What veggies are good if there is only shallow soil? Are any

[truedelphi]

Worth attempting? The area is part sun, part shade and some of it is full sun from 3Pm onward.

this is for a terrace that is mostly St John's wort and shallow soil, (and also little pebbles, medium rocks and Big Rocks.)

By shallow soil, I mean six to eight to twelve inches at the most. An hour of digging will only get me another one and a half inches down.

Some of it will be wild flowers, amidst the Saint JW, but what to do about the rest?

Will squash work? Potatoes? Another part of the yard has strawberries so I don't want more of those.
I imagine any number of herbs would be okay, but it would be nice to have things to eat as well as spices.

[Warpy]

1. Squash yes, potatoes no

You can grow most kitchen herbs and vegetables in soil that shallow, but you will have to fertilize and water carefully. Mulch can help the watering situation as well as discourage weeds.

I've grown tomatoes in bags of potting soil with Xes cut into them to accept the seedlings. Again, careful fertilization and watering is more important than soil depth, but those plastic bags really cut down on the watering here in the desert.

Carrots will be weird because of the soil depth and all the rocks, but you should be able to do radishes, lettuce, tomatoes, green onions, yellow onions from sets (maybe), squash, bush and runner beans, and cole crops like cabbage and broccoli.

Vegetables will grow in anything, including air sprayed with a hydroponic nutrient solution.

Unfortunately, potatoes grow under the ground and you'd either have to make hills for them or start digging bales of peat moss into what you've got in order to increase soil depth.

[Mendocino]

8. About potatoes

do you think fingerlings would work? Some sand mixed in might help.

[TexasProgresive]

10. Potatoes can be grown in mulch

Put landscape timbers in a square with 2 opposing on the ground and the other place on the ends of the first 2.Place the seed potatoes on the earth and cover with hay. As the shoots grow up add more hay and timbers. This can go quite high and you might place some stakes to support the structure. There will be potatoes in the hay. It works well and the hay keeps the roots cool so that the plants continue growing when they would normally play out due to the heat.

[truedelphi]

15. I am going to be trying this. Sounds wonderful.

Thank you.

[truedelphi]

17. Good to hear that. Will try that as well as some in the hay. n/t

[truedelphi]

16. I'll be planting the first of the squash tomorrow.

Nice to hear the area I prepared today should work for them.

I'd forgotten about the radishes - which I love to eat. So that's a go too.

Thanks very much.

[tridim]

2. I just tried my arugula tonight for the first time. It was soooo delicious!

I put a big pile on top of my famous homemade pot-stickers. Good for me because I generally don't get enough greens in my diet. I'm going to have a ton of it by July.

I'm growing everything in pots these days, but I'm sure it would grow anywhere.

[truedelphi]

19. Arugu;la does make a lot of good dishes better.

As in, YUM!

[noamnety]

3. Most should be okay.

Take a look at square foot gardening if your public library has it. In that method, Mel advocates something like 8 inches of soil, and he's growing all sorts of things.

I wouldn't recommend potatoes unless you want to "plant" them into hay bales. A lot of veggies can be done that way as well.

If it's really pebbly, root veggies won't be able to work around them really well - you could loosen up the top and grow the type of carrots that are like globes instead of long thin ones, and onions. Beets might be a little deformed depending on how rocky it is. Anything with greens would be great: beets, lettuces, swiss chard, radishes (sauté the greens, save at least a couple to go to seed and produce a thousand pods - like peas - which are way yummier and less bitter than the roots.). Beans and peas will be fine. My tomatoes grew better with a bit deeper soil but I've done them in areas that shallow. Tomatillos and ground cherries will be fine. Squash will work. I prefer Tromboncino Ripicante squash over other summer squashes, it's even more productive and the seeds stay just in the bulb.

If you think about hydroponics - or the ever popular aerogarden - the roots are only given a couple inches to roam. The issue isn't so much how much space the roots have, as whether they are so shallow they are drying out. So for you mulch will be extra important.

[Speck Tater]

4. Beans will put down roots to loosen soil and fix nitrogen.

After you harvest the beans just cut the plants off at ground level and leave the roots to overwinter.

[Spaldeen]

9. Neat

That is interesting. What is the lowest climate zone you can be in for that to work? I am in 5/6.

[Speck Tater]

12. It works for me. I'm in Willamette Valley OR, zone 6. nt

[Spaldeen]

13. thanks

I'll have to try that this year. I tried keeping some pepper plants over last year, and they just didn't quite hang on through the winter (even inside).

[Speck Tater]

21. Just so we're on the same page

It sounds like you're expecting the beans to come back. They WON'T. The roots will rot over the winter.

The point is NOT to have the same bean plants come up next season. The point is to loosen and fertilize the soil to improve its quality and texture. That's why you leave the roots in the soil. They break it up mechanically and provide organic material deeper down.

[Spaldeen]

24. thanks for the clarification

Understood. In that case, I already do that!

[truedelphi]

14. I have put in some beans - maybe a dozen? Scattered around to

Do just that. So far six or seven have come up.

