General Discussion

MADem

(135,425 posts)

235. Come off it it. LBJ was the MASTER OF THE SENATE.

Mon Mar 24, 2014, 07:13 AM

Mar 2014

He was a protege of Rayburn in the House and Russell in the Senate. He was a whip, a minority leader and a majority leader. He had enormous power and experience on the Hill. He was the product of a system that does not exist anymore.

By the time he got to the Oval Office he was an old man with YEARS of "arm twisting" under his belt. He knew how to count votes--it's a skill that takes years to develop. He knew where every body was buried and he knew how to make deals.

To suggest that a green, junior senator elevated to the White House could have that same skill is, frankly, naive. Obama had slightly--and just slightly--more experience in dealing with Congress than a governor elected to the Presidency might have.

See Robert Caro if you have any questions.

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"But we couldn't *possibly* have gotten single payer!" [View all] MannyGoldstein Mar 2014 OP

What did you do about it at the time? BainsBane Mar 2014 #1

People need to understand what was done to them, don't you think? nt MannyGoldstein Mar 2014 #4

We all lived through it BainsBane Mar 2014 #5

Putting words in my mouth again? MannyGoldstein Mar 2014 #6

Do you understand the meaning of a question mark in English? BainsBane Mar 2014 #7

Let's be clear: you asked a question, got no answer, and loudly determined my answer for me. MannyGoldstein Mar 2014 #16

Not true at all BainsBane Mar 2014 #87

Only true for people who speak English. nt MannyGoldstein Mar 2014 #91

Okay, I'll play BainsBane Mar 2014 #94

e.g., "By not answering it demonstrates you did exactly nothing to promote single payer at the time" MannyGoldstein Mar 2014 #99

True, I don't know BainsBane Mar 2014 #103

"Yeah, I guess I did make stuff up. But..." MannyGoldstein Mar 2014 #109

Right after you apologize BainsBane Mar 2014 #114

The jury says: TexasTowelie Mar 2014 #119

Wait, MANNY is the one who got alerted in that exchange? tkmorris Mar 2014 #163

Agreed. philly_bob Mar 2014 #260

+1 SammyWinstonJack Mar 2014 #273

Why ask questions? If you have a point, spit it out without Just Asking Questions. rhett o rick Mar 2014 #188

Why not ask questions? BainsBane Mar 2014 #197

That sounds a lot like something Glenn Beck would say. xocet Mar 2014 #278

Is your contention that being a leftist BainsBane Mar 2014 #291

Sure it is.I get accused of it here all the time. Bring up one point thats not the majority opinion 7962 Mar 2014 #304

In this case, it's not even a different view BainsBane Mar 2014 #317

Beck, is that you? Just asking.... n/t xocet Mar 2014 #305

"Putting words in my mouth again?" Capt. Obvious Mar 2014 #234

I think you did nothing to promote single payer. Am I right? nt Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #380

your reply to BB looks like evasion and blame... BlancheSplanchnik Mar 2014 #391

I see that as common response to anyone BainsBane Mar 2014 #407

I guess this is his only outlet BlancheSplanchnik Mar 2014 #415

No, he is working to make the Democratic party accountable to the needs of the people by TheKentuckian Mar 2014 #15

That would have been great in 2008-09 BainsBane Mar 2014 #20

We voted for Change We Can Believe In MannyGoldstein Mar 2014 #21

You didn't vote for single payer BainsBane Mar 2014 #22

I voted for a public option MannyGoldstein Mar 2014 #25

This just occurred to you today? BainsBane Mar 2014 #42

Are you a mind reader? MannyGoldstein Mar 2014 #44

I may be crappy BainsBane Mar 2014 #49

I feel zero obligation to respond to impolite people MannyGoldstein Mar 2014 #52

LOL BainsBane Mar 2014 #64

That was a thing of beauty Bainsbane. tridim Mar 2014 #85

Post removed Post removed Mar 2014 #221

Once again the topic is hijack zeemike Mar 2014 #157

Why should I have to defend Nancy Pelosi? BainsBane Mar 2014 #196

And who DID you vote for because YOU didn't vote for a public option because NO one ran on that/// VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #48

Uh, no. MannyGoldstein Mar 2014 #67

Thanks for proving my point... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #70

Which part of "But he touted the public option on his campaign website" are you unclear on? MannyGoldstein Mar 2014 #73

but he didn't campaign on it....even I knew that....please tell me you are smarter than I am! VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #76

So he put it on his campaign's web site but... what am I missing? MannyGoldstein Mar 2014 #151

He didn't campaign on it....I have said that all along.....I told you that is WHY I supported VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #161

