Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

ShazzieB

(16,543 posts)
40. As some have said already, I am not anti-Palestinian. I am anti-Hamas.
Sat Nov 4, 2023, 08:01 AM
Nov 2023

I am also pro-Israel, in principle, in that I passionately believe in the need for a Jewish homeland and the right of Israel to exist, but I am becoming less and less supportive of the way Israel has been responding to this crisis. There is a difference between self-defense and retaliation, and I feel that Israel's leaders have crossed that line repeatedly. If they continue as they have, Israel's standing in the world is going to be badly damaged, if it isn't already, and I hate to see that happen. (It goes without saying that this is on top of my concern for the humanitarian issues. Bombing ambulances is beyond the pale, afaic.)

At this point, I'm strongly in favor of what Biden calls a humanitarian pause in the hostilities, and I hope to hell he and Secretary Blinken can get the Israel government to agree to one. I know they're trying hard.

I am very tired of Netanyahu's intransigence and unwillingness to listen to reason. Sometimes I wonder if he's over-compensating for the bone headed errors (ignoring intelligence, etc.) that allowed Hamas to pull off their attack on the music festival. He needs to stop.

In addition to all of the above, I am throughly sick and tired of the constant fighting about it here at DU. I've been avoiding those threads for the last few days, because it just got to be too much. Even now, I am uncomfortable saying what I really think about certain things. If I express support for Israel, I'm afraid of bring accused of being anti-Palestinian. If I express concern for the welfare of the Palestinian people, I'm afraid of being labeled antisemitic. It's easier to just stay out of those threads. (And yet I couldn't resist responding to this one. Go figure.)

That's not enough said. No one is anti-Palestine. We are anti terrorist and anti Hamas scumbags. SoFlaBro Nov 2023 #1
Hamas is a result of the atrocities by Israel against the Palestinians. Imagine your new next akbacchus_BC Nov 2023 #2
Terrorist fuckstains like Hamas just want to hate, harass, and eventually kill Jews just for being Jews. SoFlaBro Nov 2023 #3
Go quarrel with yourself. Am not interested in continuing a dialogue with you. nt. akbacchus_BC Nov 2023 #4
There is nothing my neighbor could do to me to make me want to cut off the head of a baby. SoFlaBro Nov 2023 #5
You look at too much propaganda on TV. I have heard that the President of Ukraine is killing akbacchus_BC Nov 2023 #12
I know Hamas blasted their way into Israel and started killing anyone that wasn't wearing a sweaty headband. SoFlaBro Nov 2023 #14
Pretty racist verbiage bruv Celerity Nov 2023 #31
Yes, because sweaty indicates a race. SoFlaBro Nov 2023 #48
whatever Celerity Nov 2023 #49
Is "sweaty" a slur now? SoFlaBro Nov 2023 #58
if you do not think sweaty arabs is a slur then your slur radar is broken Celerity Nov 2023 #75
I said sweaty headband. You said arabs. Sounds like you have a hangup. SoFlaBro Nov 2023 #79
No, it's definitely a you thing. n/t demmiblue Nov 2023 #81
now you are trying to spin your way out Celerity Nov 2023 #82
How about "sweaty terrorists?" Mossfern Nov 2023 #113
that is not what they typed Celerity Nov 2023 #124
It was "sweaty headbands" Mossfern Nov 2023 #136
it was a racist construct Celerity Nov 2023 #137
The way you worded that certainly is. brush Nov 2023 #109
Wow "sweaty headband" obamanut2012 Nov 2023 #43
You started this thread and now you're complaining when people respond? yardwork Nov 2023 #52
They have been killing gays for years already JI7 Nov 2023 #8
Totally on-brand for fucking turds like Hamas. To them, if you're gay, you must die. SoFlaBro Nov 2023 #10
