Let's remember the Warren-Sanders brouhaha started with a Sanders campaign script

[highplainsdem]

that Warren and her supporters found objectionable.

With all the noise about what was said in 2018, the open mic confrontation, etc., there seems to be a tendency to bury that important fact about how this rift started..

Warren did not start this.

And because of that, I've been repelled by all the Sanders supporters denouncing her as a "snake." Never thought I'd see that kind of thing from people claiming to be progressives who also claim to want unity among progressives.

Worse than the damage this is doing to the left wing of the Democratic Party, though, is the potential damage to ANY Democrat.

It does NOT look good for the Democratic Party to have two 70something top candidates for president at odds like this.

It looks worse when some of their supporters are doing their best to turn social media into the equivalent of a food fight in a monkey house...except they're not throwing food.

I'm hoping that the Warren and Sanders campaigns can come out with a joint statement -- with Warren and Sanders together on video to make the statement -- with perhaps both of them admitting mistakes have been made and memories aren't perfect (there's absolutely no way to guarantee either of them has a perfect memory of what was said and the context), but they share a common cause and common ideals.

More than that, they need to put a lid on their noisiest, most offensive supporters.

I think this is particularly important for the Sanders campaign.

I honestly don't recall any primary where supporters of one candidate were doing their best to label a rival candidate a "snake."

And the reason this is a problem for Sanders is that if somehow he wins the nomination, he'll have to put together a team, and unless he chooses that team from only long-time die-hard loyalists (some of whom supported Jill Stein), he's going to need the assistance of a lot of high-profile Democrats.

Many of whom will not want to let themselves in for being savaged by Sanders supporters over any disagreement with Sanders.

This has been social-media bullying at its most despicable, and it has to stop.

I hope Warren and Sanders, working together, will be able to stop it.

For all our sakes. Especially the party's, and the country's.

[Gothmog]

1. You are correct

[highplainsdem]

19. Thanks, Gothmog!

[PatSeg]

2. This could be fixable

but I'm afraid that window to fix it is pretty small. I'm not sure Bernie can or will make things better. I'm still exhausted from our last primary and this is feeling worse.

[BannonsLiver]

5. It's going to be fixed with the primaries

And Bernie’s defeat.

[PatSeg]

16. I just hope there isn't too much

damage to the party in the process. I know people who are still bitter about the last primary.

[question everything]

27. Indeed.

And finally expose Sanders for what he is: a self centered individual who, while all his talk about the "oppressed working class," or whatever, cares only about himself.

And if this brings an end to the far left wing of the Democratic party, so be it. Sanders is not even a Democrat, we have to remember. But if AOC et al are going to take control of the party, we are doomed, anyway.

Remember: we took control of the House with moderates!

[PatSeg]

58. I don't know if Sanders has always been that way

but he certainly is looking self centered right now. I wonder if the overwhelming support and huge rallies from 2016 may have changed him. I think it would affect most people and not always in a positive way.

[R B Garr]

60. Exactly! Well said.

[highplainsdem]

23. I hope so. I don't want to think how nasty this might get if it isn't fixed soon.

[PatSeg]

28. Yes and everyone ends up damaged

When one is attacked, it is hard to not be reactive, but the candidate(s) who tries to stay above the fray, often lasts the longest. Our election seasons are ridiculously long and the nastier it gets, the more voters get turned off.

And here we have two candidates who tend to agree on policy most of the time, so that makes these attacks personal and often petty. Living with Trump in the White House is exhausting enough, we don't think this kind crap within our own party.

[yardwork]

54. This whole thing is characteristic of Bernie Sanders' campaign.

He hired people who voted for Jill Stein in 2016 to run his campaign. This is intentional.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

3. I think the candidates themselves can put the incident behind them and try to move on,

although the post-debate conversation likely created more hard feelings (and maybe a reminder to watch out for hot mics). The problem will be with supporters, especially Bernie's, many of whom tend to be too rabid to recognize that throwing shit on social media doesn't always benefit their candidate.

[highplainsdem]

24. I agree.

[mopinko]

4. the trolls are trolling again. bernie can lead, or get the hell out of the way.

if he doesnt stand up and denounce that shit, i just cant even.

[oasis]

6. Hopefully Joe Biden won't make any comment on the dust up, whatsoever.

That is my only concern.

[highplainsdem]

7. Agree. Especially since I've already seen a number of paranoid Sanders supporters on Twitter claim

that Warren must have "cut a deal" with Biden to hurt Sanders, with CNN in on this imaginary conspiracy.

[oasis]

15. It figures they'd try to drag Joe into this after their guy dropped the ball.

I'm confident the Biden campaign will know how to handle any implications coming from the Bernie camp.