So it was on his campaign web site, but he didn't campaign on it. MannyGoldstein Mar 2014 #167

No, never. He never said a thing about it. Common Sense Party Mar 2014 #363

Breaking: Presidential candidate forgets "sarcasm" tag. cui bono Mar 2014 #171

It was in his platform, he mentioned it in campaign speeches and he touted it during his first year cui bono Mar 2014 #328

Then why is your OP about single payer BainsBane Mar 2014 #286

Insurance and health in the same sentence does not compute, does not compute ... MindMover Mar 2014 #97

So you think there is no insurance in countries with Single Payer healthcare? VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #170

they do not sell basic health insurance of course there is property insurance and life insurance ... MindMover Mar 2014 #187

Oh yes they do....they sell cadillac plans.... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #189

but he didn't campaign on it because HE knew it wasn't possible... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #169

You were just telling yourself Obama is smarter than you are. hehe... cui bono Mar 2014 #335

Yes I am saying he IS smarter than I! Could I have gotten the Affordable Care Act passed... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #336

You ignored the entire substance of my post. He DID mention the public option while campaigning cui bono Mar 2014 #345

Mentioning it...supporting it....and running on it are very different things aren't they... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #348

He was putting the public option out there *after* the campaign. cui bono Mar 2014 #357

I am not missing anything.....he also put common sense-gun control "out there" after too.... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #359

The president was engaging in some mealy-mouth bullshit here. Ed Suspicious Mar 2014 #204

Is the Affordable Care Act just "mealy-mouthed bullshit"? VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #339

Who did you vote for since there was no public option? Republicans? nt Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #382

I wasn't DEMANDING it.....I was for Hillary at first because I believed she was closer to it than VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #384

Obama, of course. Of the two, Hillary is less to the left. nt Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #385

that is bunk...she is NOT VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #390

That uninformative graph was shown a long time ago to have incorrect results cui bono Mar 2014 #401

Uninformative huh? Where is YOUR graph to prove YOUR position??? VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #416

Look, I agree neither is what you and I want, but the way you're going about is not just wrong Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #402

Oh no it is not..... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #417

Across the board. So what's the problem? nt Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #435

Funny I voted for Barack Obama....and he won and not by a "tiny fringe group" VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #420

As did I, so what's your problem? nt Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #434

No what is YOUR problem...I wasn't the one that asked that question now was I? VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #442

Okay, we're on the same side. :) I live in North Florida. I've reached my limit of Repukes Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #443

I used to live in Jax Fla myself.... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #444

I know what you mean. It's HARD living surrounded by Repugs and teabaggers. I can't stand it. Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #445

and they are like an anchor around our neck...they are not going to move "leftward" easily.... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #447

And the thing is, they've tried it already. It failed more than miserably, but they want it again Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #451

Yes entirely.... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #452

Clinton is the current target BainsBane Mar 2014 #408

You can just feel the hypocritical mysogyny heating up...its already palpable... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #418

In this case, I think it goes beyond gender BainsBane Mar 2014 #419

Yeah I agree with you....in this case ...its beyond mere gender... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #421

Hmmm Oilwellian Mar 2014 #181

and as we see ....it couldn't have been done now could it? VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #208

Your claims are historically inaccurate Rilgin Mar 2014 #294

He LOST the magic wand? VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #298

I do not know what you are addressing Rilgin Mar 2014 #311

supporting it and believing it and campaigning on it are very different things... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #313

You have a wierd definition of campain and support Rilgin Mar 2014 #319

+1 cui bono Mar 2014 #398

This is how I remember it also. nt Mojorabbit Mar 2014 #344

None of that counts you know Autumn Mar 2014 #239

supporting it ....and belief that you can pass it through both the Senate and the House... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #301

Do you think he supports the TPP? Autumn Mar 2014 #351

and that damages the Affordable Care Act how? VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #352

Are we supposed to be looking for something that damages Obamacare? Autumn Mar 2014 #353

Yeah I do....but he didn't run on that either... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #360

So he lied when he campaigned? Got it. Autumn Mar 2014 #361

So is this President the same as George W Bush? VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #23

Yes, that's exactly what I said MannyGoldstein Mar 2014 #26

Yeah in an alternate reality....the one in that noggin of yours... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #74

They do love their dichotomy. zeemike Mar 2014 #160

What dichotomy.... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #307

they all work for the oligarchy ..... nt MindMover Mar 2014 #66

So it's all the same? BainsBane Mar 2014 #71

he was brought in to quell the disrupters ... and proved a point, that this government is totally .. MindMover Mar 2014 #75

