‘Men’s Rights’ and ‘Revenge Porn’ Sites Seethe With Anger Over Women’s Autonomy

[ismnotwasm]

In many ways, the argument that women should be fully equal to men has won in the public discourse. Sure, a lot of people still fight against equality, but they often pretend that it’s about something else—fetal life, religious liberty, women’s “choice” to make less money—because even they know openly stating the belief that women are a subclass of people put here to serve men tends not to go over very well with a general audience. Women’s education rates and income are going up. Violence against women is going down. The attacks on reproductive rights are escalating, but that’s in part in response to the fact that women themselves, especially younger women, are increasingly comfortable with the belief that they are the decider when it comes to what happens to their uterus.

However, there’s one growing trend that, while it’s hard to really get an idea of its size, should be a cause for concern: The number of men online creating communities dedicated to advancing the plain old, unvarnished misogynist belief that men deserve to control women. On “men’s rights” forums and “revenge porn” sites, groups of men are gathering together to find reinforcement for the plain old abusive belief that women who make their own choices about who to sleep with and who to marry are evil, and that allowing women this most basic of freedom is somehow oppressive to men. That there are many men who feel this way is no big surprise, particularly to anyone who knows the extent of domestic violence in this country, violence that is usually rooted in just this belief about male entitlement over women’s bodies. But the fact that they have found each other online and are pumping each other up and feeling more and more empowered by the minute in their ludicrous beliefs should be a major cause for concern.

Two stories from this week show exactly how true it is that these communities are about crafting the belief that women “oppress” men by wanting to be the masters of our own bodies instead of ceding that control over to men. In California, Attorney General Kamala Harris announced the arrest of Kevin Bollaert, who is being hit with 31 charges of conspiracy, identity theft, and extortion for running a “revenge porn” site. “Revenge porn” is a nasty little subset of the Internet where men take naked pictures they usually obtained during the course of a consensual relationship, and they post them against a woman’s will in order to humiliate and harass her. Often, as was the case with Bollaert’s site, the woman’s name, location, and social media information is also provided so that the men who use the site can more effectively harass her.

The name “revenge porn” really points to the fact that this is about establishing the claim that men own women, and women do not get to say no. The men justify putting up the pictures as a form of “revenge.” Revenge for what? Well, usually for something as simple as dumping him. In some cases, the men try to beef up their claim of a right to vengeance by citing cheating or some other relationship infraction. It doesn’t really matter. You have a right to dump someone if they cheat on you, but the belief that you are “owed” the right to “revenge” by stalking and humiliating them is rooted in the belief that you own them and their bodies, and what they choose to do with their bodies somehow is a violation of your rights. While there are (reportedly) a few “revenge porn” pictures of men floating out there, by and large this is a violation enacted by men on women, and reinforced by an Internet community that assures these men they deserve to hurt and abuse women because those women are making choices with their own lives of which the men do not approve.

http://rhrealitycheck.org/article/2013/12/16/mens-rights-and-revenge-porn-sites-seethe-with-anger-over-womens-autonomy/

[Squinch]

1. I've never seen any estimates of how prevalent this attitude is, have you? I kind if always assume

it is just 20 very busy guys who type fast.

But that might be wishful thinking.

[ismnotwasm]

2. A voice for men has over 10,000 alone

They're nut jobs, but they need to be exposed constantly

[Squinch]

13. Oh, shit!

[BainsBane]

4. It's growing

They reinforce each other and that validates their warped beliefs. We see it all around us, concealed only through the thinnest veil.
Their battle is ultimately a losing one, however. Try as they might, they can't turn back the clock.

[Squinch]

14. I hope to God you are right. I am trying to think of times when

women's rights were rolled back. It has happened in a number of Middle Eastern countries with the rise of fundamentalism.

[redqueen]

17. Hell it's happened here as a result of TRAP laws.

Having the right to an abortion is meaningless when providers are hundreds of miles away.

And with shit like this they are constantly attempting to chip away at the rights we have...
http://rhrealitycheck.org/article/2013/11/18/new-york-court-affirms-moving-out-of-state-while-pregnant-is-not-absconding-with-a-child/

[Squinch]

18. Yes, it is happening here, but as Bains Bane said, in the larger scheme, over the longer term,

you don't generally see that genie put back in the bottle.

