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RainDog

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139. Mark Twain

Thu May 15, 2014, 08:29 PM

May 2014

Last edited Thu May 15, 2014, 11:01 PM - Edit history (1)

was a great champion of anti-colonialism in Africa during the reign of terror by Leopold of Belgium. One of Leopold's enforcers, who cut off the limbs of people in the Congo Free State forced to work on rubber plantations, was the inspiration for Kurtz in Conrad's Heart of Darkness.

People sometimes sold a family member into slavery to pay for their taxes. Leopold exterminated entire villages. He looted the nation and much of that plunder is in a beautiful museum in Brussels... still.

Leopold, Twain noted, was upset because people only wrote about what made the King look bad. Leopold was jealous because all the other European monarchs had colonies, while his intent was to convert them all to Christianity. He meant well.

Mark Twain was ahead of his time in so many ways - sadly, b/c he used the vernacular of speech of his time, he's often seen as supporting rather than opposing what existed. That happens when people don't read with their critical thinking skills involved. I try to remember that.

http://diglib1.amnh.org/articles/kls/

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I hate to get into it, but here goes [View all] RainDog May 2014 OP

I see this, the feminist group and the men's group, all as divide and conqure angstlessk May 2014 #1

a big tent has lots of different experiences within RainDog May 2014 #5

Divisive? alp227 May 2014 #10

In a back and forth in one of the other threads... CANDO May 2014 #21

Whoa. So you're essentially arguing the same thing that spammers argue, alp227 May 2014 #26

Where are you coming up with that? CANDO May 2014 #28

when I saw the "bash white people" part of your post, alp227 May 2014 #32

Post removed Post removed May 2014 #33

no one is talking about YOU! boston bean May 2014 #27

It's a term that has been around for a while RainDog May 2014 #34

Thank you for a positive and constructive response CANDO May 2014 #38

Thank you for taking the time to listen to my rambles RainDog May 2014 #40

Yes, yes. People different from you talking about their experiences really just boils down to Squinch May 2014 #104

*sigh* ismnotwasm May 2014 #109

I see this quote as key RainDog May 2014 #151

I think we need to stay away from broad brush generalizations of everybody. White privilege? Give applegrove May 2014 #137

I don't think you understand what big tent means. n/t mattclearing May 2014 #163

It doesn't mean "do whatever you can not to make the majority uncomfortable." n/t nomorenomore08 May 2014 #200

I stay out of a lot of discussions here notadmblnd May 2014 #2

rec'd mike_c May 2014 #3

Dang! Baitball Blogger May 2014 #4

this guy said it better than me RainDog May 2014 #48

The phrase "white privilege" couldn't be better designed to put poor whites on the defensive Fumesucker May 2014 #6

Think of it as a test of character RainDog May 2014 #7

This message was self-deleted by its author Dragonfli May 2014 #24

No, the stupid strawman erected about poor white people is what's designed to do that. NuclearDem May 2014 #8

I personally understand that Fumesucker May 2014 #9

I understand what you're saying, too RainDog May 2014 #11

Yes, talk of privilege is undermined with the Randian "you deserve what you got" mentality Chathamization May 2014 #23

Luck and personal effort are both involved. It's not either/or. nomorenomore08 May 2014 #201

"Personal effort" is a poor term for it Chathamization May 2014 #205

I agree with you. There is a lot in life we can't control, starting with the parents we're born to. nomorenomore08 May 2014 #210

True, it's a hard line to walk. Chathamization May 2014 #214

Agree with everything you wrote, especially "those that end up at the bottom" not being at fault nomorenomore08 May 2014 #215

Well said. Thanks for going over some of this stuff with me. N/T Chathamization May 2014 #217

Thanks for your contributions to this thread RainDog May 2014 #216

Thank you for making a thread that's fostered such a good discussion Chathamization May 2014 #218

it was not meant to "put poor whites on the defensive".... VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #45

please don't try to read others' minds RainDog May 2014 #49

I was responding TO reading of minds..... VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #50

that person talked about phrasing, not mind reading RainDog May 2014 #53

Why are certain words, terms and phrases essentially banned on DU? Fumesucker May 2014 #55

