Aspen Daily News endorsement.

[Kanary]

Saturday, July 17, 2004


7/16/04
Vote Miles, Schaffer in Senate primaries



Mike Miles and Ken Salazar are both formidable candidates in the race for the Democratic nomination to replace Republican Ben Nighthorse Campbell in the U.S. Senate, but we feel Miles has the clear edge because he doesn't play party politics like his challenger does.

As the scrappy underdog, Miles has been on a shoe-gum campaign for the last two years. And to Attorney General Salazar and his campaign staff's chagrin, the once obscure educator and former Army Ranger has posed a tougher campaign than they ever projected.

Miles claimed the most votes in May's Democratic State Assembly, and by doing so, claimed the top line on the Aug. 10 primary ballot.

There's reason for Miles' swelling popularity. He's held a firm stance against the war on Iraq since it began, instead of testing the political winds - like Salazar did - before opposing the invasion. Miles' views are much like fallen Democrat Howard Dean, but he's able to keep his cool when the pressure mounts.

EDITED BY ADMIN: COPYRIGHT

[Hawkeye-X]

1. Wonderful news!

This is one of the biggest swing areas, but Mike Miles should have wooed these folks a while, while Salazar has the Democratic party backing but not the backing of the common folks, which is still strong from the days of Howard Dean - and Miles is a Dean supporter!

Hawkeye-X

[Kanary]

2. Dean supporter, with policies more like Kucinich ^_^

Mike Miles is a candidate who comes along once in a generation.

Kanary, with fingers crossed

[Crunchy Frog]

11. I've found him to be

much more similar to Wes Clark myself. Other Clarkies that I know, who support him, feel the same way,:evilgrin:(runs away to avoid the flames).

Agree that he's a once in a lifetime candidate, fingers crossed right along with yours. :)

[Robb]

4. Not to nit-pick

...and I think I've made my position liking both but supporting Salazar as transparent as possible... but one of Salazar's greatest strengths happens to be the backing of the "common folks". Remember, this state does not end west of Canon City. Out here he's extremely popular across the political spectrum.

[Hawkeye-X]

5. Answer me this.

Comparing Mike Miles and Ken Salazar -- how long do you think each one has campaigned?

I await your answer, Robb :D

Hawkeye-X

[Robb]

6. What?

Miles has been running his Senate campaign far longer. Not to be glib, but so what? :shrug:

[Kanary]

7. so what, indeedy

We wouldn't want to confuse our decisions with facts.

How did I do in the glib department?

Kanary

[Robb]

8. You've both lost me

...but I have a reputation for being a little slow, so it's probably not your fault.

Is there any question Miles' campaign has been underway longer? Is anyone disputing that? I'm just wondering why that's a big deal, that's all.

[CO Liberal]

55. Sure, Mike Miles Has Been Campaigning Longer

But Ken Salazar is leaving him in the dust....

[Moderator]

3. Kanary

Per DU copyright rules
please post only four
paragraphs from the
copyrighted news source
and provide a link to
the source.


Thank you.

DU Moderator

[Thrill]

9. Just curious

This guy Miles sounds pretty liberal how is that going to play in the conservative state of Colorado? Also when is the primary?

[Kanary]

10. To hear the dlc talk about it,

we should all give up any idea of ever winning with any liberal any time in the future.

We should just give it up, and vote for the most conservative DEM we can find.

Of course, then we'll just continue to be pissed when they pull stoooooooooopid stunts like backing the repubs, but...... oh well.......

Kanary

[Crunchy Frog]

12. The word "liberal" is at this point

a fairly meaningless word that seems to be mainly used as a label applied to people you want to discredit. There is no doubt that Miles is much more progressive than Salazar is, but he is no ideologue, and in my opinion is not so easy to categorize.

I see him as a principled pragmatist. He looks at what the real concerns are of ordinary people, and tries to come up with the most practical solutions based on his fundamental principles as well as his wide range of experience and knowledge. He is not beholden to special interests and he doesn't bend with the wind, or try to place himself on the "correct" spot on the political spectrum, whatever that may be at any given moment.

