Religion

guillaumeb

(42,649 posts)

163. Speaking of debates, this one was a bit bizarre.

Sun May 13, 2018, 10:27 PM

May 2018

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1114&pid=12711

An interesting bit of explaining on your part.

So it is not just in this forum.

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Deism. What it is, and what it is not. [View all] guillaumeb May 2018 OP

'The term is used chiefly of an intellectual movement of the 17th and 18th centuries elleng May 2018 #1

True. And I feel that many theists accept that view. eom guillaumeb May 2018 #5

Speculation Lordquinton May 2018 #26

Of course. And I framed it as an opinion. guillaumeb May 2018 #32

It's still mere speculation Lordquinton May 2018 #45

Some could have been atheists Eko May 2018 #2

Speculation. guillaumeb May 2018 #7

Maybe, maybe not. Eko May 2018 #18

He seems to have opposed the negative aspects of the institution. guillaumeb May 2018 #20

I dont know. This one is pretty strong. Eko May 2018 #22

Jefferson also wrote that each generation needs a revolution. guillaumeb May 2018 #29

What does that have to do with religion? Lordquinton May 2018 #46

It has to do with Jefferson and his views. guillaumeb May 2018 #65

So it's a non-sequitur meant to distract from the topic Lordquinton May 2018 #76

You seem confused. guillaumeb May 2018 #108

No, you're just trying to cover for yourself Lordquinton May 2018 #128

Congratulations on convincing yourself. guillaumeb May 2018 #136

Wow, a stock answer with less than zero substance Lordquinton May 2018 #142

Amazingly enough, I thought the same about your response. guillaumeb May 2018 #145

And again distracting from the topic at hand Lordquinton May 2018 #151

And again, missing the point. guillaumeb May 2018 #154

Did you even read what I wrote? Lordquinton May 2018 #169

You're missing the point Major Nikon May 2018 #182

It's a good thing I'm used to these responces Lordquinton May 2018 #190

As predictable as a broken record Major Nikon May 2018 #183

Oh my... Lordquinton May 2018 #191

A choir of one, apparently. trotsky May 2018 #202

There's always the fan club Major Nikon May 2018 #203

Update Lordquinton May 2018 #213

It would save a lot of time if he just numbered his responses Major Nikon May 2018 #214

I think you missed... NeoGreen May 2018 #215

I'm going to have to combine some of them Major Nikon May 2018 #216

how about delineated variations... NeoGreen May 2018 #217

That would save a lot of time Lordquinton May 2018 #218

Someone should open a thread on it Major Nikon May 2018 #219

Perhaps when more time is available Lordquinton May 2018 #220

Did he really say that? dont think so. Eko May 2018 #164

There you go with your reality again Major Nikon May 2018 #184

Sorry Mr Major Sir! Eko May 2018 #185

You need to put yourself on report Major Nikon May 2018 #186

I think it might have been the 12th. Eko May 2018 #189

That's fully covered by the 11th Major Nikon May 2018 #194

Shucks. Eko May 2018 #195

Does that say how it relates to his views on religion? Lordquinton May 2018 #192

I think I could answer that, Eko May 2018 #196

Taking it far away from the topic at hand Lordquinton May 2018 #197

ah, Guillaumeb is a ally. Eko May 2018 #198

guillaumeb saidsimplesimon May 2018 #178

I do find it interesting that Eko May 2018 #231

Sometimes I wish that Jefferson favored the period lordsummerisle May 2018 #177

He didnt say that also. Eko May 2018 #168

This doesn't sound like opposition to the negative aspects of the institution. Eko May 2018 #170

So where were the atheists of the 17th and 18th centuries? Major Nikon May 2018 #23

A good question. guillaumeb May 2018 #30

And you are certainly entitled to that opinion Major Nikon May 2018 #38

Unfamiliarity with the concept? guillaumeb May 2018 #64

Not an answer Major Nikon May 2018 #81

I was referring to your question, and a possible reason guillaumeb May 2018 #109

Understanding the difference seems to be the best reason. YMMV. Major Nikon May 2018 #121