Failure.... VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #60

But they weren't playing on the "easy" setting Fumesucker May 2014 #62

No one said anything about that but YOU! VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #63

Isn't that that the implication of privilege? Fumesucker May 2014 #68

and every indication says that if you are a White male...in any situation VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #71

Isn't that what I said? Fumesucker May 2014 #72

So are you saying that those who are poor and not White male are even more at fault? VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #74

No, just the opposite and you know it Fumesucker May 2014 #75

No....this is the dumbest argument for your position ever... VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #78

Explain how the uber-privileged fail then.. Fumesucker May 2014 #83

Are they? VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #86

Evidently we are in violent agreement Fumesucker May 2014 #87

Well you have...whether you know it or not... VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #91

I already said that and explained what as I see as some implications Fumesucker May 2014 #95

Yes calling it like it TI is... VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #96

I'm glad we had this little chat Fumesucker May 2014 #99

Giving up so soon? VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #103

What part of "I agree with you" do you fail to understand? Fumesucker May 2014 #105

I am sure you do.... VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #107

Exactly, fairly shortly men will be unnecessary for reproduction Fumesucker May 2014 #114

Of course you are.... VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #118

Of course you are... VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #119

Nice graphics Fumesucker May 2014 #120

I know they are.. VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #122

The drug war is somewhere the government could make a *huge* difference in white privilege Fumesucker May 2014 #123

Yeah right....sure whatever... VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #124

If you are poor and White male...it is still easier than being poor and Black and or poor and Female VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #64

Where do we disagree? Fumesucker May 2014 #76

Then you admit you are just trolling? VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #79

How is agreeing with you trolling? Fumesucker May 2014 #82

How is what you are saying agreeing with me? VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #130

You don't think white males have a significant advantage in life? Fumesucker May 2014 #155

Of course you do... VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #157

What are you arguing with? Fumesucker May 2014 #162

I am not arguing....nor am I making light of a serious issues people are facing in this country... VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #164

Boy it sure doesn't take much to get an ad hominem response from you truedelphi May 2014 #181

fwiw RainDog May 2014 #195

fwiw VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #213

Ad Hominem I have been posting chart after chart to prove my point... VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #212

I know from visiting my son's college and being on his campus for some two weeks, truedelphi May 2014 #115

Selective admissions in general are anathema to equality and public money shouldn't go to Chathamization May 2014 #173

I'm going to try to speak to this point ... JoePhilly May 2014 #128

Thanks for your thoughtful reply RainDog May 2014 #138

Thanks ... JoePhilly May 2014 #176

Nailed it. ctsnowman May 2014 #58

No he didn't VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #61

Yep. Great outreach program. Eleanors38 May 2014 #81

So by your theory....since we have a Black President....Racism is over right? VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #160

Thank you for your consideration RainDog May 2014 #165

hahahaha he has? VanillaRhapsody May 2014 #166

Kick. Denial and arguing that "I probably have it worse than a person of color Squinch May 2014 #12

to read that shit here is just heartbreaking and maddening. boston bean May 2014 #18

Yes. That was beyond the pale. Squinch May 2014 #39

BRAVO Raindog!!! As a poor white person who's been through a lot... it's NOTHING compared to what DesertDiamond May 2014 #13

It's the strangest thing, how some people deny and get offended BlancheSplanchnik May 2014 #19

I agree RainDog May 2014 #37

I agree mostly, as well... freebrew May 2014 #70

It's the outrage du jour! Initech May 2014 #14

I see hurt on both sides RainDog May 2014 #15

Excellent post RainDog and well said. Thank you. justhanginon May 2014 #16

Thank you RainDog May 2014 #47

Only a fool believes that white privilege doesn't exist. blackspade May 2014 #17

Damn right. riqster May 2014 #57

Yes, I grew up poor and made plenty of bad decisions bhikkhu May 2014 #67

Problem solved! shaayecanaan May 2014 #88

We can admit that there is both a poverty problem and a race-based inequality problem bhikkhu May 2014 #150

