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Emrys

(8,815 posts)
58. Reuters, old and established as it is, hasn't been the most reliable source on developments in Ukraine in recent times
Wed Nov 19, 2025, 08:34 PM
Nov 19

Last edited Wed Nov 19, 2025, 09:36 PM - Edit history (2)

Its coverage is only as good as its stringers, and the fact this latest bid of blatant kite-flying is filtered via Axios is not encouraging. Let's just say Axios has form, and not good form, when it comes to anonymous sourcing and Ukraine-US relations.

This was in early 2022:

White House ‘appalled’ at Axios over Ukraine article
...
The White House spent much of Friday frustrated by an Axios report that it believes was based on a fabricated letter purportedly written by Ukraine’s top national security official.

The Axios story, written by reporter Zachary Basu, said that Oleksiy Danilov had asked the US earlier this month “to go beyond traditional military aid and provide the country with the funding, training and weaponry to support a long-term resistance movement.” But Ukrainian Ambassador Oksana Markarova later told Axios that she believed the letter was “falsified.” And officials at the National Security Council also told Axios they have no record of receiving such a letter from Danilov.
...
“We were appalled that Axios apparently did not have time to verify with Ukrainian officials whether or not this letter was a fake, but made sure to reach out to a former Trump official with no knowledge of the situation for a ‘gotcha’ quote,” the senior admin official told me. “And then we were even more appalled it stayed up all day despite our repeated asks to take the story down when became obvious the letter was a fake — which Axios should have dug up before publishing in the first place.”
...
Shortly after I contacted Axios for comment Friday evening, the outlet updated its story. Axios changed the headline — which initially read “Scoop: Ukraine sought long-term resistance funding” — to “Ukraine’s ambassador disputes letter asking U.S. for resistance support.” The new story, which included Markarova saying the document appeared “falsified,” cited a “former senior Ukrainian official close to Danilov” who told Axios “that they had received the letter from Danilov’s office, and that it was also distributed to Ukrainian American groups and think tank experts in Washington.” But crucially, the source also told Axios that he or she could not confirm the letter was officially transmitted to the US government — essentially the crux of the initial story.

Notably, at that point, the article didn’t include a correction or retraction, despite it seemingly having no real legs to stand on. Later in the evening, a proper correction was ultimately appended to the top of the story. It read, in part, “This corrects an original version of this story that stated the Ukrainian government ‘asked’ for additional assistance from the U.S. government, when Axios was unable to confirm the letter was actually sent.” Still, given that Axios is now conceding it was “unable to confirm” the main point of its initial story, it is surprising that a more forceful correction or full retraction wasn’t issued.

https://edition.cnn.com/2022/03/18/media/axios-ukraine-article


Apart from the nebulous references to "security guarantees", what's supposedly proposed now is little different to the "deal" the Ukrainians rejected out of hand during the Alaska summit debacle and its backwash. The fact that the discussions have reportedly included Witkoff on the US side gives even less cause for confidence given his obsession with landholding, as befits a property developer, his ignorance of the basics of Ukrainian geography, the clear evidence of his being a poodle in past dealings with Putin, and his inability to even convey accurately to NATO allies the results of his meetings with Putin and what scant concessions Russia has indicated it might be prepared to make.

Vault over the paywall at the Axios article, and way below its snazzy headline, you'll come across a few snags (my bold):

Behind the scenes: One source with direct knowledge said Umerov was empowered by Zelensky to negotiate with Witkoff, and many of his comments were incorporated into the text of the 28-point plan.

* The source claimed many understandings were reached in the talks with Umerov.

* A Ukrainian official confirmed Zelensky sent Umerov to be briefed about the U.S. plan. but said it was an oral briefing and Umerov didn't receive a written proposal from Witkoff.

* The Ukrainian official denied that Zelensky's adviser accepted the terms of the plan during the meeting and claimed Ukraine objects to many of the points.

* Prior to meeting Umerov, Witkoff held extensive discussions on the plan with Russian envoy Kirill Dmitriev.

https://www.axios.com/2025/11/19/trump-ukraine-peace-plan-russia-donbas


Witkoff was supposed to meet Zelensky yesterday during Zelensky's visit to Turkey for talks with Erdogan, but that was called off. Apart from those discussions, Zelensky has a few pressing domestic problems on his plate at the moment, and any hints at capitulation seem unlikely to be considered wise while the aftermath of the recent corruption problems plays out. In terms of Ukraine's non-US allies, such a scheme to placate Russia looks like a non-starter since Poland is incensed by what is believed to have been a Russian attack on some of it rail lines and other countries are being subjected to mounting military and non-military attacks. Some of the territory Ukraine is supposedly being expected to concede includes essential defensive lines Ukraine has spent a lot of time and resources installing because those areas are strategically vital for any further Russian incursions.

