Can an athiest become a Christian?

[angstlessk]

I work with Christians every day..and they are NOT the bug eyed Bachman...they are kind, considerate, loving people who CARE about me..NO REALLY they care... I might be wrong, I do believe in secularism, but maybe I am NOT an atheist?

[Electric Monk]

1. Why not?

Btw, you might enjoy the Religion/Theology forum if you're looking for extended discussions on pondering such as this http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topics&forum=214

[SidDithers]

2. What does being "loving people who CARE about me..NO REALLY they care"...

have to do with believing in God? It's a false association that good = Christian. There are plenty of asshole Christians out there, as well as plenty of atheists or non-Christians who are absolutely wonderful people.

Sid

[angstlessk]

12. The people whom I talk abou are very devout Christians, but non judgemental

and kind beyond belief...I think an atheist can be good, but they are pragmatic and not very emotional when emotion is needed!

[Goblinmonger]

16. That's a heck of a strawman you are building there.

I'm a pretty solid atheist. I'm pretty emotional. I can't imagine the wreck I will be when I drop my daughter off for her first year of college on Wednesday. Hell, I cry at the Parent Trap remake, for zeus' sake. You make it sound like all atheists are Dr. Spock.

[darkstar3]

24. +1

[fishwax]

19. why do you think atheists aren't emotional and/or can't be emotionally supportive?

That's certainly not true in my experience.

[raccoon]

53. That's totally just your own opinion.

"but they are pragmatic and not very emotional when emotion is needed"

[raccoon]

52. Great post! nt

[left coaster]

3. I work with atheists who are kind, considerate, loving people, who care, etc..

I don't see what believing in, or not believing in, an invisible sky daddy has to do with possessing any of those very HUMAN qualities..

[fishwax]

4. i don't understand your last line

You think you might not be an atheist because you work with nice Christians? How does that relate to whether or not you believe in a deity?

[Greg K]

5. Christians can be nice. Atheists can be a-holes.

The question is - do you believe in God. If you don't, you're an atheist.

[angstlessk]

18. Now there's the rub...believe in god...I really do not believe one has to believe in God to be a

Christian..one can believe in social contacts, using God and that fish thing to promote their "Christianity"

But the folks I work for are TRUE CHRISTIANS

[Humanist_Activist]

27. A christian is anyone who sincerely believes that Jesus Christ was the messiah and...

Son of God. If you don't believe that, you aren't a Christian, oh, and don't even start with the "true" Christian stuff, its inaccurate at best.

[darkstar3]

28. Cue the contradictions in 3...2...1...

There is no accepted definition for Christianity. It's been that way for a long time.

[Thats my opinion]

39. It is probably more authentic

to define and describe what it means to be Christian from someone inside the tradition, not an outside critic.

[Humanist_Activist]

42. Not really, pretty much anyone who describes themselves as Christian...

is regarded as Christian by me, I basically take the view a census or survey would.

The most obvious reason is that I can't read minds, so I don't know if their beliefs are sincere or not.

The definition I made in my previous post is general enough to apply to all denominations, if you have a problem with it, too bad.

[struggle4progress]

32. Birkbeck Institute for the Humanities podcast

Saturday 17 October 2009 15:00 – 17:00
Birkbeck Main Building Room B35

Atheism in Christianity: “Only an atheist can be a good Christian; only a Christian can be a good atheist”

In the long unavailable Atheism in Christianity, Ernst Bloch provides an original historical examination of Christianity in an attempt to find its social roots. He pursues a detailed study of the Bible and its long standing fascination for “ordinary and unimportant” people. In the Bible stories’ promise of utopia and their antagonism to authority, Bloch locates the appeal to the oppressed -- the desire “to transcend without transcendence.” Through a lyrical yet close and nuanced analysis he explores the tensions within the text that promote atheism, against the authoritarian metaphysical theism imposed on it by priest interpreters. At the Bible’s heart he finds a heretical core and claims, paradoxically, that a good Christian must necessarily be an atheist.

http://backdoorbroadcasting.net/2009/10/atheism-in-christianity-only-an-atheist-can-be-a-good-christian-only-a-christian-can-be-a-good-atheist/

[cleanhippie]

34. Oh, they are TRUE CHRISTIANS. Why didn't you say so in the first place?

:rofl:

[NMMNG]

44. If you don't believe in God

How can you worship/follow His purported son, Jesus?

