. Surprise!

[cui bono]

150. So again, I ask. Is this the advice you post over at the Clinton Cave?

To your fellow Cavers? All Hillary supporters (except one)?

[Sheepshank]

171. this is so stupid...you are attempt to insult some here by referencing another site.

have you Googled Clinton Cave? There are twitter feeds, Facebook, and other sites actually called Clinton Cave, and fwiw I don't know anyone that posts over there.

If hillaryclintonsupporters.com is the site you are trying to diss with you not so clever renaming, you gotta know what a loosing deal that is, because all of us that post at hillaryclintonsupporters.com can unequivocally stated we do not talk to anyone at Clinton Cave.

gawd your insult fell flat!!!

I do know several people that post at hillaryclintonsupporters.com, including myself. Your absurd question doesn't come up there...and frankly why should it? It's for Clinton Supporters, not really designed for socks that may infiltrate and cherry pick months old info to spread from that site.

A majority of the hillaryclintonsupporters.com site is dedicated to Hillary support without the bashing and pissy, nasty innuendos of Bernie supporters hell bent on outrage at every turn. You can spare me the screen shots, they are old and over used and not a true reflection of the entire site.

If we were to use your standards, I'd say that certain tweets from a Bernie supporter could handily represent the entirety of the Bernie Group (remembering that a whole lot of you seem to adore her racist nastiness via recs and honoring her in threads). Is that where you want to go with this line of bashing? Because frankly I'm pretty sure I know of many an AA group that would love to see those tweets from a Bernie supporter and show them the hundreds of Recs it garnered. I may just do it anyway...so sick of the Bernie supporters.

[cui bono]

178. It's not an insult, it's pointing out the hypocrisy of the poster I was responding to.

S/he does not limit their nastiness to the Clinton Cave either. I did not coin that name, someone else did and others took to it so I use it. And yes, it is hillsaryclintonsupporters.com, you know the site that is a cesspool of vile hate, as is noted in several threads here on DU, even if it has since been hidden from public view.

So, no, your analogy of standards is incorrect. I do not consider all Hillary supporters to be nasty and full of hate, but most, if not all, of the ones that post on that hate filled site spewing hatred clearly are, as evidenced by the screenshots that were posted here.

And I believe the poster you are speaking of is Catherina, who is an AA. So if you think she's racist then I'm confused. Unless you think - as someone else who is AA thinks per their pm to me - that she's not black enough, that her skin color is too light, to criticize other PoC. I don't know, that sounds weird to me but not for me to say if it's right or not.

I have no feelings one way or another about Catherina. I see she comes and goes from DU. I saw a tweet that a self admitted troll posted where she used terms that certainly no white person should ever use imo, but again, she's not white. Maybe you didn't know that. I didn't know - although she wasn't on my radar until I was sent that pm - until I went to her Twitter page to verify it was a real tweet by her and then have since read here on DU that she's black.

So if that's what you're talking about... then I don't know, but it's not a valid comparison. Also, as I mentioned, I am speaking directly to the person who posts nasty shit here and at the Clinton Cave. I am not incriminating all Hillary supporters. I do think anyone who particpates at a hate filled site though is suspect. Especially after seeing all the crap they post over there, which you can see in the links here:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=647936

And it's not just hate, it's about trolling DU as well, like alert stalking and trying to prod people into their 5th hides, and also about stacking juries ("our own juries" was posted there). I have never seen such hatred directed at people simply because of who they support for the presidency. That site rivals Tea Baggers and Freeperville.

.

[Sheepshank]

187. Oh ffs, take it to the secret FB page and unload your myopic insults there.

HCS it is not a cesspool, and your insults are disgusting and narrowminded and very mypoic.

Based on special tweets here by the well adored Berni Supporter, should I be judging all Bernie supporters as antisemetic bigoted racists, or just the person who posted. Do I decry the entirety of DU because of the disgusting posts of a few. Should I judge the entirety of Islam because of a few extremists? You stand is not only obnoxious, but false in its premis.

And it's not just hate, it's about trolling DU as well, like alert stalking and trying to prod people into their 5th hides, and also about stacking juries ("our own juries" was posted there). I have never seen such hatred directed at people simply because of who they support for the presidency. That site rivals Tea Baggers and Freeperville.

You just described your group to a "T".

To repeat what I said above:

A majority of the hillaryclintonsupporters.com site is dedicated to Hillary support without the bashing and pissy, nasty innuendos of Bernie supporters hell bent on outrage at every turn. You can spare me the screen shots, they are old and over used and not a true reflection of the entire site.

If we were to use your standards, I'd say that certain tweets from a Bernie supporter could handily represent the entirety of the Bernie Group (remembering that a whole lot of you seem to adore her racist nastiness via recs and honoring her in threads). Is that where you want to go with this line of bashing? Because frankly I'm pretty sure I know of many an AA group that would love to see those tweets from a Bernie supporter and show them the hundreds of Recs it garnered. I may just do it anyway...so sick of the Bernie supporters.

DONE.

[cui bono]

189. I don't use FB so I have no idea what you are talking about.

And your post makes it obvious that you failed to read mine.

I stated - very clearly - that my comment was directed to a specific poster and I also stated - very clearly - that I do not think ALL Hillary supporters are hateful people. The ones that participate at the Clinton Cave are mostly hateful and in an extremely vile manner. This can be seen in the screenshots.

So AGAIN - what you are saying is completely invalid since, AGAIN, I am not talking about ALL Hillary supporters.

Just like someone else, you seem to think that if you keep repeating something it will make it true, but it doesn't. Everyone knows that.

And I don't have a group so I don't know what you are talking about there either.

To repeat what I said above:

178. It's not an insult, it's pointing out the hypocrisy of the poster I was responding to.

S/he does not limit their nastiness to the Clinton Cave either. I did not coin that name, someone else did and others took to it so I use it. And yes, it is hillsaryclintonsupporters.com, you know the site that is a cesspool of vile hate, as is noted in several threads here on DU, even if it has since been hidden from public view.

