General Discussion

paulk

(11,587 posts)

46. the Democratic Party isn't going to nominate anyone outside of the establishment, actually

Thu Dec 15, 2011, 09:30 AM

Dec 2011

yes, I realize that - and that we all need to be pragmatic and accept that we'll have five more years of a centrist President who is beholden to the usual powers that be and will, consequently, get nothing much done and be unwilling to fight for or even discuss the real solutions to our problems...

I just think it would be a good thing to have an honest to god liberal voice in the process, something that might push the leadership of the Democratic Party back toward it's more populous/liberal/labor roots instead of the Rockefeller Republican crowd that currently controls things.

I don't know who that person is - we didn't know who it would be in '68, either.

But the point I made is that this fear that running someone against Obama or even running someone against Obama that defeats him in a primary will automatically lead to a Republican victory is not necessarily true. The republican field is the weakest I have ever seen in my life and I believe there are other Democrats beside Obama - liberal Democrats, perhaps as yet unknown - who could win this upcoming election.

In fact I think it's damn near imperative. I agree with the OP - on many levels, Obama doesn't deserve our vote. The only real reason to support him is that the alternative (a Republican President) is worse.

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President Obama Richly Deserves to Be Dumped [View all] Karmadillo Dec 2011 OP

Interesting - but who do you recommend? GoneOffShore Dec 2011 #1

Dennis is about the only one speaking out these days. Fire Walk With Me Dec 2011 #4

Dennis has proposed some pretty attractive ideas. LoZoccolo Dec 2011 #6

What an indictment you just made of the broken system, unintentionally I'm sure, we live under. sabrina 1 Dec 2011 #18

Well said! New7up Dec 2011 #135

If Dennis Kucinich looked like Josh Brolin would he have gotten further? Mimosa Dec 2011 #206

joke, big joke. dennis wouldn't last a month once they started in on him. okieinpain Dec 2011 #229

Ah, but he has been active in his government roll. Fire Walk With Me Dec 2011 #25

Good to see you recycling your DU2 material. Union Scribe Dec 2011 #29

Yes. With the Citizen's United decision in place, only candidates sanctioned by the 1% Zorra Dec 2011 #122

Very true, judging from what I saw from inside the Kucinich campaign in 2004 Lydia Leftcoast Dec 2011 #150

Unintentionally, you know, you just described Obama's 2008 presidential platform... RandomKoolzip Dec 2011 #240

Dennis and Sanders I trust completely. emilyg Dec 2011 #32

He knows better than to mess with an incumbent Democratic President Freddie Stubbs Dec 2011 #78

Huh? New7up Dec 2011 #136

Raul Grijalva texshelters Dec 2011 #119

when someone says that it's a strong clue that they don't know enough about individual congress cali Dec 2011 #127

I haven't seen anything posted here, AFAIR. Fire Walk With Me Dec 2011 #237

Dennis is viewed as an eccentric crackpot banned from Kos Dec 2011 #151

Only by the far right. sabrina 1 Dec 2011 #152

DK is fine as an obscure House member - he is just not presidential material. banned from Kos Dec 2011 #157

He IS presidential material and was the most popular candidate for that office sabrina 1 Dec 2011 #161

Well, I don't want to argue but you wrote your post with passion and conviction. banned from Kos Dec 2011 #179

Ditto. The Tim Russet/UFO debate is all the tape u need to hang him. zonkers Dec 2011 #209

Post removed Post removed Dec 2011 #20

He sure does sound like a thoughtful man.. midnight Dec 2011 #36

Al Gore Octafish Dec 2011 #52

Agreed on all points. ThomWV Dec 2011 #72

Al Gore is Mr. DLC himself. Remember its the Clinton machine that spawned the "Blue Dogs". Erose999 Dec 2011 #74

Blue Dogs were in existence long before Clinton. He just did more. LiberalFighter Dec 2011 #245

whack job, really? themadstork Dec 2011 #59

so, why is dennis a "whack job?" newspeak Dec 2011 #97

If Dennis was serious DonCoquixote Dec 2011 #121

Yes, the MSM did everything possible to make Dennis lok like an ass. dotymed Dec 2011 #144

other nominees are: Hulk Dec 2011 #106

What, or who is stopping them? sufrommich Dec 2011 #107

Elizabeth Warren, Howard Dean, Jerry Brown, Mark Udall, Barbara Boxer... mckara Dec 2011 #128

