I despise the patriarchy

[Ripley]

It is the root cause of everything wrong on Earth right now!

War. Greed. Hatred.

Mother Earth is rebelling and no human can stop it.

[Vanje]

1. How do you feel about homophobia?

I think its a form of sexism.

[Ripley]

2. How do you feel about patriarchy?

That is the topic of discussion.

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

3. I think they're inter-related

Homophobia is basically rooted in putting down women.

[lukasahero]

6. Please see the Group's "Mission Statement"

About this Group

- This is not a group to discuss gender, class or sexual orientation rights and issues. It is specifically to discuss women's rights and issues as they affect women from a woman's perspective and experience.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=341x1

For the most part, people here understand that homophobia is directly linked to misogyny, however, this group was specifically formed "to discuss women's rights and issues as they affect women from a woman's perspective and experience." When the OP is about the patriarchy, questioning that poster's take on homophobia is not an appropriate response in this group.

If you want to talk about homophobia, start your own thread. This OP was about the patriarchy.

[seabeyond]

4. i thought ripley.... i thought i actually found a place where i could read posters that took

this stuff seriously. it isnt on general, and certainly not in the lounge. sexism is rampant in those rooms and so full of hypocrisy that would put repug hypocrisy to shame. i spent the end of last week reading four pages of this site and was feeling really comfortable in this room, getting to know the posters, their opinions and thought in their seriousness of the issue.

i hadnt even had a chance to start posting in here to share my ideas, before that bullshit took over this room. ya, i am having issues with patriarchy. i was hoping i could resolve some issues here. unfortunately it appears that isnt going to happen

deep breath.

peace

[Name removed]

5. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[femrap]

8. Do you ever read

I Blame the Patriarchy blog? It's the best. Don't know what I'd do without her. Fabulous writing and scathing wit.

[seabeyond]

12. thanks, i will check that out

sounds fun. tomorrow.

i like what you wrote down below too about maya. sounds like you have traveled your own journey. big thumbs up

[lightningandsnow]

7. I think it's more accurate to say that the cause is kyriarchy.

Kyriarchy - a neologism coined by Elisabeth Schussler Fiorenza and derived from the Greek words for “lord” or “master” (kyrios) and “to rule or dominate” (archein) which seeks to redefine the analytic category of patriarchy in terms of multiplicative intersecting structures of domination…Kyriarchy is best theorized as a complex pyramidal system of intersecting multiplicative social structures of superordination and subordination, of ruling and oppression.

http://feministphilosophers.wordpress.com/2008/05/01/word-of-the-day-kyriarchy/

While I think patriarchy is a big part of it, I've become more and more uncomfortable lately with people blaming patriarchy and patriarchy alone for all problems in the world.

Is it patriarchy when a white woman is racist towards a Middle Eastern man?

Is it patriarchy when able-bodied women try to stop women with disabilities from reproducing?

Again, this is my issue with some "radical" feminist thought. Some people tend to ignore other forms of oppression.

And yes, I am in the right forum, and very much a feminist.

[femrap]

10. Maybe the white

woman doesn't like the way the Middle Eastern man treats the female members of his family forcing them to dress and act a certain way? As for your second question regarding a disabled woman reproducing...that's pretty vague. Is she mentally and emotionally capable of the responsibilities of motherhood? Where's daddy....is he able to help? Or is this just a physical disability....in a wheel chair?

You know, there are lots of women who are tools of the patriarchy...they feel that need to be one so to survive in the world of patriarchy. They were taught that a man and only a man can protect from that 'dangerous world' which I hear about every night on my local news.....over and over and over and over.

[seabeyond]

11. hm.... lets see, a lot of women tools of patriarchy

from beginning of time to about the 50's consistently most all women, except the few. 60's, 70's and 80's where a wonderful time to break free of that though some still feel the need of submissiveness to their mate, allowing them to be dominate. but we have a whole other group of women/girls that are now a part of that onditioning, imo, only in a different kinda way.

today they would say eeeew, to male dominence, now they just allow themselves to be reduced to things with no respect and say gooodeee

(not that i am being .... well shit, was going to say bitchy, hm... thinking thinking for a replacement, sarcastic, snippy, snarky)

see, you gals have taught me some stuff.

