*****Debate Thread 2***********

[bdamomma]

Here you go Guys

[nolabear]

1. Oops! I did too. I'll delete

[underpants]

2. 💩

[bdamomma]

3. On the same page

[nolabear]

5. See how we Dems work together?

[IcyPeas]

13. thanks

[McCamy Taylor]

4. Hi!

[we can do it]

7. Joe's eye blew up again.

When Castro attacked him.

[Sugarcoated]

15. Huh?

[we can do it]

24. Eye bleeding like last debate.

[UniteFightBack]

43. Yeah and how'd that work out huh? nt

[nolabear]

47. Had nothing to do with last debate. I've had a couple.

Harmless, though dramatic as fuck. Hell, Castro just about gave ME another one!

[madaboutharry]

22. Castro is the one who looked bad.

I know I'm not the only one who thinks that.

[MBS]

33. Agreed

I was pretty shocked, to be honest.

[we can do it]

48. Biden's eye is full of blood and Castro looked bad.

Not mutually exclusive.

[MustLoveBeagles]

66. That was very disappointing

It will backfire on him.

[underpants]

8. The first 40 minutes were fun - Yang Beto and Castro ran themselves out of the race.

[nolabear]

12. Not sure re Beto but the other two...OY!

[underpants]

20. Reparations

[IcyPeas]

16. i thought beto was okay so far

[barbtries]

41. i don't think so.

but yang and castro were already extreme underdogs.
Beto just keeps rising lately for me.

[ecstatic]

61. LOL @ the graphic! nt

[MustLoveBeagles]

86. I don't agree with you about Beto but I love the graphic

[nolabear]

9. Yes, Joe! Good prison reform platform.

[Celerity]

10. WaPo real time fact check, 10 million remain uninsured under the Biden plan

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2019/live-updates/election-2020/third-democratic-debate-analysis-and-fact-checking/

Sanders’ plan would give insurance to the approximately 30 million people who currently lack it, while preventing millions more from facing medical bankruptcy or crippling costs. But critics say at more than $30 trillion it would be prohibitively expensive and require enormous new tax increases on businesses and individual households.

Sanders’ bill would also outlaw coverage that is duplicative with generous government plans, reducing the multi billion-dollar health insurance industry to a small, supplemental role.

Biden’s health care plan would build on Obamacare by creating a government program that all Americans could purchase — a so-called public option — if they are uninsured or do not like their existing plans.

By creating this “public option,” Biden’s plan is intended to drive down private insurers’ costs while also creating a more affordable alternative. This idea was pushed as part of Obamacare but eventually discarded after push back from private industry and moderate Democrats.

Biden’s plan would be substantially cheaper than Sanders’ “Medicare-for-all” plan, a fraction of the cost, and is more likely to win the support of moderate Democrats in Congress. But, according to Biden’s website, it would still leave roughly 10 million Americans without insurance — while also doing far less than a single-payer model to drive down costs and eliminate rising out-of-pocket expenses.

snip

[McCamy Taylor]

11. Wanting for Biden to remind Warren he was a Democrat when she was GOP

[demmiblue]

35. He won't because that is petty bullshit.

[tblue37]

77. +1. nt

[Thekaspervote]

177. This.. too classy for that kind of crap!

[peggysue2]

97. Nah, Biden won't go that route

Cheap shot. Unless, of course, you thought Hillary Clinton being a Goldwater Republican in HS was relevant. It wasn't and neither is this.

[bdamomma]

14. I think I like

Town Halls better, more at ease, and you can really listen to that candidate. I don't like these time restrictions.

Cory Booker I like him.

[elleng]

17. Better, yes, I agree,

but this is more debate-like than others have been.

[nolabear]

21. Agreed. This one is better. All except Bernie are better. Wonder if he's ill.

Not he’s not capable ill, just under the weather.

[elleng]

32. Glad you agree this one's better.

Hoarseness always happens, during grueling primary season.

[nolabear]

58. I couldn't do it myself!

I do public stuff sometimes but man, this is grueling.

[elleng]

69. AWFULLY grueling,

and I always forget how much.

[femmedem]

34. Yes, Booker is doing great.

Passionate, principled, bold.

[sprinkleeninow]

182. I thot Cory and Pete... n/t

[McCamy Taylor]

18. Oh! Sandy Hook! That is dirty pool.

[brooklynite]

23. Why?

[DrToast]

19. Yang seems like he was bored and wanted something to do for a year.

[Jirel]

55. Ouch!

But you’re not wrong.

[IcyPeas]

25. nice praise by Biden for Beto

re: how he handled El Paso aftermath

[McCamy Taylor]

29. I think Beto is transitioning from candidate to civil rights icon.

[ecstatic]

56. He's killing it on guns and civil rights! Love it! nt

[IcyPeas]

68. I like his anger and passion

(I wouldn't say he's "killing" it.......) if you get my drift.

