Horns of a dilemma. I need some advice.

[Cleita]

I just learned something about a neighbor from another neighbor that I wish I didn't know. I live in an area with small ranches like between 2 1/2 or five acres or more. The lady who lives up on top of the hill with her daughter has about 50 acres. She has about five trailer spaces scattered around, that I could count, which she rents out. There could be more on the side of the hill that I can't see. Most of us have wondered how legal they are and her tenants are very marginal to say the least. A young girl in her thirties lives in one of the spaces. I'll call her Cecile. She seems spaced out most of the time and her front teeth are missing. I have talked to her on occasion and she is very sweet although a bit out there. It turns out the other neighbor discovered that she's cooking meth in her trailer. She tried to sell him some.

Now we have a live and let live attitude here on our road and there's a lot that goes on that we don't tell the authorities because most of it isn't important in the larger frame of our day to day existence. I mean some of the neighbors grow pot and it's no skin off of the backs of the rest of us if they do and other activities that could be considered marginally illegal but aren't really criminal like selling eggs without a license. The tenants of that lady don't steal or abuse their animals or children or other bad behavior that would make the rest of us take notice. We have had that in the past and usually take care of the problem on our own. However, between Cecile's trailer and my house is a eucalyptus grove. If you don't know, eucalyptus is very flammable and during the droughty season, which is also the fire season, we are always wary of fires coming our way.

I really don't want to get Cecile into trouble. I think jail would be a bad scenario for her. She's not a criminal, and just seems to be making bad choices. I doubt she could hold down a job, so maybe this is her way of making money to survive. In the past we got the landlady to crack down on tenants who were behaving badly, but the other neighbor and I agree that the landlady would evict her and have her arrested. She's not a nice person. She's all into money and doesn't care about other people's problems and has no problem exploiting the poor who live in her ramshackle, slum like trailers.

My dilemma. I really think that a meth lab would be a big fire danger especially with Cecile handling things because she's a subtance abuser not to mention how she could kill herself in an explosion. There was the time that she came home stoned and tried to take a short cut through the woods and ended up getting lost on someone else's property. She ended up hysterically screaming and the neighbor found her, who had to help her find her way home. There have been other instances of her stoned behavior as well. I'm really stymied on what to do.

Should I just wait and see and keep my fingers crossed that there is no accident? Notify the landlady? Notify the authorities? All three options don't feel right to me. I doubt if having an intervention or some kind of meeting with Cecile and a few of us would do any good. She's not mentally in a place to accept what is being said to her. I don't know what to do.

[Kind of Blue]

1. Wow. That's a tough one, Cleita.

Our last fire grew worse around here because of the burning eucalyptus. I was in the thick of it during the evacuation and it was like Armageddon, as I'm sure you know. And some nut-job a few years ago purposefully set 10 eucalyptus trees on fire during fire season causing all kinds of pandemonium.

So maybe I'm speaking from fear, which I hate to do and tend not to indulge. I could say we've gotten a lot of rain this season, so don't worry about it. But you Know how quickly the Earth can dry up. She's like a child playing with matches, you'd take them from her right away, and maybe she can get some help.

I would call Crystal Meth Anonymous, http://www.crystalmeth.org/contact-us/18-california.html - I just looked it up. I would explain exactly what you've told us.

Good luck, Dear Girl! :hug:

[Cleita]

2. Thanks. I didn't even know there was an organization

out there for it. Maybe because I don't rub elbows with druggies that often. Most of my friends and family are pretty straight arrows. I will contact them and let you know where I get with this. Having been close to a few forest fires, they are scary. I'm happy you made it through all right.

[Kind of Blue]

3. LOLOL... I wanted to add that

I don't rub elbows with druggies either. But there were several explosions in the county due to meth labs, then the law for pharmacies to conceal over-the-counter cold medicines because of the key ingredient to produce it that makers were buying up in huge quantities, and seeing a lot of gambling anonymous billboards, due to all the casinos, there has Got to be one for meth.

There was one explosion caused by kids whose parents had them making the stuff while they took a nap! They slept through it. The kids called the fire department and were taken away. It's so dangerous and sad :cry:

[Cleita]

8. Wow, that's terrible when children are in the middle of

this. Fortunately, Cecile doesn't have children, any that I know of any way that live with her.

[PinkTiger]

4. Very hard.

I think you should meditate on it, and ask your higher power what to do.
If you aren't into that type of thing, think about this: What if you were Cecile. How would you have yourself handle it? She obviously needs help.
Imagine the worst case scenario, and then imagine that you could have done something to prevent it.
Then decide, based on that, how to proceed.

Good luck, and I hope it works out for the best.

