Democratic Primaries
Related: About this forumThe Bernie Supporters Who Say They'll Never Vote for Elizabeth Warren
Source: Newsweek
BY SHANE CROUCHER ON 10/11/19 AT 11:53 AM EDT
Massachusetts Senator Elizabeth Warren has the momentum in the Democratic Party's 2020 race with polls suggesting that she is now pulling ahead of former vice president Joe Biden, the longtime frontrunner in a contest that is still months away from its conclusion in July next year.
The data shows she is drawing in a big chunk of support from both moderate and liberal Democratic primary voters. Warren is the most popular second choice among not only Biden's supporters but also those backing independent Vermont Senator Bernie Sanders, a democratic socialist.
Yet there is a group of Sanders supporters active on social media who say, as they did in 2016 when he ran against Hillary Clinton, that it is "Bernie or bust." Warren may appeal to many Sanders supporters. But some of them say they will never vote for herin either the primaries or 2020.
Victor Tiffany, an activist from New York, describes himself as the godfather of the #BernieorBust campaign, which started back in 2015. He even co-authored a book on it: Bernie or Bust: Pioneers of Electoral Revolt. And he has plenty of reasons for never voting Warren even in a two-horse race with Trump.
"Take your pick: She's 'a capitalist to her bones,' consulting with Hillary Clinton, a warmonger who's been voting for Trump's defense budgets, not especially honest, not progressive but a 'fauxgressive' Obamawannabe, and more," Tiffany tells Newsweek.
-snip-
Read more: https://www.newsweek.com/elizabeth-warren-bernie-sanders-2020-trump-election-polls-1464669
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Hav
(5,969 posts)He just managed to bash Dems, is critical of Trump's policies and would still not cast a vote to beat Trump. These guys aren't very smart, it seems.
But he isnt't alone. You often see these clowns on Twitter messages either from or about Warren. I bet they are the same who said Hillary was just not the right woman.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Funtatlaguy
(10,879 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
BlueMTexpat
(15,369 posts)have not been, are not now and never will be Democrats.
They showed that in 2016.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Celerity
(43,415 posts)up a far greater one than they did of his 2016 supporters.
Of his NON DU supporters:
They are far more radical, far less Democratic Party-friendly this time around. They have turned hard on Warren and now even Gabbard.
Many of them actually ARE true socialists (and if you know anything about me, I am one girl who constantly battles (see https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287299679#post30 ) Sanderites when they falsely claim Bernie is a democratic socialist, as he is simply a bog standard social democratic, which is a BIG difference from a true socialist) for whom even Bernie is a semi-hold-your-nose vote. See Jacobin Magazine (overall they are real socialists or damn close) for that debate. A Jacobin writer (Meagan Day) is who kicked off the whole Warren smear about her teaching job, which was the picked up by the RW and ran with. see https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287303161#post18 and https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287303161#post34
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
BlueMTexpat
(15,369 posts)the "smear" worked out for Elizabeth in the way that Meagan hoped it would.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
thesquanderer
(11,990 posts)...is part of what gives him good potential in a general election (and explains why so many 2016 polls showed he was stronger than Hillary in a head-to-head against Trump). But it also means that you can't count on every Bernie supporters to vote for whoever the Dem is, because some of them just aren't Dems to begin with.
People bemoan open primaries, because it allows "outsiders" to influence our candidate selection, but OTOH, without healthy support from "outsiders," it's hard to win the general, and so we actually want a candidate who has strong outside-the-base appeal, who won't necessarily vote for the dem no matter what. It's a predicament.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
rampartc
(5,412 posts)in fact ms warren is my second choice. i'm a long time fan of hers.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,122 posts)if she's our nominee!!
Bernie/Elizabeth or Elizabeth/Bernie 2020!!
Either way, they're stronger together!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
myohmy2
(3,163 posts)...Elizabeth is next in line for the Progressive mantle...
...any Bernie supporter not voting for the Dem candidate, if not Bernie, is cutting their nose off to spite their face...
...four more years of trump ain't worth any principle I know...
...sinful...
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
NCLefty
(3,678 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
corbettkroehler
(1,898 posts)You know the old saying, Democrats fall in love and Republicans fall in line.
Rational thinking would prevail over most if Sanders didn't capture the nomination. Fortunately for us Berners, we know that he will.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
betsuni
(25,538 posts)Idiots. Hillary and Bernie voted the same 93% of the time. Warren is more progressive than Sanders as far as votes go. Idiots.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
B Stieg
(2,410 posts)This isn't some high school Election, now is it?
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
True Blue American
(17,986 posts)I am really tired of these top posts pretending they are speaking for someone else when it is, in reality bashing other Democrats.
I have my favorites but if Lassie won the Primary as a Democrat I would vote for het. She was smart.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
pertello
(55 posts)But I will vote BLUE no matter who!