So, no, your analogy of standards is incorrect. I do not consider all Hillary supporters to be nasty and full of hate, but most, if not all, of the ones that post on that hate filled site spewing hatred clearly are, as evidenced by the screenshots that were posted here.

And I believe the poster you are speaking of is Catherina, who is an AA. So if you think she's racist then I'm confused. Unless you think - as someone else who is AA thinks per their pm to me - that she's not black enough, that her skin color is too light, to criticize other PoC. I don't know, that sounds weird to me but not for me to say if it's right or not.

I have no feelings one way or another about Catherina. I see she comes and goes from DU. I saw a tweet that a self admitted troll posted where she used terms that certainly no white person should ever use imo, but again, she's not white. Maybe you didn't know that. I didn't know - although she wasn't on my radar until I was sent that pm - until I went to her Twitter page to verify it was a real tweet by her and then have since read here on DU that she's black.

So if that's what you're talking about... then I don't know, but it's not a valid comparison. Also, as I mentioned, I am speaking directly to the person who posts nasty shit here and at the Clinton Cave. I am not incriminating all Hillary supporters. I do think anyone who particpates at a hate filled site though is suspect. Especially after seeing all the crap they post over there, which you can see in the links here:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=647936

And it's not just hate, it's about trolling DU as well, like alert stalking and trying to prod people into their 5th hides, and also about stacking juries ("our own juries" was posted there). I have never seen such hatred directed at people simply because of who they support for the presidency. That site rivals Tea Baggers and Freeperville.

.

[JonLeibowitz]

39. You think this recent post of yours isn't insulting and denigrating a democratic voter?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=868580

[bravenak]

46. I watch new posters go after long term posters with amusement.

I have seen many come and many go just as fast as they came. But the older termers seem to outlast them. Often, new posters who safe links and try to harass the older termers are returnees with a nasty agenda.

[JonLeibowitz]

48. So what?

By the way, I have no nasty agenda. I responded to MaggieD's nastiness with a substantive explanation of what I believe in and why i am fighting for Bernie: http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=868638

No agenda, just my take on policy and where I want to see the country head. Where did you get that I have a nasty agenda? Or are you just using my relatively low postcount as an easy avenue of attack? Not very nice.

[bravenak]

57. Just telling you. It's what I see.

[JonLeibowitz]

61. Thanks. I don't need to be told that. Bye.

[bravenak]

63. I will continue telling you anyways.

[JonLeibowitz]

66. You know, I wasn't even "saving links", as you said. This was a message MaggieD had just sent.

I had literally just finished responding. So, nothing like "saving links" to harass "older" members.

[bravenak]

72. Once you called me a liar for no reason I decided to see what was up with you.

[JonLeibowitz]

74. And what did you discover about me?

I didn't call you a liar for no reason. I saw the same post that many others saw.

[bravenak]

81. That pm was be telling the same truth I have been repeating since summer.

You would KNOW THAT if you bothered to read the BLM threads from before your time.
Anyways, I decided it was peer pressure or peer group conduct. That once the season was finished, you would feel badly and disengage and perhaps find yourself completely on my side. And I am just waiting for you to join me over here. Way to the left of the rest on all issues. ALL. Not just money. That you will see that racism prevents the equitable distribution of finances and that our fight has been going on for hundreds of years. And that if you join us in making the race question an answer of NO MORE BULLSHIT, your battle would be pretty much won. And that your fight will not be won until our is done so you will be fighting super hard for my justice so that I have time to join you in this economic fight.

[JonLeibowitz]

82. I can hardly read all the threads from the time before I signed up. Sorry?

I doubt I disagree with you on the importance of BLM, actually. It is an enormously important movement. I am not fighting BLM, I applaud them.

[bravenak]

84. That is why you think I am lying.

Because there are so many threads from before your time where I said EXACTLY what I said in that PM. Now you know.

[JonLeibowitz]

85. Well,

while that may be true, it is still dishonest to personally back a candidate other than the one you claim to support. The previous threads would not contradict that I don't think. By the way, I would be interested in reading those threads, if you could kindly link them.

[bravenak]

88. I can like him better and think she is a better candidate.

I do not LOVE politicians. I trust NONE of them.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=827101

I have more. Read those. They show why I watch these people with absolute disbelief.

[JonLeibowitz]

93. Some of those are worse than others.

WillyT's for example was pretty bad.

cali's on the other hand, seemed reasonable enough.

[bravenak]

94. Yes.

One day for kicks try searching july 21- aug 11 BLM threads. You will see my shift from Bernie to no way never ever ever. It was not HIM. It was THAT. Now they LOVE BLM. Nope. Too much fakery for me.

[JonLeibowitz]

100. Okay. I still think it's unwise to pick candidates based on supporters and not issues.

[bravenak]

102. I started looking at him more closely in Oct.

Do not like what I see with him leaving out the fact that black strikers for the sanitation services were fighting for the same pay as white workers. He constantly leaves that stuff out. I notice. Bad choice. I oppose rewrite of history. Do not like his co opting of Dr. kings legacy. Bad idea. Makes me ill and angry. In his zeal to be on his economic war or whatever, he has quite a few times erased us from our own history in order to be inclusive to his white audience. Not fair.
And trip, him not knowing what his supporters are doing makes me not want him leading our nation. A leader must be aware. The way you run a campign is the way you might run the nation. Would he erase us as president if he felt the need to do a re write? No thanks.

[Scootaloo]

109. Do you think Clinton is aware of the nastiness of your fellows, Bravenak?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=866916

I don't see much from her about shit like that.

[bravenak]

111. That post was removed by admin. So, it only appeaers here.

I do not remember it. I may not have been there yet.