[JI7]

52. if Biden is the nominee, Beto would be too him what Biden was for Obama

[Thekaspervote]

178. Have to agree!!

[MustLoveBeagles]

95. That was a great moment

[peggysue2]

121. Really liked that Biden gave Beto a

. And Beto is having the sort of debate people were hoping for in the 1st and 2nd round. He's bold, passionate and won't step down from the subject of gun control. Good one on him!

[Cha]

136. Thank you for that, IcyPeas.. and Biden!

[nolabear]

26. Where's Warren? It's a bit odd isn't it?

[tblue37]

107. Yes, I posted about her being excluded, too--and soon after she was allowed to speak. nt

[McCamy Taylor]

27. So glad they are focusing on violence.

No American should have to weigh the risks of going to shop for groceries.

[emmaverybo]

28. Love Biden giving kudos to Beto and Beto's kinda shy and sweet response.

[MustLoveBeagles]

100. I loved that

[dweller]

30. i'm sensing

a Joe/Beto ticket

jus sayin

✌🏼

[BlueMississippi]

59. +1

[bdamomma]

102. Joe

and Warren??? They are all good. Better than the POS we have now.

[dweller]

167. that works for me too

but we need also a strong Senate leader, when
we take it back 🤔

✌🏼

[Sugarcoated]

31. Nice, Joe!!!

Kick the gun extremists greedy asses!

[MustLoveBeagles]

101. Well said

[bdamomma]

36. They need to

get McConnell out, he's just no good. All these are great ideas but they need to vote out McConnell.

[McCamy Taylor]

37. This is where Harris can shine---keeping us safe!

[nolabear]

38. Kamala does well with personal stories.

[ecstatic]

39. KH giving great response on executive order

to ban assault weapons. Good delivery. I think she's being herself right now and that's all she needs to do!

[elleng]

44. WUNNERFUL!

[bullwinkle428]

42. BOOM! K. Harris : "Trump has certainly been Tweeting out the ammunition!"

[IcyPeas]

45. Beto is righteous!

[ecstatic]

46. Go Beto! "I am" (proposing taking back assault weapons)

Straight to the point. No bullshit. It's beyond time for common sense in America!

[bdamomma]

49. Beto

is kicking ass.

[McCamy Taylor]

51. Beto is on fire! Forget the presidency, dude! March for us instead!

Speak for us instead!

[tblue37]

53. Yeah, Beto!!! nt

[tblue37]

64. Warren isn't getting to speak, even when she signals she wants to. nt

[Sugarcoated]

54. Beto!!!!

I'm loving his passion, especially on the gun issue!

[aikoaiko]

57. Sorry Beto. I'm not with your mandatory gun buy back

Your definition of what constitutes a weapon of war would include almost every major gun design.

[elleng]

62. Forget the quibbles,

such details are negotiable.

[aikoaiko]

98. Taking guns away from law abiding people is not really negotiatble to me.

Its an even more extreme reaction than the one we had to machine guns used in crime.

We never told anyone to turn in their machines guns. They only had to register them.

[elleng]

126. 'Sorry,' turn them in and get paid for them.

[aikoaiko]

134. It won't become law and but the stance will help Republicans keep their seats.

[jcgoldie]

154. right! play politics on gun control

More people get killed but maybe somebody with a bunch of guns won't vote republican. Yeah right.

[aikoaiko]

161. Remember, Bill Clinton attributed the 1994 Rep takeover to the NRA's pushback on the AWB.

Remember Newt.

[TwilightZone]

131. You're OK with citizens owning machine guns?

If you're saying that you think regulating machine guns was an "extreme" mistake, you're not going to get a lot of agreement with that stance here.

Or anywhere, for that matter. I doubt much of the public agrees with you.

[aikoaiko]

145. Do a little research and find out how many legally own machine guns have been used in homicides

since the NFA.

My point is that we didn't have to confiscate or do forced buybacks to almost eliminate homicides with legally owned machine guns.

[TwilightZone]

151. So, the answer is "yes".

Thanks for the clarification.

[elleng]

146. Thanks

[jcgoldie]

133. They are weapons of war designed only to kill people

Beto said it well. Fuck your AR 15.

[BlueMississippi]

65. hmmmmmm .. that is NRA's position nt

[aikoaiko]

74. It is my position.

Revolvers, pump actions, Colt 1911s, bolt actions, heck even flintlocks muskets were designed to increase efficiency on the battlefield.

[hlthe2b]

78. Yes and their tactic is to engage in semantic arguments ad nauseum. We've banned ARs before

and even if the definitions need to be both updated and better delineated, this is doable.