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Celerity
(43,415 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
True Blue American
(17,986 posts)[ we are sick of Rhondas whining!
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Mister Ed
(5,940 posts)I hope and pray they are few.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Celerity
(43,415 posts)million primary voter defections (defection meaning they either will not vote for POTUS at all, or they will vote Green or other small party, or will go full asshole and vote Rump) in 2020 versus his 3.2 to 3.4 million or so defections in 2016. He had a defection rate of around 23-24% in 2016. Clinton had an even higher rate (around 30%, after pulling out the Operation Chaos fake Dem voters, who were actually much smaller in number than many think) in 2008.
Still too many variables outstanding for me to be even remotely sure what will happen in 2020. The Greens will have a weaker candidate this time around so that helps. as does the much lower totals of Sanders primary voters this time versus 2016, and finally, of course, Trump is know a FULLY known monster.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Response to Celerity (Reply #14)
NYMinute This message was self-deleted by its author.
janterry
(4,429 posts)but that's just a few folks around my part of the country
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Response to Eugene (Original post)
Skittles This message was self-deleted by its author.
INdemo
(6,994 posts)I think so
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
TidalWave46
(2,061 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
TomCADem
(17,390 posts)I think so
I disagree and do not think that Bernie is a Russian troll as you suggest. There is no evidence of that. Rather, the evidence has been that Russians helped Bernie's campaign by promoting Bernie and attacking Hillary Clinton.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2018/02/17/indictment-russians-also-tried-help-bernie-sanders-jill-stein-presidential-campaigns/348051002/
WASHINGTON It turns out Donald Trump wasnt the only candidate the Russians allegedly tried to help during the 2016 presidential campaign.
A 37-page indictment resulting from special counsel Robert Muellers investigation shows that Russian nationals and businesses also worked to boost the campaigns of Vermont Sen. Bernie Sanders and Green party nominee Jill Stein in an effort to damage Democrat Hillary Clinton.
The Russians engaged in operations primarily intended to communicate derogatory information about Hillary Clinton, to denigrate other candidates such as Ted Cruz and Marco Rubio, and to support Bernie Sanders and then-candidate Donald Trump, according to the indictment, which was issued Friday.
The document, which spells out in detail how the Russians worked to support Trumps campaign, alleges that on or about Feb. 10, 2016, the Russians internally circulated an outline of themes for future content to be posted on social media accounts.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
WePurrsevere
(24,259 posts)voted for Stein and helped put Trump in position.
There are extremists on the left and on the right (and I suspect Putin messes with both just for "shits and giggles" . The ones in the article are similar to their right Cult45 'cousins' in that they're the same childish types who tend to vote for an extremist loon or flim flam type or stay home because they didn't get their 'pony' fast enough. The only thing we can do about these toddlers in grown-up skin is hope like heck that they have an epiphany that makes them wake up and grow up before they help re-elect Trump.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
ritapria
(1,812 posts)In fact they overwhelmingly supported HRC (79%) in 2016 General Election .In 2008 24% of Hillary supporters voted for John McCain in the General . From Gallup :"If McCain v. Obama, 28 % of Clinton Backers go for McCain '
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
PAMod
(906 posts)In fact, it's appalling.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
ArcticFox
(1,249 posts)I mean, Trump supporters aren't all about racism and misogyny. Some are just tired of status quo politicians. Trump pretends to be against the status quo; Sanders genuinely is.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
CentralMass
(15,265 posts)election and determjned that only 76%: of Hillary voters voted for Senstor Obama in the general.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,122 posts)Bernie/Elizabeth or Elizabeth/Bernie 2020!!
Either way, they're stronger together!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
dsc
(52,162 posts)he means she doesn't have a penis.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
efhmc
(14,731 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Squinch
(50,955 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Sherman A1
(38,958 posts)More manufactured drama to fill bandwidth, airtime and column inches.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
DrFunkenstein
(8,745 posts)To stay home. I seriously doubt any of these fools are under such illusions this time around. Anti-Trump turnout is going to be massive, no matter who we nominate.
This is cheap, anecdotal faux-nalism.
Newsweek.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Response to Eugene (Original post)
elocs This message was self-deleted by its author.
BlueMississippi
(776 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)They're hopeless. Better to spend the time and effort gaining new voters and first time voters and reasonable/thoughtful/mature voters who will support our party's nominee.
Why waste one's time trying to validate and console and flatter a handful of butthurt BS supporters who feel the need to "punish" Democrats? Honestly, the same (or less) effort to GOTV would easily result in tenfold that number of disgruntled malcontents.
There will always be stupid and selfish and self-righteous people. You can't "save" them all. The wisest and smartest choice is to overwhelm them with the votes of rational people who care more about their country than they do about their personal pride or their hurt feelings.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
gab13by13
(21,360 posts)I have seen zero Bernie supporters who have said they won't vote for Warren.