In my opinion, people accross the political spectrum, with the exception of the extreme RW, will respect him for that. They will respect the fact that his positions are not the product of ideology, or of testing the wind, but of his understanding of the issues, and desire to find workable solutions.

I believe that people accross the political spectrum tend to respect people who have principles and beliefs that they stand up for strongly, and without fear. They respect honesty and integrity more than specific political ideology.

Many people who are far to the right of the Colorado electorate, get elected because they are seen as standing strongly for their beliefs.

Also, I believe that his background in the military, in counterterrorism, intelligence analysis, and diplomacy, as well as his straight talk on such issues will tend to resonate with more conservative voters. Salazar has no experience, and very little knowledge in those critical areas.

I do not at all buy into the notion that Salazar will have more appeal in Colorado, just because he's more conservative. People in Colorado want someone who will listen to their concerns, and work towards real solutions.

The primary is on August 10th.

[janx]

58. Great summary, Crunchster!

;-)

[CO Liberal]

60. People Will Vote For Someone Who Will WIN!!!!

We haven't had a Democrat for a Senator since Ben Nightmare Campbell showed that his full first name was "Benedict Arnold".

I think Salazar has more appeal because he has more appeal. He's already won two state-wide elections - two more than Mike Miles. Personally, I wish Mike had gone after the congressional seat currently held by Joel "The Combover" Hefley.

[janx]

61. People will vote for the candidate they feel is best for the job.

I like Salazar, but I'd really love to see Miles win this one. And as I mentioned elsewhere, I really think that Salazar would be great for our next governor.

In any case, we'll find out soon who the Dem candidate will be.

[CO Liberal]

62. I'll Be Supporting Whoever Wins The Primary

But right now, I'm supporting Ken Salazar.

[CO Liberal]

13. Our Primary Is August 10th

From what I've gathered in the local media Ken Salazar is essentially guaranteed a win in November. No matter who wins the GOP nomination.

Mike Miles may have been campaigning for two years - I met him at a Domocratic Party meeting in Pueblo two years ago - but he does not appear to gathered mych interest outside his core group of supporters. The rank-and-file party members seem to be falling in behind Salazar.

Including me. I want a WIN this November.

[Kanary]

14. your facts aren't quite accurate

Mike has a lot of support, but the party machine are doing their utmost to crush him.

Democracy at work..........NOT

Thanks for buying into the DLC myth.....

[CO Liberal]

16. I'm Speaking as A County Assembly Delegate and Precinct Captain

Down here in Pueblo County, I just didn't see very deep support for Mike Miles among the other delegates. Since his brother John is running in our congressional district (and the 3rd CD covers about half the state), many people are just naturally supporting both Salazars.

No myth - just what I've experienced.

[CO Liberal]

49. I Believe My Facts Are Quite Accurate, Kanary

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=142x642

I'd like to draw your attention to Post #2 in this thread.

[CO Liberal]

50. From The Referenced Denver Post Article

Underlining emphasis mine:

Nearly one-third of the 300 likely Democratic primary voters in the poll said they had never heard of Miles.

Only 24 percent of them said they had a favorable opinion of the former Army Ranger and diplomat.

Salazar, on the other hand, has strong name recognition. The state's top lawyer earned a 62 percent favorable rating from likely Democratic primary voters. Only 8 percent don't know him.

"I'll probably vote for Ken Salazar because he has strong name recognition," said Mark Twarogowski, a 40-year-old school administrator in Denver who was one of those polled.

http://www.denverpost.com/cda/article/print/0,1674,36%257E64%257E2239261,00.html

[CO Liberal]

51. Again From The Referenced Article

Underlining emphasis mine:

The high profile is paying off for Salazar.

In the primary contest, Salazar gets 61 percent, to Miles' 15 percent, with 24 percent undecided.

Salazar's lead in that race is so large that it is comfortably outside the 6 percentage point margin of error in the poll of likely primary voters.

* * * * *

I rest my case.

[Kanary]

15. Oh yeah....

And how satisfying will your "win" be when we have one more Dem who takes our money and our efforts, then votes for RW issues, and possibly crowns that all with changing to a Repuke?

