General Discussion

HughBeaumont

(24,461 posts)

125. It's disgraceful.

Wed Oct 26, 2016, 08:36 PM

Oct 2016

American citizens asserting that there is no way to make people's lives better and there's no point in trying. So hey, let's just continue the bake-sale-to-bankruptcy plan, the gofundme-so-I-won't-die racket, because it's just working out SO well.

It's defeatism, and we seem to be great at it.

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The only way to control soaring healthcare costs is to have single payer [View all] Yavin4 Oct 2016 OP

The only way to control healthcare costs is to get insurance companies pbmus Oct 2016 #1

This is only 10% of the cost, the rest of it is doctors, pharma and hospital corps... uponit7771 Oct 2016 #11

They charge so much because Foggyhill Oct 2016 #29

Good point and prolly why my HCI wouldn't pay for this medicine... if the HCI's pushed back on the uponit7771 Oct 2016 #30

the word is PROBABLY Skittles Oct 2016 #99

Without taking the whole system down? How do you propose do that? ehrnst Oct 2016 #28

ooh ooh let's think small ellennelle Oct 2016 #84

It's called realistic goals, and acknowledging what is and is not likely. ehrnst Oct 2016 #112

"Realistic goals" is why we're in the mess we're in. "Single payer is off the table," remember that? Doremus Oct 2016 #154

Insurance companies don't charge $141,300 for dual knee replacement. Doctors and hospitals do. lumberjack_jeff Oct 2016 #97

Not really. Act_of_Reparation Oct 2016 #113

The poster to whom I'm replying was arguing that ins. companies should be removed from the equation lumberjack_jeff Oct 2016 #118

I'm not sure I follow. Act_of_Reparation Oct 2016 #138

The $140k was the billed amount lumberjack_jeff Oct 2016 #141

Tthe insurance companies already set the rates. Act_of_Reparation Oct 2016 #144

I have been saying what you posted for years having been a controller upaloopa Oct 2016 #129

Get the insurance companies out of there.. annabanana Oct 2016 #2

Health insurance should be viewed similar to a fire department. Yavin4 Oct 2016 #3

I used to volunteer with a fire department Travis_0004 Oct 2016 #7

Understood, but that model is not pratical in most urban areas in America n/t Yavin4 Oct 2016 #9

I'm getting tired of pointing out the obvious on this, but I'll do it again mythology Oct 2016 #135

That's not the only issue. Medicare costs are rising, too, pnwmom Oct 2016 #59

no no no ellennelle Oct 2016 #78

Both Canada and Switzerland have a mixture of public and private plans pnwmom Oct 2016 #83

um, yes; it will ellennelle Oct 2016 #90

Drug prices are regulated in other countries too TexasBushwhacker Oct 2016 #95

Right. And Medicare's rising costs are largely due to high drug prices here. n/t pnwmom Oct 2016 #96

And Congress decided Medicare can't negotiate drug prices TexasBushwhacker Oct 2016 #102

Worse than stupid. n/t pnwmom Oct 2016 #104

I wonder though. Insurance companies are rotten, but so are some healthcare providers OKNancy Oct 2016 #6

that is NOT the provider ellennelle Oct 2016 #81

I would think it would be easy safeinOhio Oct 2016 #8

If only it was that easy Yavin4 Oct 2016 #10

And there's a lot of distrust B2G Oct 2016 #12

The only path for single payer is for employers to stop offering health insurance as a benefit. Yavin4 Oct 2016 #15

And then what happens to people when they lose their insurance? ehrnst Oct 2016 #23

Creating a Public Option today would be the first step Yavin4 Oct 2016 #26

I agree. Incremental steps are going to be the best way - but tell that to people ehrnst Oct 2016 #31

it's not about selling out ellennelle Oct 2016 #82

Because the majority of Americans get their health care through their employers Yavin4 Oct 2016 #108

Agreed. There is so much more involved than people think. (nt) ehrnst Oct 2016 #115

