2016 Postmortem

pdsimdars

(6,007 posts)

145. Rational thinking has no effect on them. Just like the GOP

Reply to Armstead (Original post)

Wed Jun 15, 2016, 12:12 PM

Jun 2016

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Before the big clampdown, I'm gonna say this [View all] Armstead Jun 2016 OP

This is the classic Third Way strategy - looks like it worked - djean111 Jun 2016 #1

Yep -- False Dichotomies are tasty, I guess Armstead Jun 2016 #2

The Third Way has elevated Sophie's Choice into a wildly profitable form of artfulness. n/t djean111 Jun 2016 #3

Perfectly put. nt Else You Are Mad Jun 2016 #151

! bobthedrummer Jun 2016 #183

!!! Pastiche423 Jun 2016 #212

Coin that phrase, djean111! MrMickeysMom Jun 2016 #229

Thanks! I have been saying that the Third Way gives us Sophie's Choice for quite a while. djean111 Jun 2016 #230

No one in the Democratic Party ever said this. randome Jun 2016 #24

Plenty of DUers were using sexism and... tex-wyo-dem Jun 2016 #103

Really? You mean that in your reality no one has ever said that. rhett o rick Jun 2016 #217

Yet never has this idea been seized upon as voraciously by "minority" voters, pitting them against highprincipleswork Jun 2016 #30

The Third Way, as a matter of fact, considers EVERYBODY is equal - we will ALL be victims djean111 Jun 2016 #104

Correct. nt ReasonableToo Jun 2016 #231

All money is white fasttense Jun 2016 #178

It was a hideous thing to behold. nt m-lekktor Jun 2016 #4

I think this is a bit of a strawman jcgoldie Jun 2016 #5

Thanks for saving me the trouble of writing what you wrote obamanut2012 Jun 2016 #6

Code for what? you can't deny the fact that at times she has outright Exilednight Jun 2016 #7

The fact that she's under criminal investigation AtomicKitten Jun 2016 #8

Last I checked investigation does not equal guilt. DCBob Jun 2016 #22

The OIG's report refutes a litany of her lies about the facts of the case. AtomicKitten Jun 2016 #26

Your comment referred to the FBI.. no? DCBob Jun 2016 #33

The IG report did not detail any laws being broken... tex-wyo-dem Jun 2016 #127

Please be more specific.. regarding the "lies". DCBob Jun 2016 #133

Here's a pretty good summary... tex-wyo-dem Jun 2016 #136

None of those are clear cut. DCBob Jun 2016 #138

Then why hasn't she? AgingAmerican Jun 2016 #143

Because for the most part she sees this as much ado about nothing. DCBob Jun 2016 #146

Well, okay, that's your filter I guess... tex-wyo-dem Jun 2016 #144

What dots? Please be more specific. DCBob Jun 2016 #147

Connect away... tex-wyo-dem Jun 2016 #150

I dont have time to go through all that. DCBob Jun 2016 #156

Why would you describe your personal opinion as a preview of a report you know nothing about? Kentonio Jun 2016 #218

Let's say it's an educated guess. DCBob Jun 2016 #226

Lol. NIce Spin and I mean it. Not "follow all the rules ... perfectly" lol Rilgin Jun 2016 #181

What are you talking about?? She complied with FOIA. DCBob Jun 2016 #185

No She didnt Rilgin Jun 2016 #187

She provided copies of all her work related emails to the State Dept. DCBob Jun 2016 #188

What part of 2 years after leaving office and under pressure do you not understand? Rilgin Jun 2016 #189

It took time to sort out the work related from the personal stuff. DCBob Jun 2016 #190

Lol. She started sorting years after leaving office. See post on what Report said about it(NT) Rilgin Jun 2016 #192

She did comply with the requirements of FOIA.. just not immediately. DCBob Jun 2016 #194

The report said "At a minimum" she was required to archive her emails when leaving office Rilgin Jun 2016 #191

I suspect its a common issue among high level officials to not always provide a complete archive.. DCBob Jun 2016 #193

Actually, I suspect most public officials like most lawyers follow the systems put in place Rilgin Jun 2016 #199