Those of you who are buying into this whole thing have NO ROOM to complain about Dems who are DINOs and keep voting against us.

Kanary

[CO Liberal]

17. Sorry to Burst Your Bubble...

...but I just don't see Mike Miles being as electable as Ken Salazar. Remember, by registrations our party is outnumbered by Repubs and independents. In order to win in November, the Democratic candidate will have to attract independent voters as well as GOP voters who are dissatisfied with their candidate.

Ken Slazar has a track record in wining statewide elections in Colorado. Mike Miles doesn't.....

[Kanary]

18. As I said, don't complain afterwards, when you have

one more DINO who betrays the Party, and continues to disappoint you with votes that are much less DEM-like.

Or, even pulls a Campbell.

I hear complaints all the time about DEMs with no spine, yet people can't wait to vote them into office.

This time I really don't want to hear about it two or three years down the road.

Kanary

[Robb]

19. My biggest complaint about Miles

...is frankly his more vitriolic, closed-minded supporters who would rather wax sardonic towards Salazar supporters and spout alarmist "pull a Campbell" or "DINO who betrays the party" nonsense -- or keep repeating the "Salazar was for the war" non-point -- than actually try to be persuasive about the men and the issues.

Which is a disservice to a remarkable candidate who has done unprecedented things in Colorado politics. And I'm talking about Mike Miles, who outweighs Salazar in many important aspects. But not the majority of them, and I'm sorry, but anyone who thinks one of the Salazar brothers is going to cast votes that are anything but "DEM-like" is just being ignorant.

Outside that urban bubble, out here where Democrats work with their hands lies an overwhelming, real grass-roots (corn-roots) support and respect for the Salazars... and as good as Miles is, he just doesn't have that base, and may never have it.

Spineless? No. He's a good man and a strong Democrat, just like his brother who will also take an important seat here shortly.

[Kanary]

22. You don't lecture me about "real democrats"

I have more at risk than you even *dream* of, and certainly don't have the support of the party anymore.

What you see as "close-minded" is people who have finally had it up to here with being attacked, first by republicans, then by dlc types who have closed hearts.

Since Mike is from Colorado Springs, which is about as conservative as it gets, and has bi-partisan support, I will just say...... you don't know what you're talking about.

I'll say it again........ I'm sick to death of seeing DEMs cry and complain about DINOs in washington who betray the best interests of the party, then go out and work and vote for more of the same.

Kanary

[CO Liberal]

25. And Don't Lecture US About "Real Democrats"

OK???

[Kanary]

31. Actually, I didn't

OK???????????

[CO Liberal]

47. Yes, You Did

How many times in this thread did you make "DINO" references? Or to Ben Nightmare Campbell.

Whether you see it or not, you're lecturing us - telling us that Mike Miles is the only "true" Democrat in the Senate race. Well, I'm not buying it. And from what I've seen, a majority of the Democratic yoters in this state aren't buying it, either.

[Robb]

28. Your own terminal uniqueness aside

...I don't get why you can lecture but I cannot. I can understand reacting to attacks, but I'm unconvinced every Democrat who doesn't support Miles has gone after you personally. I hope it doesn't appear I have, because I certainly don't want to be doing that.

And sure, I'm impressed by Miles' support in the Springs, but you can't really think it's more broadly conservative there than on the Western Slope? A little more publicly nutty, yes. :) Again, Miles has done amazing things, but Salazar's still more impressive to me. He's got a track record and his family have a good reputation out here -- and honestly I liked the man. Attack-dogging him isn't swaying me.

Miles has run a campaign appealing primarily to folks concerned about issues and elements of leftist ideology that aren't relevant in ag and ranch country, and while I applaud him for the energy he's created, as we say "it doesn't play in the sticks". Colorado is not Colorado Springs, neither is it Denver, nor Boulder. I'd like a Senator with a better understanding of his constituency than that Miles' campaign has shown.

For what it's worth, I got Salazar to raise his hand a swear to remain a Democrat once elected, in a moment of good humor that the paper carried. He's a good guy and a strong candidate, and slamming him with these DINO accusations is silly.

[Kanary]

32. Try doing a lot of phoning, and see what attacks you get

About the same as the Kucinich campaign...... those "Keebler elf" comments are soooooooooo endearing.

Of course I'm silly........ I have a lot personally at stake about who represents me..... Nightmare did such a great job of selling me out, and any more of that and I'll cease to exist.

I don't have the luxury of playing around with it.

So, while Miles' commitment to poverty issues is silly for you, for many it's a very serious matter, I can asure you.

Kanary

[Robb]

33. Twist away at my words if you need to

...but it amounts to the same thing. Feel burned, but don't get bitter if you want to actually convince people.

But if negativity and slamming are how you think you can change the world, carry on. I'm sorry.

[Kanary]

34. You're doing the twist ......without music.....

You told me I don't get attacks..... I told you I do. So, stalemate.

Twist?

I came to DU quite some time ago, expecting Democrats who were into listening, *understanding*, and figuring out how to work with each other. I was quickly disabused of that notion, and told to "grow a skin".

Well, I have, and the fact that that isn't liked either isn't something I can do much about.

There isn't much changing of *anything* that goes on here....... People don't listen, so there can't be any understanding, and they attack each other rather than support each other in actually WORKING ON ISSUES. Nothing I can say will change that.

So, I had my say about how discouraged I feel about the whole Salazar thing. We get what we deserve, and I will repeat, I don't want to hear any complaints about how we have DEMs in office who sell us out at important times.

Since you think that's just me, how 'bout you go read the thread about Obama talking on MTP.... you'll find it in GD.

I'm very far from being the only DEM discouraged and disgusted with the party. My elderly neighbor told me she's always been a committed DEM, but stopped working with the party years ago because of this very thing.

So, keep trying to isolate me, tell me I don't know what I'm talking about, and paint me as horrible.

There are plenty more like me, and some day, the DEMs are going to have to deal with us.

If they still want a party.

Kanary

[CO Liberal]

37. You May Think Mike Miles Is the Greatest Thing Since Sliced Bread

You're entitled to that opinion.

But we all don't have to think the same as you.

[Kanary]

38. You're right. Neither do the people who keep electing Zell

I don't wanna hear them cry, either.

[CO Liberal]

39. Who Died and Named YOU The Savior of the Democratic Party?

:shrug:

[Kanary]

42. WOW GREAT COMEBACK

:eyes:

this has been fun, but now that we're on the kindergarten level, don't you think it's time to admit we've gone about as far as this can go?

[CO Liberal]

44. Not Until...

...you concede that we're all entitled to our opinions. Even if they don't agree with yours.

[CO Liberal]

45. Incidentally, There ARE No "People Who Keep Electing Zell"

He's retiring this year, so no one will be electing him.

You really need to start reading more than just Miles campaign literature....

[CO Liberal]

43. "I came to DU quite some time ago..."

I see from your profile that you have about 4,400 posts.

I have over 22,500. Does that make me a better Democrat than you? Of course not.

We all have a stake in this election. You think Mike Miles is out best bet. I disagree - I think Ken Salazar is our man.

[CO Liberal]

20. I'd Rather Have A Democrat In That Seat....

...than Pet Coors or Bob Schaffer. And I think Ken Salazar will give us the best chance for that.

Don't get me wrong - I have nothing against Mike Miles. I only wish he had run for the 5th CD seat, to get rid of Joel "The Combover" Hefley.

[Kanary]

23. Haven't we learned *anything* about this damned

"electability" crap?

How much are we willing to keep giving up to the republicans?

Is there any limit to it?

Kanary

[CO Liberal]

26. Ken Salazar is an Honest, Honorable Man

That's all I need to know to trust him with my vote.

Not every candidate you don't like is a Ben Nightmare Campbell, Kanary.

[Kanary]

30. He might be....... I don't trust him.

He shows those same tendencies, and we've been bit enough......... this is not a state where we can afford more of that. The time comes to learn from the past.

I told Salazar I'll happily vote for him.......... for Governor.

And not before.

Kanary, who can't ignore the fact that * is also seens as an "honest, honorable man" to his supporters....