I'm with you on Howrd Dean Ned_Devine Dec 2011 #142

Those are viable choices. And electable if there was a chance of them running. GoneOffShore Dec 2011 #148

well, of course there's no chance- every single pol you mentioned supports Obama , even Bernie. Capn Sunshine Dec 2011 #214

In order to express dissatifaction with Obama, Kermit the Frog will do Jack Rabbit Dec 2011 #129

+1 nt ooglymoogly Dec 2011 #154

This would never happen, but thescreaminghead Dec 2011 #133

See bankrupcy "reform" and get back to us. TheKentuckian Dec 2011 #162

Rocky Anderson bonnieS Dec 2011 #149

Yes The Justice party ecoalex2 Dec 2011 #184

Yes swilton Dec 2011 #247

Kucinich speaks for progressive democrats. sabrina 1 Dec 2011 #155

I'm a fan of Bernie Sanders RyanPsych Dec 2011 #174

Sanders is not a Democrat Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin Dec 2011 #196

There Must be someone who won't be a chameleon like Obama ecoalex2 Dec 2011 #178

I would vote for Russ in a heartbeat. n/t nebenaube Dec 2011 #221

Yeah, good luck with that...nt SidDithers Dec 2011 #2

Well, him or Kermit are bound to split the party! n/t Bolo Boffin Dec 2011 #175

Why ProSense Dec 2011 #3

Nice strawman DesMoinesDem Dec 2011 #24

I can only ask, Did you vote for him. olegramps Dec 2011 #143

Yep DesMoinesDem Dec 2011 #195

Obama has succeeded in killing a lot more of our dedicated enemies than Bush did. olegramps Dec 2011 #250

Wrong war Union Scribe Dec 2011 #30

It does get confusing with so many going on... midnight Dec 2011 #35

Name them. The Doctor. Dec 2011 #84

You too... The Doctor. Dec 2011 #88

what does that have to do with anything? Skittles Dec 2011 #109

Yawn. Harper's becoming obsolete, needs attention? nt babylonsister Dec 2011 #5

it's not as if the author doesn't know what the result of that would be bigtree Dec 2011 #7

oh, I don't know paulk Dec 2011 #19

who's your Humphrey? bigtree Dec 2011 #37

the Democratic Party isn't going to nominate anyone outside of the establishment, actually paulk Dec 2011 #46

For, at least the last 2 1/2 years,many of us on DU and elsewhere have been dotymed Dec 2011 #147

You need to read a little history. ooglymoogly Dec 2011 #156

Careful! The Doctor. Dec 2011 #86

And we all know what happened to McCarthy. n/t Bonhomme Richard Dec 2011 #8

This is one huge pile of steaming bull shit Motown_Johnny Dec 2011 #9

we ended up with Nixon because the Democratic elites screwed McCarthy. provis99 Dec 2011 #15

I'm not slurring liberals, I am slurring that article Motown_Johnny Dec 2011 #31

McCarthy never had a snowball's chance in hell. Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin Dec 2011 #198

You are eliding so much history with the statement that "after this challenge coalition_unwilling Dec 2011 #28

Wow... Motown_Johnny Dec 2011 #39

You allege that, because McCarthy mounted his challenge to LBJ, we ended up coalition_unwilling Dec 2011 #44

Very well said. nt hifiguy Dec 2011 #61

my point is Motown_Johnny Dec 2011 #62

Since you're fond of referencing Wikipedia, I'd like to point you to another Wikipedia article: coalition_unwilling Dec 2011 #65

Bravo for the voice of reason here. Hart2008 Dec 2011 #222

+1 Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin Dec 2011 #201

Bingo. ....almost every credible poltiical scientist now argues that Humphrey would have defeated MADem Dec 2011 #98

Exactly right. Zoeisright Dec 2011 #40

Your grasp of the political history of 1968 is hifiguy Dec 2011 #60

agreed Motown_Johnny Dec 2011 #63

+1 n/t jaysunb Dec 2011 #211

+1 n/t FSogol Dec 2011 #66

Under this reasoning, if Gingrich had a "(D)" after his name, would you support him? AnotherMcIntosh Dec 2011 #71

Obama is doing a damn fine job of being a President GinGrinch himself. NDAA, the continuing of Erose999 Dec 2011 #77