The reproduction wars are in the process of being waged here and are not yet over. I am interested to see what happens in 2014 with respect to that. I am hoping to see that the effort to take control of women's reproduction will, in the end, have the opposite effect of its intention. I am hoping that women are enraged into exercising their options.

I may be naïve, but I am hoping that this is what will happen, and working for 2014.

[redqueen]

19. Well Savannah Dietrich was enraged enough at the gag order imposed on her to act.

Only time will tell what women in the states affected by TRAP laws will do.

[Squinch]

20. But even with her acting, the revised sentences were still bullshit.

I just can't believe American women will allow themselves to be put back to barefoot and pregnant. But I have been disappointed in such things before.

[redqueen]

9. It's way more than that.

As detailed in that Salon piece, these people are determined and organized. And it goes further than the mainstream efforts to prevent battered women from keeping their children, or fighting for laws like the VAWA.

Consider the very public responses to women like Anita Sarkeesian and Caroline Criado-Perez. The hate directed privately at feminist bloggers is no less jarring. Even women (and men) who don't declare themselves feminists are subjected to it, if they dare publish feminist-leaning commentary.

We are seeing a growing backlash. As awareness of rape culture and resistance to it increases, so will the backlash.

[xulamaude]

10. A woman I know was doxxed by AVfM

and had her very successful career seriously compromised. She, personally, was not terribly worried for herself but her business partner and other associates (all women) were next in line and she felt the need to protect them.

Another talented, outspoken feminist is silenced

[redqueen]

11. And that's the goal of the bullying and harassment.

They want to silence women who threaten the status quo.

[Squinch]

16. Have you heard about the book "Angry White Men" by Michael Kimmel?

CSpan did an interview about it. Kimmel, a sociology professor, went into gun shows to find, shall we say, a certain demographic, and then told them he wanted to find out where their ideas and political beliefs came from. The interview was fascinating. I can't wait to read the book.

[smirkymonkey]

31. I think we are seeing them in their death throes.

Hoping anyway.

[seabeyond]

34. they did a misstep and finally getting negative attention. also meet the needs of a lot of pathetic

men

i do not think they are on death throes. i believe that the momentum is on their side with a universal backlash toward women

[smirkymonkey]

36. A light burns brightest before it goes out!

I am hoping that will be some kind of reassurance!

[seabeyond]

37. there is always hope. hence why women continue to speak out day after day after day. regardless

how exhausting it is. regardless of the hostile environment we are forced to do it in. regardless of the personal attacks and insults. regardless of the stupid.

[niyad]

3. k and r--bookmarking for later, because I don't feel like throwing things right now.

[gollygee]

5. She summed up the whole MRA in this one paragraph

The argument, which went over like gangbusters on the website, couldn’t be more obvious: Men are oppressed because there are women they find sexually attractive who are sexually unavailable. And that this is the real oppression, and not all that feminist jibber-jabber about rape, domestic violence, abortion bans, and pay inequity. Indeed, that women are actively oppressing men because women don’t accede to demands to have sex with any man just because he wants it.

[CrispyQ]

6. What adult man thinks this way?

These men must be emotionally stunted - stuck at age 11 or thereabouts. Or maybe age 2, where you still think everything is all about you. Other than the guys they get together with to bash women, I wonder if these types of guys have male friends? I ask, cuz when I read about these types of guys, they come across as socially inept & incapable of a real relationship with anyone, not just women.

[gollygee]

7. They make friends with each other

hence the popularity of their websites.

They're out there.

[MadrasT]

8. "These men must be emotionally stunted - stuck at age 11 or thereabouts."

I know some of these guys in real life and this assessment is accurate. They have packs of male friends, and one of their favorite activities is to natter on endlessly to each other about how hard it is to find decent women... and go out trolling for women and getting upset that women aren't falling over over their attempts to come on to them.

Those damn women. It's all the fault of the women. Clearly.