FYI.. most of what you claim I said, I didnt. DCBob Jun 2016 #214

Have not been talking about claasified.. Only foia and transparency Rilgin Jun 2016 #216

No one is going to jail for being late submitting FOIA documents. DCBob Jun 2016 #227

Nice strawmman. Find the word jail in any of my posts Rilgin Jun 2016 #239

So what's her penalty for being late? DCBob Jun 2016 #240

Not all problems are criminal.Perhaps its not being rewarded with the highest office in the Country. Rilgin Jun 2016 #245

I think you exaggerate this issue tremendously. DCBob Jun 2016 #247

This message was self-deleted by its author AtomicKitten Jun 2016 #31

And Sanders was under investigation regarding campaign finance laws. randome Jun 2016 #27

The way his trip to Italy is treated as a non-issue is a thing to behold.... bettyellen Jun 2016 #63

Yeah, that was ridiculous, too. randome Jun 2016 #71

They'd be calling to jail HRC for that too. Crazy. bettyellen Jun 2016 #77

Agreed!! nt eastwestdem Jun 2016 #206

We know what they'd be saying about Hillary for the same shit..... bettyellen Jun 2016 #211

Ain't THAT the damn truth! 60K to hang out in the lobby and "discuss" POVERTY with the pope Number23 Jun 2016 #224

Well said. auntpurl Jun 2016 #9

The big mistake Bernie made at the beginning..... Armstead Jun 2016 #44

Then we generally agree. auntpurl Jun 2016 #47

Yes. You are correct. bvar22 Jun 2016 #205

Agreed, but most of the problem stemmed from the fact that there was little of substance to actually eastwestdem Jun 2016 #207

Yes, I remember when Hillary chained herself to the post in Congress as a Senator... Armstead Jun 2016 #208

+1, "when you might get shot before your boat rises. " uponit7771 Jun 2016 #244

^^^This!^^^ Surya Gayatri Jun 2016 #16

Strawman? chervilant Jun 2016 #17

What about all the people who voted for her because they preferred her positions? auntpurl Jun 2016 #18

15,804,479 Stuckinthebush Jun 2016 #19

No... Armstead Jun 2016 #21

Hillary hate has always been based on gender. It came from men who could not deal with a strong upaloopa Jun 2016 #29

I have never met any Bernie supporter who didn't strongly support Elizabeth Warren virtualobserver Jun 2016 #53

Well, until last week. auntpurl Jun 2016 #57

which confirms that it was about Hillary, not gender. virtualobserver Jun 2016 #66

Dunno, didn't see the same kind of vitriolic rhetoric against Obama auntpurl Jun 2016 #67

because Obama and Hillary are both viewed as centrist.... virtualobserver Jun 2016 #72

Bingo. Else You Are Mad Jun 2016 #152

I hate warmongers, whether they have a penis John Poet Jun 2016 #97

Is it impossible for you to wrap your head around, we don't like her policies? Fuddnik Jun 2016 #157

+1000 sarae Jun 2016 #40

Here's one example from just this morning: surrealAmerican Jun 2016 #45

Discussing race and gender and the effects they have on how one perceives situations ismnotwasm Jun 2016 #114

Strawman? You do know what that means, right? lumberjack_jeff Jun 2016 #120

.. tex-wyo-dem Jun 2016 #134

What's the difference? bonemachine Jun 2016 #135

I agree with your analysis Gothmog Jun 2016 #142

Its because she's been around too long already arikara Jun 2016 #196

+1, Weaver and Divine admitted not competing in "southern states" & Sanders lost by over 2 mil votes uponit7771 Jun 2016 #243

Life is in session, Armstead, and there really is a difference between the parties BeyondGeography Jun 2016 #10

Life is always in session and the GOP is an ever present threat Armstead Jun 2016 #32

+ 100 K & R ancianita Jun 2016 #219

Operative words "believe" and "had"..... bettyellen Jun 2016 #233

Believe is the operative word for everyone here and elsewhere regardless of their opinion Armstead Jun 2016 #234