LBJ lost the presidency by pushing civil rights legislation through congress, ending the nearly 40 Warren Stupidity Dec 2011 #153

Gingrich will not be the nominee ooglymoogly Dec 2011 #160

It's all about what John R MacArthur wants to happen. Hidden deep in his mind. LiberalFighter Dec 2011 #246

I'm kinda unhappy with Obama & the current batch of Dems. I've made no secret of it. Jackpine Radical Dec 2011 #10

/thread. boxman15 Dec 2011 #21

At what point does a primary become inevitable? EOTE Dec 2011 #57

How 'bout voting for the lesser of two evils & then Jackpine Radical Dec 2011 #70

I don't think that's worked at all these past 30+ years. EOTE Dec 2011 #90

I guess I'm looking outside "politics as usual" to find my agents of change. Jackpine Radical Dec 2011 #91

+1 n/t jaysunb Dec 2011 #212

Well said IMO! Exactly what is/will happen. RKP5637 Dec 2011 #254

This message was self-deleted by its author Maven Dec 2011 #112

the election of 1968 is a great example in no small part because nixon won. unblock Dec 2011 #11

Wake up people ...they don't give a fuck about us. Poor people don't finance political campaigns. L0oniX Dec 2011 #12

If all poor people voted it would be a slam dunk for the dems every four years and we would still demosincebirth Dec 2011 #16

Not necessarily, as we were reminded in 2000 and probably again in 2004 sad sally Dec 2011 #22

It can be done (nt) T S Justly Dec 2011 #13

BS spanone Dec 2011 #14

Lol, BS to what? In '68, Gene and Bobby showed it can be done (nt) T S Justly Dec 2011 #17

This isn't '68 OhioBlue Dec 2011 #26

No, but the landscape is the same - unpopular U.S. military offenses, mass civil uprisings ... T S Justly Dec 2011 #38

The landscape isn't remotely the same onenote Dec 2011 #67

Well (and factually) said. n/t jaysunb Dec 2011 #213

Lazy, lazy, lazy... brooklynite Dec 2011 #23

The dude must be smoking a lot of something OhioBlue Dec 2011 #27

Do you remember who was actually elected that year? LiberalAndProud Dec 2011 #33

Humphrey could have been elected if he would have chosen to oppose the war, or say that he did. AnotherMcIntosh Dec 2011 #75

How do you know this? LiberalAndProud Dec 2011 #82

How? An application of logic and common sense. AnotherMcIntosh Dec 2011 #92

All I know is that the rightward slide has been inexorable. LiberalAndProud Dec 2011 #104

I was in high school when robert kennedy was killed newspeak Dec 2011 #101

Humphry was a good man, but he would not take a public position contrary to the war hawks. AnotherMcIntosh Dec 2011 #114

Said the spider to the fly frazzled Dec 2011 #34

No, thanks. Name a challenger and I'll work even harder to support President Obama. NYC Liberal Dec 2011 #41

If he has overwhelming support Occulus Dec 2011 #68

x2 Absolutely right. AnotherMcIntosh Dec 2011 #76

I'm not speaking for anyone else; only for me. I haven't said "Do you want President Newt." NYC Liberal Dec 2011 #103

This seems to be different he has the "overwhelming support of the liberal base of the party" AnotherMcIntosh Dec 2011 #115

He does... nt NYC Liberal Dec 2011 #120

right or wrong, good or bad - there is not even a .00001% chance that it is going to happen Douglas Carpenter Dec 2011 #42

If I could recommend a reply, it would be this one. I will wish with you. LiberalAndProud Dec 2011 #110

Real turds are more productive than this article. nt BootinUp Dec 2011 #43

I'm open to it. joshcryer Dec 2011 #45

Dumping an incumbent Democratic president, who has high approvals ratings... MrScorpio Dec 2011 #47

. ProSense Dec 2011 #48

MacArthur tells it like he sees it. Octafish Dec 2011 #49

Funny--When someone asked me why I thought O had shown no interest in taking on the MIC, Jackpine Radical Dec 2011 #255

Interesting how little changes over time sharp_stick Dec 2011 #50

Don't Compare Obama To The Almighty. Compare Him To The Alternative. DemocratSinceBirth Dec 2011 #51

