Bernie Sanders
Related: About this forumHillary Clinton's Betrayal of the American Left
By Walker Bragman
It has long been said by disenchanted left-wing people that America has no left wing partyjust a right wing and a moderate right wing party. This has been the case for years until recently with the candidacy of Bernie Sanders. One would think liberals would be ecstatic. While many are, once again, the left is cannibalizing itself in the face of opportunity.
Im just going to say this: Hillary supporters are pessimistic and politically blind. Theres no other way of putting it. They are mostly Baby Boomers, many of whom base their votes on an assumption of Republican narrative dominance that has been for years since the realignment of the south, but no longer exists. For the sake of electability they are afraid of embracing ideas they think are too radical even though they may agree with them.
But here are five charts from the nonpartisan PoliticalCompass.org which places candidates on a political spectrum based rough estimations of their ideology. Each one should serve as a wake up call about what is actually too radical. The X-axis is the economic scale, and the Y-axis is the social scale:
This graph shows where Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders fall on a political spectrum in comparison to the GOP. Well keep referencing this as we go on, but for now, something very interesting should stand out: Bernie Sanders is closer to the middlethe objective political centerthan any other candidate running.
much more
http://www.pastemagazine.com/articles/2016/02/hillary-clintons-betrayal-of-the-american-left.html
TTUBatfan2008
(3,623 posts)...goes to show the effect of Reagan on this country. Sanders is seen as some crazy ultra left person when he really isn't. It's that damn near everyone else in national politics is way to the right of where they should be, especially on the issue of authoritarianism. These politicians should be standing up for us, not trying to enact a police state against us.
SoLeftIAmRight
(4,883 posts)About ten years ago a book was published that detailed the 40 right wing think tanks funded by a billion dollars each year. The goal of these organizations is to limit the range of topics that get broadcast to the world and frame how these topics are to be understood.
Many of the talking heads have been trained in these places and they have been very effective in directing the way Americans think about issues. Climate change is a very good example. Many here can see through the confusion spread about this issue but still are not able to do the same with so many other issues.
No we can't is true for those living in the right wing world. There are many wise people that quietly offer rational solutions to many of the problems that we face. It is time to listen to these voices. It is time to elevate a different and rational approach to our problems.
Sanders offers us a chance to take a fresh look at the world around us. Sanders offers us a chance to explore new possibilities in the way we deal with our challenges.
Sanders offers us a chance to Change the Narrative.
Take the chance - accept the challenge - join the movement that can Change the Narrative.
appalachiablue
(41,135 posts)K & R. Thanks for this very impt. post-- the reality!
mrdmk
(2,943 posts)On August 23, 1971, prior to accepting President Nixon's request to become an Associate Justice of the Supreme Court, Powell sent the "Confidential Memorandum" titled "Attack on the American Free Enterprise System." He argued, "The most disquieting voices joining the chorus of criticism came from perfectly respectable elements of society: from the college campus, the pulpit, the media, the intellectual and literary journals, the arts and sciences, and from politicians." In the memorandum, Powell advocated "constant surveillance" of textbook and television content, as well as a purge of left-wing elements. He named consumer advocate Ralph Nader as the chief antagonist of American business.
This memo foreshadowed a number of Powell's court opinions, especially First National Bank of Boston v. Bellotti, which shifted the direction of First Amendment law by declaring that corporate financial influence of elections through independent expenditures should be protected with the same vigor as individual political speech. Much of the future Court opinion in Citizens United v. Federal Election Commission relied on the same arguments raised in Bellotti.
Though written confidentially for Eugene Syndor at the Chamber of Commerce, it was discovered by Washington Post columnist Jack Anderson, who reported on its content a year later (after Powell had joined the Supreme Court). Anderson focused on the efforts of Powell to undermine the democratic process (at least as Anderson saw it); however, in terms of business's view of itself in relation to government and public interest groups, the memo did little but convey the thinking among businessmen at the time. The real contribution of the memo, instead, was its emphasis on institution building, particularly updating the Chamber's efforts to influence federal policy. Here, it would be greatly influential in motivating the Chamber and other groups to modernize their efforts to lobby the federal government.
link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lewis_F._Powell,_Jr.#Powell_Memorandum
Attack of American Free Enterprise System
Date: August 23, 1971
T0: Mr. Eugene B. Sydnor, Jr., Chairman, Education Committee, U.S. Chamber of Commerce
From: Lewis F. Powell, Jr.
