What's up with Indiana?

[sandnsea]

How come you guys are SO RED??? In a sea of blue, Indiana obviously sticks out. What's your take on this? Also, I've been curious if the founding of a state has anything to do with its current politics. What's the early political and religious history of Indiana?

[coloradodem2005]

1. I don't know how they got that way.

I just know that I have a very Republican Grandma that lives in that state.

[Bombtrack]

2. It's like the New Hampshire of the Midwest

A LONG time ago the Midwest and to a lesser extent New England were the strongholds of the GOP. Now both have tilted way to the dems. The midwest obviously less so, as most of it is still close to down the middle, but the one state left that leans way to the right is Indiana, as the one New England State that leans somewhat to the right is New Hampshire.

[XNASA]

3. Take it from someone who lives 6 miles from the IL/IN border...

I don't know.

It would be real easy for me, someone who lives in one of the most Liberal Cong Districts in the country to criticize Hoosiers. But I can't put my finger on it.

[tech3149]

4. Education and propoganda

A friend of mine went to a good school system here in the Pgh area. He moved back to Indiana when he was 15. The teachers were so impressed by what he knew he became the teachers pet. He honestly wasn't all that smart, he just had the opportunity to learn in a good school system. He moved back there when he was about 30. After two years of living in an environment of fundie Christian types and a steady diet of Faux news, he was a full blown rw nut. It took month's to try and re-educate him to see through the bs.

[Myrina]

5. Hoosiers don't think, they do as they're told.

Change is bad.
The media never lies.
Jesus is the Savior.

And all that jazz.

[olddem43]

6. Indiana has always been strange - like the time the KKK

took over the entire state government. You'd think that would have changed by now.

[sandnsea]

10. The KKK?

Truly? Very interested in that.

[olddem43]

21. Yes, I saw it on the History Channel

Story about the history of the KKK in America. I don't remember the time period but the Klan was very powerful in Indiana and got a majority of seats in the state legislature and the governorship. It all fell apart when many of them, including the governor were convicted of crimes and sent to jail.

[PVnRT]

23. The governor raped an underage girl on a train

Unfortunately for him, she survived long enough to tell her tale, and there were plenty of people itching for a reason to take the man down and have a reason to stand up to the KKK machine. This was back in the 1920's, by the way, when the Klan had their rebirth nationally, so to speak.

Their are allegedly Klan members in southern Indiana, used to be an honest-to-God chapter in Rockville, but they are mostly wannabes who are just racists I want to think that they are real-life Johnny Rebs fighting for the South to rise again so that they can kill theyselves some nee-groes.

[sandnsea]

24. I remember that story

So that was Indiana, hmmm.

[Ouabache]

28. It was the Grand Dragon , not the governor

but the governor at the time was a Klanner/former Klanner and he was in the Grand Dragon's pocket. The Grand Dragon was DC Stepehens or Stephenson, not sure which. It was the old Democratic newspaper the Indianapolis Times that was partly responsible for taking down the Klan in Indiana. The Times is defunct now and all we have is a Gannett rag, formerly owned by Dan Quayles family. The Indianapolis Star is largely part of the reason for Indina's 'backwardness'.

However tonight I was in a Starbucks and there was a newspaper stand with a shelf for the NYTimes and the STAR. The Times shelf was EMPTY. The STAR rack was still half full. Hope.

[jeffrey_X]

30. in the 1920's and 1930's....

1/3 of all white protestant men in Indiana were members of the KKK.

[BiggJawn]

31. She wasn't underage.

Her name was Madge Oberholtzer. she worked as a clerk in Indy, and had caught the eye of Grand Dragon D. C. Stephenson, who used to stand on the balcony of his home in Irvington ( a few streets away from the Oberholtzer home) and claim that he was THE LAW in Indiana....

He took her on a trip to Chicago, "had his way", and she got ahold of some Mecuric Chloride tablets and poisoned herself with them on the train back. I live within sight of those tracks...Freaky...

They had the trial in Noblesville because of allegations that the whole Marion County court system was in D. C.'s pocket.

That pretty much was the beginning of the end for the KKK's hold on Indiana politics. I think the GOP filled the vaccuum, and that explains why we have Democrat Governors and Mayors, but ReTHUG pretzeldents and congress-critters...

[Sporadicus]

7. I've Wondered That Myself

I lived for a few years in Indiana, and the depth of conservatism never failed to amaze me. Oddly enough, a relatively large segment of the workforce is unionized.

[JitterbugPerfume]

8. gosh--I have been a hoosier my whole life

uhhhhhhhhh----I will go sit in the corner now

[Sporadicus]

22. Don't Take it Too Badly

I'll forgive your hoosierosity :-)

Kentucky isn't any better in the political category, let me tell you. My congressional district had one of the best representatives possible - Bill Natcher. He never missed a vote in over 40 years in the House, until the very end. You may recall the time he was wheeled into the House chamber on a gurney - straight from the hospital - to cast a vote and keep his record intact.

