Ok, this is something I've wanted to ask for ages...

[dolo amber]

but DU being DU (sigh :eyes:), I figured I'd get my arse flamed off as I'm not the greatest with the words and such...I'll do my best to convey my meaning here in a non flame-incducing way... :)

Right, so I was born in 1967. I remember clearly the early 70s...when black folk and white folk *seemed* to be moving toward a truly peaceful, equal existence. The days of Sly and the Family Stone and "Everyday People" and such. The "Kid Power" cartoons. People of all colors really finally feeling like it was 'ok' to socialise and mingle with anyone. (Bad stereotype: my parents' best friends and my godparents were fantastic people who happened to be black.)

Am I just idealizing my childhood? Was I just part of an enlightened culture, and not the norm? Is this not really a true portryal of the times? I hate to go all Cosby and stuff, but seriously...remembering what *I think* I remember from then, contrasted with what the world has become...fucking breaks my heart. And if I'm not...politically/culturally speaking...

WTF HAPPENED???? :wtf:

[msgadget]

1. No, I don't think you're idealizing it.

Depending on where you grew up, this is very likely a true picture - for you - of what that time period was like. This particular divide is a political construct meant to counteract all the liberal ideas that not only fostered such unity but also celebrated the end to Jim Crow, something many red staters saw as the true natural order.

You're normal. They're not.

[Kahuna]

2. You did not imagine it. There was a period during Carter's administration

when the tensions between the races began to decrease. Of course, as we know, republicans can't have that. Reagon won his first term (and later his second) on his devisive message of maintaining the "status quo." That's why blacks hate Reagan, while a lot of white people revere him as a god.

[Robeson]

3. It also depends on what part of the country you were living in...

...back then. I live in the South, and I remember well, parents picketing schools over busing, well into the early to mid 70's.

[dolo amber]

4. I was in Southern Cali then

I remember there being very little black/white tension...BUT, that could possibly be due to the proximity to Mexico...they were the unfortunate targets of far too much racism :(. I distinctly remember being around 6 or 7 when I first heard the ugly 'n' word, but I recall innumerable times to that point hearing racial slurs directed at Mexicans. Perhaps it was just where I was, but in retrospect it seems things were just SO...not a big deal at all.

I think you guys are right about the Reagan thing though. Asshole. :grr:

[Robeson]

5. Thats definetly a good point on racism towards Mexicans...

From growing up in the South, I was always exposed to the black/white racial thing, and never really knew about the overt racism towards Mexicans that goes on in the West. When I went to college, I met a couple of people from California, and they were very racist towards Hispanics. It was an eyeopener for me, because I'd had never been exposed to that side of racism or realized how overt it was in California.

[LWolf]

12. I was in SoCal then, too.

(I still am). I'm a little older than you are. I was 3 or 4 the first time I heard the "n" word; I remember it clearly. I was in the "kid seat" in a grocery store cart, and heard someone in the aisle use it. I repeated it to my mother, who had an uncharacteristically horrified response. She told me it was a hateful word, about hating people, and that I was never to use it, ever again. It was my first introduction to prejudice, and I've never forgotten it. That was in the midwest, before I got to CA in 1967.

In California, I didn't encounter prejudice again until I got to high school. Probably the circles my mom operated in; multiracial and quite liberal. In '70 or '71, she took me to a rally somewhere in L.A. to hear Angela Davis speak. I was 10 or 11 at the time. I remember her speaking about racial discrimination by law enforcement on the street and in prisons.

[FrenchieCat]

6. I emigrated straight to Berkeley, California....

from Paris, France in the early 1970s. I caught the tail end of the Black Panther movement (at the time, I truly admired Kathleen Cleaver and Angela Davis).

One of the reason we left France and came to California is due to the racism we experienced in France (many are shocked by this....The French--Racists?). Although Bi-racial, my brother and I were often mistaken for Northern African Algerians because of our appearance. Algerians have been France's Black folks ever since the Algerian War of the 60s. Because of this, my mother strongly felt that we would have a better chance for opportunities in America.

The refrain in Berkeley, at the time of my arrival was, "Say it loud, I'm black and I'm proud".

I will have to say that I did experience some color based prejudice (yes, in Berkeley in the 70s) ...from those who didn't fully accept me because I was not considered "Black enough". Light skin, straight hair and green eyes were out (vs. the 50's)in favor of the Natural, "Black is beautiful" skin and the Dashikis. I guess that my big French accent didn't really help (this was in kid's world). I probably would have been picked on for something else if not my color, so I later wisely pegged my experience as a phenomenon of "Children can be cruel if you are different".

I was not exposed to White folks until we moved into a more affluent neighborhood in the Bay Area Hills. These were the years of integration. Because I lived in the Hills, I was bused back down to the minority high school along with my White neighbors. Our school was a 50/50 race mix. We all got along pretty well.....but students didn't do much mixing. I hung out with the Black students most often...although I had attended Jr. High School with the White ones.