In some of the Ukrainian media, the focus seems to be more on, yet again, negotiations about Ukraine being held without due consideration of Ukraine's views, needs and interests, seemingly seen as inconvenient afterthoughts. Here's The Moscow Times (more reliable than its name might suggest):

U.S. Peace Proposal Requires Ukraine to Cede Land, Cut Army Size – Reports

Ukraine has received a new peace proposal from the United States that requires Kyiv to cede land controlled by Russia and more than halve its army's size, a senior official briefed on the proposal told AFP on Wednesday.

The plan appears to repeat Russia's maximalist terms — demands consistently rejected by Ukraine as tantamount to capitulation.

The draft provides for "recognition of Crimea and other regions that the Russians have taken" and "reduction of the army to 400,000 personnel," the source, who did not wish to be identified, told AFP. The plan would also see Ukraine giving up all long-range weapons.

"An important nuance is that we don't understand whether this is really Trump's story" or "his entourage's," the official added.

It was "unclear" what Russia was supposed to do in return, the source said.

https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2025/11/19/us-peace-proposal-requires-ukraine-to-cede-land-cut-army-size-reports-a91168


And here's the The Kyiv Independent:

US holding secret peace talks with Moscow to end Russia's war against Ukraine, Axios reports

The White House and Moscow have been secretly working on a proposal to end Russia's war against Ukraine, Axios reported on Nov. 18, citing U.S. and Russian officials.

U.S. Special Envoy Steve Witkoff and Russian Envoy Kirill Dmitriev have extensively discussed the 28-point peace plan, an unnamed U.S. official said.

Dmitriev described the secretive peace deal optimistically, saying that, unlike in the past, "we feel the Russian position is really being heard."

Russia has repeatedly issued maximalist demands to Kyiv in previous direct peace talks, including that Ukraine give up its NATO aspirations, demilitarize, and cede territory that Kyiv controls.

https://kyivindependent.com/us-holding-secret-talks-with-moscow-to-end-russias-war-against-ukraine-axios-reports/