What we got after he died was Ron Lewis, a fundie former-minister repug. He's active in drafting preemptive legislation against same-sex marriage as we speak. Sadly, his opposition in November is a 26-year-old farmer with a M.S. in political science from near my home town - heck of a nice guy, but the Democratic Party in Kentucky hasn't even seen fit to fund a website for him.

[blackcat77]

32. Me too

Before anybody goes TOO far overboard with this poor-pitiful-Indiana stuff, I'd remind you that we were also the state that gave the nation two great liberal senators, Birch Bayh and Vance Hartke. Unfortunately, Evan Bayh, the current senator is obviously not cut from the same cloth as his dad.

[Indiana_Dem]

35. Sorry so late in the conversation but

my 96yo grandpa told me the other day that the Dems used to be very conservative although the union was always a part of the Dem party. He says the 2 party's have flip-flopped ever since the Depression and WWI when Roosevelt created all the social programs to combat the Great Depression. He said it was the Republicans who were very liberal and one example was Lincoln and slavery during the Civil War. It was the Republicans in the North under Lincoln who fought slavery. The Democrats in the South were the conservatives and were responsible for wanting to keep slavery, thus you have the "Dixie Democrats" like Zell Miller is. He said the Dems REALLY became liberal during Civil Rights in the 60s. Maybe they were trying to right their wrong???? Then I asked my gramps why so many liberals are in the New England states up north then and all the conservatives in the South? He said, they switched parties pretty much but there are still a lot of "Rockefeller Republicans" in the New england states who are more liberal as they used to be and then the "Dixie Democrats" in the South or they've just switched party affiliation later.

I thought all of this was quite interesting. Maybe Indiana has always been conservative and they just switched from Dem to Republican over the years as the parties have switched but kept their conservatism.

Just thought I'd add my 2 cents. I can't stand all of this conservatism around me! Ugh! Needs balance. I can't believe I grew up here yet I'm not like most of Indiana.

[Psst_Im_Not_Here]

9. Born and raised a Hoosier

I really can't explain it myself! It truly makes no sense. A state where there are plenty of farmers, plenty of factories with unions, loads of blue collar workers and it remains RED.

I think that the true republican "stay out of my life", small government appeals to most there. However, that is a party of the past. It is a state where religion is very important and conservatism is the majority. The media markets there are truly right leaning, sometimes blatantly and the people tend to believe what they hear. However there are small pockets of Democrats in places like Indianapolis.

Even stranger still is the fact that the state generally votes Democrat for local offices and for the governorship. Nationally though, it always goes Republican.

I hear that the present temporary governor (the governor died in office) is having a hard time with re-election. It's a very close race.

My parents are republican but, raised 3 democrat children. my father has said that he made a mistake by having 3 children. Now not only do we cancel out their votes, we go up by one. LOL

It will be different this year however as I'm in Colorado now. My siblings are jealous that my vote might actually make a difference this year. But they will still be canceling my parents votes.

[sandnsea]

11. Religious base?

What's the predominant religion? Early missionaries? Who settled the state? Early power players? This is very confusing.

[Psst_Im_Not_Here]

13. The religious base

is predominantly Christian. It was settled much the same way most states were, by settlers traveling west. It has a high percentage of Germans and Irish so there is a mixture of Catholic and Protestant religions there. There were also many Native Americans as well, but they were converted to Christianity by French monks during the French Indian and Franco-American wars.

The northern part of the state is flat and has a lot of agriculture, the people have the traditional Midwestern accent. The further south you go, the more "hilly" the land becomes and you get into horse and livestock country. The people there have a more southern accent.

There is a history of racism in the central and southern half of the state and Indiana was once the capitol for the KKK. Though I've never seen it myself, it has been said that the Klan is still around, though not very popular.

The factories have been hit especially hard in the past 10 years. The auto industry (GM and Chrysler mostly) has/had many factories in many small towns throughout the state. This has lead to many people leaving the state or dealing with unemployment.

Many/most of the students who go to college in Indiana, leave Indiana for greener pastures.

The people there are friendly and prefer the simple life. They may vote republican for president but, mostly they are good people, just misinformed.

[sandnsea]

15. Well duh

Now you mention it, my ancestors were some of those French Catholic Indiana settlers at Vincennes. I do recall that many of the French went across the Mississippi to be under Spanish rule rather than be under the rule of the British. Don't know if that was as true in Indiana or not. It's just weird how one little pocket can be so different than the rest of the region. Like New Hampshire I guess.

[Psst_Im_Not_Here]

17. Actually

in Indiana, it was the Native Americans who were forced out beyond the Mississippi. Unfortunately, most of the history and culture of the Natives there has been lost. It's sad. Half of my family history and culture (on my fathers side) is irretrievably gone.

[coloradodem2005]

12. You live in Colorado?

Of course I see a lot of conservativism in the South suburbs of Denver. Basically through affluence. It has always been that way here.

[Psst_Im_Not_Here]

14. Yep Colorado

If you think they're conservative in south Denver, try the Springs! LOL

I thought Indiana was bad, sheesh! Not as bad as it is here.