This memorandum is submitted at your request as a basis for the discussion on August 24 with Mr. Booth (executive vice president) and others at the U.S. Chamber of Commerce. The purpose is to identify the problem, and suggest possible avenues of action for further consideration.
<snip>
Dimensions of the Attack
No thoughtful person can question that the American economic system is under broad attack. 1 This varies in scope, intensity, in the techniques employed, and in the level of visibility.
<snip>
Sources of the Attack
The sources are varied and diffused. They include, not unexpectedly, the Communists, New Leftists and other revolutionaries who would destroy the entire system, both political and economic. These extremists of the left are far more numerous, better financed, and increasingly are more welcomed and encouraged by other elements of society, than ever before in our history. But they remain a small minority, and are not yet the principal cause for concern.
<snip>
Tone of the Attack
This memorandum is not the place to document in detail the tone, character, or intensity of the attack. The following quotations will suffice to give one a general idea:
William Kunstler, warmly welcomed on campuses and listed in a recent student poll as the "American lawyer most admired," incites audiences as follows:
"You must learn to fight in the streets, to revolt, to shoot guns. We will learn to do all of the things that property owners fear." 2 The New Leftists who heed Kunstler's advice increasingly are beginning to act -- not just against military recruiting offices and manufacturers of munitions, but against a variety of businesses: "Since February, 1970, branches (of Bank of America) have been attacked 39 times, 22 times with explosive devices and 17 times with fire bombs or by arsonists." 3 Although New Leftist spokesmen are succeeding in radicalizing thousands of the young, the greater cause for concern is the hostility of respectable liberals and social reformers. It is the sum total of their views and influence which could indeed fatally weaken or destroy the system.
There is a lot more at the link and a very interesting read.
link: http://www.webcitation.org/64jAmJkKB
SoLeftIAmRight
(4,883 posts)So many people do not understand what forces are aligned against us.
Mufaddal
(1,021 posts)But I wish I had more than one to give it.
ladjf
(17,320 posts)She's likely to be a billionaire before she dies.
n2doc
(47,953 posts)Her attitude has clearly been "I'm Queen Hillary, and you had better treat me like that!". The power and prestige of the Presidency can't be bought by a mere billionaire for themselves. Unless they are named Trump, of course. But I think she is in it for the Power. That is scarier than being in it for the money.
ladjf
(17,320 posts)money is the goal of the power. She doesn't strike me as the megalomaniac type. But, power is attractive to people.
Watch this
The quote "We came, We Saw, He Died". She is reveling in the power of the moment. Hell that interaction she had with the BLM protester yesterday was full of contempt for the person who dared to ask her a question.
The female Nixon, that is what I believe she will turn out to be if elected.
ladjf
(17,320 posts)as though either of us is backing Hillary. That's the important thing.
chervilant
(8,267 posts)"Won't Support Hi11ary" cake. She was and is a disgusting politician, and I cannot understand why ANYONE supports her.
Duval
(4,280 posts)I thought she showed tremendous courage by asking Clinton to apologize for previous comments. Clinton's dismissive and condescending answer, followed by a Secret Service guy who escorted her out, nearly made my eyeballs turn blue. She has a YOUUGE problem.
eridani
(51,907 posts)No clue why she couldn't do the same thing when presented with a perfect opportunity.
JDPriestly
(57,936 posts)And that is the opposite of Obama. Obama is always respectful and kind.
Hillary's contempt will get her into trouble especially if we have, as we are likely to have, a Republican Congress.
If elected, I do not believe she will finish her term without being challenged in a number of unpleasant ways that will be disruptive to our country.
Hillary is contemptuous and arrogant. There is no getting around that.
Hillary will mean trouble if she is nominated.
90-percent
(6,829 posts)Watching her revel in the death of the leader of a country is much more impactful than reading it! I know he was a creep in the Idi Amin dictator model, but didn't he get mobbed to death "by his own people"? Certainly doesn't seem like a giggly thing to me. It seems monstrous. Not to mention the standard unintended consequences of making things even worse afterwards.