So what's your solution? BainsBane Mar 2014 #77

we are using the future right now ... this instant ... nt MindMover Mar 2014 #80

That says nothing BainsBane Mar 2014 #82

we are still able to converse instantaneously on this medium which certain oligarchs ... MindMover Mar 2014 #86

In other words BainsBane Mar 2014 #90

that might be your method, while others around the world are changing their world .... MindMover Mar 2014 #93

You do know that the revolutionaries BainsBane Mar 2014 #96

First, the will of the people should be how our representatives vote, not the will of someone who .. MindMover Mar 2014 #101

Unfortunately, Citizens United and related rulings make that impossible BainsBane Mar 2014 #106

money will never leave politics ... MindMover Mar 2014 #108

and thus the oligarchy's power increases BainsBane Mar 2014 #111

so you are one that believes Snowden should be hung by his balls ... MindMover Mar 2014 #115

No BainsBane Mar 2014 #117

You said we lose to the oligarchs if we communicate thru this medium to our reps MindMover Mar 2014 #120

That is not what I said BainsBane Mar 2014 #123

see my post 125 MindMover Mar 2014 #129

But we keep voting in people who pretty much are the same for the most part. cui bono Mar 2014 #174

This message was self-deleted by its author BainsBane Mar 2014 #198

I believe the reason we have the shift to the right BainsBane Mar 2014 #198

The right's leaders get a message out though. They know how to frame things so that they cui bono Mar 2014 #207

Ding Ding Ding! bullsnarfle Mar 2014 #261

BINFUCKINGGO!!! laundry_queen Mar 2014 #276

Yes, and the R's come in with their crazy demands and Obama meets them halfway cui bono Mar 2014 #338

The Right Wing Owns the Media and the Churches AndyTiedye Mar 2014 #453

This message was self-deleted by its author BainsBane Mar 2014 #198

+1000 Bobbie Jo Mar 2014 #262

24,000 posts in 2 years. I'm glad to hear you're not sitting around and surfing the web. nt DisgustipatedinCA Mar 2014 #392

Clearly writing isn't as challenging or time-consuming BainsBane Mar 2014 #397

Oh, no doubt. DisgustipatedinCA Mar 2014 #399

Clearly you've missed the context of this discussion BainsBane Mar 2014 #411

"you see my concerns for human equality as objectionable" DisgustipatedinCA Mar 2014 #414

Nicely done. nt Bobbie Jo Mar 2014 #438

Well it took him a bit longer than Bush to get his truedelphi Mar 2014 #219

But we did not support him after we voted him in. passiveporcupine Mar 2014 #138

If Democrats had gotten the job done in 2009-2010, we'd have elected more of 'em MannyGoldstein Mar 2014 #142

Yeah...I guess you are right passiveporcupine Mar 2014 #176

We did not "let" the Republicans take the house. cui bono Mar 2014 #177

Yes they gerrymandered the hell out of varies states but thats our own fault really. cstanleytech Mar 2014 #186

Any gerrymandering did not take place until after 2010. MineralMan Mar 2014 #252

Okay, maybe I'm mixing the years up with the gerrymandering but cui bono Mar 2014 #321

It was low turnout, period. MineralMan Mar 2014 #322

I don't agree that gerrymandering is just an excuse. Yes, it can be overcome considering the number cui bono Mar 2014 #324

Well, if people don't turn out because of gerrymandering, MineralMan Mar 2014 #325

Gerrymandering doesn't keep people from turning out, it makes the district unbalanced to cui bono Mar 2014 #329

Wait, what? ljm2002 Mar 2014 #449

Politicians who do the work of the people will hand you something. cui bono Mar 2014 #168

No, actually, he's whining and wanting 1 person to reverse the damage done over 33 years by him (the Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #381

Yes we do need to be reminded, how do you think it will get fixed? A Simple Game Mar 2014 #256

I would love to talk about fixes BainsBane Mar 2014 #287

I read the OP as a reminder that we have to put more pressure on our elected officials. A Simple Game Mar 2014 #332

Then why when asked how to exert that pressure? BainsBane Mar 2014 #395

Maybe it's the way he is being asked. n/t A Simple Game Mar 2014 #400

I see BainsBane Mar 2014 #406

Because that particular talking-point is still being used. Fantastic Anarchist Mar 2014 #277

expanded background checks have 93 percent support in the polls BainsBane Mar 2014 #302

Is Manny in Congress? Shouldn't you be asking what his Rep in Congress did sabrina 1 Mar 2014 #320

Single payer advocates were plentiful. They asked to be seated at the table during the JDPriestly Mar 2014 #355