Revelation is an interesting subject. guillaumeb May 2018 #132

They also do Major Nikon May 2018 #138

You well demonstrate what you attack. guillaumeb May 2018 #144

My first line matter of factly answers the question you posed yourself. Major Nikon May 2018 #153

You have convinced yourself. guillaumeb May 2018 #155

I can't take all the credit Major Nikon May 2018 #157

Yes, you can. guillaumeb May 2018 #159

No need to be so modest Major Nikon May 2018 #162

Speaking of debates, this one was a bit bizarre. guillaumeb May 2018 #163

You post this immediately after your diversion remark? Major Nikon May 2018 #173

Are you welcoming me from "mansplaining" world? guillaumeb May 2018 #209

Won the debate with you as well Lordquinton May 2018 #193

Some arguments are self-defeating Major Nikon May 2018 #212

Actually the term "atheist" was used by Greeks and Romans to refer to early Christians. malchickiwick May 2018 #52

The term was also used differently in the 17th and 18th centuries by freethinkers Major Nikon May 2018 #53

Do you think "creator" and "god" are interchangeable? Major Nikon May 2018 #44

So, are you a deist? MineralMan May 2018 #3

I am a theist first, guillaumeb May 2018 #8

So, then, you are not a Christian? MineralMan May 2018 #10

I see no problem with being a Christian and a deist. guillaumeb May 2018 #12

OK, then... MineralMan May 2018 #14

Was this Jesus person a god? Voltaire2 May 2018 #49

I agree with the American Friends that each person has a fragment of the divine. guillaumeb May 2018 #66

That is not an answer. Voltaire2 May 2018 #71

If all humans are a part of the Creator, guillaumeb May 2018 #106

Nope. Still haven't answered. Voltaire2 May 2018 #114

I did answer, but not as you wanted. guillaumeb May 2018 #120

I understood it perfectly Major Nikon May 2018 #176

So you think you're a god? Lordquinton May 2018 #129

You sound confused. guillaumeb May 2018 #137

Again, not in the slightest Lordquinton May 2018 #146

Definitely confused. guillaumeb May 2018 #148

You talking about yourself? Lordquinton May 2018 #167

Sometimes a non-answer provides far more information Major Nikon May 2018 #179

multiply this by a hundred Lordquinton May 2018 #188

"the message of Jesus" trotsky May 2018 #204

Still confused? guillaumeb May 2018 #211

Gaslighting. n/t trotsky May 2018 #221

Does that not make you an atheist? Major Nikon May 2018 #59

Are you working on some sort of routine? guillaumeb May 2018 #70

Come on Gil, don't project. Mariana May 2018 #74

Just questioning how much or little you know about the subject matter Major Nikon May 2018 #83

As are mine of you. guillaumeb May 2018 #110

Sorry I didn't mention it before, but thanks for utterly disproving your argument Major Nikon May 2018 #124

Thank you for confirming my suspicion. guillaumeb May 2018 #135

I am, thanks for noticing. Major Nikon May 2018 #139

Preceded my agnostic 'belief,' elleng May 2018 #4

My opinion is that this described George LeMaitre as well. guillaumeb May 2018 #9

Who was a theist and decidedly not a deist Major Nikon May 2018 #84

Sarcasm and insult are not substitutes for insight. guillaumeb May 2018 #111

You stole my line! Major Nikon May 2018 #123

Depends on what they meant by "placeholder" marylandblue May 2018 #6

After reading the response, and replying to it, guillaumeb May 2018 #11

You never actually asked that question marylandblue May 2018 #13

I disagree. guillaumeb May 2018 #15

I have no dog in this fight marylandblue May 2018 #19

I accept that about you. guillaumeb May 2018 #21

The best part is his own source says virtually the exact same thing Major Nikon May 2018 #42