Hillary is Dick Cheney without the snarl.
-90% Jimmy
Its fascinating what people will reveal bout their sordid inner world.
tk2kewl
(18,133 posts)for now
Dragonfli
(10,622 posts)depending on the whims of political parties in the US (A great many do by the way)
It is important to note that political right and left are well defined and the definitions don't change via popularity contests of what some wish they mean depending on their personal preferences.
Here is a map of Canada 2015, note the differences, if you follow Canadian politics you will see that they are quite acurate, just as the US one above is
PatrynXX
(5,668 posts)Liberal was Right of Center then it would show Conservatives and a little farther right it was some guy called Hitler I learned this at a WELS based (one of the more Conservative wings) Lutheran School .. Imagine that
Dragonfli
(10,622 posts)A pop chart From a site that basically said to take their graphs with a grain of salt as it was just based on a little theory of theirs they were trying to develop and that that was ALSO based on the results of a test taken by the politician herself, with nothing other than the test itself, easy to manipulate for any outcome one may want (not the issues votes or stances) so yeah, as condescending as it sounded I felt the need to post a "control" or comparison chart based on the only country besides the US most Americans even notice exists
Do you remember the Hillary as extreme left chart?
I was also lectured the other day that FDR was left in His day, but things change and politicians in "our' age mean the progressive caucus were the extreme left and Hillary was just plain left (further left than centrist even.)
Knowing that definitions mean something and political compass has a well tested and respected methodology internationally, that does not use a self test but metrics based on policy and actions or proposed policies taken as a whole, although my post sounded condescending I felt it very necessary. (they do have a test if you want to graph yourself, but it will only be accurate if your answers are truthful) They don't let politicians use the test because around the end of the first year into it they found out the pols (surprise) were cheating on the tests to manipulate the outcome)
retrowire
(10,345 posts)nenagh
(1,925 posts)came to mind.
LiberalEsto
(22,845 posts)Great chart!
mountain grammy
(26,621 posts)from yet ANOTHER Boomer.
Go BERNIE!!!
#NotMeUs
stupidicus
(2,570 posts)the theft/selection that occurred in 2000 left those of on the actual left and the 3rdway pretenders united against that, but in a sad state of disarray when it came to our collective introspection and analysis that the Bernie candidacy has forced like just about no other would at this point in time.
The same can't be said of the BHO admins, because they have played a critical role of putting the spotlight on our differences with and objections to the 3rdwayer ways Hillary champions.
That's why I told them around here in response to their pottymouthing over BHO criticisms prior to the last election, that they were likely the minority here on DU as well as the wider public arena, and hopefully, Bernie will show that to be correct.
THe cat is now outta THE BAG IMHO, and the Bernivirus will continue to spread and afflict more with the network moment feeling, regardless of the outcome this Nov.
chervilant
(8,267 posts)Hillary Clinton is hurting the Democratic Party, and ensuring Americas left remains unrepresented. Her ambition and lack of judgment are liabilities. Enough is enough.
Enough IS enough.
Feel the BERN!!!
#NotMeUs
PatrynXX
(5,668 posts)First one I ever took I was pretty much dead center, although below the line Libertarian. I see from Bernie he's both and neither so thats probably why alot of Libertarians like him. Right Win Libertarians are better known as Tea Party.... in theory although I assume thats a fake.
starroute
(12,977 posts)At some point in 2009 or 2010, I was trying to track down how one particularly paranoid anti-Obama rumor had originated and spread, so I had occasion to check out a number of right-wing message boards. And what I found was that the mainly libertarian movement that had come out of Ron Paul's 2008 presidential run was being overwhelmed by tea partiers and was reacting with a horrified tone of "who are you people and why are you spreading these insane stories?"
Of course, there's not much to be hoped for from right-wing libertarians these days either. Most of them are hard-line anarcho-capitalists, defenders of deregulation and the "free market," and sworn enemies of any kind of collective action for the public good. But they're still not as insane as the tea party.
Populist_Prole
(5,364 posts)It turned out to be just a re-branding of the republican far right, bristling with christian theocrats, bigots and MIC worshipping authoritarians.