K&R Spot On! B Calm Jun 2016 #11

".. playing right into the hands of the GOP and Big Money and Big Power." Scuba Jun 2016 #12

In addition to my reply above... auntpurl Jun 2016 #13

We'll see. I hope you are correct Armstead Jun 2016 #35

Those people are a vocal minority. auntpurl Jun 2016 #36

I've been browsing the front page of GDP. LWolf Jun 2016 #14

Well we feel the same about you and yours. My guess is the months and years of other interests will upaloopa Jun 2016 #23

Hillary has said many times auntpurl Jun 2016 #25

Hillary says a lot of things. Beowulf Jun 2016 #48

She'll fight for your rights and prosperity too. auntpurl Jun 2016 #51

Saying so don't make it so. Beowulf Jun 2016 #58

Hillary has been a dedicated public servant for 30 years auntpurl Jun 2016 #60

So was Richard Nixon. Beowulf Jun 2016 #96

Nixon supported a guaranteed basic income. Nt lostnfound Jun 2016 #179

And founded the EPA. nt Lyric Jun 2016 #213

I see it. LWolf Jun 2016 #62

I find the best way to forgive is simply to feel sadness for the betrayer. Kentonio Jun 2016 #220

Yes. LWolf Jun 2016 #232

Absolutely. Kentonio Jun 2016 #246

TELL me about it. Miles Archer Jun 2016 #34

I took everyone off of ignore. Primary is over. nt Demsrule86 Jun 2016 #74

I just did the same. 30 names. auntpurl Jun 2016 #75

No one has said that focusing on economic justice is racist or sexist Nonhlanhla Jun 2016 #15

No, it is having a focus on economic justice at all that is the problem as far as I can see TheKentuckian Jun 2016 #40

Pushing for economic justice is not a problem Nonhlanhla Jun 2016 #83

"The Just Us system" All in it together Jun 2016 #174

The point is that Bernie folks had to be taught the lesson you just described. upaloopa Jun 2016 #20

That phony characterization was started long before the first primary was held Armstead Jun 2016 #70

Ah Yes, We Must Be Made To Heel!! ChiciB1 Jun 2016 #167

Brocialist* Octafish Jun 2016 #28

Bingo tonyt53 Jun 2016 #46

they really can't fob this sort of rhetoric outside of Jezebel/Medium/college commons MisterP Jun 2016 #203

To Detroit, Joe Biden brought busses Octafish Jun 2016 #209

the worst part for me has been Demsrule86 Jun 2016 #37

If many other male senators had run I would have said the same thing, so.... Armstead Jun 2016 #73

It was about gender. Demsrule86 Jun 2016 #82

If Charles Schumer were to run, I'd have said the same thing Armstead Jun 2016 #93

The problem is, your man was essentially a single-issue candidate Tarc Jun 2016 #38

It's also a general philosophical disagreement about whether the system is broken or not auntpurl Jun 2016 #42

I think your conclusion is very wrong. Kentonio Jun 2016 #221

He was focused on bringing out an issue that the Democrats have ignored since.... Armstead Jun 2016 #79

I'm sure he did, but most voters weren't interested Tarc Jun 2016 #112

To our collective detrement Armstead Jun 2016 #160

Actually a post like this should be allowed in the new DU "World Order". DCBob Jun 2016 #39

Progressive equals entitled? HassleCat Jun 2016 #43

Exactly -- We've lost a holistic sense that it all ties together Armstead Jun 2016 #50

Tell that to the voters rjsquirrel Jun 2016 #49

No....I am not blaming people who voted for her Armstead Jun 2016 #54

As far as I can tell Demsrule86 Jun 2016 #86

He did NOT call abortion rights a distraction.That was Rachel Maddow's disingenuous framing of his myrna minx Jun 2016 #200

You think what you posted supports the position did not consider abortion a distraction? Demsrule86 Jun 2016 #237

"But it's ridiculous to say..." BumRushDaShow Jun 2016 #52

You are right. Racism is a systemic problem. Armstead Jun 2016 #64

But it was initially seperated. And those who pointed it out were attacked and accused of working bettyellen Jun 2016 #76