Guess what atreides1 Nov 2023 #134
News Flash Straw Man Nov 2023 #17
The solution would have been that Israel and Palestine were States. Not Israel sanctioning everything in akbacchus_BC Nov 2023 #24
Palestinians had a chance for a state SickOfTheOnePct Nov 2023 #39
The Palestinian Authority... PJMcK Nov 2023 #41
Post removed Post removed Nov 2023 #55
Plus the many other times Palestinian leadership has rejected any kind of compromise Autumn_Angler Nov 2023 #204
Israel is not building settlements on the Gaza strip. former9thward Nov 2023 #96
Yes, and that was soundly rejected by Hamas. Straw Man Nov 2023 #189
Martin Buber thought Israel should be a single state, secular democracy. PufPuf23 Nov 2023 #95
Actually no. Think Al quaeda, ISIS, Hezbollah, etc. elias7 Nov 2023 #28
I had decided to withdraw from this conversation cachukis Nov 2023 #74
And the armed settlers, backed by Likud, appropriating Arab land continue to inflame things. brush Nov 2023 #116
Israel has established dominion over its cachukis Nov 2023 #132
I don't get what you're saying. Is it that settlers have a right to encroach on Arab land? brush Nov 2023 #135
Not at all. But they did and it is done. Now what? cachukis Nov 2023 #138
How about the Israeli government put a stop to it. And returning the land too could help. brush Nov 2023 #139
You are aware of Netanyahu and autocracy, I'm sure. cachukis Nov 2023 #144
It sure is going to be tough. There's a sliver of hope though that Bibi and his admin wiil be ousted... brush Nov 2023 #207
So very true. The Israeli government cachukis Nov 2023 #210
Who is going to stop Israel from decimating cachukis Nov 2023 #140
So October 7th Dorian Gray Nov 2023 #36
They were both going to be recognized as a state in 1948 EX500rider Nov 2023 #50
There is little to no awareness of this fact among marybourg Nov 2023 #68
Both sides Zeitghost Nov 2023 #64
Israel was not given preference. marybourg Nov 2023 #69
Nothing can justify the atrocities committed by Hamas on 10/7. totodeinhere Nov 2023 #98
Hamas is a GD Butchering Terrorist Org that Cha Nov 2023 #99
What ignorance of history and disregard for facts you are revealing wnylib Nov 2023 #105
Excellent POST.. TY! Cha Nov 2023 #110
Great post Zeitghost Nov 2023 #119
You seem to leave out that Israel didn't exist cachukis Nov 2023 #157
Neither was there a State of Palestine. Mossfern Nov 2023 #175
That is not the point. The people living there, cachukis Nov 2023 #178
Personal story- something I was considerting as an OP Mossfern Nov 2023 #188
I cannot get into this. I did not say cachukis Nov 2023 #191
Their lives had already been upended, prior to 1948. yardwork Nov 2023 #214
Never said it was a happy place. cachukis Nov 2023 #217
"Most (Jewish) enclaves were seriously disrupted during the war." yardwork Nov 2023 #218
I suppose, but conversations here have cachukis Nov 2023 #219
All good points. yardwork Nov 2023 #220
You are in the wrong place TexasDem69 Nov 2023 #176
Hamas is the result of Yasser Arafat not taking "Yes" for an answer... SKKY Nov 2023 #215
Tell me you know nothing about the Palestinian/Israeli conflict... SKKY Nov 2023 #216
Kiss my grits Chuuku Davis Nov 2023 #230
Being happy - no BUT I wouldn't be cutting DenaliDemocrat Nov 2023 #232
K&R, One too many anti Palestine who blame them for Hamas terrorist uponit7771 Nov 2023 #6
Hamas is MAGA - Palestine branch. Same psychotic behavior as the pieces of shit in the MAGA cult. SoFlaBro Nov 2023 #9
YEP!! Dictators don't represent the people uponit7771 Nov 2023 #13
They can call themselves HAM ASS Salad. The name matters little. Terrorists are terrorists worldwide like MAGA. SoFlaBro Nov 2023 #15
I agree with this. LakeArenal Nov 2023 #183
THIS malaise Nov 2023 #29