[CO Liberal]

35. Oh - Isn't THAT Special??

Just because I don't share your enthusiasm for Mike Miles, you equate me with a BUSH SUPPORTER?????

Is that supposed to make me vote for Miles? Don't count on it....

[Kanary]

40. same terminology

But, of course, you *were* thinking of changing your mind before I said that......

BWahahahha

[CO Liberal]

21. For The Record

Today, I am supporting Ken Salazar for the Senate. In the Aug 10th primary, I will be voting for Ken Salazar. On Aug 11th, I will whole-haetedly support whichever candidate receives our party's nomination.

:kick:

[Kanary]

24. Thanks for informing me.

[CO Liberal]

27. Then Stop Lecturing Us, Kanary

We're all intelligent, thinking adults here - that's why we joined DU!!!

:-)

[Kanary]

29. Telling you "Thanks for informing me" is a lecture?

How...... interesting is that.......

[CO Liberal]

36. You Keep "Lecturing" Us ....

...that YOU have "seen the light" and that anyone who supports Ken Salazar will live to regret their choice.

If you think you're gonna move any of us over to the Miles column, think again.

[Kanary]

41. you're too heavy for me to "move"

I told you what I thought.

I told you in another post why I said that.

I think we've completed this circle.

[CO Liberal]

46. And I Think.....

...that your attempts to advance Mike Miles on this forum have only served to make many of us stronger in our support for Ken Salazar.

[CO Liberal]

48. It Doesn't Look Like Any Other Papers Have Made Their Endorsements Yet

We'll have to wait and see how many follow the lead of the Aspen Daily News, and how many endorse Ken Salazar.

[F.Gordon]

52. How is this an "endorsement"?

Vote Miles, Schaffer in Senate primaries

I've read the "article" and it sounds more like a voting recommendation to me than an "endorsement". And if you "endorse" someone don't you have to choose a side?

:shrug:

[CO Liberal]

53. And Since No Other Paper in Colorado Has Endorsed Any Candidate...

...I'm not really sure WHAT to make of this. :shrug:

[CO Liberal]

54. From the "Aspen Daily News" Article

underlining emphasis mine:

Besides, the bulk of his (Pete Coors) platforms are difficult to stomach, much like his beer. We'd also like to keep the lid on Schaffer, whose name sounds just like another low-shelf brew, but he's the lesser of the two evils. Each candidate's support for the war in Iraq is enough to not elect them, but come Aug. 10, we encourage Republicans to pick Schaffer.

We won't mince words for our reasoning. We feel both Salazar and Miles would have a better chance defeating Schaffer than the aristocrat Coors in the November election.

On Aug. 10, we encourage Democrats to pick Mike Miles, and Republicans to choose Bob Schaffer.

* * * * *

ON EDIT: Actually, what I first thought was a half-hearted endorsement is no endorsement at all. They only "encourage" their readers to vote for Miles or Schaffer - and endorse neither.

http://www.aspendailynews.com/

[CO Liberal]

56. Hmmmm...No New Posts in 48 Hours

And still no newspaper endorsements......

[CO Liberal]

57. Latest Salazar & Miles Endorsement Data

From Ken Salazar’s web site (http://www.salazarforcolorado.com/about_ken/supporters.html):

The following individuals and organizations have signed on to help elect Ken to the US Senate.

Groups

AFL-CIO
Colorado Education Association
Fraternal Order of Police
League of Conservation Voters
The National Education Association Fund For Children And Public Education
Congressional Hispanic Caucus
21st Century Democrats
Clean Water Action
National Association of Social Workers


Elected Officials, former Elected Officials and Candidates

Senator (NC) and Democratic Vice Presidential Candidate John Edwards
Senator Gary Hart
Congresswoman Diana DeGette
Congressman Mark Udall
Congressman David Skaggs
Governor Roy Romer
Governor Richard Lamm
Lt. Governor Gail Schoettler
Mayor Wellington Webb
Rollie and Josie Heath
Dottie Lamm
Paul Sandoval
Ruben Valdez
State Senator Joan Fitz-Gerald
State Representative Andrew Romanoff


