Biden's poison pill attack ad probably cost Pete a win in NH.

[denem]

Last edited Wed Feb 12, 2020, 02:34 PM - Edit history (1)

There were only 4,000 votes in it. Whatever his motivation, if Bernie wins the nomination, Joe will have done his bit for the cause.


What's not to like?

[BusyBeingBest]

1. How many people saw that ad I wonder? I tend to think Amy K came across

as a serious alternative to Buttigieg and people went for her.

[denem]

4. I think (nearly) as many people were talking about it,

as the debate performances. A word of mouth phenomenon - in both cases.

[LeftTurn3623]

2. I agree

the ad backfired. It would have been better for Joe if Pete won than Bernie

[oldsoftie]

3. Dont worry about that; Bernie barely won in his own neighborhood.

I doubt he'll get the nomination

[denem]

6. In 2015/16, the GOP "moderates" kept putting off taking it to trump

until it was too late. By giving Bernie a pass, Democrats are making the same mistake.

[oldsoftie]

10. but now the race moves out of friendly territory. After Super Tuesday, let's see where he is

I think Sanders will not do well super Tuesday.
I could be wrong, but how often does THAT happen???

[denem]

15. Trump was the threat.

The 'moderates' kept telling themselves he had a ceiling, and held their fire.

[oldsoftie]

23. True; and I guess it is odd that most of the negative stuff I see comes from trump

but i just cant imagine a scenario where the 'powers that be" think Sanders can actually beat trump electorally.

[denem]

26. The GOP was sure trump would lose the GE

right up until the convention. It's the same pattern - hold your fire on the guy you think can't win - until it's too late.

[Act_of_Reparation]

11. That doesn't make much sense.

VT and NH are geographically close, but that's about all.

[oldsoftie]

29. I kinda think so though. Its like a Southerner winning in neighboring states.

But i guess we'll see soon enough. MAybe you're right

[Act_of_Reparation]

34. New England's state identities and cultures are fairly distinct. NH in particular.

The politics of NH and VT are pretty different. NH is to the right/libertarian side of the spectrum.

[Loki Liesmith]

5. Politics ain't beanbag

Suck it up folks

[denem]

9. Indeed it is not a bean bag.

What goes around, come around.

[Demsrule86]

7. Sorry...Buttigieg went after Biden as did Warren...so too bad. It is nothing compared to what Trump

would do. Buttigieg isn't going to win the primary either and had he got out maybe Warren and Biden would be in a better situation. Pete acts as a spoiler and helps only Sanders.

[denem]

16. All these excuses for the fact Biden gives Sanders a free pass.

[Celerity]

17. The dog whistle aspect of the double decorative lights and bricks usage

in the shitty smarmy mocking voice advert was disgusting.

No wonder Joe pulled it and stopped with that shite.

Totally classless and beneath Biden. I am sure he was talked into it by some hack. You can tell that he was and is uncomfortable with attacks against fellow dems, which is one of the things I admire about him.

Also, charging him as a spoiler is laughable.

[denem]

19. Joe is not as uncomfortable with attacks on fellow Dems as you might think.

When Pete began to rise in the polls, he was asked about Medicare for All Who Want It. He replied - 'He stole it - it's the Biden plan' - A charge of plagiarism from someone who ought to have known better.

[Celerity]

21. I recall that, but it was silly and easily disproven and went away quickly, but that dog whistle

advert really pissed me of as an LGBTQ person. Again, I am sure Joe was talked into it, and did not come up with that undertone at all, but he did ok it and the buck stops with the candidate.

At least he killed it off quick, which I approve of.

[denem]

22. I picked up the dog whistles, as soon as I saw it

Then became angry as I read comment after comment about imagining it. It was 'Worthy of the the GOP'

[cwydro]

24. It was classless indeed. Glad he pulled it; I wasn't aware he did.

It was beneath Joe.

[emmaverybo]

28. +1

[LAS14]

8. What is this "poison pill" attack? Link? nt

[denem]

12. A cyanide level attack. nt.

[Celerity]

13. The other bad thing, and the only time he has done this in a debate

Is when Klobuchar falsely said that Pete said he wanted to turn off the impeachment and watch cartoons, which is the exact opposite of what he said. He said that many voters react that way but that we need to fight that frustration and get back to caring about what Trump is doing to the nation.

He never corrected that mischaracterisation, which he could have done so easily and really turned it around on Klobuchar. It would have lit her up for trying to take a disengenous cheap shot, but instead it nailed him and aided her.

My wife was going bonkers because she had just watched a town hall with him where the whole thing happened. It was the only major time in a debate he let something pass that was a dodgy attack, and it cost him. No clue why he let it pass. He must have been kicking himself afterwards.

[Callado119]

14. Yup..

Same for Klobuchar. They are attacking each other and no one has laid a glove on Bernie and his mountains of baggage. Unfortunately I see the same thing happening in NV. They are just helping sanders and by extension trump who would crush sanders in the GE. It’s time to put country first and some people need to start dropping out so we can coalesce around a non sanders alternative before it’s too late..

[OnDoutside]

18. Yes Biden should have taken all Pete's attacks without giving a

bit back. Yeah right, he's playing in the grown ups league.

[denem]

20. It's a grown up game with Sanders getting free passes.

That's the point.

[OnDoutside]

37. Sanders is going to be challenged. Harris and Warren got

clobbered for having the similar M4A policy as Sanders, the only thing is Sanders kept it vague. The Nevada union were the first to bring this into the arena, and MSM will take it up.

[denem]

38. "the moderates" kept on putting off challenging trump in 2015/16

and concentrated on differentiating themselves, partly because they thought he could not win the whole thing, and partly cause they thought it wasn't that urgent. They were wrong. Same diff.

[OnDoutside]

39. Yes, they were playing by different rules to at least Sanders

surrogates, allowing Bernie to claim plausible deniability.

[emmaverybo]

31. Amazing to me that Pete's supporters would think Pete could constantly take big digs at Biden,

casting him as some old foggy riding on accomplishments from the model T era, and not expect Biden to challenge him on the substance of his own accomplishments.

[OnDoutside]

36. I agree, it's a learning experience all round.

[customerserviceguy]

25. I think it did more damage

to Joe Biden than to Pete Buttigieg. Especially after Pete castigated Trump for trying to divide a father and a son at the debate Friday night. Add in the "lying dog-faced pony soldier" comment, and that was what sunk Joe Biden to fifth place.

[TwilightZone]

27. Buttigieg out-performed the polls, so your assertion seems rather unlikely to be accurate.

[denem]

30. So the hardest attack ad of the cycle was a plus?

No it was a minus in a contest separated by 4,000 votes.

[TwilightZone]

32. There's no proof of that.

It's just something you're assuming influenced enough people to make a difference. The numbers tell a different story.

[denem]

33. Are you saying that the ad was a plus for Buttigieg?

[Laelth]

35. No biggie.

I think Biden's anti-Pete ad was lame and beneath the dignity of a former Senator and Vice President, but it didn't do any real damage. Pete still leads in pledged delegates. Bernie was expected to win NH. The fact that he only barely beat Mayor Pete (and came out of the contest with the same number of delegates) is the real story.

-Laelth

[highplainsdem]

40. Don't think so. Klobuchar had a spectacular debate performance, and Buttigieg wasn't

nearly as strong in that debate.

We haven't seen ANY surge in this campaign comparable to Klobuchar's.

[denem]

41. I've said my piece on this HPD.

Opinions may vary, but it is time to more on. Sanders has the wind in his sails. It up to competitors to capsize his skiff.

As for Amy, you KNOW I am rooting for a woman president