Halfway between right and wrong is still wrong. Occulus Dec 2011 #85

Halfway Between Newt Gingrich Or Mitt Romney Is Still Fascism DemocratSinceBirth Dec 2011 #87

Any point between those two is just crazy Occulus Dec 2011 #227

You Do Know The Next President Will Be Barack Obama Or His Republican Opponent DemocratSinceBirth Dec 2011 #248

I prefer to compare him.. sendero Dec 2011 #203

This thread deserves to be dumped. tallahasseedem Dec 2011 #53

This is TRIPE old tripe and odorous...fuck this dude opihimoimoi Dec 2011 #54

unfortunately, the party leadership will only run who they want fascisthunter Dec 2011 #55

I've predicted for a while he won't be the nominee. BlueIris Dec 2011 #56

Whatever. This billionaire trust fund baby tool... jefferson_dem Dec 2011 #58

LOL. dreams die hard, don't they.... dionysus Dec 2011 #64

He does, but there is no alternative. The only person who can beat him isn't interested. Tatiana Dec 2011 #69

"Granted, there are big differences between 1968 and 2012" ProSense Dec 2011 #73

I dunno about the primary challenge, but Obama does remind me of Carter in some ways. bemildred Dec 2011 #79

Stupid is as stupid does. MjolnirTime Dec 2011 #80

Here's the deal ProSense Dec 2011 #83

I don't think it bolsters any new anti-Obama sentiment. MjolnirTime Dec 2011 #100

+1 dionysus Dec 2011 #102

This message was self-deleted by its author Bunny Dec 2011 #81

Kick Obama Out? JGug1 Dec 2011 #89

Indeed he does. K&R Tierra_y_Libertad Dec 2011 #93

While I largely agree with this Carolina Dec 2011 #94

Don't you Know You Can't Post That on DU3? MineralMan Dec 2011 #95

but iread that DU3 was Big Brother "stifling dissent" and "censoring"! dionysus Dec 2011 #96

Guess not... MineralMan Dec 2011 #99

Dump Johnson gave us Nixon. Yeah, great plan. nt mistertrickster Dec 2011 #105

Johnson and Humpty gave us Nixon with their war. Tierra_y_Libertad Dec 2011 #132

The war that was widely popular in 1968? mistertrickster Dec 2011 #163

Anyone who was voting against the war wouldn't, and didn't, vote for Nixon or Humphrey. Tierra_y_Libertad Dec 2011 #169

Sirhan Sirhan Gave Us Nixon NashVegas Dec 2011 #191

Yep (nt) T S Justly Dec 2011 #235

There simply is no good solution to Obama.... samplegirl Dec 2011 #108

Ah, the wee whiff of W wafts through the bog. Efilroft Sul Dec 2011 #111

That about sums it up - and I wholeheartedly agree. nt gateley Dec 2011 #123

K&R (n/t) a2liberal Dec 2011 #113

As an Arizona voter texshelters Dec 2011 #116

This article texshelters Dec 2011 #117

We must do like the republicans nineteen50 Dec 2011 #118

This is the polar opposite of a cranky Tea Party rant against Romney. JohnnyRingo Dec 2011 #124

Please explain to me SixthSense Dec 2011 #125

Let me save a couple thousand words: JohnnyRingo Dec 2011 #189

+1000 n/t jaysunb Dec 2011 #218

Good Lord, those pictures should say it all Number23 Dec 2011 #225

good one. "no one except Fox News promised he would be a liberal dream once in office" certainot Dec 2011 #186

Well said ! n/t jaysunb Dec 2011 #220

According to Turley the ONLY pro-civil liberties candidate is the LIBERTARIAN Ron Paul! alp227 Dec 2011 #126

While replacing obama may or may not be a good idea with a more liberal democratic cstanleytech Dec 2011 #130

there may never be a better point SixthSense Dec 2011 #134

Well I believe our best choice is to cstanleytech Dec 2011 #137

my beliefs here are SixthSense Dec 2011 #139

Its not that Obama has refused solutions because he has its that the republicans stonewall him and cstanleytech Dec 2011 #158

What's the excuse for the first two years then? SixthSense Dec 2011 #166

Yup they controlled them but not enough to totally block the republicans from cstanleytech Dec 2011 #172