[Scootaloo]

116. You don't remember? Oh, that's weird.

'Cause you certainly were there. Remember, you had posted an article by the Clinton supporter who insisted Obama was "an exotic who talks of barbershops"? And you jumped my ass for bringing HCS up in a thread, 'cause you thought I was "out to ruin you"?

Nah, you were very certainly there. You and cali even had a brief inter-forum conversation, before your creepy woman-stalking friends shut her down ("turned her into a quivering chickenshit" is how those Hilalry-supporting saints of liberalism put it.)

But yes, I see that "admin" ("Bill" in those screenshots, for anyone curious - "William796," on DU) removed that post. And everything else. So weird, don't you think, that the guy running a site is so happy and proud of his site that he blocks it to outside view then deletes all content from it.

You were also on Du for all the DU threads linked - and more! Even made some of your own. Remember, #WhiteAssedCrowds? Or "Third Way Progressives"?

C'mon Bravenak, you're in Alaska. Salmon is almost free up there and chock full of omega-3 fatty acid. Good for the memory!

So, where's Clinton at, calling all these people out and dealing with htem, like you demand bernie does? Where's Clinton sticking her finger in your face, and telling you "cut it out!"

[bravenak]

122. I did not post on that thread so why would I have noticed it?

Did not even see it over there. But I like posting my grumbles.

The exchange me and cali had was because I posted a link to a piece. She no likey.
Which did not stunt me cause I no carey.
Cant ruin me. I'm fine. See? Doing well!

I have no idea what you mean creepy woman stalking frinnds? I have none of those. I post here and most are not my friends. Plenty of gross stuff passes juries. Yet folks still post here and nobody harasses them for posting at a hate site, lol. Cause stuff gets posted that many do not approve of.

Yes. 'White ass crowds' was in my sigline for a while, I remember and it was very apt. So was third way progressive. Thank you for reminding me to bring that back in style.

I love Bill, yes. He removes bad posts.

I hate Salmon. I told you that before, within the last few weeks. I can see the post in my minds eye. Told you I prefer halibut but folks keep bringing me this nasty salmon. I remember in photographs, not completely clear, but I have decent recall. If I forget it is because I wanted to at the time of the event. Took years to be able to discard memories.


Why should Clinton worry about a members only closed off to the public site? She has Hillary Mojo, right? Lol!

[Scootaloo]

125. So Clinton is exempt from the standard you expect from Sanders.

He needs to patrol the internet to "keep his crowd in line," but Clinton doesn't. The people you associate with, name as friends and buddies can go on insane bigoted rants, and that's cool. They can stalk and harass people, and that's cool. Snarl and rant about "TEH JOOZ!" and all but so long as they're for Clinton, they're held to no expectations and neither is she.

You love Bill. That's great. Do you know what "White Trash" is? An an elitist white slur against white people who are perceived as being "essentially n****rs." That's what it means. It's what it's always meant. White people perceived by other white people, as being "down there" with black people. That's a term he used.

That's genuine love, right there.

And Hillary Clinton ain't saying shit about it. An't she just hte worst?

[bravenak]

135. Patrol? Notice. All he has to do is NOTICE.

She messed up last time creating the environment and allowing surrogates to run free and say stupid shit. Her fans turned me off her quick. This time? Ha!

I saw nobody ranting about the jews. That is pure fiction. Shit like that gets posted here and removed. Mostly removed.

Now, if you do not care about yr friend calling me house ns why should I care for your gripes? Samesies. I did not post about white trash nor did I support it. I always say that. You do not see me do that ever. Take it up with him. He is here.

Hillary is not having the same problems. She does not need his voters to win the primary. He needs black voters to win so it is his job to make that happen.

[Capt. Obvious]

142. "Good for the memory!"

Someone with a photographic memory doesn't need it.

[Juicy_Bellows]

164. I remember her claiming a photographic memory too!

Amazingly, I recall that and do not claim to have a photographic memory myself. Odd.

[Capt. Obvious]

166. I remember her claiming lots of things

and I don't claim to have a photographic memory.

[Scootaloo]

176. Photographic memory, huh?

Must be a couple of fingerprints on the lens.

[George II]

147. This stuff again? Stalking DU members on another site? As another Sanders supporter likes to say...

....., and I quote, "stalkers are creepy"

[ismnotwasm]

148. Very creepy

I agree--but they're gonna do what they're gonna do here I guess. I don't care too much

[redstateblues]

152. weird for sure

[cui bono]

180. "stalkers are creepy" - You should know.

When's cali coming back?

[JonLeibowitz]

71. I am a registered democrat. Since you were responding to me, you were insulting a Dem. Simple.

[Bluenorthwest]

143. Not only am I a Democrat, I come from a family of Democrats, both sides.

I've been active since I was a child, helping my parents. At 18 I was out of the closet and by 21 I was in the public eye, earning large sums and being vocal and very active in Pro Choice and LGBT politics, starting with the Briggs Amendment battle and the first mass coming out event in history, all through the AIDS crisis emergency activism and constant protest of Reagan and Bush.

In all of my years as a Democratic and LGBT activist, I have never met any person who employs the level of invective against others and the intense claims of personal standing that you make. Never met any LGBT person who looked at the liberal end of the Party with such disdain, as that is the Harvey Milk and Larry Karmer part of the Party and the entire community knows where we'd be without their conviction and consistency, their lack of willingness to fold upon demands from the Machine.

Harvey Milk, as most LGBT people know, ran his first primary campaigns on the slogan 'Harvey Milk vs The Machine'. That would be the entrenched Democratic Machine that he sought to replace with new politics expressing the diversity and wholeness of the country.

To elect the first was an act of radical politics, an act of opposition to the mainstream, straight white power base's vice like grip on the political scene of the times. Most LGBT people are very glad that Harvey Milk defeated The Machine. And they tend not to be enamored of The Machine.