BK

[Cleita]

6. Thanks. Meditating or thinking about it has been

helpful. I'm going to talk to the neighbor who told me and suggest that we should go talk to her and try to get her to understand the results and outcomes of what she is doing could be tragic, not to mention what she is doing to herself and people who use her product. I will let you know. It will take some time to do this. I really don't want to bring the law or the land lady down on her, but it occurred to me that we could use it as a last resort and a threat if you will, if she doesn't stop doing it.

[SheilaT]

5. My reaction is to say that if you're perfectly okay

with a meth lab blowing up that close to you, then don't do anything about it.

On the other hand, meth is truly terrible stuff. If you think you can say something to her or to the landlady, then do so. I understand your impulse to live and let live, but when actual bad illegal things are happening, it's my opinion that you have some kind of a responsibility to step in.

However, if you honestly feel you don't, please do not take what I am saying as a judgment. It's simply my opinion.

[Cleita]

7. I'm not okay about what you suggested and that's why

I posted here, hoping some better minds might have a better solution. I agree I have some responsibility to step in. I think my neighbor and I should go up and talk to her and explain to her what she is doing could be very harmful to everyone she comes in contact with and that she stop doing it. Ask her if there is any way we can help her get through this because if she doesn't stop we will have to get the sheriff and land lady involved. I imagine it will take a few days to get this plan into action, so I will keep everyone posted.

[SheilaT]

11. I think something like this has few good ways

to be resolved. You do care about your neighbors, you are committed to a policy of tolerance and live and let live, which I think is admirable all around. But the genuine dangers of a meth lab cannot be ignored.

Thank you for trusting all of us to give input, and I hope it gets resolved well.

[BlancheSplanchnik]

15. This right here sounds like the best plan of action, to me

because:

You are clear on the fact that her cooking meth is a potentially dangerous situation, for a lot of people.

You're setting a clear boundary and you have a plan to go talk to "Cecile", including telling her there WILL BE consequences.

You're giving her a chance to behave responsibly--maybe she won't be able to do that, but there's nothing wrong with giving her a chance. You never know....

You're prepared to enforce your boundaries: Blow her in if she doesn't stop endangering everyone.---if you can depend on yourself to be strict if you have to (that's the hard part for me).

You're committed to handling Cecile as gently as possible, but you're also not willing to put up with a dangerous situation.



And about not wanting to get her in trouble......well, you've got the part about giving her a chance to be responsible: that's her opportunity to take repsonsibility for getting in trouble or not!

How are drug programs and other softer sanctions in your area? It may just be that being forced into some recovery program could be a wake up call that she needs. You never know......

[get the red out]

18. I agree with all you wrote here

Have you checked to see if there are any drug treatment options for low income people in your area? It might not hurt to speak with any of those anonymously and see what it takes for someone to be accepted. When you have that talk with Cecile it might be helpful to have some positive options you could suggest to her for her to get her life back. The poor girl is cruising toward death as it is, talking to her is a positive and caring action on your part and I commend you for it.

That being said, if all else fails, she's better off spending some time in jail than being dead and perhaps creating a fire disaster for the area in her wake.

[MorningGlow]

9. When, she's straight, explain it to her just as you explained it in your OP

Stress the danger of cooking meth--because it's insanely dangerous, even without the eucalyptus grove there. And suggest getting professional help to break her addiction. Remind her how awful jail can be for someone like her, if she ever gets caught. Try to get through to her.

But remember, if she doesn't clean up her act (and depending on how addicted and strung out she is, she might not) and you think she's a danger to herself as well as others, seriously consider contacting the authorities. Jail is a horrible option, but maybe she can get into a treatment program to get clean. Before she does herself and others serious harm.

You're good people, Cleita. Blessings to you for being concerned about your neighbor. Sending you light, and to Cecile as well. :hug:

[Cleita]

12. Thanks MG. In this case a lot of sent light is needed

for all of us involved.

[MagickMuffin]

10. Some thoughts to consider

First off, if you and the neighbor who informed you talk to her, do not, I repeat DO NOT tell her you will contact the authorities. Meth heads do not take to well to threats. Meth heads are often very paranoid people. The drug makes them that way. I speak from personal experience knowing a meth head and their delusional behavior and tendencies.

Secondly, if you do approach her you could try and explain the dangers and risk of her motivations. The consequences are high stakes game. Does she understand that she could be responsible for so much destruction if her "lab" blows up?!? Could she live with herself knowing that she could cause so much harm, not only to people living around her, but to herself as well?!?


Thirdly, just let her know that several people know of her "lab" and she needs to move on, because someone might be prone to exposing her. Let her know that you would never expose her, but someone else in the community could very well do such a thing out of concern for everyone's safety.

And finally, more than likely she will be under the influence when you talk to her, so what you say will probably say will set off paranoid alarms, bells, and whistles, so be very careful.