It's a campaign with millions of people Armstead Jun 2016 #85

It's not "sensitivity" to notice the most common sexist/ racist trope- the concept that some should bettyellen Jun 2016 #95

I'm glad you are a mindreader Armstead Jun 2016 #105

You'd actually benefit from reading up about sexist tropes because you've treated us all to quite a bettyellen Jun 2016 #197

"But that doesn't mean it has to be separated" BumRushDaShow Jun 2016 #101

I agree with that Armstead Jun 2016 #108

Your definition of "material" BumRushDaShow Jun 2016 #111

I refer to material as things like.... Armstead Jun 2016 #115

I understand however what continues to be missed is that BumRushDaShow Jun 2016 #125

Economics is why there are food deserts Armstead Jun 2016 #155

Still missing the point BumRushDaShow Jun 2016 #180

You're missing MY point Armstead Jun 2016 #215

My pre-clampdown conclusion.... democrank Jun 2016 #55

"The practical side of life for everyone"= human rights are not practical. okay then. bettyellen Jun 2016 #56

No one is saying that, and if you insist on believing it, then we have nothing to say to each other Armstead Jun 2016 #65

If you don't get how this "practical" shit is fucking insulting then you've learned nothing... bettyellen Jun 2016 #69

Tilting at windmills with no hope of succeeding may feel good Demsrule86 Jun 2016 #89

If you don't get that I am not saying it is eitehr/or then you've learned nothing Armstead Jun 2016 #92

It's ridiculous to say that Hillary and her supporters don't want to address economic justice. YouDig Jun 2016 #59

We can legitimately disagree about ends and means on the economic issues Armstead Jun 2016 #68

That is what the primary was about. YouDig Jun 2016 #81

I disagree about the nature of the Clinton reactions Armstead Jun 2016 #90

Human rights are essential, should never have been called secondary. bettyellen Jun 2016 #98

I don't know about the posts here saying that. I didn't make them, and haven't really seen them. YouDig Jun 2016 #99

Amen. n/t Tom Rinaldo Jun 2016 #61

You are wrong. Evergreen Emerald Jun 2016 #78

Short and sweet....And I would just reply that so are you Armstead Jun 2016 #87

Yes...but you are wrong. Evergreen Emerald Jun 2016 #88

You are wronger Armstead Jun 2016 #91

The responses in this thread say it all Hydra Jun 2016 #80

Great post. Smarmie Doofus Jun 2016 #84

You miss the point-there are valid reasons for African Americans and others to not support Sanders Gothmog Jun 2016 #94

No...I agree with you that there are valid reasons to not support Sanders Armstead Jun 2016 #100

Social justice concerns are not the reason why Sanders failed to attract key groups in the base Gothmog Jun 2016 #141

Shit-stirrer WillyT set up the false dichotomy of economic v social issues. With tons of recs emulatorloo Jun 2016 #102

I agree with you workinclasszero Jun 2016 #107

I am not saying that we were all lily pure Armstead Jun 2016 #110

Trust me, my post is not about WillyT, it is about those who validated and amplified his message emulatorloo Jun 2016 #116

going to.....? yes? Armstead Jun 2016 #117

I added a sentence while you were replying emulatorloo Jun 2016 #121

I hope you are correct Armstead Jun 2016 #159

Just going by past history of DU's primary mode to GE mode transition. I hope you hang around to emulatorloo Jun 2016 #161

Yes, so much early constructive criticism. stranger81 Jun 2016 #163

That is clearly not one of the posts I was talking about. emulatorloo Jun 2016 #165

No, your team owns that. And has doubled down on it at every opportunity this election cycle. stranger81 Jun 2016 #168

I wrote "I do recognize that at some point unscrupulous HRC posters did run emulatorloo Jun 2016 #172

The "at some point" happens to be in May 2015. stranger81 Jun 2016 #175

So we disagree on when it started. I don't have any problem with that. emulatorloo Jun 2016 #177

+ a million, loo. I went through the rec list of WillyT's posts and blocked people from the AA forum Number23 Jun 2016 #225