[Scootaloo]

78. Strangely, most of the insults have been coming from Camp Clinton.

Did you know that because I support Bernie Sanders, I'm a white supremacist? I suppose it's true, since Clinton supporters are never wrong, but it strikes me as odd that a white supremacist like myself would support a liberal Jew. Especially when the people calling me the white supremacist are themselves pulling out the "disloyal Jew" and "Jews hate black people" and "Jews are greedy lairs" tropes, and all but declaring outright ownership of all black people, while declaring that people of color "don't count" unless they're barking for Clinton. But hey, Clinton supporters gotta be right, right?

I'm also a piece of trailer park white trash, for supporting Sanders. Now this one, I can own up to, though I was trailer park white trash long, long before I ever heard of Bernie Sanders. Turns out that for some people, we get born into it. While I suppose it's nice to be born into a stable family with a solid cash flow and support structure, it turns out that generational poverty is still a real thing. Who'd have guessed? Apparently not Clinton supporters, who seem to be mostly Anglo-Saxon Yuppy Scum.

I'm also in the interesting position of being both a "right-winger" and a member of the "far left" for supporting Sanders. I'm not exactly sure how this works. I suppose that clinton supporters, being the super-smart beasts of intellect that they are, just have such a complex vision of politics that my white supremacist trailer trash brain just can't unravel. It's a little odd, though, seeing as Sanders isn't exactly "far left" except by the standards held by the right wing.

And of course the regular demands that I affirm, and reaffirm, and swear blood oaths over hte grave of my grandma with five witnesses and a judge present, that I will absolutely always forever vote for the Democratic nominee. Much as with ,y status as trailer park white trash, this predates my support for Sanders, it was being demanded around here even all the way back in 2013. And what's weird is that it was coming from people who had themselves abandoned the party for the republicans because a black man became the nominee (wouldn't you know it, they are also the ones calling me a white supremacist!) But I hear tell that that is okay, because "Party Unity, My Ass!" no longer "counts." Nor does the rampant racism from these same people. "that was then, this is now, fall in line!"

As for the candidate i support? Well, he's been called all sorts of things. A rapist. A protector of pedophiles. A segregationist. A gun nut. A republican with his head between women's legs. A disloyal Jew, like I already mentioned. Recently an attempt was made to paint him a homophobe for meeting with Bernice King, which seems to only be a problem for Sanders, since Clinton meeting her is a sign of solidarity. And by your insistence, he's a lying egomaniac and "no different from Trump."

I've seen people around me harassed, stalked, dox'd, browbeaten, and threatened by Clinton supporters. An entire forum was set up by the guy who calls me trailer park white trash, where you and yours organize and enact such harassment here on DU. You've told my associates and allies that they can't possibly be who they are. Nadine can't be a Latina or a Jew because she supports Sanders, Artislife has no say because apparently she can "pass" as if that makes her less of a Latina, Yuiyoshida sneered at because apparently Asian-Americans "don't count," all of it down the line, including insistence that black DU'ers "must be" white people in blackface if they support anyone other than Clinton.

I would politely insist you keep your advice about insults to yourself, MaggieD. You're the one in need of it.

[Art_from_Ark]

106. Great post!

[Douglas Carpenter]

133. an understatement to say the least..

[ms liberty]

134. I would rec this a million times. Very well said!

[cui bono]

183. +1

[Punkingal]

181. Here is a news flash for ya...

I am a tried and true democrat, and I happen to support Bernie Sanders. People who support Hillary Clinton are not the only real democrats.

[Kalidurga]

3. That's another good selling point thanks

if that is your position, then I will talk only to white people about how we are going to deal with the very real problems,

He probably should have said that then Hillary supporters would fawn over him for keepin it real or being strong or some such.

[MaggieD]

5. You can talk to whomever you'd like

But if you want to convince people you should probably stick to white people as you suggest. All his supporters have done so far is piss off everybody but white people.

[Kalidurga]

8. That was what Hillary said to some BLM folks

[Juicy_Bellows]

162. She must know that, right?

Jesus.

[bravenak]

37. His message is for them, not us.

[Juicy_Bellows]

163. Those are Hillary’s words. Nt.

[artislife]

6. And h isn't Obama. nt

[Scootaloo]

12. Nope, she's still Hillary. The same ol' Hillary from 2008.

With the same supporters.

[artislife]

17. She has started putting her foot in her mouth

I wonder what will happen when the news that Bernie didn't have to pay to get on the ballot in Texas sinks in...

This is gonna burn like 2008...

[Renew Deal]

43. Actually, that's not true

Just compare Hillary's 2008 endorsements to 2016. A lot of prior Obama supporters are now supporting Hillary. Of course the same group of Hillary haters still hate her (not referring to DU).

[BlueMTexpat]

127. Too many facts, LOL.

I can understand Bernie's appeal and I love a lot of what he is saying.

I love how both he - and Martin O'Malley - are getting many of the right things discussed. That is a wonderful thing for us all, IMO. I cannot imagine my country surviving under any GOPer. But I can imagine it surviving under any of our excellent Dems. I just prefer that our standard-bearer in 2016 be Hillary because, IMO, she is the most comprehensively qualified for the job. She also has no illusions whatsoever about the obstructionism and nastiness of today's GOP.

But I really do not understand why so many of Bernie's followers are so fervently behind him - to the exclusion of any other Dem - when Martin O'Malley, a lifelong Dem, is saying so many of the same things. O'Malley is also much younger than Bernie, which I think would be a great plus in their consideration. This factor makes me believe that many Bernie followers are not Dems in the first place. But even if they are sincere in their beliefs and are not just trying to sow division among true Dems, Bernie is a candidate GOP can more easily shoot down, IMO. They haven't even gotten started on him yet.

Without Bernie in the GE, many followers will revert to their previous status of Libertarian or Independent (aka Republican) or even non-voting. Even with Bernie in the GE, if ever Bernie deviates even the slightest from their purist standards, they will likely abandon him in droves. And if he wants to win, he will have to deviate significantly. So their abandonment is a risk I do not want to have to take.