Recommendations

1 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

No shit! Ray Bruns Nov 19 #1
Why do I believe the unnamed sources have the initials DJT? Ray Bruns Nov 19 #2
Yup. sheshe2 Nov 19 #32
Putin must have some real nasty shit on Trump RazorbackExpat Friday #86
Diddling Donny can't stay out of Putin's pants. Safe as Milk Nov 19 #3
What if Putin's Bubba? BadgerMom Thursday #73
Ukraine doesn't have to anything the US says. It is a sovereign nation. NotHardly Nov 19 #4
Ukraine wants a security guarantee from the US. maxsolomon Nov 19 #15
Russia had an agreement with Ukraine and had agreed republianmushroom Nov 19 #21
Like many big powers they renege on their agreements...nt mitch96 Nov 19 #24
I think Ukraine is disinclined to accept security agreements, as the... LudwigPastorius Nov 19 #22
Quite true. However, NATO membership may be unobtainable. maxsolomon Nov 19 #23
Russia opposed Ukraine joining NATO because it would have blocked them from taking the land for the future pipelines. cstanleytech Nov 19 #33
Most of the NATO nations couldn't give a stuff what Russia wants. n/t Emrys Nov 19 #48
Russia invaded Donetsk precisely to stop NATO extending membership to Ukraine. maxsolomon Nov 19 #53
Russia's rationales for its invasion vary almost as windingly as a Trump diatribe. Emrys Nov 19 #61
Helpful post, maxsolomon Thursday #83
I can't immediately find a map of the situation in 2023, but if it helps, Emrys Thursday #84
Well, I hope your optimism is correct. maxsolomon Friday #85
Their last security guarantee when giving up nukes didn't hold up so well SamuelTheThird Nov 19 #26
Yes, I am aware. maxsolomon Nov 19 #28
Please research blue-wave Nov 19 #35
I don't need to research as I already knew about it. maxsolomon Nov 19 #37
I'm saying blue-wave Nov 19 #38
US security assurances are only as good as the word of the President karynnj Nov 19 #40
What would Russia get in the deal then? Polybius Nov 19 #59
What will Russia get? blue-wave Thursday #70
Ok, so the war doesn't end then n/t Polybius Thursday #75
it ends the way the Russia war in Afghanistan ended lapfog_1 Thursday #76
That could take years Polybius Thursday #77
then it will take years... lapfog_1 Thursday #78
Ukraine itself is offering Russia something Polybius Monday #89
And Russia has already rejected blue-wave Tuesday #90
This is misunderstood. Ukraine DID NOT receive Security Guarantees WarGamer Nov 19 #46
Correct. Emrys Nov 19 #49
Ukraine needs to be in NATO or have signed legal defense GUARANTEES from US, UK, Germany, Poland and France. WarGamer Nov 19 #50
Over the past few years, Ukraine has signed bilateral security agreements with a number of countries Emrys Nov 19 #62
The only agreement that would blue-wave Thursday #69
If you want to split hairs over the blue-wave Thursday #72
All I have to say is, I get spanked for asking a question but, gab13by13 Nov 19 #5
"linking this right wing talking point" - this is news, FFS muriel_volestrangler Nov 19 #6
Posting 2 unnamed sources for the article because of the sensitivity, gab13by13 Nov 19 #10
I don't think you understand what news is. muriel_volestrangler Nov 19 #14
Hopefully, Ukraine will say "fuck that shit" Fiendish Thingy Nov 19 #7
"give up land, some arms under US peace plan...... yea that ain't gonna happen.. nt mitch96 Nov 19 #25
FU, Putin and drumphf! Slava Ukraini! electric_blue68 Nov 19 #8
Again, like before, I say BULLSHIT!! bluestarone Nov 19 #9
Handing Putin victory from the abyss of defeat CanonRay Nov 19 #11
After all this, now Putin is allowed to take land from Ukraine just to go away and leave them alone FakeNoose Nov 19 #12
Wasn't this same plan rejected a few months ago? (nt) William Seger Nov 19 #13
The US should butt out and F*ck off. sinkingfeeling Nov 19 #16
There's absolutely no way. LudwigPastorius Nov 19 #17
trump kissing Putin ass. republianmushroom Nov 19 #18
Why should they give anything up? They didn't start the war. Putin should have to pay them to rebuild the country. Vinca Nov 19 #19
Rewarding Russia for its invasion? What a plan. Dave Bowman Nov 19 #20
Trump cannot stop blowing Pootie Skittles Nov 19 #27
Trust the Russians and any agreement they sign. republianmushroom Nov 19 #29
3 Words: Fuck That Shit! Nictuku Nov 19 #30
When will the world ever learn? blue-wave Nov 19 #31
I approve this plan......if it includes arrests and war crime trials for a number of Russians. cstanleytech Nov 19 #34
LOL, why wasn't such a deal worked out with Iraq and Kuwait? RedWhiteBlueIsRacist Nov 19 #36
US Security Guarantee Nasruddin Nov 19 #39
Nope. Not the right move. Russia go home and expletive you and your horse. twodogsbarking Nov 19 #41
And what weapons and territory will Russia give up in exchange? WestMichRad Nov 19 #42
Just say NO Bayard Nov 19 #43
Now the population of Crimea is mostly all Russian womanofthehills Friday #87
I'm betting if Crimea was returned to its rightful owner, Bayard Friday #88
Am I wrong in thinking this sounds more like a demand that Ukraine surrender to Russia? slightlv Nov 19 #44
Budapest Memorandum 2 paulrevere2018 Nov 19 #45
F this "peace agreement." One sided BS. Drumpf has been in bed with Vlad for at least 9 years. Evolve Dammit Nov 19 #47
This pisses me off. AllyCat Nov 19 #51
As usual, Dump bends over for Putin mdbl Nov 19 #52
Russian attitude..what's mine is mine .what's yours is negotiable! Playingmantis Nov 19 #54
this is bullshit. ananda Nov 19 #55
Be quiet piggy! bronxiteforever Nov 19 #56
This all from Putin using his power over tramp 3825-87867 Nov 19 #57
Reuters, old and established as it is, hasn't been the most reliable source on developments in Ukraine in recent times Emrys Nov 19 #58
Be quiet piggy Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin Nov 19 #60
Trump and Putin JPK Nov 19 #63
I hope Zelenskyy tells them to fuck off and Europe backs him ChicagoTeamster Nov 19 #64
x2 Sam I Yam Thursday #71
screw that SaydiTom Nov 19 #65
Bullshit plan designed to appease Putin. He'll take the win and keep going. Martin68 Nov 19 #66
What about that rare earth minerals deal trump wanted from Ukraine?? IcyPeas Nov 19 #67
Stick it up your asses, Trump and Putin. Efilroft Sul Nov 19 #68
Ukraine, Don't Do It! Can't trust US anymore Bread and Circuses Thursday #74
Give'm an inch and they'll take a mile. no_hypocrisy Thursday #79
I'd say Krasnov's status a a Russian asset "bothers" America as much as his being an "alleged pedophile." Miles Archer Thursday #80
One word answer Botany Thursday #81
"would be" expected nuxvomica Thursday #82
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