[aikoaiko]

83. And that ban didn't work.

https://www.factcheck.org/2013/02/did-the-1994-assault-weapons-ban-work/

[hlthe2b]

88. Bullshit

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/04/opinion/assault-weapon-ban.html
That Assault Weapon Ban? It Really Did Work

Since the ban was lifted in 2004, gun massacres involving military-style weapons are way up.

[aikoaiko]

150. Yes, the ban made them very popular.

[hlthe2b]

162. Nonsensical response

[aikoaiko]

165. Its hard to prove, but yes, I think the ban contributed to rising interest in AR15s and

and other forbidden guns in certain configurations. The forbidden fruit effect is a real thing.

[Thekaspervote]

179. You are correct, the number of deaths related to gun violence went down during the AR15 ban

[McCamy Taylor]

70. This is a principled stance, not a political stance.

[aikoaiko]

125. I'm not sure what his principle is in this case.

[TwilightZone]

138. Taking a stand, for one.

Not relying on semantic arguments to support his position, for another.

[aikoaiko]

149. As if "weapons of war" is not a semantic argument.

[TwilightZone]

153. Summarily dismissing a plan for which you have zero details...

and continually changing the subject isn't going to win over any converts.

[Devil Child]

89. Either am I n/t

[bdamomma]

60. Amy

said his name McConnell.

[emmaverybo]

82. So glad she brought this up.

[hlthe2b]

63. Just taking note: I think the moderators are doing a very good job in this one

[Jirel]

72. You mean asking real questions?

Not softballs or attack jobs? Yes, way better in control.

[elleng]

79. Yes

[ecstatic]

73. I was just thinking this. Perhaps the DNC should agree to ONLY ABC moderated debates going forward?

Until the other networks grow up?

[nolabear]

75. The whole thing is better. It feels like a serious race with serious candidates.

With two notable exceptions.

[elleng]

76. Yes

[McCamy Taylor]

81. Agree! The Mouse is a Democrat.

Don't forget, ABC broke the Foley scandal in 2006 which was the final nail in the GOP Congressional coffin. And they deliberately flubbed "The Path to 9/11" that was supposed to be the GOP's dirty election trick.

[cannabis_flower]

90. Except..

Elizabeth Warren isn't getting much chance to speak!

[gristy]

91. agreed

Very good. And I usually can't listen to any politician. Let alone 10 of them at the same time.

[emmaverybo]

67. What happened to Warren? She needs in on the conversation. Oh, Booker just has to go

critical and all Spartacus. Only he can do it,

[Sancho]

71. Finally...a license to possess a gun!!

[stuffmatters]

80. Outf'ingrageous.Eliz Warren has been completely ignored since Stephanopolous' questions

[McCamy Taylor]

84. Agree.

[Blaukraut]

85. She's being iced out. Wonder if it's by design.

[emmaverybo]

87. Partly her own fault cause she gets so plan preoccupied. Needs to deal with issues not just detailed

Economic polices.

[ihaveaquestion]

172. Agreed...but...

She has to dump the phrase "Let me be clear". It's tired and somewhat condescending. Replace with something like 'I think I've been clear, but if not...' or simply 'I think...'

[nolabear]

92. Each candidate's time so far:

Link to tweet

[nolabear]

96. Sorry about the buried Yang message. But stats are good.

[Thekaspervote]

180. If EW time is 16.8 minutes of speaking then she's getting her chance

[Celerity]

93. Beto 'Hell yes we are going to take your AR-15' Anyone thinking risk-adverse Biden is picking

him as a VP maybe might have to reconsider.


As much as I would LOVE to see the 2nd Amendment repealed, it is not going to be, and the Rethugs will go WILD running that soundbite 24-7, as it will be twisted into verbal/visual evidence of their small-cocked paranoid fantasies.

The gunners and gun-humpers will be whipped into a frothy rage. Many of those are the lunch-bucket and rural crowd in the Midwest that Biden is banking his campaign on winning back.

[McCamy Taylor]

99. Principles over politics.

I love Beto. He is too good to be a presidential candidate.

[Celerity]

103. Oh, I agree personally, but when is comes to actually gaming out the real election, my cynicism

goes through the roof when speaking of US politics.

[pangaia]

158. "I love Beto. He is too good to be a presidential candidate."

THIS is a very perceptive observation.

Somewhere, years ago, I read something that, to paraphrase-- "Anyone with all the qualities to be a president, or any type of leader of a country, also has those qualities that would make him/her too wise and too good a person to ever want to do it."


There is a lot of truth in that, not always, but a great percentage of the time....

[cwydro]

163. Yup.

This.

[BeyondGeography]

94. Bernie needs some water

[MustLoveBeagles]

106. He sounds very hoarse

[tblue37]

152. So do Biden and Warren, though not quite as hoarse.. nt

[bdamomma]

112. or lozenges

nt

[nolabear]

105. That calling for regrets is foolish. Joe is handling it well.

That was a ridiculous question. He could have asked real substance.