While the GOPers have not even begun to smear Bernie yet, smear they will if they ever believe he has a chance at getting to the GE. They are now too focused on Hillary because they have good reason to believe that she is the most powerfully dangerous candidate that the Dems currently have.

If and when the GOPer smears start with Bernie, I'm afraid that he will not even know what hit him. In the debates, I have seen him react in a somewhat nonplussed manner when the questions/discussions do not deal with inequality, a major strength area I grant him. But these Dem debates, with courteous Dem candidates, are softball compared to the full GOPer treatment with the crazies who can and will say anything. I'm afraid that he'll be left red-faced and spluttering in the face of GOPer inanity. I empathize with him in this because I know that I would be too. Hillary has faced down eleven solid hours of inanity and come out looking like a President. I just don't see that happening with Bernie.

Without Hillary in the race, most Dem endorsers and funders would more likely have gone for Biden (who likely would have entered the race) or for O'Malley than for Bernie. I personally believe that Hillary is a much stronger candidate than Biden would ever have been, however, so I am glad that scenario didn't take place. I truly believe that O'Malley will someday be a President - and a good one - but likely not this time around.

Many people had to work very hard to convince Hillary even to run for the 2016 round - and she did have to be convinced of that, despite what many Bernie followers on DU say. Some make up sh** that is certainly GOPer and Faux Noise-worthy. They literally do not know what they are talking about.

[ViseGrip]

7. Bernie is better than Obama.

[immoderate]

9. You're gonna lose!

--imm

[MaggieD]

21. Bookmarking

I am so looking forward to the post linking to my bookmark collection.

[immoderate]

25. Let it happen, cap'n!

--imm

[jeff47]

10. Why does it seem like this is a mantra you constantly repeat in your darkest moments? (nt)

[MaggieD]

19. I don't have dark moments

So your crystal ball is wrong, yet again.

[PowerToThePeople]

11. Lame.

Trashcan for this one. I have already spent too much energy composing this response. This OP does not deserve it.

[Fawke Em]

13. You're right. He's better. eom

[reformist2]

16. You beat me by mere seconds! lol

[leftofcool]

129. At least Obama has never been a laughingstock among Democrats.

[Fawke Em]

145. I know. I laugh at Hillary every day.

Her attempts to co-opt Sanders' platform while knowing she'll run to the right if she wins the nomination is amusing at this stage.

It won't be so fun if she gets the nomination, though.

[reformist2]

14. I'll say it - Bernie is BETTER than Obama.

[MaggieD]

18. Well so far the minorities that make or break the Dem nomination

... don't agree.

[Dawgs]

144. "So far" is the smartest thing you've said in awhile.

Most people don't pay attention until it matters, which is one month away.

[Renew Deal]

36. At what? Symbolic gestures?

If we had a lot more Obamas we'd be better off

[restorefreedom]

20. thank goodness for that! bernie is a REAL progressive! nt

[restorefreedom]

26. um, not sure what you are talking about there,

i am talking about bernie SANDERS, us senator. fought for equality and fairness for many years.

in any case, have a nice evening.

[Renew Deal]

34. He's fought for a lot

And accomplished little. The Congress is full of his symbolic gestures.

[restorefreedom]

40. yes i am sure our veterans in particular are unappreciative

of his "lack of success."

whatever makes ya happy....

[Armstead]

51. Whats sad is the many of those "symbolic gestures" should be laws

Mant people would agree with the thrust of his symbolic gestures. But Congress is too corrupt and cowardly and lazy to actually do anything of substance...That's not the fault of Sanders

[Renew Deal]

59. I agree that many are good

But that doesn't change that few have passed. We get on the republicans for trying to repeal Obamacare 50 times but we let Bernie slide.

[Armstead]

75. Thats a strange analogy

You are comparing Sanders trying to inject things that are good into Congress with The GOP Trying to repeal Obamacare?

Strange comparison. Seems to me that sanders shouldn't be criticized for the fact that more Democrats don't get off their butts and work for the same kind of good things Sanders proposes,

[Renew Deal]

76. They are similar because

Neither has a chance of passing.

[Armstead]

79. To repeat, the fact that Democrats don't fight for....

......The same kind if good proposals is somehow Sanders fault?

[MaggieD]

49. You don't know your candidate

Sadly for you, lots of other voters do. You should study up on him. If you did you would realize why Hillary is beating the pants off the guy with Latinos, AA, women, and LGBT.

Like it or not you cannot win a Dem primary without those folks. To believe you can is sheer fantasy.

[restorefreedom]

60. i have known him since before he ran for pres

have followed his career for a long time.

as to the results, i guess we will find out when the polls open....

[Live and Learn]

83. Actually, it is you that doesn't know Bernie as demonstrated by your posts. nt

[pnwmom]

105. She was referring to the essay he wrote discussing male and female rape fantasies when he was 30.

Here's a piece from NPR.

http://www.npr.org/sections/itsallpolitics/2015/05/29/410606045/the-bernie-sanders-rape-fantasy-essay-explained

An excerpt from his writing:

"A man goes home and masturbates his typical fantasy. A woman on her knees, a woman tied up, a woman abused.

"A woman enjoys intercourse with her man — as she fantasizes being raped by 3 men simultaneously.

"The man and woman get dressed up on Sunday — and go to Church, or maybe to their 'revolutionary' political meeting.

"Have you ever looked at the Stag, Man, Hero, Tough magazines on the shelf of your local bookstore? Do you know why the newspaper with the articles like 'Girl 12 raped by 14 men' sell so well? To what in us are they appealing?"

[restorefreedom]

107. ahhhh yes. that ancient satire/criticism piece

i thought that was discussed and dispensed with long ago. i remember at the time avoiding threads mentioning it. i had already forgotten, until now.

[pnwmom]

112. It doesn't read like satire. But he was trying to make a larger point, apparently.

It is so hard to understand, though, that he and every other Democrat just wish he'd never written it.

