What is the big deal about hairy legs?

[redqueen]

Why do so many feminists make a point of saying how they're one of the good kinds of feminists? Not those bad evil women who won't ... what ... follow patriarchal beauty norms?

This irritates me to no end. While making some point about women's issues, a woman mentions that she's a feminist, but makes sure to specify that she's not that kind of feminist.

What's the point of that? I don't know what these feminists think they're accomplishing when they say stuff like that, but I hope those who do will take a moment to reflect on what they're actually saying. If someone thinks that your not shaving your legs is some horrible thing, maybe you shouldn't actually give a shit about what they think of you.

[chervilant]

1. Good point!

Early on, in my growing appreciation of feminism, I had an epiphany about not having to shave hair off my body (who knew!?!). Since I hated sharp edges against my body (being inept with the precursors to "safety" razors), I stopped shaving. You'd have thought I declared war on women who shave! I got so much grief from other women --and men persistently made eye contact with my pits -- that I finally tried the new "safety" razors. They work better (far fewer nicks and scrapes), but I STILL hate to shave!

[SheilaT]

2. Lightweight razors have been around for, I can't remember,

more than thirty years. I only recall using heavy ones that cut me easily more than forty years ago. And cream depilatories have been around at least as long.

If another woman doesn't want to shave, that's her business, but for a really long time it's been pretty easy.

[chervilant]

4. Really?

My dad had one of those brass jobs that took double-edged blades. It was the only thing available for surreptitiously shaving three teens' legs and pits. I frequently shredded myself. I'm glad you had other choices.

[SheilaT]

17. I can't speak to how men shave,

but I can speak with great assurance about what was available to women by 1970 or so.

[chervilant]

18. Not in my household.

Again, good on you that you had other options. Not all of us did.

[SheilaT]

19. How old were you before you were allowed

to purchase such things for yourself? Did your mother not help in these things?

I'm feeling distressed that you were unaware of other options besides a very heavy razor thing intended not for women's legs.

Of course, even these options might not have made you feel like shaving your legs or armpits was what you really wanted to do, so I get that aspect.

[chervilant]

20. Well, goodness!

I grew up poor, in a VERY rural part of north Arkansas. We had no electricity for the first four years we lived there; no running water the first two. We were not allowed to wear make-up or shave our legs until we were 16. My dad forgot his razor once while working a union job several hundred miles south, and we three girls started using it. I think I was 14.

I was the first one in my family for 3 generations to attend college. Every penny was precious. I think the college where I lived the first semester (the dorms were called 'colleges') gave us some toiletries during orientation, but razors weren't an essential item and not a regular purchase until I had my own income.

BTW, my mother had her first pregnancy at 14; the result of my father raping her (dad was 16). The second time he "got her with child," my maternal grandmother forced a marriage. My mother was married with two children before she was 18. She NEVER discussed sex or personal hygiene, although she did require us to bathe daily.

[SheilaT]

21. Thank you for being willing to reveal this very personal information.

I too often forget how very different life circumstances can be for someone else.

And given what you told me, I'm even more impressed that you actually got to college. Good for you! It must have been an amazing journey.

[chervilant]

24. Yeppers,

I was a geek child -- high IQ, sci-fi afficionado, reading Weber and Marx before I hit puberty. Attended Rice U. -- because I loved the bucolic campus, lol! I read Rachel Carson's "Silent Spring" when I was 12, and determined that I would remain childless (unless I could adopt) and that I would become an activist. I've been an advocate for survivors of relationship violence for more than thirty years.

I'm back home in the Ozarks. I baked a peach cobbler today, and mowed most of my three acres. I have a modest bio-intensive garden, and a lovely walking path. I am blissed out most of the time.

I write every day, and create mixed media art multiple times a week. Life is good, despite the threatening damages wrought by the corporate megs. I grieve for our children, but I don't let it pull me into the abyss.

[Mojorabbit]

30. We did not have them either in the late sixties early seventies

when I started shaving. I shredded my legs for years. I love the Venus razors. I can actually shave without looking like I fell into a rosebush.

[chervilant]

31. I've gotten better at it.

Like others posting herein, I shave when I want to, and skip it when I don't. I usually go all winter without shaving.

Don't wear pantyhose anymore, either (the sacrilege! the horror!), and rarely use makeup.

I'm listening to a pileated work on an insect-laden dead tree in my side yard -- reminds me there are more important things to experience before our species exits stage right.

[Mojorabbit]

32. Yes, I am off to see a good friend in hospice. Puts things into perspective.

[BainsBane]

23. There are ones now that you couldn't cut yourself with if you tried

Venus are great.

As for Redqueen's comment, I think those women are afraid men won't like them so they feel compelled to say they don't fit a male stereotype of a feminist. I saw fuck all of it. I shave my legs when I want to and not when I don't. The same with wearing make up. I do it for me, not what others expect of me. And I certainly have never felt compelled to identify myself as a "good feminist."

[chervilant]

25. Yeah, well, I follow your posts,

and -- personally -- I think you're a GREAT feminist!

(I have sliced myself with a Venus, but I love the design aesthetic.)

[BainsBane]

26. Oh, TY

Sorry about the Venus. Sounds like you're even more talented that I am.