There are a lot of possibilities to consider. Just remember meth heads are not rational people. Proceed with caution.

Good Luck :hug:

[Cleita]

13. MM, thanks so much for the warning and we will heed it.

No mention of contacting the authorities will be made. Thank you so much for explaining this. This could have ended badly. My other neighbor is coming over this evening and we are going to discuss what to do.

[Mnemosyne]

14. Tread lightly and stay safe, Cleita.

I am sending light your way.

:grouphug:

[Cleita]

16. Still in limbo. Neighbor won't go with me to talk to her

and I don't want to do it alone for security reasons. I found out though it's other people using her trailer and not her that's doing the cooking. I may have to tell the landlady after all and let her handle it. I really hate to go down that road because she has all the compassion of Attila the Hun. :-(

[get the red out]

19. Keep in mind that bad as it seems

You may be saving this young woman's life, the meth will kill her eventually if the cooking doesn't blow her up or the people doing the cooking decide to be rid of her permanently at some point. Jail would be bad but not as bad as dead.

[cate94]

17. Your compassion and concern is admirable

but I fear that facing this person could put you in danger.

If you are absolutely opposed to contacting the authorities, send an annonymous letter to the woman with the meth lab. Tell her too many of her neighbors know what is going on and she needs to shut it down before someone calls the police.

It may sound like a chicken sh*t approach but I think it serves the purpose without putting you or someone else in danger. Addicts are not stable. Meth users are particularly unstable. And. if it is someone else using her trailer, you really have no idea what they might do if they feel threatened.

[elleng]

20. Not a bad idea.

[Kind of Blue]

21. Have to agree on the indirect approach.

I just don't think Cecile will believe any danger she's putting the community in will be her fault. In one case here, a meth addict's friends had often burglarized her parents' home and garage used for storage. The addict screeched in court that the robberies were not her fault, because her friends did the stealing though she'd take them to the house whenever the parents were out of town. She couldn't stop them, she said, but did enjoy the products of their thievery every time. Insane thinking.

I still think getting the advice of an organization, or perhaps they could get involved could really help.

[Tumbulu]

22. So I wonder if you have a volunteer fire department

In my area we have one. I know a few people on it. This could be a route to deal with the issue.

I agree with all the posters above about not confronting Cecile. But I do wonder if you can speak with someone on your volunteer fire department (if you have one) to tell them of this rumor going around. This allows them to understand that there is a potential fire risk and decide if they wish to do something to prevent it. It is their lives and your neighbors as well as your own and indeed hers at stake.

[Cleita]

24. No. We have regular paid fire departments from five

surrounding municipalities that respond to calls out in the ranch country where I live.

[woo me with science]

23. Strongly agree with those who have said not to confront her

or put your fingerprints on this in any way that might make you a target of retaliation. It is just too dangerous.

I am sorry you are in this situation. Good luck.

[Cleita]

25. Yes, I'm considering this not a good idea too.

Another neighbor got into trouble because he got bit by a neighbors' dog. Said neighbors let their dogs run wild. Of course when the neighbor who got bitten went to the ER, they notified the sheriff's animal control division and the sheriff gave the dog owners a citation for not fencing in the dogs or walking them on a leash, which is a state law that applies to the whole of California, even if you live out in the boonies. They have been harassing the bitten neighbor ever since, silly childish stuff, like stealing his outdoor lighting bulbs and blasting loud horns when they pass his house, but unpleasant just the same.

[Tumbulu]

26. I had neighbors with a bunch of dogs who would run my sheep

into a fence- thus killing them. I tried talking to them again and again, always it could not be their dogs. Then once when I had some small children with me, the pack surrounded us and if I did not always carry my crook and did not scream and chase them off, perhaps a child would be bitten. And this was on my own farm. I thus felt that I had to call the animal control people.

So, of course, shortly after that the county comes out to my place looking for building code violations - some neighbor had called in with a complaint.....

Luckily these people did leave as they had diverted their septic system to go directly into the creek. But it was the volunteer fire department guys who figured this out and turned them in on that.

You are in a tough spot, but the more I think about it, the more I think that you should notify someone in some fire department to let them know about this rumor.

[Cleita]

27. So sorry that happened to you.

I love dogs, but dogs allowed to roam start packing and attacking other animals and people.

[Tumbulu]

28. This topic though brings us to the "live and let live" attitude

in rural areas.

You see, neighbors harassing people who have already being victimized by their lack of control of dogs, or fires, etc. are not exercising "live and let live" they are acting in a bullying, destructive and dangerous manner.

It is the landowner putting all of you at risk by not not dealing with her tenant and so perhaps it is simply best to alert her of this rumor so that she can investigate it .