Well Said! BlancheSplanchnik May 2014 #20

true, many of them are one in the same. boston bean May 2014 #22

that's a fact. BlancheSplanchnik May 2014 #25

As a matter of principle, I'll just take a moment to note that perhaps, JUST PERHAPS... Shandris May 2014 #29

I think that's one reason the term isn't the best RainDog May 2014 #30

Well said, and I can't (and wouldn't want to) argue with the overall sentiment one bit. Shandris May 2014 #35

well said RainDog May 2014 #36

You cannot "set aside" economics in probably any political discussion, definitely not in the US. TheKentuckian May 2014 #178

I agree, of course RainDog May 2014 #187

Your comment is extremely petinent. n/t truedelphi May 2014 #116

K&R Ohio Joe May 2014 #31

With you. High five. Unity need not be conflated with uniformity of outlook and purity of soul. ancianita May 2014 #41

When people of color discuss our experiences here on DU regarding race, PLEASE Liberal_Stalwart71 May 2014 #42

+1 ScreamingMeemie May 2014 #43

I've really not been aware of the level of aggravation RainDog May 2014 #46

White male poster here - can't disagree with a word; happy to K&R. bullwinkle428 May 2014 #44

"supports the idea that white people do not want to understand the experience of others" Number23 May 2014 #51

I hesitated RainDog May 2014 #54

K&R, well stated. (n/t) MadrasT May 2014 #52

Please stop blaming DU for its trolls. nt valerief May 2014 #56

Why? If those views are expressed here and continue to be expressed here with no PPRing or hiding seaglass May 2014 #59

You know the poster doesn't want to be lumped in with racists and hell neither do I. boston bean May 2014 #66

Excellent post RainDog NCTraveler May 2014 #65

All white privilege means The Wizard May 2014 #69

The same for Chinese, Japanese, etc shaayecanaan May 2014 #89

You are presuming to tell people that a particular topic of discussion is off limits. totodeinhere May 2014 #73

Diversity good, dissent bad... shaayecanaan May 2014 #92

No, honestly, it doesn't say that RainDog May 2014 #106

I became aware of how priviliged I am sulphurdunn May 2014 #77

Good post Harmony Blue May 2014 #84

No wonder you say things like this. bravenak May 2014 #98

No one disproved what I put forth Harmony Blue May 2014 #154

Competition is in our nature. davidthegnome May 2014 #80

oh we are all human first in this country heaven05 May 2014 #94

To be honest, I've only ever heard the term from pious white liberals... shaayecanaan May 2014 #97

per your last line heaven05 May 2014 #85

I appreciate your post, and agree with most of it. Eleanors38 May 2014 #90

we live in a country where a political party routinely uses race noiretextatique May 2014 #108

If I'm getting what you say, the difference in messages Eleanors38 May 2014 #117

bullshit noiretextatique May 2014 #219

Whether it 's the internet or T.V., the message is created Eleanors38 May 2014 #220

White Privilege is very real . . FairWinds May 2014 #93

75% of Americans oppose legacy preferences shaayecanaan May 2014 #100

but preferences for a winning college athelete are just dandy ... kwassa May 2014 #149

here you go shaayecanaan May 2014 #186

Can't read it, there is a paywall. kwassa May 2014 #189

then try here shaayecanaan May 2014 #193

I didn't know this was started to limit Jewish and immigrant kids RainDog May 2014 #194

I agree n/t RainDog May 2014 #110

Thanks RainDog. NOLALady May 2014 #101

AMEN and AMEN!! If we objectify human nature like the OP has done then MAYBE people will stop uponit7771 May 2014 #102

this shit is so insidious...and yet so obvious noiretextatique May 2014 #111

as a teen underachiever, I got a pretty close look at white privilege paulkienitz May 2014 #112