[coloradodem2005]

16. The Springs is really bad.

While Colorado itself is not as conservative as Indiana, the Springs is the worst. As for our congressional races, the 5th will definitely stay with Hefley. The others could actually go Dem or stay Dem.

[Psst_Im_Not_Here]

18. I'm a bad bad girl

I'm the rebel of the neighborhood, with my bumper stickers and rhetoric. People get frustrated with me because I love to argue and am relentless. LOL My hubby has to give me "the eye" sometimes to get me to tone it down. I tend to scare people sometimes.:shrug:

I've even gone as far as to tell guests at our BBQ not to bring any Coors!

I'm not sure that everyone here is a conservative as much as the conservatives here are louder than most. I've been getting more and more compliments from people on my bumper stickers and I'm beginning to think that we're not so much the minority anymore.

[Hoping4Change]

19. The following is a brief overview but very informative.

http://www.kshs.org/publicat/khq/1932/32_2_malin.htm

Also a must read is "What is the Matter with Kansas" by Tom Frank.

[PVnRT]

20. Social wedge issues

That's really all there is to it. The Democrats might start winning around here if they would stop letting these things get out of control. Unfortunately, we're a "lost cause," so we get no attention from the national party. I find it amazing I've seen one Kerry-Edwards ad here; in 2000, I don't remember a single ad from the Gore campaign playing around here.

[democraticinsurgent]

25. true to some extent...

it does become a self-fulfilling prophecy. Indiana is a red state so no campaign resources from the Dems. That leaves the fundies and the Bushies to feed their BS unanswered. I long for the old days when campaigns used network tv; at least then we'd see something. now it's only cable network stuff that we get.

Historically it is a bible-belt state with many small to medium sized towns with agrarian roots. Those same towns are going through the transformation from agriculture to manufacturing to Walmartization. A lot of pain in this state, economically.

The social wedge issues tend to trump economics so far. The Indianapolis Star dominates the agenda but has lost a lot of power in the past few years and with Gannett's purchase of the paper it is less rabid RW.

Meantime there's an information gap. Few people have a clue as to what's really going on in Washington, but i think that's changing. Lots of people are going to see F9-11, it's playing all over Indianapolis and throughout the state.

I think Kerry has a shot at making it close this year. In 2000 it was something like ten points with no Gore effort and nader on the ballot. This year, we have f9-11, severe economic pain and no nader on the ballot.

Let's all see what we can do to encourage Kerry to have a presence here! Wouldn't it be fun to surprise everyone and turn Indiana blue?

[LostInAnomie]

26. The brain drain

Indiana has one of the biggest brain drain problems in the country. Hardly any college grads stick around IN to find jobs and start a family.

That leaves all the fundies who will fall for wedge issues every time, and all the dim witted rednecks who fall victim to the labels and catch phrases of the republicans.

[salin]

27. and ironically

there are, per capita, a LOT of colleges and universities in the state - very high number of small liberal arts colleges throughout the state. We import students (from out of state) and we lose students (even our own homegrown leave.) Huge brain drain in Indiana. I left as soon as I could - I just keep coming back... always one to defy a trend, I guess.

[Felix Mala]

29. Conservatisms Deep Roots

Although I'm a proud Hoosier, I'm not too proud of Indiana's fealty to the current version of the Republican party. This goes back to the Civil War and continued throughout the GOP's progressive period. I know many of ex-Republican's who have left the party because of anti-unionism and and anti-agricultural policies. But far right wingers are still shunned in many parts of the state. Indiana was founded by Quakers in the south and Central parts. There was a strong Catholic presence in the Central and Northern parts. There was so much fear of "papistry" that the state constitution forbids any kind of tax funding for religious organizations or programs. Ironically, the same yahoos who were worried about catholics were the forebears of those who want to divest the state of public education with voucher programs. Sorta let their ignorance and fear get in the way, wouldn't you say.

One final note, the Klan in Indiana was organized to oppose Catholicism. Catholics were the target of their demonstrations, although some blacks were attacked on occasion. I've heard family stories of my protestant grandfather and great-grandfather standing up to local yokels who wanted to burn the nuns out of their home. Of course, blacks were never really persecuted in Indiana for the same reason that Jews were never persecuted in Ireland: they were never allowed to settle here in the first place. Famously, much of the American auto industry began in Indianapolis - that why we have that race - but the city passed on the growth because of a fear of large numbers of minorities moving into the town. So the industry moved north, to Detroit. Come and enjoy some Hoosier Hospitality sometime!

[dray178355]

33. two quick points...

All of Indiana'a major cities have Democratic mayors. Indy, South Bend, Fort Wayne, Mich City, Gary, Bloomington...and the Governor has been a Dem for almost 15 years. I have a hard time believing that that many people split their tickets but there it is.

Remember, George W. Bush maanaged to become the President of this country without the consent of the governed. It can happen anywhere with a little manipulation.

I'm just sayin'.

[stranger_with_candy]

34. Goshen

I went to school at Goshen College, have many friends in the area... Goshen is a fairly liberal school but the surrounding area is the complete opposite. Made for some interesting interaction with the locals. ;)