Incorrect, plenty of calls for collective punishment obamanut2012 Nov 2023 #42
I'd like to see a link to one of these OP's "calling for collective punishment" EX500rider Nov 2023 #102
+1. much more in line with anything I have seen stopdiggin Nov 2023 #126
What i've seen... druidity33 Nov 2023 #190
Resignation is not the same thing as callousness Happy Hoosier Nov 2023 #194
Of course not, i'm a cook... druidity33 Nov 2023 #211
That's kinda my point.... Happy Hoosier Nov 2023 #212
I didn't say i saw that attitude FROM YOU. nt. druidity33 Nov 2023 #213
Plenty of people are justifying killing Palestinian civilians iemanja Nov 2023 #122
It's difficult to be anywhere, to breathe in and out with everything that is going on mahina Nov 2023 #7
The killing will abate when Hamas takes a dirt nap; best for both Palestine and Israel. SoFlaBro Nov 2023 #11
Send trump and his cohorts to stop the carnage. They managed to cause an insurrection on the Capitol. akbacchus_BC Nov 2023 #16
Orange Bastard will only destroy a toilet or a Hefty bag filled with McDonalds. SoFlaBro Nov 2023 #18
At least we are on the same page re the orange man. I don't know what 2024 will bring, but his akbacchus_BC Nov 2023 #20
His supporters are faithful to him calguy Nov 2023 #60
I totally share your sentiments. I hope this will conflict will not escalate. What bothers me though, is akbacchus_BC Nov 2023 #19
With you MorbidButterflyTat Nov 2023 #125
"The media needs to stop escalating crap." Aussie105 Nov 2023 #21
I agree with you, the media escalates the situation, no matter where the conflict is. Guess their boss akbacchus_BC Nov 2023 #23
The media inthewind21 Nov 2023 #228
This is a really (REALLY) complex problem that has taken years to fester Layzeebeaver Nov 2023 #22
Unfortunately, the US has the same insurgents, but they are not fighting for human rights, like Hamas, akbacchus_BC Nov 2023 #25
Did you say Hamas is fighting for human rights? Patton French Nov 2023 #34
Hamas is NOT fighting for human rights Dorian Gray Nov 2023 #38
Did you really just claim Zeitghost Nov 2023 #66
I appreciate the mask-off honesty Sympthsical Nov 2023 #73
But No "points" for Not knowing Shit about what Hamas stands for. Cha Nov 2023 #112
Can I ask a question? claudette Nov 2023 #143
"I am NOT condoning terrorism that Hamas committed on 10/7." Jedi Guy Nov 2023 #159
Okay claudette Nov 2023 #162
On the contrary, I think I understand what you're saying just fine. N/T Jedi Guy Nov 2023 #163
I'm sorry Zeitghost Nov 2023 #164
Huh inthewind21 Nov 2023 #229
I'm confused by your question. BlueCheeseAgain Nov 2023 #168
The statement you made below does not apply to Gazans: yagotme Nov 2023 #221
W.T.F? edisdead Nov 2023 #76
Whoa, I missed this reply. W.T.F.?! demmiblue Nov 2023 #77
This is one of the most fucked-up things I've read on here. Wingus Dingus Nov 2023 #86
Yeah but it's "difficult" . Cha Nov 2023 #117
I guess it IS difficult seeing such a noted "human-rights group" like HAMAS Wingus Dingus Nov 2023 #123
Yeah Yeesh.. Cha Nov 2023 #127
Well that certainly makes things clear sarisataka Nov 2023 #90
We were told Wrong. Cha Nov 2023 #120
"...but they are not fighting for human rights, like Hamas." Jedi Guy Nov 2023 #94
Well inthewind21 Nov 2023 #231
Remind me again about how the US military explicitly set out to rape, mutilate, and torture civilians as their goal? Jedi Guy Nov 2023 #233
You are responding to an entirely different point. Layzeebeaver Nov 2023 #97
Hamas is Slaughtering to wipe OUT Israel. Learn some FACTS. Cha Nov 2023 #101
This is the most batshit insane thing I've seen posted on DU. Ace Rothstein Nov 2023 #111
Rec.. TY Cha Nov 2023 #129
Post removed Post removed Nov 2023 #226
not me Skittles Nov 2023 #26