They are organic soybeans - they are left overs from soybeans we had last winter to use to make soy milk.

I'd really like fava beans - anyone have some seeds for those?

[sandnsea]

5. I've got spinach in 6" of soil

They're in a long container with some marigolds. They sit on the west side of the house, right under the windows so they get late afternoon sun. I haven't done anything to them and they are growing like crazy. I just pick some baby spinach leaves for a little salad or to put on a sammi. I planted some out in the actual flower garden and they aren't doing so well. I think the potting soil made a huge difference.

[truedelphi]

18. That may work for the containers I will have left once I start

Planting the stuff currently in them i.e. the tomatoes that get to go in the part of the yard where we have two or three feet of real dirt to work for.

So now I know what to do with those container thing-es.

[catgirl]

6. Look for veggies with shallow root systems (like celery)

You may want to try to build up. Raised gardens are great in small spaces. Then you can almost grow anything!

[Mendocino]

7. Maybe radish, onions

or baby carrots? Most lettuce is shallow rooted but depending on your locale it may too late. I might try to raise it up with cedar planks and a lot of organic compost.

[Petrushka]

11. You can grow potatoes above ground, under straw . . . adding more straw as the plants grow.

It's was delightful to harvest potatoes with no digging---clean potatoes!

There was only one vegetable I found unsuitable for growing in shallow soil: carrots.
Today, however, if I was still raising all of our produce as I did when we owned a
small farm, I might try one of the new varieties of carrot---round ones, for instance.

Plant whatever vegetables you enjoy eating most. I've seen vegetables growing and
thriving in 8 to 12 inches of soil in raised beds placed on a deck or rooftop.

Earlier today, my daughter brought me her first ripe sugar snap pea. She's growing them
in an 8-inch deep raised bed---using bean towers to support the vines. She is also raising
the following vegetables in raised beds: mesclun, spinach, beets, radishes, pole beans,
cucumbers, scallions, onions, garlic, parsley, cilantro, dill, basil, bell peppers, and
tomatoes . . . plus marigolds for insect control.

For some pretty good info re: raised bed gardening, see:

http://www.gardeners.com/on/demandware.store/Sites-Gardeners-Site/default/Link-Page?id=kgp_home

[truedelphi]

20. Thanks everyone - the yard has been so discouraging on account of its

Rockiness. So everyone's enthusiasm and suggestions are very appreciated.

Four house lots over, they are putting in a septic tank, and they have dug down nine feet - and it is all rocks and pebbles all the way down. I went over there after the work crew left thinking I could scarf up any dirt they dug out - and it is all just rocks and pebbles. And more rocks and pebbles. All the way down to nine feet!

[dgibby]

23. You're definitely going to have to go up with your garden!

See my post below. I would never go back to gardening in ground again, even if I could. Raised beds are so much easier and more efficient.

I'm growing tomatoes, potatoes, onions, peppers, squash, cukes, melons, strawberries, and herbs. I do have blueberry bushes and kiwi planted in the ground, but that's it, and even they're in a raised area.

Container gardens will require more water, but I use soaker hoses, which are more efficient.

Two great methods to use are square foot gardening and lazagna gardening (refers to layering composting materials, not food!). Just google both terms. Lots of great info. Also, google "companion planting". More great info about which plants co-exist well and are beneficial when planted together.

[truedelphi]

25. I guess I have to keep your recomendations in mind.

There really is not any other way to do it.

I put 500 to 600 pounds of dirt into the rocky area last year, and it just has all filtered away into the pebbles and rocks.

Probably I will only attempt a few larger containers this year, but will think about going all out by next year.

[dgibby]

22. Try using raised beds, containers.

At my age and with a bad back, I can only garden using raised beds and containers, but that's all I need, and it works well.

I'm using 4x4 raised beds, half whiskey barrels, pots, kids plastic swimming pools,and even black plastic trash cans (cut down).

I'm also growing grape tomatoes in topsy turvy bags(the really good ones from Gardener's Supply Catalog).

As for potatoes, I'm growing them in potato bags from GSC. They're heavy duty fabric, portable, can be stored flat when not in use.

Good luck!

[arachadillo]

26. Shallow Soil Vegetables

What veggies are good if there is only shallow soil?

Warpy says: You can grow most kitchen herbs and vegetables in soil that shallow, but you will have to fertilize and water carefully. Mulch can help the watering situation as well as discourage weeds.

sandnsea says: I've got spinach in 6" of soil...They're in a long container with some marigolds. They sit on the west side of the house, right under the windows so they get late afternoon sun. I haven't done anything to them and they are growing like crazy.

Mendocino says: Most lettuce is shallow rooted but depending on your locale it may too late. I might try to raise it up with cedar planks and a lot of organic compost.

Petrushka says: There was only one vegetable I found unsuitable for growing in shallow soil: carrots.
Today, however, if I was still raising all of our produce as I did when we owned a
small farm, I might try one of the new varieties of carrot---round ones, for instance.

Thanks for all the tips.