[restorefreedom]

113. even repubs are not bothering with it

its so old, they would rather talk about his "disastrous" policies.

good, keep talking guys...

[pnwmom]

124. They would if this were the general election. But right now

they're aiming most of their attacks at the candidate they think they'll be facing.

[restorefreedom]

138. i thhink most people realize

a 40 plus year commentary on gender roles, despite its ineloquence, has no bearing on the issues of today. even republicans won't try to paint bernie as some kind of misogynist..they know he absolutely is not.

they will try to paint him as a socialist, which will fail since most people are actually on board with his "socialist" policies.

[pnwmom]

155. They will throw absolutely everything at him and see what sticks. n/t

[bobbobbins01]

30. This is one ugly comment.

You should rethink your approach, you're not adding anything of value with these kinds of attacks.

[restorefreedom]

45. flamebait no doubt

the nastier the attack, the calmer i get.

clearly his presence and success is threatening to many. that's ok. i wouldnt want to watch the second flameout of my candidate, either. i am sure it is difficult.

[Mnpaul]

80. Thankfully, someone put an end to this vile crap

and there will be no more from this poster in this thread.

[Armstead]

44. You are amazing

I'll say no more

[Jamaal510]

22. BS has had

sub-par polling numbers among just about every demographic in addition to the aforementioned 4, and across the spectrum. And yes, the two men are completely different especially when it comes to their approaches. What I appreciated about Obama when he first ran that BS doesn't seem to be doing as well was that he did what was necessary to have enough grassroot support, his campaign was Internet-savvy, his message was inspiring and positive, he could juggle different facets of domestic and foreign policy, and he had a calm demeanor in the face of opposition. He might've been a once in a lifetime candidate.

[Jarqui]

23. This does remind me of stuff I heard about Obama in 2007

- too far behind in the polls
- lack endorsements
- doesn't have the money
- unelectable
- can't garner white support - only blacks will support him and he can't win a general election because he's black

etc, etc

Sorry MaggieD, I've heard it all before.

No Bernie isn't Barack, he's Bernie. Even though he isn't favored and he's behind, I think he can still win.

I'm going to wait for all the votes to get counted before I write Bernie off - just like I did in 2007.

[MaggieD]

27. Please explain his path to victory

Are you in the skewed polls camp, or do you think there is going to be a sudden turn around by AA, Latino, LGBT and woman voters? Do tell. I can't wait to hear your theory.

[JonLeibowitz]

47. His path to victory? If enough people hear and like his message, and vote, he will win.

[MaggieD]

52. But they DON'T like his message

He's clueless about their issues and they are not stupid. The "people don't know Bernie" meme sailed long ago. They know him. They just don't like him.

[JonLeibowitz]

54. .

That doesn't change his path to victory. That just makes his path harder.

"He's clueless about their issues and they are not stupid" -- LOL, no. False.

[bravenak]

65. I find him clueless.

[JonLeibowitz]

68. Good for you. I would encourage you to vote for someone else.

In the meantime, you do not speak for all Americans.

[bravenak]

70. Most Democratic Americans agree and will not vote for him this primary.

I guess that means I speak for MANY.

[JonLeibowitz]

73. No democratic Americans have voted. At best your unsolicited commentary is premature.

[bravenak]

89. Very premature. I am known for proclamations and claims of prescience.

[cascadiance]

115. And would you have believed the polls that were UTTERLY WRONG in 2007 too?

Would you have been criticizing Obama then for not resonating with the people then prior to the primary season because his poll numbers then were also not close to Hillary's (actually further behind Hillary than Bernie has been!)

[bravenak]

118. I had gotten so pissed at Clinton that I expected Blacks to jump ship.

He had charisma, was smart, funny, cool, harvard grad, handsome, magnetic... So yes. I thought she had screwed up when she took us for granted. And she knows better this time.

[senz]

95. They love him. People love him. He fills up arenas with cheering people.

People smile and wave or even stop to talk with others wearing Bernie t-shirts, buttons, bumper stickers. He's adored.

Open your eyes. You're missing out on a once in a lifetime phenomenon, Maggie.

[bravenak]

97. Just like the Ron Paul Revolution!!!! That was fun too.

[cascadiance]

117. So, what city the size of Portland did Ron Paul get TWENTY EIGHT THOUSAND PEOPLE attending a rally?

Huh? Nope! FALSE analogy!

[bravenak]

119. Who knows? Lol! Looks the same to me. A place I would NOT FIT IN AT.

[cascadiance]

121. So was Black Lives Matter Symone Sanders introductory speech troublesome for you?...

Would that be too hard for you to "fit in" to listen to?

[bravenak]

123. She is not Black Lives Matter. She is a supporters as i am.

I though the idea of chanting down the protesters was not good. I notice she is not getting him many black voters.

I did not like the vibe of that crowd. I prefer smaller venues. Chronic anxiety. I power through but it is not good to have an attack in that type of place. Plus I say shit real loud and who know who would get their fee fees hurt.

[cascadiance]

120. It was a better analogy to the post that you were responding to.

... that was talking about the numbers of people coming to see his events.

[redstateblues]

154. Bernie could get a big crowd in Nashville, my city

and get completely crushed in TN

[leftofcool]

130. They have heard it, they don't like him.

[Jarqui]

205. Didn't see you question before

I've looked underneath a number of the polls and feel the polls are a bit skewed (demographics that favor Clinton) but no, that doesn't explain the current big gap in the polls.

Although not the most likely path, here's one way that to me, still remains possible as an example:
Bernie wins Iowa and NH (he currently competitive in both)
Media jumps on it like Obama 2008 to milk ratings
- media talks about Hillary's flaws (untrustworthy / poor favorability) to explain why she lost
- media talks about Bernie's positives (integrity, favorability, matches up well against GOP "he can win&quot to explain why he won
the above boost Bernie's national numbers
Bernie loses SC and is competitive but loses Nevada
Elizabeth Warren and the Kennedys endorse Bernie - Bernie gets a boost in the polls
Bernie does well on Super Tuesday
We have a competitive race
Bernie edges Hillary.