Newsweek leans pretty far right.
I'd be happy with Warren or Bernie.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
oldsoftie
(12,555 posts)trump thinks Fox has gone liberal. Go figure.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
ArcticFox
(1,249 posts)Is it any surprise, given that they all rely on support of big money interests? In fact, the center has been sliding rightward for decades.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
TwilightZone
(25,471 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
oldsoftie
(12,555 posts)I see people pushing "OAN" because Fox is "so liberal these days" & "Murdochs boys are Libs"
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
TwilightZone
(25,471 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
lark
(23,105 posts)I have to keep reminding myself that they are not representative of the true Bernie supporters who would definitely vote for Warren over drumpf..
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Idiots.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
BluNoMatterHu
(31 posts)Who the nominee is. Any one of our choices is a million times better than anyone on their side and I will be proud to pull the lever for any of our wonderful candidates! I am so sick of these butt hurt people who cry and whine when they dont get their way. (Ironically, just like trumpers and one of the numerous reasons we lost in 2016.) Heres the rule: Fall in love during the primaries. Fall in line during the general election. Get over yourself and understand this is bigger than any one person.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Thekaspervote
(32,778 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
mcar
(42,334 posts)They don't care about this country. They are spoiled little children who are going to take their ball and go home if they don't get their way.
Fortunately, there aren't as many of them (IMO) as there were in the 2016 GE.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
brooklynite
(94,598 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
kacekwl
(7,017 posts)I suspect if any it may be a dozen knuckleheads with this view. Stop dividing us at another candidates expense.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Thekaspervote
(32,778 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
RobertDevereaux
(1,857 posts)I have this peculiar fondness for the survival and flourishing of the human race on this planet!
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
efhmc
(14,731 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Response to Eugene (Original post)
Post removed
emulatorloo
(44,131 posts)Everyone on DU will vote Democratic in the GE
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Me.
(35,454 posts)Where are you getting that idea, people here will vote for the nominee.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
DaDeacon
(984 posts)This is just bullshit! Sanders is a good candidate but not the only candidate. Against the GOp we need to vote for whoever isn't (R) !
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Thekaspervote
(32,778 posts)Not saying these voters wont vote blue!
Heres an explanation
Sanders and Warren voters have little in common.
More at the link
https://www.politico.com/story/2019/07/12/sanders-warren-voters-2020-1408548
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
TidalWave46
(2,061 posts)Republican enablers.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Me.
(35,454 posts)Tha save our country. And the Senator needs to address this if they are truly 'his people'.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
ArcticFox
(1,249 posts)I wish all this "Bernie supporters aren't real Democrats" thing would just end. I mean, who cares if some think he's the only one that "gets it"? Surely every candidate has some fanatic "my way or the highway" supporters.
Does anyone else think it's probably just a bunch of Republican bots ginning up animosity between the democratic factions?
What if, instead, we start celebrating all the various and good ideas put out there by Democrats. And talking about real issues that matter (not like whether Warren was really fired for being pregnant, e.g.). One thing I've generally loved about Democrats is their willingness to consider others' ideas.
Divisive talk attempts to squelch the ideas Sanders stands for. They are overall very good ideas. It will hurt us all if we're make people feel excluded for having them. And it's not done just to Sanders, either. It's any time somebody proposes a change to the status quo.
Let's not turn into a lockstep party. That's the Republicans.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Champion Jack
(5,378 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
oldsoftie
(12,555 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
peggysue2
(10,832 posts)This should put a lid on the people who say this backlash from the Far Left never happened in 2016. Look at the language Victor Tiffany uses to describe Hillary Clinton, language which they're now transferring to Elizabeth Warren. The very fact that Warren has described herself as a capitalist is viewed as a crime. An Obamawannabe?
Here it comes, again.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Response to Eugene (Original post)
Name removed Message auto-removed
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)As a policy of THEIR government. Same in 2016 and they recognize and regret no wrongdoing. This is continuation of extremism, what destroys nations when good people dont keep them in check, as we did for 70 years.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Amimnoch
(4,558 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Gothmog
(145,321 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
helpisontheway
(5,008 posts)like a fool at the convention.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
corbettkroehler
(1,898 posts)The potential mess which a blockade on other candidates would yield been borne out for the whole world to see in Herr Drumpf. I voted for Hillary in the 2016 general and haven't regretted that decision for a second. Anyone who asked me about Stein at the time received the same answer, "The primary is over. Hillary remains a fine choice."
In 2020, I will vote for our nominee. Should that turn out to be Senator Warren, my conviction would not waver in the slightest.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Maru Kitteh
(28,341 posts)really economic anxiety, or whatever bullshit.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden