Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

ProSense

(116,464 posts)
60. So because Greenwald says,
Mon May 12, 2014, 11:27 PM
May 2014

"I am not “endorsing” or expressing support for anyone’s candidacy"

...you're buying into his spin, and claiming:

"I don't agree with everything Greenwald says in this article, but his view on the Pauls is far more nuanced than you are making it out to be. "

Greenwald stated:

But what makes the media most eager to disappear Paul is that he destroys the easy, conventional narrative — for slothful media figures and for Democratic loyalists alike. Aside from the truly disappeared former New Mexico Governor Gary Johnson (more on him in a moment), Ron Paul is far and away the most anti-war, anti-Surveillance-State, anti-crony-capitalism, and anti-drug-war presidential candidate in either party. How can the conventional narrative of extremist/nationalistic/corporatist/racist/warmongering GOP v. the progressive/peaceful/anti-corporate/poor-and-minority-defending Democratic Party be reconciled with the fact that a candidate with those positions just virtually tied for first place among GOP base voters in Iowa? Not easily, and Paul is thus disappeared from existence. That the similarly anti-war, pro-civil-liberties, anti-drug-war Gary Johnson is not even allowed in media debates — despite being a twice-elected popular governor — highlights the same dynamic.

It is true, as Booman convincingly argues, that “the bigfoot reporters move like a herd” and “put fingers on the scales in elections all the time.” But sometimes that’s done for petty reasons (such as their 2000 swooning for George Bush’s personality and contempt for Al Gore’s); in this case, it is being done (with the effect if not intent) to maintain simplistic partisan storylines and exclude important views from the discourse.

However much progressives find Paul’s anti-choice views to be disqualifying (even if the same standard is not applied to Good Democrats Harry Reid or Bob Casey), and even as much as Paul’s domestic policies are anathema to liberals (the way numerous positions of Barack Obama ostensibly are: war escalation, due-process-free assassinations, entitlement cuts, and whistleblower wars anyone?), shouldn’t progressives be eager to have included in the discourse many of the views Paul uniquely advocates? After all, these are critical, not ancillary, positions, such as: genuine opposition to imperialism and wars; warnings about the excesses of the Surveillance State, executive power encroachments, and civil liberties assaults; and attacks on the one policy that is most responsible for the unjustifiable imprisonment of huge numbers of minorities and poor and the destruction of their families and communities: Drug Prohibition and the accompanying War to enforce it. GOP primary voters are supporting a committed anti-war, anti-surveillance candidate who wants to stop imprisoning people (dispropriationately minorities) for drug usage; Democrats, by contrast, are cheering for a war-escalating, drone-attacking, surveillance-and-secrecy-obsessed drug warrior.

The nuance there is Greenwald basically saying: Yeah, sure progressives find Paul's "anti-choice views to be disqualifying" and while his "policies are anathema to liberals" they give Reid and Obama a pass on equivalent or worse views.

I mean, why are Democrats "cheering for a "war-escalating, drone-attacking, surveillance-and-secrecy-obsessed drug warrior" when they could be "cheering" the genuine Ron Paul?

Greenwald is delusional, and your spin doesn't work. He holds Democrats in contempt and spends a lot of ink defending Ron and Rand Paul against criticism from Democrats.

Glenn Greenwald defend Rand Paul against "Democratic myths"
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022485711

You want Greenwald to have his cake and eat it too by claiming that he isn't “'endorsing' or expressing support for anyone’s candidacy." He's just saying Ron Paul is the best, "genuine," on every issue, yet instead of cheering Paul, Democrats are "cheering for a war-escalating, drone-attacking, surveillance-and-secrecy-obsessed drug warrior."

Why can't Democrats see what Greenwald sees in Paul?

That's the nuance. Greenwald is delusional.

Greenwald: Thumbs Up or Down? [View all] MannyGoldstein May 2014 OP
Did someone say something mean about Greenwald again? ProSense May 2014 #1
Post removed Post removed May 2014 #63
Looks like you're in the minority. ForgoTheConsequence May 2014 #75
You mean popularity contest? Bobbie Jo May 2014 #79
Watch out, now! Number23 May 2014 #77
The reason people hate Greenwald so much is because they are terrified of him Bjorn Against May 2014 #2
I think people ProSense May 2014 #5
I know you like to pretend he focuses his energy promoting Ron Paul... Bjorn Against May 2014 #9
Wait, ProSense May 2014 #13
He claimed that Ron Paul was the most "anti-war, anti-Surveillance-State, MannyGoldstein May 2014 #15
Well, ProSense May 2014 #33
I guess there's not a straightforward answer to my question. nt MannyGoldstein May 2014 #36
LOL! ProSense May 2014 #37
This message was self-deleted by its author Dragonfli May 2014 #71
He also said continuously that he did not endorse Ron Paul Bjorn Against May 2014 #28
"the simple-minded Manicheans and the lying partisan enforcers will claim the opposite" Hassin Bin Sober May 2014 #51
That's certainly how it works around here. n/t QC May 2014 #91
It only "works" for a handful who post far more often than their actual presence here. bvar22 May 2014 #98
So because Greenwald says, ProSense May 2014 #60
The fact that he's an asshole who promotes people who want to destroy this country baldguy May 2014 #19
Oh yeah, greenwald is a big ol scary asshole and wants everyone to be very afraid of him. Cha May 2014 #44
I'm gonna go out on a limb and say there isn't a single DUr terrified of Greenwald nt arely staircase May 2014 #53
I concur psiman May 2014 #64
you think DUers are afraid of Greenwald? a few suits in govt agencies, perhaps, but regular people? dionysus May 2014 #89
Big thumbs up! Three cheers for Greenwald! Autumn May 2014 #3
"sad" - does "Milquetoast" count?!1 n/t UTUSN May 2014 #4
Greenwald is a user and abuser, his patsy is stuck in Russia after flying there on advice, Thinkingabout May 2014 #6
A patsy is a person who pays for a crime another person committed 365fx May 2014 #8
Wrong, check another dictionary, one who is easily fooled, that be Snowden. Thinkingabout May 2014 #11
Are you saying that Greenwald told Snowden to steal the NSA documents? 365fx May 2014 #12
Who has used the information to write articles? Snowden, who ask Putin a trumped Thinkingabout May 2014 #17
Snowden offered and gave Laura Poitras, Glenn Greenwald and Barton Gellman the information 365fx May 2014 #25
You're forgetting about Greenwald's astonishing powers of mind control MannyGoldstein May 2014 #29
Thank you for your fact-based comments truebluegreen May 2014 #45
Message auto-removed Name removed May 2014 #50
how dare anyone make money! bobduca May 2014 #82
It's easy, just need a list of patsies and sit back and get big contracts for yourself. Thinkingabout May 2014 #83
Up !!! & Rec !!! WillyT May 2014 #7
yeah, callous remarks about stolen children can be controversial. nt arely staircase May 2014 #10
I couldn't agree with you more, arley! sheshe2 May 2014 #16
Sure, among people with poor reading comprehension skills who are unable to parse a sentence. nt Electric Monk May 2014 #18
ah, the old taken out of context excuse arely staircase May 2014 #20
You are opposed to the 6th amendment? Electric Monk May 2014 #26
I am against assholes arely staircase May 2014 #31
Glenn was Hale's civil attorney. By choice...the 6th has nothing to do with Greenwald's decision to msanthrope May 2014 #54
And John Adams represented British soldiers accused of attacking Americans around the time of JDPriestly May 2014 #72
Thank you for underscoring my point....Greenwald protected the business interests of msanthrope May 2014 #74