Another way:
FBI charges her from their investigation

Another way:
House or Senate comes up with something damaging from their email investigation

Another way:
Someone comes up with more juicy stuff about the Clinton Foundation

Another way:
Tabloids run with story and photos of who Bill is doing these days

Whole bunch of things could happen but all together, they're less likely to happen:

I think the betting has Hillary around 90% and Bernie around 10%
https://www.ipredict.co.nz/app.php?do=browse&cat=445
https://www.predictit.org/Browse/Category/6/US-Elections
http://www.predictwise.com/politics/2016DemNomination
I don't put much faith in those having read about campaigns propping them up. Hillary has the Wall Street money and those guys can afford to bet big.

I'd give Bernie about a 20% chance. This is not over yet. Obama trailed just about as badly. A couple of months is a long time in politics.

[Renew Deal]

29. Obama is a towering political figure

Sanders never has and never will match him.

[Truprogressive85]

31. Obama beat her

The Same Hillary Clinton that said she was better candidate because she could attract more "hard working whites"
The same Hillary Clinton that bashed Obama about guns so much so he call her Annie Oakley
The same Hillary Clinton that voted to give Bush a green light for the Invasion of Iraq

Barely won huh lol the American people reject H.C no matter the margin of victory

Anti immigration ? oh you mean H.C when she said we should send back kids that were escaping Central America because of crime waves n their native lands

[bravenak]

32. The huffing and puffing has blown his chances.

[Cheese Sandwich]

33. "The minority vote is a monolith in the Dem primary contest."

Ignorant statement.

Mildly offensive too.

People are free to vote for who they want.

There is no monolith.

[cheapdate]

38. How refreshing to see such a thoughtful and compelling post.

It's great to see that the art of persuasive argument hasn't been entirely lost!

[MaggieD]

58. You seem upset at the facts

Perhaps you can tell us how Bernie wins with no support from those major Dem voting groups?

Goodness knows the Bernie will be the next Obama canard has been floating around here long enough to encourage you to come up with some convincing speech about how that is true.

Lay it on me. Can't wait.

[cheapdate]

87. Surely you jest.

I will not be wasting time posting a serious reply to your disrespectful and careless rant. People have honest differences of opinion over Bernie Sanders and Hillary Clinton. They're both intelligent and passionate candidates. They both bring credit to the Democratic Party.

[rusty quoin]

42. i don't agree

[Bonobo]

53. A STUNNING revelation, Maggie D. You are full of win! nt

[Warren DeMontague]

99. Indeed. This thread is truly a sight to behold!

Who's up for the after party?

[SunSeeker]

56. K & R

[Mnpaul]

77. Yeah we know he is not Obama

I don't expect him to change positions once elected. I don't expect him to work with Republicans to pass crappy trade deals.

[morningfog]

126. You sound silly.

[NCTraveler]

128. Understatement of the year. Nt

[leftofcool]

132. Another good truth telling post! Thanks Maggie.

[NurseJackie]

137. Bernie's LOST this already. Too many mistakes. Too much baggage. Not enough experience.

If he can't do better in mere primaries against someone as "weak" and "hated" as Hillary (according to his fans) then he'd never survive a general election fighting against the GOP money-machine and their dirty tricks*. He's a weak candidate that lacks experience and achievements. (Apparently the primary voters being polled agree.)


*Anyone who believes that topics which are "forbidden" here will not be gleefully and effectively exploited by the GOP is fooling themselves.

[2pooped2pop]

160. too much baggage?

Hillary is a Samsonite warehouse compared to Bernie. Man you guys just make shit up don't you. Starting to make sense why you support Hillary now. Birds/feather

[NurseJackie]

167. Yes. One or more "baggage-topics" regarding Bernie are (apparently) not permitted here.

It's a safe bet that the GOP money machine and their "dirty-tricks" gang will not be as accommodating to the sensitivities of his supporters.

Yeah, he's got baggage. Pretending that he doesn't won't make it go away. Accusing me of "making shit up" doesn't change the facts.

A similar avian argument could be made as to why "you guys" support Bernie.

[2pooped2pop]

170. I should play your guys game at this. Prove he has more baggage than weathervane n/t

[NurseJackie]

172. Oh good grief! You have no sincere interest in "proof" of anything. I wasn't born yesterday.

And even if some bored individual was inclined to flatter you by obliging your demands, it wouldn't make a bit of difference to you anyway. It's hard to take seriously any such request from someone who uses the term "weathervane" to describe Hillary.

If you're interested (which you aren't) but if you were, you're more than capable of doing your own research, or just perusing this website.

Besides, do you REALLY think I'd fall for the trap of posting links and screen captures for forbidden things that are "alert bait" and typically hidden?

Ha! I'm on to you, ya little sneak! I wasn't fooled!

[2pooped2pop]

174. yet you and your buddy will call prove it , prove it. prove it

just to see if you can control us. It's weird. I would have pegged you for a teacher thinking she can control the students in this way, rather than a nurse.

[NurseJackie]

175. I have no idea what you're talking about. Slow down and start from the beginning.

Clearly you're very angry and frustrated about something. Can you calmly explain what it is?

[Hiraeth]

139. well, no shit. He is better than Obama and I love me some Obama. Let's be real.

[Cha]

191. No, BS is not "better" than President Obama. No way no how. I'm so glad the country appreciates

our President and he's so popular now.

[Hiraeth]

194. Cha, Bernie was serving this country when Obama was in diapers.

History will judge their presidencies.

[Cha]

199. I don't care how old BS is.. President Obama has done much more than bernie every will.

I am so grateful we've had him as President.

[Hiraeth]

200. No disrespect intended to anyone but, I think you need to return your crystal ball

to Wal-Mart and get your money back. Obama has done us a big solid with the ACA and imo, that is historical. What Mr. Sanders will do ---- is wide open and so much depends on what WE do. Bernie is a game changer in a way that the country has not seen before.

