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shaayecanaan

(6,068 posts)
190. Bullshit
Wed Sep 4, 2013, 08:24 PM
Sep 2013

I've made my position quite clear. I was glad that Hezbollah kicked Israel out of Lebanon in the same way that I was glad that the Red Army kicked the Nazis out of Eastern Europe. That doesn't make me a supporter of Hezbollah or a communist, for that matter.

as the OP successfully argues


Ha ha. And I successfully argue that you eat dog shit for breakfast. You should stop trying to claim the point for yourself, it just makes you look incredibly lame.

And as to apartheid and racism, as the OP successfully argues it's Australia that is FAR worse to its indigenous than Israel.


I normally wouldnt bother with this hasbawanker bullshit, but lets go through and debunk the claims one by one:-

By contrast, only 1.3% of Australia’s current federal Parliament are from religious minorities (one Muslim and two Jews).


Only about 0.6% of Australians are Jews, meaning that Jews are in fact over-represented in parliament by a factor of about 40%. Muslims account for about 2% of the population, meaning that you would statistically expect there to be 2 or 3 Muslim MPs rather than one for parliament to be truly representative. Of course, the OP fudges a bit on the figures, including Arab Christians as minorities in Israel but not in Australia. There are a further two Australian MPs of Arab Christian heritage, including one (Joe Hockey) of Palestinian descent.

16% of Israelis are Arab, but only 10% of MKs are; therefore Arabs are substantially under-represented in the Israeli Knesset.

Judiciary: Israel has a judge from the Arab minority serving on its highest court (Salim Joubran). Sadly, Australia has not had a single High Court judge from a racial or religious minority for over 80 years, since Sir Issac Issacs! • Military: Israel has three Druse generals currently (or recently) serving in its defence forces (Major-General Yusef Mishleb and brigadier-generals Imad Fares and Hasson Hasson). Disturbingly, it appears Australia has not had a single general from a religious or racial minority for over 80 years, since Sir John Monash! The legislature, judiciary and military are the key sources of hard power in any society and the success of racial and religious minorities reaching these corridors of power is a litmus test of the true openness and lack of racism in a society. Australia’s scorecard on this test compares very poorly to Israel’s.


Blatant cherry picking.

Sir Isaac Isaacs was the last Australian High court judge. However, Australia has had Jewish federal court judges since. Australia has also had two Jewish Governors-General (a position equivalent to the President of Israel), Sir Zelman Cowen being the most recent. Again, given that Jews only constitute a very small part of the population in Australia, this compares very well with Israel.

Salma Fiomy-Farij, a hijab-wearing Israeli Muslim Arab, came second in this year’s Israeli Master Chef (the winner was a German convert to Judaism).

In Australia Master Chef has not had a single winner from a religious or racial minority.


Notice the sleight of hand there? I'll point it out for you:-

Salma Fiomy-Farij, a hijab-wearing Israeli Muslim Arab, came second in this year’s Israeli Master Chef (the winner was a German convert to Judaism).

In Australia Master Chef has not had a single winner from a religious or racial minority.


Like Israel, Australia has certainly had Muslim finalists in its own Masterchef series. In fact, the third place-getter in this years series was an Arab Muslim:-