Thanks to RainDog for this Post kmlisle May 2014 #113

great reply RainDog May 2014 #144

People either get it or they don't ecstatic May 2014 #121

Kicked and recommended. Uncle Joe May 2014 #125

Can we resolve Climate Change now, please...next! randys1 May 2014 #126

Believe it or not, this moves us a step forward in that regard. Uncle Joe May 2014 #131

You write good...me stupid compared to you LOL randys1 May 2014 #177

Thanks for the positivity RainDog May 2014 #188

Just when Miami gets to be the Venice of the south? RainDog May 2014 #141

If we all take a step back Babel_17 May 2014 #127

Not to mention RainDog May 2014 #142

Well said, Rain Dog bettyellen May 2014 #129

Thanks for your kindness RainDog May 2014 #140

"African Americans cannot talk about offenses against them without some white taking it personally" yurbud May 2014 #132

Good insights RainDog May 2014 #167

the phrase, even if "true" is a big boon to the Tea Party and the GOP The Green Manalishi May 2014 #133

I agree with you RainDog May 2014 #145

"I thought DU was better than this." Spitfire of ATJ May 2014 #134

Lol! It sure was. NealK May 2014 #136

yeah. sometimes it's like this RainDog May 2014 #146

Or this.... Spitfire of ATJ May 2014 #152

this is for all you snarkoleptics... RainDog May 2014 #153

How now brown,....HEY!!!! Sheeze,....white privilege AGAIN!!! Spitfire of ATJ May 2014 #170

Okay so whites should just get over it..... whistler162 May 2014 #135

Mark Twain RainDog May 2014 #139

Of course there is white privilege, but it is a pretty useless and misused concept. Vattel May 2014 #143

I had to think about that last sentence for a minute to decide whether I agree or disagree yurbud May 2014 #182

Welfare Queen! justiceischeap May 2014 #147

to be honest shaayecanaan May 2014 #168

Great post! etherealtruth May 2014 #148

What do you mean "we", white woman? R. Daneel Olivaw May 2014 #156

I'm a woman RainDog May 2014 #158

Amended. Joke still stands. R. Daneel Olivaw May 2014 #159

not dat depp RainDog May 2014 #161

Wow, you really seem to have stepped in it hfojvt May 2014 #169

This message was self-deleted by its author RainDog May 2014 #171

so long, farewell, adieu, auf weidersehen RainDog May 2014 #172

well that's nice, and nice of you to tell me too hfojvt May 2014 #180

Hmmm gollygee May 2014 #174

having a greater chance hfojvt May 2014 #179

White privilege sometimes leads to wealth and sometimes doesn't gollygee May 2014 #184

Please, Please, Please RobinA May 2014 #175

Kicked and recommended In_The_Wind May 2014 #183

KnR RainDog Hekate May 2014 #185

K&R! Beautifully and eloquently stated! Thank you! n/t markpkessinger May 2014 #190

To add to RainDog's excellent OP . . . markpkessinger May 2014 #191

Thanks for bringing this post to the discussion RainDog May 2014 #192

Dr. Joy DeGruy RainDog May 2014 #199

Economic stats that demonstrate systemic issues RainDog May 2014 #207

I also want to provide a link to this post RainDog May 2014 #196

Thank you, RainDog! Well said. Sissyk May 2014 #197

thank you so much RainDog May 2014 #198

Thanks so much for this post. Hopefully it'll make at least a few folks stop and think. nomorenomore08 May 2014 #202

Plus the anniversary of the decision in Brown v Board of Education of Topeka was this week. Major Hogwash May 2014 #203

was it on tv? RainDog May 2014 #204

Yes. Major Hogwash May 2014 #209

I am SO glad I leave this kind of shit alone. A HERETIC I AM May 2014 #206

When a right wing, blatantly racist post is allowed to stand here RainDog May 2014 #208

+1 nomorenomore08 May 2014 #211