Props to Obama.

[Cha]

208. I stand by my post.

[m-lekktor]

140. The reason I like Bernie is because he is not like Obama or Hillary!

The DEM candidates have always been too right wing/the lesser evil for me since I have been old enough to vote and I have always voted for the DEM. I support Bernie even though I am to the left of him on guns and Israel!

[Walk away]

141. Apparently, Sanders doesn't need the AA or even the woman's vote because...

so many Independents and republicans are going to vote for him. First he has to magically win the nomination but that should be a snap! Just use republican smear tactics!

No, Sander's isn't Obama. Our President is a proud Democrat. Bernie is just Fringe.

[TSIAS]

186. I don't get it

On one hand, Sanders supporters are just the fringe and hardly exist outside of DU.

However, HRC supporters are already attempting to blame this so-called "fringe" if she is unable to win the GE.

[taught_me_patience]

146. I agree. Plus Obama ran an uplifting campaign

Bernie is running an "angry" campaign. Obama artfully tapped into the anger of Democrats following 8 years of Bush crap, but delivered a message of hope and change for the future. Bernie comes off as cynical, grumpy, salty, and elitist. Many Democrats, including me, wonder what he's so mad about? His campaign is morphing into a "tea partyesque", aimless rage. It certainly draws fervor, but doesn't attract a large coalition.

His anti-immigrant rhetoric has REALLY personally turned me off. My wife is an immigrant from Asia. I guess she and her family are stealing good white-american jobs...

[redstateblues]

151. Bernie's campaign is fueled by anger

Obama was inspirational.

[hrmjustin]

153. I don't think Sanders can defeat Hillary.

Even if he won IA or NH he will lose SC and likely NV. He willhave a hard time on March 1st in the southern states.

[Beacool]

157. I think that Sanders is a decent man, but a one issue candidate.

As proven yet again during the last Democratic debate. The debate started by honoring the victims of the Paris terrorist attack. Hillary demonstrated her knowledge of foreign policy, as she should have as a former SOS. Sanders made a quick mention of the attacks in his opening statement and then pivoted immediately to his main issue, economic inequality.

A president needs to focus on all aspects of the job. I think that Hillary can do that in ways that Sanders cannot.

I have nothing against Sanders, but some of his supporters on this board cannot leave well enough alone. The insulting endless posts about Hillary, and even her supporters, have been counterproductive and tiresome. Hilary is not their enemy, she has been a good Democrat since the 60s and has supported every Democratic nominee, including Obama after he won the nomination. I expect no less of her now or of Sanders if she wins the nomination.

[RichVRichV]

179. So speaking on more than one topic in the opening statements makes him a one topic candidate.

Mmm, I love me some pretzel logic.

Funny enough, I remember all 3 candidates discussing foreign affairs at length in the debate. I don't think Paris or the middle east was short shifted.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

159. I do not believe

I do not believe Bernie is

-a homophobe
-a nativist
-a bigot

et cetera...

I do believe he has a parochial world view that sees the world as a constant battle between the oligarchs and everybody else.

[sonofspy777]

161. No he's MUCH BETTER

You are soooo out of touch.

Like Hillarot.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

168. "Like Hillarot"

Like Hillarot.

Where am I ? Free Republic... Go call your associates... The only thing that gets me off more than their enmity is sex and presents, in that order.

[Beacool]

184. Notice the low posting count.

Just saying........

[bvar22]

173. Bernie is not Obama????

Thank gawd for that.

I'm ready for some REAL Hope & REAL Change and not BS campaign promises.

I trust a 40 year track record.
That is why I All In for Bernie.

[RichVRichV]

177. The mistake you're making is assuming when we speak of 2008

we're comparing Bernie to Obama when in reality we're comparing Hillary to Hillary.

Your second mistake is assumining the minority vote is a monolith that will fall in line. I think you're going to be suprised when it's all said and done. The youth vote in particular (of all races) is goung to be a shock.

[coyote]

185. It's the same Clinton posters over and over

I'll give you credit, you are very vocal for such a small group. However, if you put the 6-8 Clinton hot air bags on ignore, it's like Bernie bliss here at DU. I don't like ignoring people, but I need a wellness weekend from Clinton supporters.

Hope you enjoy the weekend as much as I do. Buh-bye.

[Cha]

193. "the 6-8 Clinton hot air bags on ignore.." all the BS fans have are insults. You can put me on

Ignore, too. I'd be honored.

[retrowire]

188. No he's not Obama.

He's better.

[Cha]

192. President Obama is so popular right now.. people appreciate what all he's accomplished.. Millions do

Just because the majority around has never appreciated him.. means shite in the Real World.

I can't wait until he gets out and campaigns for Hillary and his legacy!

[Vinca]

197. Hillary isn't Obama either.

The big concern with Hillary in the general is that she doesn't generate excitement among people who stay home when it's the midterm elections. If those people don't come out, the GOP has a good chance of winning.

[Iliyah]

201. HRC said she would continue what Pres O started regarding the economy

And you are right, HRC is not Obama. HRC is HRC.

[Voice for Peace]

202. i don't think you're paying attention to the trends.

Bernie is viable competition. And doing it with integrity.

[morningfog]

203. I support Sanders largely because he is not Obama or his policies.

[Thinkingabout]

204. The only thing similiar is they both served in the Senate and both have run

In DNC primaries. Other than this Sanders is not Obama.

[bowens43]

206. blah blah blah blah blah youre right bernie isn't obama, he a much better candidate then obama

if by some miracle the democrats are dumb enough to nominate hillary they will be handing the presidency, the senate , the house and a couple of supreme court appoints to the republicans.

hillay will never be president.


now go away

[redstateblues]

207. Bernie's anger doesn't wear well

Obama is an inspirational politician- Hillary is very calm and strong