I know, always liked your posts, even the bad word ones. akbacchus_BC Nov 2023 #27
it is difficult for me to hear about bombings Skittles Nov 2023 #32
You should cease acting surprised when DUers equate support of Palestinians with support of Hamas... FBaggins Nov 2023 #30
Your point is valid until you consider that some folks here have implied that the two, Hamas and Palestinian are Chainfire Nov 2023 #57
any such equation (and they have been relatively few) is VERY quickly contested and rebuked -(nt)- stopdiggin Nov 2023 #130
I don't think anyone here is anti-Palestinian. Jedi Guy Nov 2023 #33
Oh but some seem to be claudette Nov 2023 #62
Well, stating that Gazans voted for Hamas is factual. They did. Jedi Guy Nov 2023 #70
However claudette Nov 2023 #72
I didn't say all who voted for Hamas approved of 10/7. Jedi Guy Nov 2023 #84
Sorry claudette Nov 2023 #91
I can just as easily reply that everything you said sounds a lot like Hamas talking points. Jedi Guy Nov 2023 #93
Yes, you can say that, but claudette Nov 2023 #118
you haven't been listening to those same voices stopdiggin Nov 2023 #131
I haven't seen any claudette Nov 2023 #141
From a thread you have posted in: yagotme Nov 2023 #142
I don't see it as claudette Nov 2023 #145
"Condoning an attack" is different than "supporting Hamas". yagotme Nov 2023 #146
Exactly what do you claudette Nov 2023 #148
Good Grief Willto Nov 2023 #151
It was almost claudette Nov 2023 #154
A Groups ability Willto Nov 2023 #192
Look closely at the phrase. yagotme Nov 2023 #152
"because they don't have a standing military or a working government" EX500rider Nov 2023 #153
Good Post EX500rider Willto Nov 2023 #155
Oh no PBateman70 Nov 2023 #180
Human Culture, as found in the study of multigraincracker Nov 2023 #35
There's no "anti-Palestinian rhetoric" here. betsuni Nov 2023 #37
Yes, there is - entire OPs obamanut2012 Nov 2023 #44
Link to one OP then EX500rider Nov 2023 #223
Yes, there is, including entire OPs obamanut2012 Nov 2023 #45
As some have said already, I am not anti-Palestinian. I am anti-Hamas. ShazzieB Nov 2023 #40
There was a lot of anti-German bias in WWII as well Mysterian Nov 2023 #46
"Maybe the Palestinians don't want peace" Zeitghost Nov 2023 #89
Yes! LiberaBlueDem Nov 2023 #100
Most Zeitghost Nov 2023 #114
I nearly said something, but it might be insensitive, so you have to click to read this Bucky Nov 2023 #47
Excellent Post ProfessorGAC Nov 2023 #51
You have zero credibility. From a post of yours, below NoRethugFriends Nov 2023 #53
I can't take sides on this, I think both sides are equally to blame. It is up to doc03 Nov 2023 #54
You can't take side? Zeitghost Nov 2023 #165
Didn't one side have their homelands taken from them? Its a stupid war based on doc03 Nov 2023 #181
No Zeitghost Nov 2023 #208
I have't seen any "Anti-palestinian" rhetoric. Happy Hoosier Nov 2023 #56
lol thats funny dembotoz Nov 2023 #65
How would a peaceful two state solution have stopped Hamas? brooklynite Nov 2023 #59
They would claudette Nov 2023 #63
Fatah might take a two-state solution, but Hamas would not. LauraInLA Nov 2023 #80
Point to any statement by Hamas that they would accept a Palestine along with Israel brooklynite Nov 2023 #83
Yes claudette Nov 2023 #61
"Egypt coordinates with Israel about what to allow because they consider Israel the occupying power" EX500rider Nov 2023 #107
In your opinion claudette Nov 2023 #115
Less opinion, more proven fact EX500rider Nov 2023 #147
A good number of trolls, a lot of shocking rhetoric from non-trolls, many ill-founded insinuations thrown around... demmiblue Nov 2023 #67
This message was self-deleted by its author gulliver Nov 2023 #71
Count me among those who's bitten their tongue while the fights have raged on DU. Emrys Nov 2023 #78