[Tumbulu]

29. It has never been easy for me

I hate all sharp things and bought this epilady thing that pulls the hair out some 25 years ago for that reason. I only used it in the summer when I would be seen in public by family members who did not approve of normal body hair.

I always found shaving legs and underarms to be rather savage and undignified. And resent anyone who thinks it is necessary. I simply clean up the hairs so that I won't stand out. It is not something I enjoy or approve of. But I got tired of it standing for something. What I do not know, but it seems to be a very charged subject.

[redqueen]

3. I very rarely bother.

At first I was uncomfortable walking around with hairy legs on display in public, but gradually I came to care less and less about what the stinkeye people think, because... well, obviously, they're horrible people, so fuck em!

[Warpy]

5. Women get slagged off no matter what they do in this culture

and yes, bucking patriarchal beauty standards can be dangerous to the ego.

Once I started living in scrubs and jeans I had no fucks to give and stopped shaving. It was just one more damned nuisance I didn't have to put up with, not a feminist statement or a revolutionary act.

It's personal choice. It's just a pity those aren't respected among women.

[Stargazer09]

12. +1

I think you summed up the whole thing very nicely. Personal choices should be respected.

[geckosfeet]

6. Yes. Thinking about what one is saying is rapidly becoming a lost art.

[hlthe2b]

7. That isn't the current body area for which so much of society seems obsessed...

and for which the current obsession on waxing, "styling", shaving, and other means of removal leaves me annoyed as hell.

Maybe shaving legs (and underarms) was the start of all this... While I say, to each his own, if I see one more magazine rack full of waaay too much info on intimate "landscaping" expectations and methods, I think I may just lose it.

[redqueen]

8. Uggggggghhh...

If as many feminists ever started saying they're not one of those "hairy vulva'ed feminists" I will officially give up because that would mean the patriarchy has won forever.

[Stargazer09]

11. It has gone overboard lately

I've always liked keeping myself trimmed, but only for myself and my own neat-freak tendencies.

Why it has suddenly become a national obsession is beyond my understanding. If people are doing it because it's another form of self-expression, that's one thing (and personally, I support that). When someone feels pressured to do it, or are only doing it because it's "expected," then it's a bad thing.

I admit that there is a very tenuous line between self-expression and societal pressure.

[Stargazer09]

9. The definition of feminism

The general public believes that feminism means replacing patriarchy with matriarchy. That makes a lot of people very uncomfortable, because they envision a world where men are treated as (let's be honest) women are today, or worse, where men are completely emasculated.

My women's studies courses in college always defined feminism as treating men and women as equals, with the goal of dismantling patriarchy and dissolving gender-based barriers. That's far less threatening to people who have only known patriarchy, and it's also seen as a worthwhile and fair viewpoint to support.

The result of having these two different definitions is confusion. When you tell someone that you're a feminist, you are almost required to say that you are not a man-hating "femi-nazi" who hates all men, because that is how most of society defines the word.

I want my friends (male and female alike) to embrace feminism, because I want true equality and mutual respect. If it means redefining the word in their minds, then so be it. Maybe next time someone tells them that she is a feminist, those particular friends will remember the equality definition, instead of the combative one.

As far as shaving is concerned, I do it for myself. Even when nobody else sees my legs and armpits, I just don't like feeling hairy. I think it's a personal choice, just like men who prefer to shave their facial hair.

[ismnotwasm]

13. This is an interesting point

The general public believes that feminism means replacing patriarchy with matriarchy. That makes a lot of people very uncomfortable, because they envision a world where men are treated as (let's be honest) women are today, or worse, where men are completely emasculated.

Who the hell wants a matriarchy? That doesn't even make sense. This is off topic, but's thats like expecting a woman president will be less militaristic because she's a woman and therefore more 'nurturing', but I certainly see where someone would pick up that idea.

Call me a feminazi and I point out what Nazi's actually did.

Or say something about Goodwin's law

I tell everyone I'm a feminist who gets to know me, without qualifiers.

[Stargazer09]

14. It really doesn't make sense

But unfortunately, that is what a lot of people think when asked to define feminism. It's a patriarchal definition, if you think about it. Men (in general) are currently in power, and they assume that if feminists had their way, we would take that power away from them. They don't understand that feminism isn't about controlling men, it's about equality.

I know. We have a long way to go.

[ismnotwasm]

10. There is no big deal

Just a lot of shit-talking by both men and women about personal choices. For women, Personal choices of course, are far more respected when they follow the societal norm of the look of prepubescence.

To each their own.

[spin]

15. I find it somewhat interesting that many men are starting to remove body hair. ...

Now some do it to increase their athletic performance times (swimmers). But many shave their chest and/or legs and arm pits because their girlfriends like it.

I'm an older male. The only time I shave hair on my arms, legs or chest is when I'm testing a knife to see if it is sharp.

[Iris]

22. a salon here in Atlanta now offers "Manzilians" n/t

[Still Blue in PDX]

16. Sadly, my body hair seems to have migrated to my chin and upper lip.

To loosely paraphrase a bumper sticker, if someone can see the hair on my legs or in my pits they are too close.

[Deep13]

27. *shrug*

My wife doesn't shave usually. Neither of us really care about it.

[Politicalboi]

28. My 86 year old mother shaves her legs

I help to bathe her, and sometimes she wants to shave her legs. I tell her nobody is looking, why do something that can cause you to bleed just to shave your legs.