What do you we do about it? BainsBane Mar 2014 #394

No, but people who figure that Democrats don't respond to their interests, their problems, their JDPriestly Mar 2014 #431

Those who don't remember history... cui bono Mar 2014 #158

Yes, well it seems the OP is a bit fuzzy on his recollection of history BainsBane Mar 2014 #289

The public option was in Obama's platform and he "touted" it during his first year as POTUS. cui bono Mar 2014 #327

I am well aware of that BainsBane Mar 2014 #396

Your memory seems rather clouded. jeff47 Mar 2014 #330

No it isn't. No one tried for the public option, let alone single-payer. cui bono Mar 2014 #333

Yes, LIEBERMAN tried for a public option. And then he killed his own proposal. jeff47 Mar 2014 #337

So killing something is trying for it? mmmkay.... n/t cui bono Mar 2014 #354

Apparently you don't understand the concept of "time" jeff47 Mar 2014 #358

I thought you hated the idea of people "silencing" each other? Bonobo Mar 2014 #175

Because that is still our goal. Right? grahamhgreen Mar 2014 #231

What could, or should Manny have done about it at the time? MNBrewer Mar 2014 #240

For anything to come about BainsBane Mar 2014 #300

I agree that single payer was never on the table passiveporcupine Mar 2014 #450

How many years? MrMickeysMom Mar 2014 #422

Look, Manny, you're talking to the wrong group. And, as you know, what Americans want means nothing NYC_SKP Mar 2014 #2

we use the tools we have to organize and disorganize the oligarchs .... MindMover Mar 2014 #88

We are an O L I G A R C H Y ... MindMover Mar 2014 #3

Totally agree. Although in matters of military might and natural resources, we truedelphi Mar 2014 #218

I think you recall incorrectly. Hoyt Mar 2014 #8

Obama was green and apparently had just learned why mandates were needed. Vattel Mar 2014 #9

Obama Never Had a "Mandate" AndyTiedye Mar 2014 #47

nothing funny about an oligarchy unless you are on the inside .... looking out ...nt MindMover Mar 2014 #61

Actually I was talking about mandated health insurance Vattel Mar 2014 #100

You must confuse ours with gov't of, by and for the people. polichick Mar 2014 #10

But those "distractions" are what make all the difference. jazzimov Mar 2014 #11

and 2/3rds of Americans are not in the House..... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #12

Exactly. Hoyt Mar 2014 #14

my thoughts exactly. Whisp Mar 2014 #29

Bingo! sheshe2 Mar 2014 #34

bingo nt steve2470 Mar 2014 #148

Yeah, but that kind of blunt political analysis doesn't get a bunch of recs and attention. nt redqueen Mar 2014 #257

... Richardo Mar 2014 #258

nailed it nt steve2470 Mar 2014 #266

and this is YOUR "blunt political analysis" VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #284

I believe this would be one good example of statistics and representative forms of government MrMickeysMom Mar 2014 #423

And what makes you think we are doing what YOU described? You don't know that to be the case do you? VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #424

Who exactly is "we" in your sentence? MrMickeysMom Mar 2014 #425

whoever it is you were describing... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #427

You don't even know who I was describing... MrMickeysMom Mar 2014 #428

I don't even think you know what you were describing.... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #429

They could not give us background checks after Sandy Hook nadinbrzezinski Mar 2014 #13

Or they didn't want to do it. MannyGoldstein Mar 2014 #18

if buts and ors were gold you would be rich... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #24

We HAD a majority in the House. MannyGoldstein Mar 2014 #27

Only until Ted Kennedy passed away... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #30

Did you know that Kennedy was a Senator, not a Congressman? MannyGoldstein Mar 2014 #36

Okay true...but still we only had that filibuster proof majority for about 2 months.... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #37

2 months. How long did it take to pass a gargantuan banker bailout? MannyGoldstein Mar 2014 #43

Harry Ried HAS changed the filibuster rules....or did you miss that fact? VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #51

Not back to the way it was before. nt MannyGoldstein Mar 2014 #55

And your point is.... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #58

instead of it being lubed like it is now , huh ....nt MindMover Mar 2014 #72

its not....you just like dreaming about that.... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #79

should be no tax for 50,000 and under, everyone else pays more ... MindMover Mar 2014 #57

Where is the cutoff point now? VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #63

and all those bleary lying eyes lining up to tell us we had to do it or else .... MindMover Mar 2014 #53

We NEVER Had a Filibuster-Proof Majority for a Public Option AndyTiedye Mar 2014 #65