It is easy.... CanSocDem Oct 2016 #18

Since 1980, Americans have been opened to being preyed upon economically Yavin4 Oct 2016 #22

My theory.... CanSocDem Oct 2016 #36

A hurdle that big means that it's *not* easy, and it's not the only hurdle. ehrnst Oct 2016 #32

America's heath care theme song DemInND Oct 2016 #46

Thank you - if it was that easy, it would have been done a long time ago. (nt) ehrnst Oct 2016 #21

Medicare already has this worked out. colorado_ufo Oct 2016 #41

Medicare was launched for a limited part of the population, with the costs hidden ehrnst Oct 2016 #64

We have one of those right here. colorado_ufo Oct 2016 #145

Medicare is not 'single payer' - it involves private payers for Rx and things like hearing aids ehrnst Oct 2016 #146

Single payer would NOT break up people's relationship with their doctors. subterranean Oct 2016 #48

I'm at a loss as to how a single payer system might jeopardize one's doctor choice. lumberjack_jeff Oct 2016 #98

Taiwan did exactly that. Guess who they chose to copy? IronLionZion Oct 2016 #44

Single Payer with strong price controls built in... JCMach1 Oct 2016 #14

So, how do we do that? (nt) ehrnst Oct 2016 #24

I guess we begin by MAKING NOISE Auggie Oct 2016 #38

+1, the HC community would take a huge hit at first ... doctors, pharma and Hospital groups would .. uponit7771 Oct 2016 #45

Hear! Hear! Revive H.R. 676! Roland99 Oct 2016 #17

There should be a push for this at the state level. No good reason why blue states don't have it. Chathamization Oct 2016 #19

But it's not that simple, unfortunately. If it was, then it would have been done a long time ago. ehrnst Oct 2016 #20

You are correct. The more practical solution is to offer a Public Plan to folks who cannot afford Yavin4 Oct 2016 #25

The fact that we could not get it with a dem house, senate and white house ehrnst Oct 2016 #33

it's not up to congress ellennelle Oct 2016 #43

Congress DOES NOT have to care how loud we shout right now and the president is the least powerful uponit7771 Oct 2016 #53

Congress has to make it law, so yes, it is up to them. ehrnst Oct 2016 #66

say what? ellennelle Oct 2016 #85

Trump's supporters believe that he can do things without congress that he can't actually do ehrnst Oct 2016 #147

We did not have a super controlling majority in either houses in congress... we get one then that uponit7771 Oct 2016 #49

The ACA has been challenged constantly, and sometimes successfully. ehrnst Oct 2016 #67

“To try to do it in one fell swoop would be massively disruptive" I agree, then do it piece meal in uponit7771 Oct 2016 #47

But there are those who say that's a cop out. Single Payer or nothing.... (nt) ehrnst Oct 2016 #68

for the record ellennelle Oct 2016 #88

I have been told that Single Payer is "the only way" to bring down costs, not to mention "simple." ehrnst Oct 2016 #106

always a glitch ellennelle Oct 2016 #50

Did you read about the rural hospitals? ehrnst Oct 2016 #71

excuse me ellennelle Oct 2016 #75

rural hospitals ellennelle Oct 2016 #76

THE MATH IS SO SIMPLE! ellennelle Oct 2016 #35

ps to all that ellennelle Oct 2016 #40

Well said!! (eom) CanSocDem Oct 2016 #42

Love Sanders, but Vermont ran from single payer as soon as they looked at the cost and figured out Hoyt Oct 2016 #55

not so on any point ellennelle Oct 2016 #74

They nixed it because of the taxes required. The carriers can only hike premiums if Hoyt Oct 2016 #77

just, no ellennelle Oct 2016 #89

Uncapped Medicare Part B premiums are increasing over 22% in 2017. That's a fact. Hoyt Oct 2016 #100

You would think that these people would be thrilled with the price for health insurance going up! world wide wally Oct 2016 #37

Switzerland controls costs with a combination of gov. and private plans pnwmom Oct 2016 #39

