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longship

(40,416 posts)
8. Thank you. You just made my point.
Sat Jun 9, 2012, 03:51 PM
Jun 2012


Because there is no fucking natural source of molecular hydrogen on our planet!!! (physics and chemistry 101) All molecular hydrogen comes from electrochemical, or chemical, processes, all of which require more energy than is achieved by burning the resulting product (thermodynamics 101)

And again, I am not saying that hydrogen isn't useful. It decidedly is, specifically that it doesn't contribute to global warming, and that it may be the most efficient energy storage medium. But a source of energy it is not, because it takes more energy to make it than it releases. Plus there's this problem that the Earth rotates and 1/2 of it doesn't have the Sun shining on it to generate all that free energy. A great solution is to use the energy to make molecular hydrogen -- did I mention that there is no better source on Earth?

You can store the hydrogen and use it during night, when the sun has set, or you can use in automobiles, or in airplanes, neither of which are likely to go all solar.

Again, since there is zero natural hydrogen on Earth, it requires more energy to make it than it generates by burning it.

For the naive who think I am arguing against hydrogen power, read very carefully my posts here. I am doing no such thing. Instead, I am trying to put into perspective where hydrogen stands in the energy economy and why hydrogen alone is not a solution.

I think hydrogen energy is essential for our future, but only as a storage medium. There are no molecular hydrogen sources on Earth that don't require more energy input. NONE!

Recommendations

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Electric motors can provide 100% torque just about instantaneously LARED Jun 2012 #1
Race cars have been the R&D platform for a number of automobile technologies. OKIsItJustMe Jun 2012 #2
Unfortunately hydrogen is not an energy source. longship Jun 2012 #3
Petroleum products are also not an energy source. They merely store energy in the form of chemical kestrel91316 Jun 2012 #4
What????? longship Jun 2012 #5
And how (exactly) is this relevant? OKIsItJustMe Jun 2012 #6
Thank you. You just made my point. longship Jun 2012 #8
And the point that I made was…? OKIsItJustMe Jun 2012 #9
Hydrogen is fucking NOT a source of energy!!! longship Jun 2012 #12
I believe everyone knows that OKIsItJustMe Jun 2012 #13
Okay, OKIsItJustMe. longship Jun 2012 #14
“I confess that my teaching life more than occasionally kicks in here on DU.” OKIsItJustMe Jun 2012 #15
Water, Sunlight intaglio Jun 2012 #7
Well, you've made my point. longship Jun 2012 #10
I don't believe anyone here thinks that Hydrogen is an energy source. OKIsItJustMe Jun 2012 #11
There is not a natural source of gasoline intaglio Jun 2012 #19
It is thermodynamics 101 longship Jun 2012 #20
And if the energy is free, what happens to your calculations? intaglio Jun 2012 #21
I don't give a shit about efficiency of oil longship Jun 2012 #22
So what is your alternative? intaglio Jun 2012 #23
Well, I think we're on the same page longship Jun 2012 #24
What is the specific problem you want storage to solve? kristopher Jun 2012 #26
Hydrogen, as an energy carrier, is far more efficient than petroleum and H2 Cars will kick ass and.. NYC_SKP Jun 2012 #16
I like it to even out the day/night solar power cycle longship Jun 2012 #17
H2 peaker plants at every wind farm... NYC_SKP Jun 2012 #18
Would you propose putting peaking plants next to baseload plants? kristopher Jun 2012 #25
I'm in an ag area, and my reply was quite a generalization. NYC_SKP Jun 2012 #27
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