I think I know where some of the blurring of the lines between Palestinians yagotme Nov 2023 #87
Post removed Post removed Nov 2023 #103
Never said that. I'm saying there can be mental confusion when talking about both. yagotme Nov 2023 #106
Well expressed. Emotions generally outpace wisdom. cachukis Nov 2023 #171
Excellent reply, worthy of being an OP obamanut2012 Nov 2023 #172
That's why I stay out of the Israel / Gaza threads, for the most part. LuckyCharms Nov 2023 #85
I find the antisemitism to be more disturbing sarisataka Nov 2023 #88
Irony inthewind21 Nov 2023 #234
I'm afraid to whisper even a word on this subject mainer Nov 2023 #92
Exactly, it should be anti-Hamas rhetoric. brush Nov 2023 #104
So what BannonsLiver Nov 2023 #108
there is little or no 'anti-Palestinian' rhetoric on this site stopdiggin Nov 2023 #121
I just want the killing of civilians on both sides to end IronLionZion Nov 2023 #128
THIS is what is really ugly here lately MorbidButterflyTat Nov 2023 #133
Well, it's an attempt Sympthsical Nov 2023 #156
Punctuation still doesn't explain the "but", lapucelle Nov 2023 #195
And, in approx. 11 hours, with multiple responses, it still stands. yagotme Nov 2023 #161
Exactly.. the OP hasn't denied it and no amount Cha Nov 2023 #167
I would have thought that he would have edited it by now, with all the outcry. yagotme Nov 2023 #196
Yes unless that's exactly what Cha Nov 2023 #199
Had another poster here take issue with me because they thought the poster meant something else. yagotme Nov 2023 #200
As am I and everyone else calling Cha Nov 2023 #201
Ty, some seem to be, willfully blind questionseverything Nov 2023 #206
Hopefully oil goes through the roof. roamer65 Nov 2023 #149
...I also support a full Arab oil embargo on the West and Israel. roamer65 Nov 2023 #150
That will cause a massive recession and give full control to Republicans in 2024. Ace Rothstein Nov 2023 #158
...and start to save Planet Earth. roamer65 Nov 2023 #160
magats Won't "save planet Earth." Cha Nov 2023 #166
And since then the country has mostly been developed and designed around automobile usage. Ace Rothstein Nov 2023 #169
The internet has made vehicles much more of a luxury roamer65 Nov 2023 #170
Then SickOfTheOnePct Nov 2023 #173
When the climate crisis hits hard, there won't be any functional governments. roamer65 Nov 2023 #182
Right, ok n/t SickOfTheOnePct Nov 2023 #184
I can't wait to see people like you pay $8 a gallon. roamer65 Nov 2023 #185
😂😂😂 SickOfTheOnePct Nov 2023 #186
U laugh now. roamer65 Nov 2023 #187
Wow, Enjoying the possibility of watching a fellow DU'er suffer... yagotme Nov 2023 #222
You can be anti-Hamas without being anti-Palestinian JCMach1 Nov 2023 #174
If you support Hamas TexasDem69 Nov 2023 #177
Getting very polarised, true. Aussie105 Nov 2023 #179
It is difficult to be on DU now, given the pro-terrorist rhetoric. Enough said. See kelly1mm Nov 2023 #193
Weren't you the one that said Hamas was fighting for human rights? egduj Nov 2023 #197
That's funny Calculating Nov 2023 #198
I have been requested to serve for jury duty BigmanPigman Nov 2023 #202
I've been serving on tons of juries too.... Happy Hoosier Nov 2023 #203
It's always difficult being Jewish when you are attacked by cowards. William769 Nov 2023 #205
DU has certainly changed over the years jcmaine72 Nov 2023 #209
It was Avalon Sparks Nov 2023 #224
Post removed Post removed Nov 2023 #225
Because we run things now, and that means maintaining the status quo. jcmaine72 Nov 2023 #235
Thank you for the Perspective Avalon Sparks Nov 2023 #236
I am still angry that Charlemagne had 5000 Saxon captives beheaded in a single day Redleg Nov 2023 #227
The U.N. started this.... Zeecat Dec 2023 #237
Latest Discussions»General Discussion»It is difficult to be on ...»Reply #40