EXACTLY... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #68

and we even know who and why they vote crooked ... MindMover Mar 2014 #105

Manny, you really need to stop ignoring the math. phleshdef Mar 2014 #83

"they implored LBJ not to push for civil rights in this first speech, since " MannyGoldstein Mar 2014 #98

Which means absolutely nothing because the math was there for LBJ... phleshdef Mar 2014 #143

No it wasn't. That's *exactly* the point. MannyGoldstein Mar 2014 #145

Actually it was or it wouldn't have passed. phleshdef Mar 2014 #147

He *made* the math happen. MannyGoldstein Mar 2014 #150

Well, at least you don't call him a piece of shit used car salesman who sits on the couch muttering BeyondGeography Mar 2014 #173

So, LBJ Worked Hard, Very Hard, Huh? Guess You Think Obama Isn't "Working Hard"? Then? So, He's... Skraxx Mar 2014 #183

I remember LBJ and he did know how to get things done. Mojorabbit Mar 2014 #192

I loved watching LBJ in action. The man was a bulldog , an in your face Autumn Mar 2014 #241

Wow, that post is full of dog whistle, even if you didn't mean for it to be. phleshdef Mar 2014 #194

OP has proven time and time again treestar Mar 2014 #243

LBJ sat around on the toilet..... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #201

Come off it it. LBJ was the MASTER OF THE SENATE. MADem Mar 2014 #235

100% agree nt steve2470 Mar 2014 #267

Thank you. nt redqueen Mar 2014 #271

Indeed, Johnson had incredible Senate experience. n/t PoliticAverse Mar 2014 #377

So LBJ worked hard and got shit done while Obama sits on the couch muttering Number23 Mar 2014 #362

You are exactly right. That was my first thought as well which the OP conviently overlooks Number23 Mar 2014 #364

And you are overlooking that in both cases the majorities were with them nadinbrzezinski Mar 2014 #367

So in agreeing with you, I am somehow "overlooking" something? Number23 Mar 2014 #368

My apologies nadinbrzezinski Mar 2014 #369

"Cherry picked"? MannyGoldstein Mar 2014 #374

We could have, we didn't and now we need to work our asses off to tavalon Mar 2014 #17

yeah, we need to knock on doors and get the vote out and change this country .... MindMover Mar 2014 #69

Which time? tavalon Mar 2014 #432

then they shouldn't vote for people like Bachmann, Issa , Gohmert etc to Congress JI7 Mar 2014 #19

NEWSFLASH- this is a Representative Democracy. But when your goal is to be divisive on a KittyWampus Mar 2014 #28

OK, so if two-thirds of Americans want X, then our representatives should MannyGoldstein Mar 2014 #31

America does not run by referendum.....but then....you know that. VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #35

If representatives don't represent us, we must fire them MannyGoldstein Mar 2014 #39

We have done that and the money men just get to the new ones ... MindMover Mar 2014 #46

good luck getting the Teabaggers on board to only vote for YOUR favorite Representatives... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #54

We Tried To. A Large Majority Voted for Democrats In the House in 2012 AndyTiedye Mar 2014 #121

Well then, GOTV is the only answer. Skidmore Mar 2014 #232

It's the stupid gerrymandering thing gollygee Mar 2014 #236

AMEN ... MindMover Mar 2014 #110

Representative Democracy your arse ... nt MindMover Mar 2014 #33

Nailed it...nt SidDithers Mar 2014 #41

Nailed what .... lets go knock on some doors and get the vote out .... MindMover Mar 2014 #50

The most well-paid-for "representative democracy" in the world... bullwinkle428 Mar 2014 #242

Ugh. Don't worry kids. Tomorrow Manny will watch "I'm just a bill up on capitol hill" and will Squinch Mar 2014 #32

That is because the people do not have representation ... MindMover Mar 2014 #40

And for some "Democrats", that's perfectly OK. nt MannyGoldstein Mar 2014 #102

toooo many have drunk the kool aid Manny, and on this board they have tooo ... MindMover Mar 2014 #104

Do you mean this one... adirondacker Mar 2014 #56

Great film! Squinch Mar 2014 #60

It's one of my favorites :) adirondacker Mar 2014 #78

Backpeddling and whistling are his specialties. After counting recs Number23 Mar 2014 #365

Last I saw, POLLS supported gun control... brooklynite Mar 2014 #38

you nailed it nt steve2470 Mar 2014 #113

get to universal HC would require more politcal courage than exists in the dem party. KG Mar 2014 #45

and your brilliant PLAN is? VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #202

I am not sure that it is a step in the riversedge Mar 2014 #228

Today isn't the end of time. jeff47 Mar 2014 #334

Ok, how would they get Lieberman's vote? jeff47 Mar 2014 #340

Bill Maher did a routine about how Republicans win the word game. iandhr Mar 2014 #59