[ecstatic]

108. OK, WTF is Jorge's angle here? What is his goal?

To get people to vote for trump because Pres Obama did his job with regard to deporting?

[Raven123]

123. I believe he asking why immigrants should believe Dems now.

My recollection is fuzzy, but Jorge recalls Obama promising immigration reform and then failing to offer a proposal once elected.

[ecstatic]

109. Castro has really lost me tonight. I'm angry too,

but he's directing his anger at the wrong people.

[emmaverybo]

117. I can only think this was a planned strategy, to take on the front runner. Not a good one as I see

it.

[IcyPeas]

119. it's like he's trying to get Biden in a "gotcha" moment

[Gidney N Cloyd]

124. Same here. I don't know what his plan is but he's just looking desperate for attention.

[Raven123]

127. Same here.

[emmaverybo]

110. This is wrong. Barack Obama drew up a comprehensive Immigration Reform Act. He did not betray

a promise. That was the Senate.

[Raven123]

132. Did Joe mention that?

[bdamomma]

137. Exactly

Congress needs a good cleaning out.

[Cha]

144. Who said he did, emmaverybo? The

moderator?

[emmaverybo]

174. Yeah. Forget how he put it exactly. Something about Obama promising immigration reform and then

not doing it,

[Cha]

175. Thanks.. they get so much Wrong.

[nolabear]

111. Damn, Castro. Being a dick again.

This is weird.

[CousinIT]

115. He is being a dick. He's OFF my list.

Fuck that. That's 2x in less than 20 minutes. NO MORE.

[hlthe2b]

116. He is self-destructing and can't see it.

[tarheelsunc]

122. Guess he doesn't want to be VP. His loss. eom

[Cha]

148. What's he doing? the "jeering" wasn't enough

for him?

Link to tweet

Mahalo, Nola

[ihaveaquestion]

171. I like his directness. No BS.

[madaboutharry]

113. Castro not recalibrating.

He still seems to want to ridicule Biden.

[Jirel]

129. Unfortunately, I think his scripted play tonight was to chip Biden.

I think these were planned points, practiced with his advisors. He is in the basement and needs to break out now, or never. But deciding to scrag Joe Biden in a vain hope that it’ll raise him in the polls and lower Biden...
Bad plan.

[Raven123]

139. Sure seems that way. A bizarre and self-defeating strategy

[pangaia]

164. Really childish and embarrassing....

Like a recording stuck on playback...

[debsy]

114. What is with the (lack of) enforced time on this "debate"?

I tuned in at around 10 of 9 and have seen Joe Biden speak for most of it.

[tarheelsunc]

118. That has to be the quickest 45 seconds I have ever encountered. eom

[FreeState]

120. I wish they would ask all the candidates questions n/t

[emmaverybo]

128. Agree heartily.

[FreeState]

130. I've arched for over half an hour

It’s getting ridiculous.

[underpants]

135. We don't deserve Mayor Pete

He knocks it out of the park all the time but....it's not his time. Soon hopefully.

[madaboutharry]

141. I admire him so much.

He is smart and brave and maybe you are right. He may be too good for us.

[IcyPeas]

147. I have high hopes for him too

how nice would it be to have someone so intelligent in the white house?

[underpants]

157. In a bit of a box.

Dem governor and Rob Johnson isn't up for re-election until 2022.

[Thekaspervote]

181. Indeed!! He's ahead of his time..has a very bright future. Should run for Congress then senate

[MustLoveBeagles]

140. I've started another debate thread for anyone interested

https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287275109

[bdamomma]

143. thanks!!!

[IcyPeas]

155. thanks Beagle

[Jirel]

142. Running tally of speaking time - link

https://www.cnn.com/2019/09/12/politics/third-dem-debate-btn/index.html

[AnnieBW]

156. What the heck was with that "Socialism" commercial?

That was nasty and uncalled for. What happened in Cambodia was NOT socialism - it was a dictatorship.

[Crowman]

159. Wagering on the nomination.

For those who actually put up money on the race, Warren has been rising last few weeks.

https://www.predictit.org/markets/detail/3633/Who-will-win-the-2020-Democratic-presidential-nomination

[Takket]

160. Pete: I'd like to see HIM make a deal with Xi!

SLAM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[dweller]

166. pull back the curtain

and it's a really small dude ...
👍🏻

[SunSeeker]

168. Biden is doing well tonight. So is Pete. nt

[ihaveaquestion]

170. Except for his last response... pure word salad.

[SunSeeker]

173. Everyone is looking tired at this point. nt

[jalan48]

169. I think Kamala's comparing Trump to the Wizard behind the curtain in the W of Oz was brilliant.

It shows Trump to be the fake that he is.

[IcyPeas]

176. thank you for starting this thread bdamomma