We'll see how this plays out with only a few weeks before the Iowa caucuses.

[PatSeg]

31. I think Biden and his campaign

will handle this well. He seems to have some really outstanding advisers and staff. I picture him saving his ammo for Trump in a general. Biden can be an effective attack dog (just ask Paul Ryan), but years of experience have taught him to save it for when it counts.

[oasis]

34. Yup. Joe is solid in such matters. nt

[BeyondGeography]

20. Laughable

Insanity rules in many of those precincts.

Thanks for a most excellent OP, btw.

[question everything]

30. Let them. We know they did not vote for Hillary in 2016

some voted for Trump. I don't know if they will vote for this year nominee or stay home, again.

[oasis]

36. They're a drag on the Party and can stay their asses home for all

I care. We'll win without them. The earlier we cut them loose, the better.

[Blue_true]

37. We need to have POC more activated this time and it looks like that

is happening. If we get that, we don't need the Bernie or bust people to win the presidency and Congress. I wish that I could say that we should ignore the BOB people after, but they claim to have the same values as us, so as a consequence, we cannot ignore them.

[Prosper]

12. Agreed. But the only problem with Joe is that he is never mean or vindictive.

He may make a comment trying to help that is spun by MSM to get a headline.

[oasis]

17. Joe may be tempted to comment, but his campaign has likely

cautioned him against doing so.

[Blue_true]

39. I hope so. All I would say if I were him is that he likes both people. nt

[oasis]

45. Or, "no comment". Joe can come out of this smelling like a rose. nt

[Blue_true]

48. I don't want to see Joe take advantage of the situation.

Warren is the victim in this and she has a right to be pissed off. That is why, even though I am leaning hard toward Joe now, I will continue to contribute to Warren. I believe in fairness and justice, what the Sanders campaign has done and what his supporters are doing just sits completely wrong with me.

[oasis]

57. E.W. was wronged, but refused to take it on the chin and move on.

I give her a ton of credit and respect for standing up for herself. I believe her display of tenacity will bring her out of this in a stronger position.

However, IMO, Joe will automatically benefit from this controversy by remaining neutral.

[Pachamama]

14. This fight is between two long time friends/colleagues - Warren and Sanders

How it gets resolved will be between the two of them. From my perspective, Sanders has handled this really badly and could have nipped it in the bud by apologizing and stopping his campaign and surrogates from attacking Warren. But he didn't. He doubled down and yes, on live TV basically called Warren a liar and she point blank called him out for that. If I had a "friend" who did that to me, I would have reacted exactly (maybe even not so classy) as Warren did and I certainly wouldn't shake hands or hug a friend who had just done that to me.

Whether its Biden or anyone else running for POTUS - this isn't their fight and they should stay out of it completely other than sticking to saying that its nonsense that a woman can't win and that one already did and had 3 Million more votes against Trump.

Sanders has shown us who he really is and its not very positive and people are starting to see that clearly. We will see just how supportive he is of the Democratic Party and the eventual nominee, which will not be Sanders.

[oasis]

18. It's on Bernie to fix this by making a public apology. A sincere one.nt

[treestar]

52. the media is concentrating on this

I didn't see the debate and the next day thought I'd look and see what Biden did or said wrong, and there was nothing about Biden, but just this Bernie/Elizabeth story! Kind of a relief.

[Kahuna7]

8. Yep. nt

[Nitram]

9. Correct.

[Happy Hoosier]

10. The main problem for Sanders, is Sanders himself.

He staffed up his campaign with people who have promoted incredibly divisive bullshit. It cannot be surprising to him when they act in accordance with the way they have before. I am left to conclude he either supports such behavior, or he doesn't really care, since he has not acted against the likes of Turner or Sirota.

SOMEBODY in his campaign is promoting this kind of stuff, and unless he is proactive about stamping it out, it's on him.

[The Valley Below]

22. +1,000,000

So long as Sirota, Turner, and Joy Gray remain on the campaign, a problem remains unresolved.

One must assume their actions are approved by the candidate himself.

[PatSeg]

32. Or possibly worse,

Sanders cannot control people who work for him. What kind of White House would he run?

[The Valley Below]

35. Saying "I was a little busy at the time" would be an inadequate excuse in that situation.

[PatSeg]

49. Yep

Being president is about a lot more than great ideas and policies. It is such an unique position, no other job comes close to it. While in the White House, a president's policies and ideas may change according to public sentiment, what kind of congress he/she is working with, world events, etc., but judgment and decision making are vitally important. Candidates can give us a glimpse of how they will handle big decisions by how they manage their campaigns.