w e s t b a n k ChairmanAgnostic Aug 2013 #1
BDS would continue its actions against Israel even if it left the West Bank completely oberliner Aug 2013 #2
Which is not Israel, so not apartheid. n/t aranthus Aug 2013 #5
The indigenous bastustans of Apartheid South Africa were independent homelands FarrenH Aug 2013 #7
That's Oslo, which the world supported. Not apartheid. shira Aug 2013 #10
So Shaktimaan Sep 2013 #168
Nope FarrenH Sep 2013 #169
L E B A N O N shira Aug 2013 #12
yes there is shira ... Israeli Aug 2013 #22
Am I to understand that before "Israeli-Only" roads, before the separation barrier..... shira Aug 2013 #23
I have no idea where you are going with this shira ... Israeli Aug 2013 #25
"or call Shulamit Aloni a liar..." oberliner Aug 2013 #26
thanks for the advice.... Israeli Aug 2013 #63
You obviously don't know much about President Carter's views oberliner Aug 2013 #120
so before Intifada 2, no apartheid. After Intifada 2, apartheid. Yes? shira Aug 2013 #36
It has everything to do with who you support shira ... Israeli Aug 2013 #64
2010: Abbas rejects 60% of W.Bank shira Aug 2013 #68
I oppose the occupation shira ..... Israeli Aug 2013 #71
You can't oppose the occupation & also oppose getting out of 60% of the W.Bank. shira Aug 2013 #72
sure I can shira .... Israeli Aug 2013 #73
60% borders are temporary. You're pro-occupation, against the IDF getting out..... shira Aug 2013 #74
No shira ... Israeli Aug 2013 #75
Ironic how you agree with hardcore settlers against Bibi's plan.... shira Aug 2013 #76
I'm Gush Shalom shira ... Israeli Aug 2013 #77
They oppose Bibi's plan to withdraw from the W.Bank just like you. n/t shira Aug 2013 #80
you are deflecting shira .... Israeli Aug 2013 #95
Not Apartheid. What part of "military occupation" don't you understand? shira Aug 2013 #121
seriously shira ... Israeli Aug 2013 #129
Its like the West Bank doesn't exist FarrenH Aug 2013 #3
The BDS, apartheid-week peeps claim it's within Israel.... shira Aug 2013 #9
Again? Scootaloo Aug 2013 #4
actually its the demonization factor... pelsar Aug 2013 #6
You won't find Apartheid there FarrenH Aug 2013 #8
Will we find anti-Palestinian apartheid in Lebanon? Can I see where you've.... shira Aug 2013 #11
Refer to my post just a few notches upthread n/t Scootaloo Aug 2013 #13
see below #14. I responded to the wrong post. n/t shira Aug 2013 #15
Wasn't asking you.... shira Aug 2013 #14
money is not part of the definition of apartheid... pelsar Aug 2013 #17
I didn't say money was part of the definition FarrenH Aug 2013 #18
what happened to the dictionary definition? pelsar Aug 2013 #20
"The dictionary definition" FarrenH Aug 2013 #27
and i'm just asking for the consistency... pelsar Aug 2013 #29
I've been trying to summarize it FarrenH Aug 2013 #46
so i read it....it claims the Palestinians are a race.... pelsar Aug 2013 #50
On the contrary FarrenH Aug 2013 #56
so now your claiming "force sterilization? pelsar Aug 2013 #57
The comparison requires a shallow understanding of both Israel and Apartheid WatermelonRat Aug 2013 #16
The comparison refers specifically to Palestinians in the West Bank shaayecanaan Aug 2013 #19
which is why we see apartheid in the US.... pelsar Aug 2013 #21
That is based on citizenship, not race WatermelonRat Aug 2013 #24
Its not fallacious because it is because of ethnicity FarrenH Aug 2013 #28
so according to you pelsar Aug 2013 #30
Plus according to him a Jewish state is per se apartheid. aranthus Aug 2013 #31
what a creative interpretation azurnoir Aug 2013 #33
Yours is the creative interpretation. aranthus Aug 2013 #34
Is this true or not? Does Israel wish to maintain a Jewish demographic majority? azurnoir Aug 2013 #38
The disagreement is not over whether it's true and you know it. aranthus Aug 2013 #40
Is it true or not, why dou hesitate to answer directly ? azurnoir Aug 2013 #43
What hesitation? aranthus Aug 2013 #44
are you accusing me and the other poster of antisemitism? n/t azurnoir Aug 2013 #45
I've accused you of diverting. aranthus Aug 2013 #82
That was my point however you seemed 'upset' with another poster pointing it out azurnoir Aug 2013 #84
I'm not upset with someone pointing it out. aranthus Aug 2013 #87
quote "It's like someone pointing out that France wants to maintain a French majority" azurnoir Aug 2013 #106
I'd like an answer to the question in post #87 first. aranthus Aug 2013 #107
I can not answer without knowing your parameters pertaining to who is French n/t azurnoir Aug 2013 #108
I don't see why. aranthus Aug 2013 #109
No both the nationality and citizenship are Israeli azurnoir Aug 2013 #110