Actually, Medicare is not really single payer - - it's part government, part insurer, part Hoyt Mar 2014 #127

VA is the only real Socialized Medicine in the country... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #203

We couldn't, because we needed a super-majority to get anything through the Senate. pnwmom Mar 2014 #62

Those who opposed single payer were more motivated and better funded. Kaleva Mar 2014 #81

correct nt steve2470 Mar 2014 #118

My guess is that those who vigorously supported single payer were a small minority Kaleva Mar 2014 #124

correct again steve2470 Mar 2014 #128

system needs an upgrade that can be handled by the internet ... MindMover Mar 2014 #122

Some day in the future we may have direct voting. Kaleva Mar 2014 #126

it is coming sooner than you think ... MindMover Mar 2014 #130

how? VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #205

it will start on blogs just like this .... MindMover Mar 2014 #210

We couldn't have gotten it, but it still should have been part of the discussion. DanTex Mar 2014 #84

well funded by the oligarchs .... MindMover Mar 2014 #92

What did two thirds of the .01% of the world want? They're all that matter. nt valerief Mar 2014 #89

BINGO ... and later, political winds change .... MindMover Mar 2014 #95

The ONLY time Congress is reflective of the overriding American will is.... steve2470 Mar 2014 #107

put our votes on the net ... let the whole world see it .... MindMover Mar 2014 #112

the votes of Congress or the votes of American voters ? nt steve2470 Mar 2014 #116

I say we organize an internet voting that anyone with voting rights and computer access MindMover Mar 2014 #125

it's a good idea but... steve2470 Mar 2014 #131

way to fast on the negative .... MindMover Mar 2014 #135

eh I think I'm just realistic about American apathy steve2470 Mar 2014 #137

we are apathetic for a reason ... no representation ... MindMover Mar 2014 #141

People just don't care or don't care enough... steve2470 Mar 2014 #146

now how long did that take you to type, an intelligent response reflecting your heartfelt feelings . MindMover Mar 2014 #149

Your idea is a good one...honest steve2470 Mar 2014 #152

idealism strikes again... VanillaRhapsody Mar 2014 #206

the blog bully tries to limit discourse by contributing nothing but bullyisms ... MindMover Mar 2014 #209

Have a look at the constitution BainsBane Mar 2014 #133

I think he's proposing a feedback system steve2470 Mar 2014 #136

are you bainsman or bane .... cmon, you are not getting the picture ... MindMover Mar 2014 #140

Then you simply write a letter about each piece of legislation BainsBane Mar 2014 #292

as I have said before, money is not leaving politics ... MindMover Mar 2014 #312

The Internet massively opposed the invasion of Iraq. jeff47 Mar 2014 #342

here is a needles distraction... Raine1967 Mar 2014 #132

yes we will, Social Security wasn't built in a day nt steve2470 Mar 2014 #139

You're right. It wasn't. Raine1967 Mar 2014 #153

Yup, remember when it was a private investment mandate with a tax credit to help the poor offset TheKentuckian Mar 2014 #193

you and I will always disagree about ACA steve2470 Mar 2014 #195

No, that's not what we have to do. jeff47 Mar 2014 #346

There was more than two-thirds who wanted background checks, did it pass? Thinkingabout Mar 2014 #134

Agreed. In both cases, politicians didn't get the job done. nt MannyGoldstein Mar 2014 #144

Boehner and others can yell "do what the people want", who is the people Thinkingabout Mar 2014 #155

I would question that poll treestar Mar 2014 #154

That's "2/3 of Americans"; not ... 1StrongBlackMan Mar 2014 #156

It seems like lobbyists write a fair number of laws for them. GreenPartyVoter Mar 2014 #159

Indeed YoungDemCA Mar 2014 #179

True ... 1StrongBlackMan Mar 2014 #244

Not at all. You were stating that it is the Congressional representives GreenPartyVoter Mar 2014 #372

The point is: Maedhros Mar 2014 #285

Did he take it off the table after one meeting with big pharma? ... 1StrongBlackMan Mar 2014 #315

There are benefits to taking the initiative, framing the debate and putting one's opponents Maedhros Mar 2014 #343