[seabeyond]

12. on levels, different degrees. i was in a thread, you too. all about women doing what it takes to

prevent their rape. and though i am aware and implement all that in my life, i know it is not really what is going ot keep me safe from rape. there are much more harsh realities that the men would immediately abck away from if we were truly going to be honest about it. like, see men as all men are potential rapists. like, going to a mans apartment, be sure you are ready for sex. start giving women these real facts, then we are getting somewhere.

but we wont. cause then it is the boy next door, it is our date, it is all men. cause of course, no rapists have an r on their forehead.

so, we women take these points with the illusion they will keep us safe from rape. we will be preventing our rape. snort...

but, i asked a number. why are men allowed to be offended by that OP. it was a good point. saying make is out of control, arent you offended?

why are men allowed to be offended about a PSA that directs toward men and not women

why are men allowed to be offended when a woman implements these rainn policies. you know, change side of street. step out of the elevator at 4 am so you are not alone with a stranger.

men do not like that cause it makes them feel like you are saying they are rapists. it hurts their feelings.

they demand we are responsible. but only if man is kept totally out of the scenario.

that mentality has a base, foundation to what all this is about. if this very simple contradiction cannot even be recognized. that we all must take responsibility in protecting self and make sure we in no way step on a mans toes while doing it. our girls hyperviligent changing many manners that they walk thru life, yet a non recognition that we do this to our girls.

contradiction galore. and they all feed in pack.

[Squinch]

15. Sea, taking a moment to say happy banishment, and I'm looking forward to when you come back!

Happy holidays, and stay well.

[redqueen]

21. Good point about the contradiction.

Women, to stay safe, you must avoid doing x y and z things at/with/around men.

But not me though! I'm a nice guy! How dare you be so rude/offensive/conceitedcauseyouretoouglytorapelol.

[geek tragedy]

28. they mope and say stuff like "women just don't like nice guys, they only

date assholes and guys with money" etc etc.

Adolescent self-pity and societal privilege are an ugly, toxic mixture.

[smirkymonkey]

32. They just need to grow up.

There are men that I find sexually attractive that I probably can never have, but hey that's life. I accept it. There are tons of male 3's and 4's out there thinking that they DESERVE 9's and 10's. And they are pissed that they aren't getting it. Grow up boys! It's so ridiculous. They hate us all because they can't get thier candy.

[ismnotwasm]

22. Some point out common sense measures as some sort of panacea

Not realizing how much women actually have to do to stay safe. We say, look to the rapists, look to rape culture and we hear

"What rape culture? Lock your doors and don't take candy from strangers-- or the equivalent. A systematic perpetuation of the root of the problem.

[NuclearDem]

23. Uh oh, this article just got posted in GD.

[ismnotwasm]

24. Heh!

I'm at work. Interesting to see how that will turn out...

[nomorenomore08]

25. Aside from a few dumb posts, that thread actually didn't go too badly.

No all-out flame wars at least.

[ismnotwasm]

26. Well the GD thread justified some guesses I had made

[geek tragedy]

27. See also: the men who can rattle off at least 5-6 cases

of men being falsely accused of rape, but never, and I mean never, say anything resembling sympathy for women who suffer from rape or the fear of rape.

[seabeyond]

29. exactly. it is not liek we are stupid and do not notice. and ignored when making the point.

and not one man that i have noticed has stopped and checked himself. what is that?

[geek tragedy]

30. to some men, the worst thing about rape is that it causes star athletes to miss games.

Same men deny the existence of rape culture.

And, yes, some of them also describe themselves as liberal/progressive and act all betrayed when they're not recognized as the great and awesome allies of women they are.

[smirkymonkey]

33. The lack of empathy among so called liberal men is astounding.

Abosolutely no concern for the lives of the females of the species whatsoever.

[seabeyond]

35. for the life of me, hitting different direction and angle, i could not get good men, democrats,

progressive in all ways, to simply look at an issue from a womans perspective. it was impossible. and it really is not that hard. it is simply the matter of self absorbed concerns taking precedent over the good of another human being.

no different than those financially doing ok unable to empathize with the poor, or those raised in that environment. self absorption, need and want takes precedent.