More important for Hillary to prove she's progressive than for voters to prove they are not sexist. ancianita Jun 2016 #106

I have no need to prove the latter...and I doubt she can convince me of the former. Lizzie Poppet Jun 2016 #113

Agree. Most of her supporters know it, too, but make that claim. ancianita Jun 2016 #119

Because it will fool at least a few voters. Lizzie Poppet Jun 2016 #122

Glib toss-off mocks on this thread are a reflection of that attitude. ancianita Jun 2016 #123

You're deliberately misconstruing an argument La Lioness Priyanka Jun 2016 #109

Binary thinking is not a virtue. It was a weakness, and one of the factors that ... NurseJackie Jun 2016 #126

For which I am very grateful La Lioness Priyanka Jun 2016 #131

Your mileage varies from mine Armstead Jun 2016 #149

People who dismiss the black vote as unimportant La Lioness Priyanka Jun 2016 #162

It is reflective of a general lack of imagination. lumberjack_jeff Jun 2016 #118

Which is why poor and working class people voted overwhelmingly for Bernie. auntpurl Jun 2016 #139

And ironically... Wednesdays Jun 2016 #124

That's one of the things that bugs me about it Armstead Jun 2016 #148

Thank you! K&R'd. snot Jun 2016 #128

Thank you! K&R'd. snot Jun 2016 #129

Goodbye DU pengu Jun 2016 #130

Accusations of sexism was a far better tact that having to talk "policy". NorthCarolina Jun 2016 #132

The same people used all the same tactics to dismiss LGBT activists until recently DemocraticWing Jun 2016 #137

Abortion and women's rights, gay rights, civil rights and immigration are 'wedge issues' felix_numinous Jun 2016 #140

Rational thinking has no effect on them. Just like the GOP pdsimdars Jun 2016 #145

This primary tried to accomplish the full and complete discrediting of actual progressive ideas. arcane1 Jun 2016 #153

This party has mistreated the independent voters. They are expected to fall in line or get zip. floriduck Jun 2016 #154

Bernie is more like the Wicker Man ymetca Jun 2016 #158

Thank you, Armstead. Arugula Latte Jun 2016 #164

So Many Of Us Here Are Thinking The Very Same Thing... ChiciB1 Jun 2016 #166

I no longer believe in the Rainbow Coalition. Dems to Win Jun 2016 #169

Jesse Jackson Endorsed Hillary Clinton jamese777 Jun 2016 #201

Post removed Post removed Jun 2016 #170

Amen SheenaR Jun 2016 #171

the last day and you come up with a crappy OP like THIS......you can do better. stonecutter357 Jun 2016 #173

To care about income inequality and corruption is a privileged position TheFarseer Jun 2016 #176

Lucky You! You can whine for five more days... brooklynite Jun 2016 #182

I can whine forever if I want to Armstead Jun 2016 #204

Racism and sexism are a huge problem in our azmom Jun 2016 #184

"One can not be an Economic Progressive Populist without also being racist and sexist?" jack_krass Jun 2016 #186

Posts like yours are why I come here. Juicy_Bellows Jun 2016 #195

Very well said. It's a nuanced and sensitive topic to tackle. Avalux Jun 2016 #198

even saying that you want banker criminals prosecuted is "privilege" MisterP Jun 2016 #202

Post of the year right here! jonestonesusa Jun 2016 #210

The saddest thing for me was seeing that 'attack your opponent on their strengths' Kentonio Jun 2016 #222

K&R nt Live and Learn Jun 2016 #223

The reason it makes no damned sense ... MrMickeysMom Jun 2016 #228

The unusual thing about the current circumstances... tom-servo Jun 2016 #235

The symbolism is great, but we're electing a President not a symbol Armstead Jun 2016 #236

agreed. tom-servo Jun 2016 #238

tl;dr 'my issues are more important than everyone else's because I think so' anigbrowl Jun 2016 #241

It's more a matter of getting back into balance Armstead Jun 2016 #248

All of this I agree with, to be sure .nt anigbrowl Jun 2016 #249

Well said. Uncle Joe Jun 2016 #242