Public opinion polls don't pass laws. gcomeau Mar 2014 #162

nailed it nt steve2470 Mar 2014 #166

Allowing single payer to be on the table... ljm2002 Mar 2014 #214

Nailed it. nt LWolf Mar 2014 #281

Doubtful. Lieberman killed his own public option proposal. jeff47 Mar 2014 #347

+ 100 JoePhilly Mar 2014 #387

Regardless of what Lieberman did... ljm2002 Mar 2014 #412

I'll spot you all the blue dogs except JoePhilly Mar 2014 #386

Please explain to me... ljm2002 Mar 2014 #413

That part is easy. JoePhilly Mar 2014 #433

Once again, you are unclear on the concept... ljm2002 Mar 2014 #437

Thanks for proving my point so quickly. JoePhilly Mar 2014 #440

And thanks for proving mine... ljm2002 Mar 2014 #441

Yeah, not sure why this is still so surprising to people Chathamization Mar 2014 #233

It's not because he wanted a PO: "I never campaigned on the Public Option." WhaTHellsgoingonhere Mar 2014 #164

This message was self-deleted by its author Richardo Mar 2014 #165

What does two-thirds of all Americans count for against Max Boughtkus? Jack Rabbit Mar 2014 #172

Public opinion means less and less nowadays YoungDemCA Mar 2014 #178

Fucking republicans...you can specifically thank gopiscrap Mar 2014 #180

Are You Truly This Simple Minded? Or Is It Disingenuous? Perhaps Both? Skraxx Mar 2014 #182

This. nt ecstatic Mar 2014 #223

nailed it nt steve2470 Mar 2014 #227

I would add deliberately divisive to that list. nt Bobbie Jo Mar 2014 #230

See post 249. ProSense Mar 2014 #250

Yup Bobbie Jo Mar 2014 #297

Good questions. nt redqueen Mar 2014 #259

He's upset 3/31 is approaching and JoePhilly Mar 2014 #263

A little from Column A, but overflooding from Column B. This is all fun and games to this poster Number23 Mar 2014 #366

But...but...but...they gave us the best they could!!!1111111ELEVENS Vashta Nerada Mar 2014 #184

2 Big 2 Fail vs. 2 Small 2 Matter ... Guess who ALWAYS wins in DC??? blkmusclmachine Mar 2014 #185

TWO THIRDS!!!!!! OOOOH!!! AAAAH!!!! But not TWO THIRDS OF CONGRESS.... MADem Mar 2014 #190

cmon madem, the rubber has not been meeting the road for many years now .... MindMover Mar 2014 #211

70-90% of Americans (ultimately) want peace, gun control, HSR, Medicare for all, MisterP Mar 2014 #191

And Two Thirds (AT&T) of Congre$$ where against it. Amonester Mar 2014 #212

You know politicians. moondust Mar 2014 #213

Yeah, and Kucinich was "unelectable" so we went with the black guy with the Arab name. Spitfire of ATJ Mar 2014 #215

Kick. Kurovski Mar 2014 #216

or he could have just tried harder to win , after all elizabeth warren won JI7 Mar 2014 #217

President Elizabeth Warren. Yeah, that was awesome.I loved it when Patti Smith sang at her inaugural Kurovski Mar 2014 #220

he lost his last election which was a congressional primary JI7 Mar 2014 #222

Hurray for redistricting! Kurovski Mar 2014 #373

Kucinich supported the Redistricting plan , but the district he ran in was still Dem JI7 Mar 2014 #375

They would have insisted on a wife swapping party. Spitfire of ATJ Mar 2014 #306

Why couldn't HE get more support given Manny's polls? JoePhilly Mar 2014 #314

It's the POLICY of the US to support CAPITALISM no matter which party is in power.... Spitfire of ATJ Mar 2014 #393

We have the best government corporations can buy. The majority of people want marijuana B Calm Mar 2014 #224

For the 2014 election and the 2016 election all Democratic candidates should Enthusiast Mar 2014 #225

Certainly a hit in all the Gerrymandered Republican districts... brooklynite Mar 2014 #237

But Manny, you know people don't vote that way n2doc Mar 2014 #226

"But we couldn't *possibly* have gotten single payer!" DeSwiss Mar 2014 #229

Rec'd in part because of attempts to attack the messenger (nt) Babel_17 Mar 2014 #238

The messanger needs to take a civics class. nt JoePhilly Mar 2014 #316

K & R, Manny. Single payer is going to come because it's the only thing mother earth Mar 2014 #245

How many support raising taxes on the 1%? How likely is that to happen? Adrahil Mar 2014 #246

You, um, realize we don't actually pass laws by referendum, right? Recursion Mar 2014 #247

Congress can't do shit unless the obstructionists stop obstructing. randome Mar 2014 #248

The point is manufactured outrage. JoePhilly Mar 2014 #265

Yeah, I'm not sure how no one gets this. Arkana Mar 2014 #288

The point is Congress is supposed to work for the people. Remember that? polichick Mar 2014 #296