Employers don't like paying for health insurance IronLionZion Oct 2016 #51

Big Pharma likes it the way it is DemInND Oct 2016 #52

What I don't get is this: Mr.Bill Oct 2016 #54

How about if we start with the small population states. Delmette Oct 2016 #56

Vermont tried and failed badly IronLionZion Oct 2016 #61

Are these public options federally funded or state funded? Delmette Oct 2016 #63

Minnesota is state funded IronLionZion Oct 2016 #65

I like the term Non-profit. Delmette Oct 2016 #70

romneycare ellennelle Oct 2016 #91

actually works better the larger the population to pool from ellennelle Oct 2016 #93

The federal government controls so much of health care in the US... PoliticAverse Oct 2016 #101

I get employer covered insurance and I support single-payer AllyCat Oct 2016 #58

Go Elizabeth! Go Bernie! zentrum Oct 2016 #60

That's not all there is to it - there is the implementation of it which is a huge ehrnst Oct 2016 #69

The claim of area51 Oct 2016 #73

Let's get it done this time!! Hulk Oct 2016 #62

Single payer isn't feasible unless it regulates pharma dflprincess Oct 2016 #86

single payer would correct all of that ellennelle Oct 2016 #92

So much is interlocked - you said it. ehrnst Oct 2016 #151

It's pretty simple. roamer65 Oct 2016 #87

Which Senator said it in 1986? 1939 Oct 2016 #127

No question! InAbLuEsTaTe Oct 2016 #94

I agree with you but, there is something that concerns me about single payer in the US. napi21 Oct 2016 #103

Single payer won't fix anything. We need to NATIONALIZE ALL HEALTHCARE Lee-Lee Oct 2016 #105

You're right, of course. But no Presidential candidate is MineralMan Oct 2016 #107

um, with all due respect ellennelle Oct 2016 #110

The primaries no longer matter. Truly they do not. MineralMan Oct 2016 #111

Not a candidate in the presidential election. ehrnst Oct 2016 #116

Er . . . HughBeaumont Oct 2016 #126

To be fair, I googled "Ain't never gonna happen." ehrnst Oct 2016 #130

So, multi-payer systems. Public driving the market FOR Private, not the other way around. HughBeaumont Oct 2016 #131

Yes - and incremental change. What I've been saying all along. (nt) ehrnst Oct 2016 #132

Yay status quo. HughBeaumont Oct 2016 #109

You don't sound like you have much respect for Democrats. (nt) ehrnst Oct 2016 #117

Not asswipes like Lieberturd or Baucus. HughBeaumont Oct 2016 #124

The only chance of getting single-payer is flipping the senate... Blue_Tires Oct 2016 #114

Flipping the Senate won't get single-payer. StevieM Oct 2016 #119

Like common sense gun control, moondust Oct 2016 #121

but it will crack the door open a bit... Blue_Tires Oct 2016 #123

This is the single most depressing, enraging, disheartening Grey Lemercier Oct 2016 #120

America was built on racial and social stratification Yavin4 Oct 2016 #122

It was also built on people that left European countries The2ndWheel Oct 2016 #136

Europe does has a high degree of racial diversification. Yavin4 Oct 2016 #137

Not as much as the US though, and it's different The2ndWheel Oct 2016 #139

Have you been to Europe? Yavin4 Oct 2016 #140

I'm not saying there isn't any The2ndWheel Oct 2016 #143

That is correct. More importantly ehrnst Oct 2016 #148

Germany also has a very strong anti-immigrant right wing right now. ehrnst Oct 2016 #149

It's disgraceful. HughBeaumont Oct 2016 #125

I have Medicare and need private insurance upaloopa Oct 2016 #128

Medicare recipients still pay an average of 14% of their income on health care coverage and costs. ehrnst Oct 2016 #133

Only two countries have single payer: Canada and Taiwan ehrnst Oct 2016 #134

Price discrimination needs to be banned in health care Peaches999 Oct 2016 #142

Part of it, but not the entire means to fix our mess of high costs for healthcare. tonyt53 Oct 2016 #152

Dec 1969 #