Ouch. trotsky May 2018 #205

Disagree all you want. The facts tell a different story. Major Nikon May 2018 #41

If you refrained from insults and attack, guillaumeb May 2018 #115

The facts tell a different story Major Nikon May 2018 #122

Your responses are very harmonious. guillaumeb May 2018 #134

Whatever that means Major Nikon May 2018 #140

It was his choir insult. It should be on the list. Voltaire2 May 2018 #223

Sounds more like a sock allegation Major Nikon May 2018 #224

Could be that too. Voltaire2 May 2018 #225

I'm sure at this point he would love nothing more than to see this thread fall off the first page. trotsky May 2018 #228

Yes. We are supposed to sing in harmony. MineralMan May 2018 #226

That's exactly what happened Lordquinton May 2018 #47

At least you admit your strawman Major Nikon May 2018 #24

"no evidence" Major Nikon May 2018 #133

You missed an essential part. guillaumeb May 2018 #141

Funny how you pretend to want to engage in dialog after injecting yet more strawman into it Major Nikon May 2018 #150

Funny how you ignored my point. guillaumeb May 2018 #152

The evidence proves otherwise Major Nikon May 2018 #160

Nice try. guillaumeb May 2018 #161

One would have to be delusional to think so Major Nikon May 2018 #165

I am enjoying how you divert yourself. guillaumeb May 2018 #166

I'm diverting to your own words. Please try to stay focused. Major Nikon May 2018 #172

"Deists believe in a god of nature -- a noninterventionist creator" procon May 2018 #16

I understand your position. guillaumeb May 2018 #17

It's actually simplistic and non-inclusive Major Nikon May 2018 #56

It has always somewhat surprised me when religious folks try to appropriate procon May 2018 #57

Most religions have some kind of creation myth Major Nikon May 2018 #58

That's why I'm an atheist, it's much less complicated than the religious contortions. procon May 2018 #60

There are those here who make that overly complicated as well Major Nikon May 2018 #61

LOL - that's good, too. nt procon May 2018 #62

Christians are not deists Cartoonist May 2018 #25

Christians can be deists Major Nikon May 2018 #27

Are there Christians like that? Cartoonist May 2018 #28

At one time there were many Major Nikon May 2018 #37

By definition, Christians must believe that Jesus was 'anointed' muriel_volestrangler May 2018 #85

And thus the matter is settled? guillaumeb May 2018 #31

Just responding to your OP Cartoonist May 2018 #33

The sources can make that claim. guillaumeb May 2018 #34

I'm OK with the definition you provided. Cartoonist May 2018 #35

Deity and deism. guillaumeb May 2018 #63

Dumb and dumber Cartoonist May 2018 #77

Anyone can be a Christian. Mariana May 2018 #43

There are those who believe otherwise Major Nikon May 2018 #86

Yeah, and they all believe and disbelieve different things. nt. Mariana May 2018 #87

It's part of the Christian tradition to argue about who is a Christian marylandblue May 2018 #91

Things were much simpler when you could just BBQ dissenters Major Nikon May 2018 #92

A non-interventionist creator paleotn May 2018 #36

This becomes apparent when you consider how they avoided the supernatural Major Nikon May 2018 #39

I think you didn't read very far into your own source Major Nikon May 2018 #40

I think you are channeling another poster here. guillaumeb May 2018 #67

The same methods of actually reading the material you provided? Mariana May 2018 #79

Same nonsense Major Nikon May 2018 #82

Such a literalist Lordquinton May 2018 #48

Your source is biased. Mariana May 2018 #50

Did you really expect anything other than confirmation bias? Major Nikon May 2018 #55

Name an unbiased source. guillaumeb May 2018 #68

You can do better. Mariana May 2018 #72

And some can find fault with everything guillaumeb May 2018 #112

Websters, Collins, Oxford, Britanica, among others Major Nikon May 2018 #89

So you openly admit you went to a biased source? Lordquinton May 2018 #96

You need to reread what I wrote. guillaumeb May 2018 #113

Funny how you always say that when you've been busted contradicting yourself Major Nikon May 2018 #126