You're wrong, and you don't have the right to decide. aranthus Aug 2013 #112
so the majority ethnic group in any given country gets to decide what rights azurnoir Aug 2013 #113
That is not what I said. aranthus Aug 2013 #114
you got your answer but you did not agree with it azurnoir Aug 2013 #115
BS. You're evading the question. aranthus Aug 2013 #122
you got your answer here azurnoir Aug 2013 #123
No, I got your pathetic excuse for evading the question. aranthus Aug 2013 #126
ah I was right the first time you don't like the answer which was plainly No azurnoir Aug 2013 #127
Not that I didn't like it. I didn't understand that you meant no. aranthus Aug 2013 #130
th problem is that the area where these different laws are being enforced is not Israel azurnoir Aug 2013 #32
its still not based on ethnicity pelsar Aug 2013 #35
here is Merriam-Websters defination of apartheid azurnoir Aug 2013 #37
So it's doubly not apartheid. aranthus Aug 2013 #41
I always find the contortions of denial amusing azurnoir Aug 2013 #42
why is it racial? pelsar Aug 2013 #48
lol you make it sound very pretty and nice except azurnoir Aug 2013 #83
so your redefining apartheid to include applications that dont get "fair treatment" pelsar Aug 2013 #90
I do not have to redefine anything, there is no need azurnoir Aug 2013 #94
The International Convention on the Suppression and Punishment of the Crime of Apartheid FarrenH Aug 2013 #47
the summary:.....you dont like the dictionary- but at least its clear. pelsar Aug 2013 #51
I think you're imputing intentions without any reasonable cause FarrenH Aug 2013 #53
Your intentions are clear..... pelsar Aug 2013 #55
My intention FarrenH Aug 2013 #58
I"m not doubting your intentions.... pelsar Aug 2013 #61
The thing is Pelsar FarrenH Aug 2013 #62
you've made it clear.... pelsar Aug 2013 #65
The histories of the two countries don't exactly parallel each other FarrenH Aug 2013 #66
explain gaza please.... pelsar Aug 2013 #70
that is incorrect shaayecanaan Aug 2013 #39
now put in the missing information..... pelsar Aug 2013 #49
Well, lets retrace our steps... shaayecanaan Aug 2013 #52
oops..i'll let you admit your 'mistake" and let it go at that pelsar Aug 2013 #54
You realise that this is unusual? shaayecanaan Aug 2013 #59
its military law...which has little to do with justice.... pelsar Aug 2013 #60
You admit that the military courts are reserved for Palestinians? shaayecanaan Aug 2013 #67
its an occupation.....that means the military runs the place pelsar Aug 2013 #69
name a single foreigner shaayecanaan Aug 2013 #78
Israel arrests foreign activist in West Bank raid: lawyer oberliner Aug 2013 #79
Please read the above posts... shaayecanaan Aug 2013 #85
enough already.....just simply admit you were wrong..is it an ego thing? pelsar Aug 2013 #81
you still can't find a non-Palestinian that has been sentenced by a military court? shaayecanaan Aug 2013 #86
Interesting switch from "dealt with" to "sentenced by" oberliner Aug 2013 #88
Can you find any of either? shaayecanaan Aug 2013 #91
what happend to: A foreigner in Israel is not subject to military law. pelsar Aug 2013 #89
Are you saying that foreigners in Israel are subject to martial law? shaayecanaan Aug 2013 #92
we'll make this simple...its not difficult pelsar Aug 2013 #93
thank you for admitting that non-Jewish Arab citizens of Israel are subject to different laws azurnoir Aug 2013 #96
you read it wrong... i dont make up the laws.... pelsar Aug 2013 #99
it is quite true that non-Jewish citizens of Israel are subject to different laws than azurnoir Aug 2013 #103
actually its the jews, muslims, christians,druze....that have different laws pelsar Aug 2013 #104
No pelsar the immigration laws alone are all that is needed to show discrimination azurnoir Aug 2013 #105
and of course you want to be consistent.... pelsar Aug 2013 #117
"mixed set of security provisions" shaayecanaan Aug 2013 #97
its my assumption.... pelsar Aug 2013 #100
Imagine the following scenario... shaayecanaan Aug 2013 #101
its unlikely....that it would be regular soldiers pelsar Aug 2013 #102
Not quite shaayecanaan Aug 2013 #111
so your 've redefined apartheid as discrimination based "citizenship and nationalism" pelsar Aug 2013 #116
Au contraire... shaayecanaan Aug 2013 #118
so two legals systems do not make for apartheid? pelsar Aug 2013 #119
The principle of territoriality... shaayecanaan Aug 2013 #124
Israeli settlers are not exclusively Jewish shira Aug 2013 #125
The OP proves Australia is WAY more racist than Israel.... shira Aug 2013 #128
your wrong...now what/ pelsar Sep 2013 #170