64 County Quarterbacks

Kerry Boese
Bill Shearer
Marguerite Salazar
Rosalie Martinez
Shirley Harris
Rob Eber
Charles King
Kay Lynn Hefley
Kitty Ann Long
Rollie Heath
Mike Massaro
Mark & Susan Yamashita
Jerry Mallett
Pete Cordova
Nancy Bogenhagen
Joe Hruska
Leroy Salazar
Mike Gomez
Dwight Gardner
Dave Mirnitz
David Little
Les Renfrow
Happy Haynes
Roxanne Baca
Joyce Foster
Ruben Valdez
Hazel Perkins
Vince White
Scottie Colescott
Peter Rudy
Kathy Brendza
Judy Sellers
Mark Johnson
Claire Garcia
Teri Baird
Bea Kauffman
Nancy Reinisch
Jim Lochhead
Abby Lochhead
Jeanne Nicholson
Paul Ohri
Katherine Ross
Marlene Zanetell
Alan Brown
Mary Anderson
Helen Williams
Renny Fagan
Darlene LaDoux
Zee Ferrufino
Larry Watts
Judy Arends
Tom Shipps
Mike McLachlan
Carl Miller
Don Hopkins
Andy Gavaldon
Mike & Yolanda Romero
Stephen Monks
Dorothy Arnold
Melba Hastings
Bill Cleary
Helen Traylor
BJ Myers
Sandy Seip
Don Schwindt
Ann Brown
Mary Loncar
Jim Crone
Linda Eisenach
Jane Hutchings
Peter & Dee Dee Decker
Rich Mueller
Keith Sharp
Leo Mailander
Jim True
John & Jane Stulp
Geri Lane
Tom Autobee
Phyllis Wiggington
Douglas Shriver
Greg & Susan Gosar
Ben Beall
Juan Gomez
Vicki Ford
Bev Rich
Steve Johnson
Dorothy Woltemath
Tom Looby
Helen Dyer
John Pacheco
James Drullinger
Pres Montoya
Max Harper
Paul Salmen
Sue Maisch
Robert Traylor

* * * * *

And the equivalent data from Mike Miles’ site (http://www.mikemiles4senate.com/test/endorsements/endorse.htm):

Endorsements

Colorado State Legislators

Senator Peter Groff
Rep. Terrance Carroll
Rep. Fran Coleman
Rep. Buffie McFadyen
Rep. Michael Merrifield
Rep. Lois Tochtrop
Rep. Frank Weddig


Other endorsements:

Colorado Association of School Executives (CASE)
Montezuma County Democrats Executive Committee
Garfield County Democrats Executive Committee
Julia Hicks, First Vice Chair of the Colorado Democratic Party
Vivian Stovall, President of the African American Initiative
Ann Oatman-Gardner
Margeurite Terze
Charles Hertenstein
Andie Kutinsky
Susan Jefferson
Ted Weverka
Sam Weaver
Chet Olivarez
Randa Davis-Tice
Richard Rosenfeld
Dick & Margaret Barkey
Bradley Barkey
Bruce Barkey
Kristin Homer, PhD
Eliza Hamrick
Ralph Longobardi, PhD
Phil & Judy True
Betty & Phil Weber
Dave Sullins
Lizette Mill
Linda Lungerich
Will Colbank
Louella Pizzuti
Larry Dunn
Janet Snyder
Michael Blair
Maurene McGrain
Teresa Coons
Griff & Barb Greffenius
Terry Carwile
Betty Spinuzzi
Jimmy Martinez
Peter Miaurro
Sharon Berthrong
Pete DeLuca
Loan Cornell
Liz Yet
Henry Buslepp
Kerry Dermody
Earl & Hellen Roherbaugh
Frank & Penny Starr
Glenn Graham
Bev Agnew
Judy Coursey
Robert Laitres

* * * * *

This is CO Liberal again. On balance, it looks to me like more heavy-hitters are lining up behind Ken Salazar. And of all the endorsements listed on Mike Miles' site, there's no mention of the Aspen Daily News, is there???

:shrug:

[janx]

59. HA!

I'd love to see this.