That's what a Christian is, after all, someone who follows/worships Jesus. I was a Christian for 20 years but when I lost my faith I had to ditch Christianity. After all, if I no longer believed in God I couldn't profess to follow and worship his son, or to follow a religion centered on that.


BTW, what exactly is a "True Christian"? Are you aware that the RRRW Christians you dismiss as Not True Christians would dismiss your work buddies as Not True Christians for reasons of their own? Why is your definition of a True Christian any more valid than theirs? Are you privy to some special knowledge that others aren't? Why should people have to prove their Christian Cred to you?

[johnnie]

6. Sure

I'm not either of the two, but I see no reason why not.

I always wondered...if an Atheist acknowledges the idea of a god, then that acknowledgment confirms the thought of a god which in turns makes that thought real. So if the conception exists..... Ha, just thinking out loud.

[The Magistrate]

8. The Conception Existing, Sir, Does Not make the Reality Exist....

If it did, I would have woken up with Sophia Loren every morning of my life at fourteen....

[johnnie]

15. Reality is relative

Is a thought real?

[Electric Monk]

17. A thought of a unicorn is a real thought, but that doesn't make unicorns real.

[The Magistrate]

37. We All have Relatives, Fella

Somerimes you just move far away....

[Adsos Letter]

43. Einstein's second theory of relativity...

"The closer you are to your relatives the slower time passes."

Not all relatives, just certain ones. :D

[lunatica]

7. Atheists are as kind and ethical as anyone else

But when you're talking about being a Christian, you're usually talking about faith and belief in a Creator and more specifically the God of the Bible.

Caring and kindness and consideration and love have nothing to do with religion. Christians aren't that way because they believe in God. They're just that way. Even if people think the belief in God would be the only reason to be loving they're wrong. People are either loving or they're not.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

9. lol. yes and vice versa

[Warpy]

10. Appreciating the words of the Jesus figure

and trying to put them into practice while not buying a word of the man/god myth doesn't make you a believer, I'm afraid.

It just makes you a mensch.

[cordelia]

11. I work with and have worked with a wide variety.

So-called Christians who are dicks. Atheists who are kind and good.

There are also decent people who profess Christianity. Then there are prick atheists who use terms like "invisible sky daddy", "gawd", and the like.

edit typo

[demosincebirth]

13. If you want true christianity, stay away from fundies

[provis99]

20. No True Scotsman...

[ehrnst]

14. The definition - you believe that Christ died and was resurrected.

If not, you won't be a Christian.

There are other communities of faith that really care as well, if you do not meet that requirement.

[Thats my opinion]

40. Again

It would probably be more authentic to get a definition from someone inside the tradition not from an outside critic.

[darkstar3]

41. And when are you going to validate that your definition is correct,

while the hundreds of other definitions out there (which have spawned schisms and whole new congregations over the centuries) are incorrect?

[NMMNG]

45. Are you aware

of how many atheists and agnostics (and even people of other faiths) are former Christians? We have enough knowledge about "the tradition" to make an informed opinion, thank you very much. In fact, many of us have more knowledge than we ever wanted to know--which is often what turned us into ex-Christians in the first place.

[ehrnst]

46. I was raised a Christian, and know what the basis for the religion is. (nt)

[HockeyMom]

21. Sure, but can a Christian become an Atheist?

That is the more relevant question in today's world.

[Ozymanithrax]

22. Without taking Jesus Christ as your personal lord and savior...

(for most protestant faiths) or baptism, confirmation, and the holy Eucharist if Catholic, no.

To do those, and not just flat lie to their faces, you have to believe in God.

Once, you honestly believe in God, you have quit being an Atheist.

If you flat profess that there is no god, no how, no way, you can't be a Christian.

[LeftishBrit]

23. Of course they can

But you have to decide whether you actually believe in Christianity - just because the Christians around you are nice people does not necessarily mean that you would share their beliefs in this area.

[no_hypocrisy]

25. William, son of Madeline Murray O'Hair

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_J._Murray

[darkstar3]

26. More religious salesmanship at work.

There is simply no other reason to believe that it is a chosen faith that makes one good or moral. Your OP presents a false dichotomy, reliant on a stereotype. Unrec.

[Coyote_Bandit]

29. I've known

some wonderful Christian people, a pagan with an exceptionally kind heart and more than a few athiests that were beyond trustworthy and showed the greatest respect for the beliefs of others. You will find good and bad among the members of almost any group of people.

I would suggest that you determine just exactly what one must believe in order to be Christian - and then decide whether or not your beliefs are consistent. Read the Bible and decide for yourself what the Christian faith requires. You can read the history and theology books (which come complete with the biases of their authors) at a later time if you want.