South African Apartheid didn't apply equally to all Blacks... shaayecanaan Sep 2013 #172
i understand your point... pelsar Sep 2013 #173
There is discrimination... shaayecanaan Sep 2013 #180
now i get it....you can predict the future pelsar Sep 2013 #185
Two sets of laws for two sets of people... shaayecanaan Sep 2013 #187
yet you cant define that second set of people pelsar Sep 2013 #191
Hmm... shaayecanaan Aug 2013 #98
Thus two sets of rules. R. Daneel Olivaw Aug 2013 #131
let them scream .... Israeli Aug 2013 #132
The thing is, Israeli, I just don't understand how supposed Democrats or Liberals, R. Daneel Olivaw Aug 2013 #133
I dont understand either .... Israeli Aug 2013 #134
I can give you a brief primer on American politics regarding Israel. R. Daneel Olivaw Aug 2013 #135
Well... shaayecanaan Aug 2013 #136
If you think Turkey and Pakistan are more important to America..... shira Aug 2013 #137
Well, you responded to my message... shaayecanaan Aug 2013 #142
lets hope so ... Israeli Aug 2013 #139
You should reread shaayecanaan's post balow #136 King_David Sep 2013 #171
You need to understand you're a minority within the LibDem party here.... shira Aug 2013 #138
And once again, the human punchline does her tapdance. R. Daneel Olivaw Aug 2013 #140
Well, you said you didn't understand. Now you do. You're welcome. n/t shira Aug 2013 #141
Not what I wrote. R. Daneel Olivaw Aug 2013 #143
Most Dems and Liberals disagree with you. They must not be "real" Libs/Dems...... shira Aug 2013 #144
Hi there shira .... Israeli Aug 2013 #145
She's not an anti-zionist. But that wasn't my point.... shira Aug 2013 #150
wasnt my point either shira .... Israeli Aug 2013 #159
Aloni is a politician. All politicians lie. Why do u worship a politician's every word? shira Aug 2013 #160
Aloni is not a politician shira .... Israeli Aug 2013 #161
So she doesn't lie...but she exaggerates instead? With Jew-only roads.... shira Aug 2013 #164
I asked you .... Israeli Aug 2013 #166
The answer is no...no apartheid in the W.Bank shira Sep 2013 #179
ahh shira ... Israeli Sep 2013 #182
How dishonest can you get? So Israeli Arabs within settlements all around Jerusalem..... shira Sep 2013 #184
Gotta say, I like Letty and respect her greatly for this.... shira Aug 2013 #165
you have quoted out of context shira ..... Israeli Aug 2013 #167
I wrote that I like Letty but disagree with her.... shira Sep 2013 #177
What facile dishonesty... shaayecanaan Sep 2013 #174
ah shaayecanaan..... Israeli Sep 2013 #175
ahhh Israeli.....the thing is Letty is also an American Zionist. shira Sep 2013 #178
Not at all. What I quoted is what I like about her.... shira Sep 2013 #176
Yeah, sure. A bit like movie reviews... shaayecanaan Sep 2013 #181
Well then, read what I wrote about that passage.... shira Sep 2013 #183
Fuck off again... shaayecanaan Sep 2013 #186
At least we agree on supporting Western intervention in Syria... shira Sep 2013 #188
another unfounded accusation? "And you did back Hezbollah until recently." azurnoir Sep 2013 #189
Bullshit shaayecanaan Sep 2013 #190
And yet another Israel=Nazis comparison. Only Israel = Nazis, of course. shira Sep 2013 #192
Well, Ive put my money and time on the line... shaayecanaan Sep 2013 #193
Wow. You didn't even watch this did you? R. Daneel Olivaw Aug 2013 #146
WHOOOOSH! That was the sound of Finkelstein's argument going totally over your head.... shira Aug 2013 #147
Did you miss the first five minutes of the interview? R. Daneel Olivaw Aug 2013 #148
Did you miss that you're not at all representative of most Libs/Dems on I/P? n/t shira Aug 2013 #149
So you did miss the first five minutes then...or ignored them outright. Pure Shira BS. R. Daneel Olivaw Aug 2013 #151
Well, now that you want to make this about Finkelstein....are you closer in opinion shira Aug 2013 #152
It again is about you and your hypocrisy, Shira. Again, major derp on your part. R. Daneel Olivaw Aug 2013 #153
Another evasion with nothing but smilies in response. Lemme know when you grow up. n/t shira Aug 2013 #154
I'm not the hypocrite, Shira. You are. R. Daneel Olivaw Aug 2013 #155
That might be half a logical argument. Where's the other half? n/t shira Aug 2013 #156
Goodbye, hypocrite. R. Daneel Olivaw Aug 2013 #157
Hmm. Another sound-byte, more smilies. Got anything else? shira Aug 2013 #158
I won't be able to communicate with you since you aren't trusted to be honest. R. Daneel Olivaw Aug 2013 #162
I don't think you're capable of conversing honestly about I/P..... shira Aug 2013 #163
Good lord. Shaktimaan Oct 2013 #194
Latest Discussions»Issue Forums»Israel/Palestine»Israel, the un-apartheid ...»Reply #190