I think that there may have been a period of enlightment....but I place those times in the very early 80's and it lasted only but a minute.

[Elspeth]

13. I find your story very interesting.

You grew up in much more affluent circumstances than I did and had more advantages. Yet there's still a sense of not belonging. I can see that it must have bothered you very much.

[dolo amber]

7. This has nothing to do with anything re: the subject

at hand, but I just noticed this thread is full of Clarkies. Go General! :D :hi:

[FrenchieCat]

8. I do believe that many Black Folks

understood that out of the list of White men running, Clark was the only "Badass" (doesn't cow under Republican heat) with the right qualifications for these times and a record of "walking the walk" when it came to supporting minority rights and calling for economic justice. He had offered a sound tax plan that would have allowed families earning under $50,000 annually not to pay any income taxes all...http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/01/05/elec04.prez.clark.taxes/

My personal favorite was his higher education plan that would have given a $6,000 Grant for two years (That's 6,000x2= $12,0000.....not the old tired Tax Credit everyone else was offering) ....to any college age child who's family earned under $100,000.
http://www.tnr.com/primary/index.mhtml?pid=1071

The fact that he wrote a part of the U of Michigan brief supporting Affirmative Action (and how Affirmative Action in the Armed Forces had truly worked and needed to continue)that was submitted to the Supreme Court last year. http://www.jbhe.com/latest/092503_wesley_clark.html

It didn't hurt that the Black Bufallo Bills (who had supported Clinton back in '92 and '96) of South Carolina were for Clark.....and reliable old timers like Andrew Young and Charlie Rangel endorsed him.

Here is what he had to say about the Confederate Flag:
Confederate flag is a divisive and racist symbol
The Confederate flag is a divisive and racist symbol of American history. I am proud to have served and fought under the American flag. That's what I want to see waved and supported. Perhaps some of those who have used the Confederate flag in the past don't realize how offensive it is to others. We have to take account of its association with practices that all America regrets. It is time to put that past behind us and move on into a future where we are all united. http://www.issues2000.org/2004/Wesley_Clark_Civil_Rights.htm

Additionally, Many Native Americans were Clark supporters....
http://www.nativetimes.com/index.asp?action=displayarticle&article_id=3445

[dolo amber]

10. Awesome...thanks for that!

The one other big thing about him I *SO* dug was his "What I believe is of no consequence...it's what is best for the country that matters" stance. (Re: gay marriage, abortion, etc) It takes an incredibly strong man to hold that opinion.

[fortyfeetunder]

9. You aren't imagining it

After the MLK and RFK assassinations, race relations seemed to be improving until the goddamn 1980's when Ray-gun was elected. Then it appeared intolerance was acceptable again.

Therefore, race relations, across the American spectra have been in a gradual decline ever since. Not even Clinton's charisma and enthusiasm could reverse the decline.

I won't even go into how things really are with the current administration.

[GOPFighter]

11. In all fairness...

...the civil rights movement was bound to lose steam once southerners stopped lynching, bombing churches, loosing dogs on non-violent black demonstrators, and spitting on little black girls entering desegregated schools. These images shocked and angered Americans to a degree we can't imagine. I think a lot of whites who are now anti-affirmative action Republicans back then found this behavior sickening and supported legislation to end it.

Once the blatant physical assaults ended, many whites felt anything more was not needed or deserved.

Ending discrimination is like losing weight, the first pounds come off quickly, every pound lost after that requires an exponential amount of effort. We just have to persevere.

[psychmommy]

14. i was born in 64.

i remember being able to finally get black dolls. i grew up in a mixed neighborhood in nj. there were friends houses i wasn't allowed to go to because of prejudiced parents. spanish people moved into the neighborhood and we were amazed because they spoke differently. they were very friendly and i learned lots from the wife. being a child allows you to see things differently-we are taught prejudice. the white girlfriends i had in elementary school didn't know me in high school ( one is still a friend). as we get older, we begin to see things through a different lens it is called experience. my dad divorced my mom and married a white woman. there were some mixed couples in that peer group-he worked on a college campus. our families celebrated holidays together. i can't say things were better or worse. it seems the same to me
about the mexicans-there were signs that said "no dogs, no blacks, no mexicans" there was equal hate for blacks and mexicans. also don't forget, white flight from the cities into the suburbs where there was less interaction between the races-this was still going on in the 1970's. there were communities where black folks had to sell their homes because of harassment from the neighbors (bringing down property values). there were entire towns where no black folks resided. some places didn't change until the 1980's.
being on du teaches me that the more things change the more they stay the same. read some of the threads lurking argyle catches. some of the crap said on this board is jaw dropping. i can just imagine what the rw boards are like.

[noiretextatique]

15. ronald reagan is what happened

"morning in america" was code language for "let's put them darkies back in their place."