Is it? The House is, I guess. The Senate is supposed to work for the States Recursion Mar 2014 #409

Uh... we should be thanking *Bernie Sanders and Ron Wyden* for single payer in America. ProSense Mar 2014 #249

If you have 10 fingers, i demand that you play Rachmaninoff Piano Concerto #3 by lunch. yodermon Mar 2014 #251

If I run for the office of Concert Pianist at the BSO, and claim I'm the greatest pianist available MannyGoldstein Mar 2014 #254

Remember Medicare Vouchers? HockeyMom Mar 2014 #253

It's true, republicans are so bad rock Mar 2014 #255

If Gallup polls decided our laws, a lot of Progressive dog Mar 2014 #264

Also, Mitt Romney would be President right now. Arkana Mar 2014 #269

You have a very naive understanding of how people in Washington think. Arkana Mar 2014 #268

"turn the will of two-thirds of Americans into law" Babel_17 Mar 2014 #270

Big Monied Interests and Folks in Government Who Lack the Guts fascisthunter Mar 2014 #272

DURec leftstreet Mar 2014 #274

%66.6 is not greater than %1.0 in the Corporate Representive Republic (n/t) harun Mar 2014 #275

too simplistic. the left allows 1200 rw radio stations to yell over that majority certainot Mar 2014 #279

we are a managed "democracy'. Warren Stupidity Mar 2014 #280

Exactly. A "democracy" not at all - sooner we get that, the better. polichick Mar 2014 #299

When Was The Plebiscite? ProfessorGAC Mar 2014 #282

Two thirds or more also want some gun control. Lot of good that did us! Auntie Bush Mar 2014 #283

I think you have our form of government confused with a social democracy. Rex Mar 2014 #290

The companies know what's best for the rest! 99% Austerity Baby, and good times for all! nt adirondacker Mar 2014 #303

That shows the power of lobbyists and big money in politics ErikJ Mar 2014 #293

We could have given it that college try... lame54 Mar 2014 #295

Perhaps that would have resulted in same place Rilgin Mar 2014 #308

The ACA passed - that's a fact... lame54 Mar 2014 #371

Not following thread Rilgin Mar 2014 #426

Nice ramble... lame54 Mar 2014 #439

Look at the tile of this Thread Rilgin Mar 2014 #448

Correct. We couldn't. Orsino Mar 2014 #309

The insurance companies ran that show. Mojo Electro Mar 2014 #310

i thik your polling source is suspect crimeariver1225 Mar 2014 #318

As you well know, the government serves at the exclusive pleasure of the 1%, Zorra Mar 2014 #323

Unless you explain how you get Lieberman to vote for it, you don't have a point. jeff47 Mar 2014 #326

... the corporate overlords chuckle at what the "people" want Arugula Latte Mar 2014 #331

Hit that one out of the park, Manny! Excellent OP. Divernan Mar 2014 #341

OP: "Including, IIRC, more than half of Republicans." ProSense Mar 2014 #350

Another highly manipulative post from you Yavin4 Mar 2014 #349

It was *many* poll results. Did you click the link? MannyGoldstein Mar 2014 #376

How many polls support tighter gun legislation? Yavin4 Mar 2014 #378

Sanders: Single Payer Never Had A Chance (2010) ProSense Mar 2014 #356

Check out this great post from David Swanson, Dec-24-08 11:18 AM Zorra Mar 2014 #370

I read it. David Swanson did a lot of whining. The first person to respond at least had a solution Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #383

I didn't see anything about a third party in that post. What I saw was accurate analysis Zorra Mar 2014 #389

I have noticed one thing about the anti-Obama, so-called libs. They sit on their fat asses and do Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #403

You mean, like David Swanson? Zorra Mar 2014 #410

That's Swanson's career. It's how he puts food on his table, how he buys his suits, how he pays for Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #436

Start explaining how you would've gotten single-payer if you'd been president. I await impatiently Sarah Ibarruri Mar 2014 #379

1/3 of the Senate and the entire house is up for re-election this year IronLionZion Mar 2014 #388

C'mon...everyone knows Elizabeth Warren could have won in Arkansas...Alaska...Louisiana...Montana brooklynite Mar 2014 #405

Fox News leads our bubble MSM underpants Mar 2014 #404

Which made single payer a good starting point mvd Mar 2014 #430

80% want complete background checks for gun sales krawhitham Mar 2014 #446

Kick woo me with science Mar 2014 #454

We CAN Have a Public Option -- at the State or County Level AndyTiedye Apr 2014 #455