Important Question

[Andrea]

What do we do now? These results in NV are severely disheartening. I believe it is of the utmost importance that John Edwards stay in this campaign and that we do whatever it takes to help him win. It's crucial. So, how do we go about that?

There are many issues that may all be contributing to these sad results: media blackout, election tampering, starstruck voters, dishonest media, dishonest candidates, people don't know how electable John is, other issues I'm sure.

Can we tackle all of these at once? How do we array our priorities? What do we do about each?

Please brainstorm. Please check in with your ideas. We can't just passively sit back and watch the demise of the last candidate who speaks for so many of us.

[Lugnut]

1. We stick.

A tiny fraction of voters have actually been heard to date. I'm sick of having the media choose my candidate and I'm not playing their game.

[saracat]

2. I agree.We stick and get the word out as much as we can.Screw the media and screw the nasty bastards

[Andrea]

3. Right. Of course we stick.

But, we need to look at doing more or doing something different to break through.

Do we focus on different issues? Use different media? Viral marketing? All of the above?

[Two Americas]

4. what may happen

Right now, Edwards message and Edwards candidacy are inseparable. If Edwards goes down, so does the message. The goal of most of the Edwards opponents is not to beat Edwards, it is to destroy the message. (This may be Edwards one flaw. You don't shoot at an angry tiger unless you are pretty sure you can take it down, since you may only get one shot. But I can forgive him that.)

I don't think that either Clinton or Obama can win the general. Even if on a chance one of them does, I can't see how they can govern without being under constant assault from the right wing, and without making many compromises with and accommodations to the right wing. Even if they are able to govern - some miracle could happen - they can't possibly stop the things that are happening in the country.

I don't see how the party can survive the campaigns that the two leading candidates are running, either.

What I am saying is that there may be something bigger going on here.

[Two Americas]

5. ooops

I never did say what may happen, even though that was the title of my post.

Maybe the parties are breaking apart?

A Clinton-Huckabee match up would put the Republican to the left of the Democrat on traditonal Democratic party stances (from before the right wing generated cultural war issues replaced political issues.)

[Andrea]

6. Well, I don't know

Clinton v. Huckabee would be a nightmare. The parties do show signs of breaking up. At this point, I would almost support any third party candidate because they were third party. I can't believe I'm saying that, but it seems obvious to me that things have been orchestrated to put Clinton in the whitehouse. This is not a real election. I'm worried. Is there anything we can do? Howard Fineman said this morning that if it got to the point that Edwards was forced out, he would throw his support behind Obama. Personally, I wish if it got to the point he was forced out, he would run as a third party candidate. It could be the beginning of resurrecting the real Democratic party.

[Two Americas]

9. the coalitions

Since the 60's, the two parties have based their respective power on coalitions - self-contradictory and unlikely coalitions - that show many signs of breaking apart now.

Bith parties have used the culture war issues - all of them originated, defined, and injected into the political discussion by the right wingers, we should never forget - to drive people into their camps.

The Republicans put together a coalition of "values" voters (developed as an interest group by the religious right for their own access to power) and big business interests (and their sycophants and apologists.) That coalition is splitting badly now. Huckabee and McCain and Giuliani represent one side of that coalition, but not the other.

Big money interests in the Republican party were more than willing to use the religious right to advance their interests but have no real interest in the religious right or its positions other than that. Many rank and file everyday Christians are all through with tossing away the New Testament teachings of charity and compassion, and are realizing that the Republicans are turning them into serfs and using them and have no moral foundation.

Romney is the candidate that best represents both sides of that coalition.

The Democrats put together a coalition of upscale liberal cause-oriented people, and old line authoritarian Labor.

The problem is that the upscale liberal cause-oriented people are deeply conservative on the issues of power and wealth, on economic disparity and injustice. They are Republicans on everything except the cultural war issues. Rank and file Labor people are realizing that the old hierarchical union leadership is selling them down the river, and there is a growing revolt happening there.

Clinton best represents the old coalition.

The possible realignment would look like this:

Blue collar people, represented by those who find Huckabee attractive, come back to the Democrats. The upper crust of the Democrats - that small percentage of people who control the party and the narrative of the party, and who are very much pro-big business and upper class - move over and become moderate Republicans.

This would re-align the parties back to where they once were. Sooner or later this will happen, because the current positions and methods and coalitions each party is depending upon are unstable.

We now have two parties representing two different factions of the upper class, who only disagree with each other over matters of personal values and lifestyle choices. The other 90% of us have no party and have no representation. That cannot last for much longer.

Keep in mind that only 10% of the population enjoy household incomes of $90,000 and up, and the party leadership is looking after those people, and the most domineering and controlling people in the party from the local level on up and right here at DU are from that privileged group. They do not want to give up their privilege. Their "liberalism" is a matter of demanding for themselves the same perks and privileges that the super-wealthy have, and the Hell with the rest of the people. "Let them eat cake if they are too stupid to be beautiful successful liberals like we are."

The relative handful of upscale people controlling the Democratic party at all levels would rather have a Republican win than an FDR. The wealthy and powerful people—the upper 1% - who own the Republican party would rather have Clinton win than Huckabee.

[saltpoint]

7. I'm willing to entertain any of those possibilities, but my take-away from

it is that some of our group actually attended and trudged through streets and stacks of paper and so forth to fight the good fight for a John Edwards.

I take away enhanced appreciation of those folks, and they had the good vibes from those of us who couldn't make it.

I'm a bit disappointed in my fellow Democrats in the Silver State. I'd hoped they'd show more sense in their voting. O well. It's their first caucus, so maybe they just don't know how to do it yet.

That's a JOKE, Nevadans. Ha Ha Ha!

Let's put in a strong showing in SC and then persevere to Denver. We can't have first place, I don't think, not with the media slobberring about the two leaders. But if we arrive at Denver with serious delegates, and we will, it could be that the next president is in the hands of the John Edwards campaign, and not Brit Hume's or Wolf Blitzers.

This ain't over.

[Ninga]

What distinguishes champions from the rest of the field is that champions have the

ability to "visualize" "concentrate" and "adjust to conditions".

A champion does not give up until the game is over and the clock has run out.

Edwards has the heart of a champion, and the soul of a poet. He has the mind of a warrior and the intellect of a scholar.


When Edwards goes into battle and turns around to rally his troops......who will he see, who will be there?

[Andrea]

10. We will, of course.

But my question is, how do we best grow our numbers?

[Ninga]

8. dupe