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jimmy the one

(2,776 posts)
18. overall, you lose
Fri Jan 9, 2015, 03:12 PM
Jan 2015

nra faux NY 'resolution': 3. We will stop saying “the government is going to take your guns” to block federal laws. The confiscation we announced 7 years ago never happened.
kioa: 3)"Assault Weapons BAN" It's a difficult sell to try to claim that you don't want to ban guns while supporting a gun ban

.. the nra never says 'assault weapons ban' in predominance of it's propaganda, it just says 'gun ban'. You lose. Nra intentionally tries to mislead with 'gun ban' meaning large scale gun bans, rather than the 2% national gunstock banning of assault rifles, which even rightwing demagogue scalia in his heller ruling contends are not protected by 2ndA.

'nra resolution': . We will stop blaming “mental health” problems for U.S. gun violence. We admit every country in the world has mental health problems but they don’t have Newtowns and Virginia Techs.
kioa: 4) You don't think the US should improve it's abysmal mental health care? I disagree.

You created a false premise from what was said in the faux resolution. You lose. How did you get from the faux resolution to a reduction in mental health care? non sequitur.

faux res: 6. We acknowledge that “outlaws” don’t have guns in the 28 EU countries, Canada, New Zealand, Australia, Japan and other countries with strict gun regulations. We also admit, grudgingly, they are not “tyrannies.”
kioa: 6) None of those countries can choose their own Head of State either..

Evidently neither can americans, see bush v gore where gore rec'd half a million more votes than gwbush. Canada has an electoral process not totally dissimilar to our electoral college; but I give you a push on this one: [prime minister appt'd] the viceroy will call to form a government [,] the individual most likely to receive the support, or confidence, of a majority of the directly-elected House of Commons;[7] as a practical matter, this is often the leader of a party whose members form a majority, or a very large plurality

res: 7. We will stop our insulting comparison of guns to knives, hammers, cars and swimming pools–none of which kill when used as directed.
kioa: 7) Guns when "used as directed" don't commit murder. Thus the law against murder.


Res didn't say murder. When used as directed, guns kill (see also, hunting, accidental firearm deaths, military history).

res 8: We accept responsibility for the armed vigilante movement popularized by George Zimmerman and Michael Dunn. We admit “carry” laws are the biggest revenue infusion since “Obama is going to take your guns.”
kioa: 8) CCL holders are less likely to commit crimes than the general public or police officers. Zimmerman should been found guilty & put in prison; are you going to support doing away with the right of a fair trial as well?

Again you create a false premise from what was given, which was simply armed vigilanteism, astride shall issue ccw as motivated by nra & gun industry profit. Then you toss in a red herring about concomitant elimination of due process.

res: 10. We regret our work to help suspected domestic abusers keep their guns while under orders of protection.
kioa: 10) People convicted of Domestic Abuse are felons. Felons lose the RKBA

Funny, your argument in reverse proved the catalyst to 2ndA being subverted to become an individual RKBA: Defendant, Timothy Emerson (Defendant), moved to dismiss his indictment for possession of a firearm while being under a restraining order ... Facts. During his divorce proceeding, a restraining order was placed on Defendant. Defendant was indicted for possession of a firearm while under that order, in violation.. Defendant claims that the statute is unconstitutional, as it abridges his right to keep and bear arms as guaranteed by [2ndA]..

As far as felons losing their RKBA, that's overall a falsehood. Convicted violent felons do, but not necessarily, due to nra backed fopa1986: Under federal law, people with felony convictions forfeit their right to bear arms. Yet every year, thousands of felons across the country have those rights reinstated, often with little or no review. In several states, they include people convicted of violent crimes, including first-degree murder and manslaughter ... While previously a small number of felons were able to reclaim their gun rights, the process became commonplace in many states in the late 1980s, after Congress started allowing state laws to dictate these reinstatements — part of an overhaul of federal gun laws orchestrated by the [NRA].
A crowning achievement was the [FOPA] Firearm Owners Protection Act of 1986, which significantly loosened federal gun laws. When it came to felons’ gun rights, the legislation essentially left the matter up to states. The federal gun restrictions would no longer apply if a state had restored a felon’s civil rights — to vote, sit on a jury and hold public office — and the individual faced no other firearms prohibitions.
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/14/us/felons-finding-it-easy-to-regain-gun-rights.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0


Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

I'm not a member of the NRA, but here is my response. kioa Jan 2015 #1
Without debate #4 bugs me! Sick_of_TP Jan 2015 #7
saw the lock Duckhunter935 Jan 2015 #2
I've always thought that if a person is unable to defend their position logically, kioa Jan 2015 #3
it's the sinking to Duckhunter935 Jan 2015 #4
There's a select few who will debate honestly and civilly, GGJohn Jan 2015 #5
Yes, and I give those posters Duckhunter935 Jan 2015 #6
But it really is possible... Veganstein Jan 2015 #16
Let's just pick #2 Shamash Jan 2015 #8
Let me take a shot at these: NYC_SKP Jan 2015 #9
That thread.. virginia mountainman Jan 2015 #10
New Year's Resolutions for Gun-Control religionists. oneshooter Jan 2015 #11
I would add BrotherIvan Jan 2015 #12
You are the one insisting that innocent people have to give up liberties because of your irrational kioa Jan 2015 #13
My favorite: The NRA is exploiting fear? LOL and bullshit. Gun banners depend on fear. NYC_SKP Jan 2015 #17
The entire puprose of that thread is to sucker people into accepting guilt by association. Nuclear Unicorn Jan 2015 #14
It far easier to demonize a faceless boogyman than innocent Americans. kioa Jan 2015 #15
overall, you lose jimmy the one Jan 2015 #18
You never fail to entertain. beevul Jan 2015 #19
industrial giants vs firearm industry jimmy the one Jan 2015 #20
Aww poor jimmy, you missed something. beevul Jan 2015 #21
two peas in a pod jimmy the one Jan 2015 #22
Merriam wants a word with you. beevul Jan 2015 #23
pretentious babbling jimmy the one Jan 2015 #24
Lets just cust to the chase shall we? beevul Jan 2015 #25
info please & oxford dictionaires want you jimmy the one Jan 2015 #26
Gun control, when applied as directed, bans guns and infringes on the second amendment. n/t beevul Jan 2015 #27
So equivocation then. beevul Jan 2015 #28
the equivocation is yours jimmy the one Jan 2015 #29
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