There are different varieties of Christians. You might be surprised to learn that amongst themselves they disagree over such a basic issue as what is required to be Christian. Some are politically progressive. Some are rigid and legalistic. Some embrace the concepts of love and grace and mercy. Some are aggressive and some are downright demented.

People can certainly change their beliefs. An athiest can become a Christian - or vice versa.

Your choice - and yours alone.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

30. Yes, I know people who have done it

:shrug:

[NMMNG]

Of course

Everybody is born atheist. Many people are indoctrinated into theism and/or one religion or another, typically by their parents. Some come into it later in life for one reason or another.


But if you think you're not an atheist because you've met some really nice religious people maybe you're not sure what an atheist is. Do you believe in one or more gods (Zeus, Ra, Thor, Uranus, Allah, Yaweh, Appolo, Waqqa, etc)? If so, you're a theist. If not, you're an atheist. Whether or not you are a nice person is something entirely unrelated.

[struggle4progress]

31. "If it were true -- as conceited shrewdness, proud of not being deceived, thinks -- that

one should believe nothing which he cannot see by means of his physical eyes, then first and foremost one ought to give up believing in love. If one did this and did it out of fear of being deceived, would one not then be deceived? Indeed, one can be deceived in many ways; one can be deceived in believing what is untrue, but on the other hand one is also deceived in not believing what is true; one can be deceived by appearances, but one can also be deceived by the superficiality of shrewdness, by the flattering conceit which is absolutely certain that it cannot be deceived. Which deception is most dangerous? Whose recovery is more doubtful, that of him who does not see or of him who sees and still does not see? Which is more difficult, to awaken one who sleeps or to awaken one who, awake, dreams that he is awake?"

Søren Kierkegaard
Works of Love (1847)

[dmallind]

54. Which would be meaningful if

ANYONE "believe(d) nothing which he cannot see by means of his physical eyes".

I'm fully convinced. for example, that gravity and radio waves exist. Love? Sure - good enough label for biochemical reactions in the brain to certain stimuli. Just like fear or hate. But they don't have intrinsic existence outside that - there is no love or hate running around on its own in some other dimension.

[cleanhippie]

33. Of course.

But the question of their ability to use logic, reason and rational thought come into play.

[Iggo]

35. Can a Christian become an atheist?

:eyes:

[rrneck]

36. Sure. If you dig it do it.

But claim the bad with the good.

[Deep13]

38. Well, it's a question of numbers.

Consider a few thousand atheists and I'm sure a few would be willing to consider the counterargument. I suspect those raised in a religious tradition would be more likely to consider those arguments than those raised without religion. But that is just a supposition. The bottom line is that if there are any nonbelievers who subsequently accept Christianity, then the answer has to be "yes." I am of course tempted to fall onto the no-true-Scotsman fallacy and say that any purported atheist who rejects reason in favor of superstition was never really an atheist in the first place, but having already conceded the argument to be a fallacy, it would be wishful thinking and basically bullshit.

I am around generally decent Christians and Muslims every day. Nevertheless, even though I generally consider them to be good people, I still think their ideas about gods are complete wrong.

[ButterflyBlood]

47. Well I went from Christian to atheist to back to Christian

So yeah I'd say it's possible.

[Jenny_92808]

49. I went from being a Christian to being Spiritual...

...believing G-D is not an old guy on a throne in the sky, but G-D is everything, the spiritual light. I also believe in reincarnation. I believe that Jesus is NOT a G-D, but someone who obtained the Christ of enlightenment, as all of us will in the end, after we evolve thru many incarnations, learning lessons that we need to learn.

I find Edgar Cayce’s writings very interesting…

http://www.near-death.com/experiences/cayce11.html

[orpupilofnature57]

48. Fundamentalists " Bug eyed Bachmanns " distort Christianity ,and by the way

Jesus was Secular ,when he said " Render unto Caesar What is Caesars and render unto the Lord which is the Lords". Separation of Church and State.

[dmallind]

55. funny - they say the same about liberal Christians. nt

[Curmudgeoness]

50. Just because you respect a few good people

who happen to be Christians, does not mean that you have to also become a Christian. If you start getting into that kind of thinking, you will be changing beliefs every other day. You believe what you believe and live your life so you can look yourself in the mirror. They believe what they believe and also live their life the way they see fit. These are not related to religion.

But in answer to the question, of course an atheist can become a Christian.

[jeepnstein]

51. It's up to you.