fit this frame around the 6th district- molly ivins

[mopinko]

"I listen to people like Rahm Emanuel superciliously explaining elementary politics to us clueless naifs outside the Beltway ("First, you have to win elections"). Can't you even read the damn polls?"

snip

"This supposedly pits Howard Dean, Harry Reid and Nancy Pelosi, emboldened by "a string of bad new from the Middle East ... into calling for premature retreat from Iraq," versus those pragmatic folk like Steny Hoyer, Rahm Emmanuel, Hillary Clinton, Joe Biden and Joe Lieberman.

Oh come on, people -- get a grip on the concept of leadership. Look at this war -- from the lies that led us into it, to the lies they continue to dump on us daily."

http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/01/20/ivins.hillary/

[dogman]

1. While I like a lot of what Ivins has to say, I don't agree with it all.

She has been beating the Bushes for some time with out a lot of success. If she had the answers he wouldn't have gotten out of Texas. Just because she has taken an "out now" position on Iraq, doesn't mean it's the only position or the proper position. It's obviously a great position for somebody selling their rants but a reading of where the American people stand indicates you wont get elected in a number of places (like the 6th District). Not only that, but is it wrong for those who feel their is a larger moral principle at steak to fail to bow to her? The problem with the Democratic Party is they cannot come to terms on what they want from a leader. The membership is highly independent in it's views and requires more of a herder. As to the Civil War in the Party she writes about, her cast of characters isn't quite accurate from what I've read. I believe they are not that far apart on retreat from Iraq. I don't recall Dean, Reid, or Pelosi calling for one either.

[mopinko]

2. the reason howard is setting record for fundraising

is that every time he stands up and screams the truth the dems wandering in the wilderness send him a truck load of small change.
people are absolutley sick of republican lite. it never was a winning strategy. nobody votes for a pale imitiation of anything.

[dogman]

3. Huh?

What has that to do with your OP or my post?

[mopinko]

4. it has to do with

what the rank and file in this party think. polls, shcmolls, they are telling dean, etal, that they want them to stand up, and they are saying it in the time honored american way, putting their money where their mouths are.
i think that people who think we need a "more conservative" democrat to run in the 6th are mistaken when they think that new democrats, entering this party, in this time, want some kind of soft squishy party. they don't. they want dems who stand up to the mess we are in. this is no ordinary time. the politics of triangulation that bill clinton applied, although they did work for him, sorta, really only slowed the march to the mess we are in. they did not prevent him from being hamstrung for most of his administration. and they did nothing to stop the onslaught on democracy that we are facing. in short, conventional wisdom is outdated. it is time to fight.
maybe i am wrong, but i think molly has hit in right on the head. if i were a new candidate for congress, i would damn well come out swinging. i have finally gotten to see a little of tammy, and although i do not find her to be an embarrassment to the party or anything, i do not think she is packing much of a punch.

[dogman]

5. Unless the demographics have changed Dems are not a majority in the 6th.

It may be what Dems want, no doubt, but that only works in places the Dems carry. Many places are majority GOP or a coalition of Independents and one of the two major parties. Of course that can be a real problem as we have seen. The person who wins the Primary is not always acceptable to the majority of voters in the General Election. There are no doubt races where a fresh honest face with a solid program could have an impact but they usually can't be so out there that they scare people. That is why the media jumped at the chance to misrepresent the Dean scream.