[LisaM]

50. That's the whole thing about him! He chose bad advisors in 2016

(Jeffrey Sachs, for example), he's choosing bad advisors now, and it doesn't seem to bother a lot of people. But - since in reality, most Democrats align on most positions - it's the most disqualifying thing about him, IMHO. He lacks judgement.

[PatSeg]

53. Exactly

The variations in policy are really quite minor, so in the end, it is the person who voters will pick. Poor judgment in a president could be a national, as well as global nightmare, as we can see right now with Trump in the White House.

[Amimnoch]

29. hell yes. exactly. This. +100000 -nt

[R B Garr]

61. Amen!

[Pachamama]

11. I haven't forgotten and I hope lots of voters will remember this as the accusations against Warren..

....go into overdrive against her from Sanders campaign and his supporters and surrogates.

I think Warren has class and cares about the Democratic Party and she handled this correctly. She could have ripped into Sanders and she didn't. Sanders started this mess and now acts all surprised when he is called out.

Warren became my 2nd choice after this. Sanders just confirmed for me who he really is and that is not material for POTUS.

[PatSeg]

51. I think she came across

as very sincere and authentic. Maybe they both remembered what was said differently, but I think she handled herself better.

[abqtommy]

13. It's 2016 deja vu all over again...

[Act_of_Reparation]

21. Never get enamored with a politician.

I don't give a shit who it is. Bernie. Biden. Warren. Doesn't matter. They will only let you down.

We should approach politicians for what they are: tools to get us from where we are now to where we want to be. They'll get our votes, but they shouldn't get our undying admiration until they've done something to deserve it.

[SaschaHM]

25. Sander's campaign surrogates and staffers have been hitting Warren for months.

The script was the first thing that made the Warren campaign respond, but the Sanders campaign have been drawing blood ever since it looked like Warren would be a threat.

I'm all for unity, but we do this "call for unity" bullsh*t all the time when women and PoC start to fight back.

[Blue_true]

42. ++++++++++ bingo, you nailed it. nt

[yardwork]

56. Exactly! The call for unity is a message to women and minorities to "be nice."

Warren is fighting back and I'm glad.

[WorkDoctor]

26. Remember the Howard Dean "scream"

that fixated the media. Looks like CNN has it out for the two progressives. Watch out for the fixation while ignoring all else important about these two progressives.

EW handled the fight-provoking question from CNN Philip at debate with class.

Don't let history repeat itself.

[Blue_true]

44. The problem is not CNN. The problem is one campaign that makes a habit of attacking,

then denying that anything happened.

[totodeinhere]

46. I know. That's why I get a good laugh when some people call CNN a liberal network.

I can only keep it on for a few minutes but them they bring on a Trump stooge to start telling lies and I have to turn it off.

[Blue_true]

33. Sorry. I am not interested in kumbaya moments.

Bernie Sanders' campaign started this, as it has started other rifts in the past. We CANNOT look past that tendency, it is there, ever present from that campaign.

I saw some Bernie supporters bragging about how much money Bernie took in after the situation started. It is rediculous for the rest of us to ignore that. I am leaning more toward Biden, BUT because of this Bernie campaign bullshit, I will continue to contribute money to Warren, that is only right, she is the victim in this situation and for her to have funding issues is a black mark on every decent person.

[highplainsdem]

40. The problem with NOT resolving this is that division could cost us the general election. Especially

with Republicans (and probably Russian bots) already trying to exploit the myth that Sanders hasn't been treated fairly.

[Blue_true]

47. I disagree.

The hardcore BOBs won't vote for a democrat, it will be Bernie or Trump for them.

Bernie's campaign has a long established pattern of attacking democrats and democratic priorities. I am ok with letting the ones that can't see a clear and present danger in Trump go, we don't need them to win the White House and all of Congress, we do need solid democrats like African Americans who underperformed in 2016 but came out with a vengeance in 2017, 2018 and 2019. Is we get AA excited and raring to go and bring in non-Cuban Hispanics and young Cuban-Americans, and in my Florida, newly arrived Puerto Ricans, we take the White House and all of Congress, without the BOB people.

[Beringia]

38. Seems like Warren just fell off the turnip truck

I know somehow this is likened to a Rorschach test, but her response during the open mic moment with Sanders, sounds like she has no political acumen whatsoever and is out of her depth.

[highplainsdem]

41. Disagree strongly.

[yardwork]

55. Did you watch the clip? I think Warren handled it very well.

Sanders had a temper tantrum and stalked off. He even snarled at Tom Steyer. Couldn't be gracious at all.

[totodeinhere]

43. No lets not. Both campaigns are ready to move on and so am I and so should you.

I will be willing and ready to vote for Sanders, Warren, or Biden, or whoever else our nominee is. That should be our focus.

[Cha]

59. Thank you for your OP, hpd!