John Adams was also close to a dictator as president. When Jefferson defeated him it wasnt called arely staircase May 2014 #76
There is nothing wrong with their reading skills. zeemike May 2014 #68
Suppose a president had, at his inaugural, the invocation given by a pastor MannyGoldstein May 2014 #21
suppose you just change the subject arely staircase May 2014 #22
Why? MannyGoldstein May 2014 #23
Why? You tell me. The most recent thing G has done is make an asshole comment about those arely staircase May 2014 #27
You're reducing Greenwald to an insensitive comment. MannyGoldstein May 2014 #32
so you don't want to discuss greenwald in your greenwald thread? arely staircase May 2014 #34
I assume no correction will be issued. MannyGoldstein May 2014 #35
I will explain it in detail in my book. ng arely staircase May 2014 #38
You win the thread! zappaman May 2014 #43
"Glad" for the apoplexy he causes some of my favorite DUers. WorseBeforeBetter May 2014 #14
Right psiman May 2014 #65
Trust me, DU "squabbling" about Glenn Greenwald... WorseBeforeBetter May 2014 #92
Same Capt. Obvious May 2014 #84
^^#63^^ WorseBeforeBetter May 2014 #93
It does Capt. Obvious May 2014 #97
No surprise there. Bobbie Jo May 2014 #94
Kick. By all means let's see. pa28 May 2014 #24
I think some people don't like him because JaneyVee May 2014 #30
I think the people who criticize his tweets are the ones who already hated him 365fx May 2014 #40
Always the victim. No one "hates" him. JaneyVee May 2014 #55
Thumbs up! 840high May 2014 #39
...and I'll add that it's a waste of time for some to continue personal attacks on Greenwald... Sancho May 2014 #41
Is this a contest.... Historic NY May 2014 #42
A contest. Everything's a contest. n/t DeSwiss May 2014 #46
Makes one really wonder WHY such a small minority is so vocal (nt) anti partisan May 2014 #47
Fragile egos too wrapped up in "identity politics" bobduca May 2014 #81
, blkmusclmachine May 2014 #48
The frothing hatred Greenwald gives some is hilarious neverforget May 2014 #49
I dont think it's hilarious but I agree it's sad. They are living in a denial bubble, thinking that rhett o rick May 2014 #66
neither DonCoquixote May 2014 #52
Up. Iggo May 2014 #56
greenwald pisses off the right people.. frylock May 2014 #57
I gotta say, I love threads about Glen Autumn May 2014 #58
definitely a guilty pleasure! frylock May 2014 #59
I would love to be in a newborn nursery and steal all the binkies just to hear the babies cry Autumn May 2014 #80
Actually Bobbie Jo May 2014 #96
In a post earlier today, there was a quote from Greenwald shawn703 May 2014 #61
Let's wait and see whether there are very explosive revelations and then decide whether JDPriestly May 2014 #73
"Our" interests? Whatchu mean WE, Kemosabe? eridani May 2014 #78
like him or not, snowden put his freedom in jeapordy.. as greenwalds trying to make a buck off it. dionysus May 2014 #87
I support Greenwald... nikto May 2014 #62
Greenwald is a distraction psiman May 2014 #67
Snowden made Obama look bad Fumesucker May 2014 #70
I'll have to go with "other" here War Horse May 2014 #69
oompah, loompah, doopity doo, i have another push poll for you... dionysus May 2014 #85
And this is a push poll... how? nt MannyGoldstein May 2014 #86
too narrow of a set of responses, sad\glad\other. other is too ambiguous. just my opinion though. dionysus May 2014 #88
How would you propose to word it in a way MannyGoldstein May 2014 #90
Exactly. I don't trust him. PeaceNikki May 2014 #95
Yay, Glenn Greenwald! Enthusiast May 2014 #99
I just wish Snowden had released the documents to a competent journalist psiman May 2014 #100
Latest Discussions»General Discussion»Greenwald: Thumbs Up or D...»Reply #60