ROFL Scurrilous Dec 2011 #131

This message was self-deleted by its author cstanleytech Dec 2011 #138

I guess Karmdillo samplegirl Dec 2011 #140

+1 blkmusclmachine Dec 2011 #141

MMhmm just vote Republican save the drivel Veracious Dec 2011 #145

If he votes for the NDA, I won't vote for him. n/t Atypical Liberal Dec 2011 #146

Which is a vote for Romney bjobotts Dec 2011 #171

Or Ron Paul. Or nobody. Atypical Liberal Dec 2011 #241

Where's the "rec" button? nt Deep13 Dec 2011 #159

Where's the un-rec? otohara Dec 2011 #182

I remember the "Clean for Gene" movement. annabanana Dec 2011 #164

The point about Eugene McCarthy zentrum Dec 2011 #165

Not good enough to actually be in Harper's of course. gulliver Dec 2011 #167

you noticed that too... dionysus Dec 2011 #180

Eugene McCarthy's protege and heir: Darcy Richardson 2012- The only game in town to dump Obama Hart2008 Dec 2011 #168

Who? Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin Dec 2011 #205

The Progressive Democrat running for President of the United States of America! NT Hart2008 Dec 2011 #215

Like all presidents huh bjobotts Dec 2011 #170

If Obama gets a primary challenge, the GOP wins LuckyTheDog Dec 2011 #173

You know this for a fact??? Psychic, I guess nt HarryPowell Dec 2011 #192

Historical perspective (nt) LuckyTheDog Dec 2011 #239

Third time Ill be able to vote for president Charlemagne Dec 2011 #176

Pretty Much... K & R !!! WillyT Dec 2011 #177

yeah, better stay home and not vote certainot Dec 2011 #181

Yes he is otohara Dec 2011 #183

"i can't believe all the recs, must be a lot of folks not paying attention.... or trolls..." Number23 Dec 2011 #202

There's nothing wrong with DU Cali_Democrat Dec 2011 #223

And you say this as someone who obviously knows 99% of the population? Number23 Dec 2011 #224

Keep in mind that over 70% of Americans thought Saddam was behind 9/11 at one point Cali_Democrat Dec 2011 #226

"Overall, Americans are dumber than a sack of hammers." Number23 Dec 2011 #230

cali dem is right- there's a difference - the US is aggressively misinformed starting with a radio certainot Dec 2011 #232

rat wing radio has a big say on those percentages you both talk about. certainot Dec 2011 #231

Unfortunately, he'll be running against a Republican Warpy Dec 2011 #185

No he doesn't warrior1 Dec 2011 #187

I say, yes HarryPowell Dec 2011 #188

Agree 100%. REC. nt bertman Dec 2011 #190

Nostalgic for Eugene McCarthy? Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin Dec 2011 #193

And it got us that s--thead Nixon! 47of74 Dec 2011 #194

Somewhat disappointed that this post has so many recs. tabatha Dec 2011 #197

Go for it...Primary this President...or let him lose for lack of support... Ivywoods55 Dec 2011 #199

This is probably the dumbest damn thing I have EVER read Number23 Dec 2011 #200

The ProSense Dec 2011 #207

I agree wholeheartedly! Ivywoods55 Dec 2011 #210

PERFECTLY said, Prosense Number23 Dec 2011 #216

Give Me A Break cyberspirit Dec 2011 #204

Well said. n/t ProSense Dec 2011 #208

+1000 ellisonz Dec 2011 #217

All I can say is canetoad Dec 2011 #219

MacArthur - another blogosphere backseat whiner. CakeGrrl Dec 2011 #228

Stupid article, stupid suggestion BklnDem75 Dec 2011 #233

My first thought on reading article was remembering that McCarthy didn't get nominated... Mimosa Dec 2011 #234

K & R Raksha Dec 2011 #236

McCarthy was a perennial joke like Nader. This is fringe nonsense bullshit. Find the planet. RBInMaine Dec 2011 #238

Smart for Hillary Right-Of-The-Isle Dec 2011 #242

But you support Rick Perry, so why should YOU care? n/t jenmito Dec 2011 #243

What did it get us back then? LiberalFighter Dec 2011 #244

many of the recs are from people who NEVER post ecstatic Dec 2011 #249

BTTT Scurrilous Dec 2011 #251

OK I give = ? grantcart Dec 2011 #252

BTTT: Back To The Top. Scurrilous Dec 2011 #253