Betty Karlson
(7,231 posts)maddiemom
(5,106 posts)This Bernie supporter will vote for him in the PA primary. I'm sick of all the D.U. Hillary hate, however. There isn't even an equivalent amount of Trump or Cruz bashing (or just barely). Reminds me a little of the 2000 Nader supporters who claimed Gore was no better than Bush. Freeze Hillary news out, if you want. Just don't sit back and pretend you'd rather have Trump or Cruz. At my advanced age, I'm more than sick of the "lesser of two evils" voting thing, but stop giving the Repugs so much ammo that their work is done for them if Hillary is the nominee.
n2doc
(47,953 posts)Only Sanders supporters are smart enough to do that!
I would be interested if you could point me to a post in the HRC forum or GD P where you said something similar about the attacks on Sanders....
maddiemom
(5,106 posts)in general. I'd spend all day in front of my screen if I had more free time for the forums, etc. Bernie's already got my vote, he doesn't need my support when probing deeper into what are meant to be far more detailed and slanted critiques.
farleftlib
(2,125 posts)The examples you gave were from the GE. The tenor of the debate is the same as 2000, '04 and '08. It will continue until the convention because this needs to be discussed.
Jester Messiah
(4,711 posts)Betty Karlson
(7,231 posts)"Hillary Clinton is hurting the Democratic Party, and ensuring Americas left remains unrepresented. Her ambition and lack of judgment are liabilities. Enough is enough."
Quite so.
nashville_brook
(20,958 posts)the Clintons are horrible for the party.
PatrynXX
(5,668 posts)Figures. I'm Ghandi O_O hey he had glasses too.
Bonhomme Richard
(9,000 posts)I became very disillusioned with the direction of the party during his presidency.
Javaman
(62,530 posts)then Bernie comes along and now she calls herself a progressive.
More over, people in the press and in political circles call Bernie a "leftist" when it's apparent from this graft his is certainly closer to a centrist then a leftist.
my take away from all of this? it's a glaring example of our we as a nation have slide so far to the right, that a centrist is considered a leftist.
any self respecting Dem that is of the belief that Hillary represents the average person is under some major delusions.
Dragonfli
(10,622 posts)There used to be a left in this country, Communists and socialists were all over most notably active in the very early labor movements, that ended when McCarthy put a stake through the heart of our domestic left.
The closest we have to left now is really center left, like FDR, that infused some Socialism into Capitalism and created the New Deal etc. He was sort of the first American Democratic Socialist, Bernie and his policies are very FDR, even his most extreme policies can be found in FDRs second bill of rights, hardly a communist manifesto.
But this country runs on spin and so they call Sanders a "leftist" and a "Socialist" when he is in fact a Capitalist that believes like FDR that some socialism is needed for a nation that is more evenly prosperous (which is true of Capitalism by the way) and is really, just like FDR center left.
There is a simple formula that I believe in, Capitalism without Socialism in the mix=Fascism and Socialism without Capitalism in the mix = Communism.
My biggest worry is that although Communists are nearly extinct in this country Fascism was not attacked by it's McCarthy opposite (if one ever existed) and fascists are sill alive and well in this country, just waiting for the Republicans who are already at about John Birch Society level craziness are just a short step away from Fascism for real.
SoLeftIAmRight
(4,883 posts)There is no left in America
LittleGirl
(8,287 posts)and lower than Sanders on the scale toward libertarian. This boomer is voting for Bernie.
Deadshot
(384 posts)I don't even know why she calls herself a Democrat.
Dragonfli
(10,622 posts)LongTomH
(8,636 posts)......all the greats of the Democratic party.
After the election, Hillary will move to the right so fast it'll make our heads spin.
99th_Monkey
(19,326 posts)WillyT
(72,631 posts)TBF
(32,062 posts)about lowering expectations. The elite would like us to elect Hillary to deliver austerity to America. They can f+++ off.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/102411218
Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)Major Hogwash
(17,656 posts)Farther to the left than President Obama has been able to do so far.
There is no doubt where the corporation's interests lie, with either Hillary or Trump they get pretty much the same thing.
That's why Bernie's campaign is so important.
cantbeserious
(13,039 posts)eom