Ok, reread it Lordquinton May 2018 #127

What are you trying to accomplish with all your post? njhoneybadger May 2018 #51

Nailed it Major Nikon May 2018 #54

You sound convinced of your own opinion. guillaumeb May 2018 #69

What are you trying to accomplish with your post? nt. Mariana May 2018 #73

... Major Nikon May 2018 #94

To promote dialogue in with those who wish it. guillaumeb May 2018 #107

Please do keep promoting this thread Major Nikon May 2018 #143

Your best talent so far seems to be posting such clips. guillaumeb May 2018 #147

Yours seems to be hubris Major Nikon May 2018 #156

You need a better dictionary. guillaumeb May 2018 #158

We can use yours if you like Major Nikon May 2018 #171

LMAO trotsky May 2018 #206

At least he is consistently inconsistent Major Nikon May 2018 #207

Not another type of theist - here's the definition of theism: muriel_volestrangler May 2018 #75

You may be using a too-high level of diction. MineralMan May 2018 #78

Were you confused? guillaumeb May 2018 #117

Someone is Major Nikon May 2018 #181

Kinda funny though Major Nikon May 2018 #88

Now, here we have the crux of the matter. Both recognize a supreme being but PatrickforO May 2018 #105

So in your view, what does a deist believe that's different from your belief? Major Nikon May 2018 #180

According to the definitions provided here, the deist believes there is a God, PatrickforO May 2018 #199

Creation was intervention. guillaumeb May 2018 #116

Which is where the intervention stops for deists Major Nikon May 2018 #131

You yourself bolded "a noninterventionist creator". Are you saying that's an oxymoron muriel_volestrangler May 2018 #200

What's your take on free will? Htom Sirveaux May 2018 #80

As sentient beings, we have free will. guillaumeb May 2018 #118

From your own crappy source: Voltaire2 May 2018 #90

... Major Nikon May 2018 #93

Apparently, one needs only to read the introductory material MineralMan May 2018 #95

The 11th Commandment in action is amusing to behold. guillaumeb May 2018 #119

"amusing to behold" Major Nikon May 2018 #125

"Mansplaining" can also be amusing to see. guillaumeb May 2018 #229

... Major Nikon May 2018 #230

So pointing out that your source contradicts your thesis is a violation of your rules? Voltaire2 May 2018 #222

Many things are amusing... MineralMan May 2018 #227

Someone clearly got their feelings hurt in the process Major Nikon May 2018 #232

So you go to a conservative christian site for absolute definition on religious matters Lordquinton May 2018 #97

This thread is now a religion forum classic trainwreck. Voltaire2 May 2018 #98

It should be a sticky Major Nikon May 2018 #99

Well, it is sunday... Lordquinton May 2018 #100

Bookmarking to be a permanent reference... NeoGreen May 2018 #101

Don't forget to rec Major Nikon May 2018 #102

Done (nt) NeoGreen May 2018 #103

Oh, we do know Lordquinton May 2018 #130

K&R for future reference. MineralMan May 2018 #104

Only 27 out of 80. guillaumeb May 2018 #149

The quality more than makes up for the quantity Major Nikon May 2018 #174

Irrelevant to the discussion. MineralMan May 2018 #208

There's a lesson to be learned here Major Nikon May 2018 #187

"Thoughts" saidsimplesimon May 2018 #175

Which does not make them atheists. guillaumeb May 2018 #210

And there you go with a fine display of hypocrisy once again. trotsky May 2018 #201

Deism defers to the study of Nature; Science Bretton Garcia May 2018 #233

This might be an eternal thread. Voltaire2 May 2018 #234

Hopefully there's no religion in it Bretton Garcia May 2018 #235

Good god man, don't ever say that Major Nikon May 2018 #236