[femrap]

13. Just look at what happened when

the ERA got close to being passed. I've never seen organized religion and Phyllis Schaffly
(I can't spell her name) go into such a frenzy....it was organized religion on STEROIDS!

Now with Media owned by so few rich white dudes, young women have a very difficult time fighting the 24/7 onslaught of how they are to be. CONFORM CONFORM CONFORM to the eye candy model. I am hopeful to see that women are earning most of the law and medical degrees though. I hope they have not accepted the 'male model' though.

take care.

[femrap]

9. Nothing has more power

than Mother Nature. I've been reading about 12.21.12 and what the Mayans and Nostradamus have to say as well as others. In some people's minds, this date will end this tragic heavy macho period of history including dog eat dog capitalism and all of its wars. Finally we reach that 'age of Aquarius' where the Feminine prevails and we will see cooperation, sustainability, and common sense.

But the Earth may very well tilt on its axis...which it does every 26,000 years. Interesting times, huh?

[Runcible Spoon]

14. are you serious?

Aside from all of that garbage about "Mayan" prophesies, the suggestion that women are intrinsically more inclined towards "cooperation, sustainability, and common sense" is just ridiculous. Remember, biological determinism cuts both ways and is in the end a by-product of Social Darwinism.

[Name removed]

17. Deleted sub-thread

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[La Lioness Priyanka]

18. thatcher and gandhi apparantly did not happen. it was all flowers and candy

during their era

[musette_sf]

15. i do too

thank you for saying it

[iverglas]

16. have you read

my favourite little window into patriarchy in the US?

http://erg.environics.net/media_room/default.asp?aID=456

I'd like to reproduce the whole thing, but it isn't allowed.

It's a news report from 2001 on an ongoing study by Environics, one of Canada's leading polling firms, of patriarchal attitudes in Canada, the US and other countries.

Nearly 20 years ago, my colleagues at Environics in Toronto and CROP in Montreal began a study of Canadian social values. In our first survey of Canadian values in 1983, we asked Canadians if they strongly or somewhat agreed or disagreed that: "The father of the family must be the master in his own house." We posed more than 100 such questions to respondents that year. Our intention was to track these 100 items over time, dropping some, adding others; we hoped we'd measure what was important to Canadians or what was changing in our values and perspectives on life.

The "father must be master" question has become legendary at Environics. We love it because it measures a traditional, patriarchal attitude to authority in our most cherished institution: the family. ...

The findings indicate that, over time, that patriarchal attitude has been in rather sharp decline in Canada and even in France -- and has been rising in the US across all demographic groups.

In Canada, almost everyone was part of this revolution, even men, who by 2000 had only 23 per cent of their numbers in support of dad being boss at home. The 60-plus group showed the largest drop: In 1992, 40 per cent thought father should be master, but by 2000, only 26 per cent of this age group said so. The highest-income category was also the most progressive (only 12 per cent of those earning $60,000 or more believed dad should be king of his castle). Married and single people were exactly the same.

Meanwhile, we found that where 42 per cent of Americans believed the father should be master in 1992, the number increased to 44 per cent in 1996. We wondered if this was a statistical anomaly. We went back into the field in 2000 to find out if the frontal assault on patriarchal authority by U.S. president Bill Clinton and television icon Homer Simpson would bring U.S. numbers more into line with those in Canada and France.

This time, 48 per cent of Americans said the father of the family must be master in his own home; 51 per cent disagreed and 1 per cent had no opinion. We were stunned.

One thing the report highlights is the quite stunning conservatism of the baby boomer group in the US. I could never understand complaints I read in internet forums from the younger ones, about how we boomers had betrayed our principles blah blah. This clarified it.


USAmericans: 48% of boomers aged 35-44 (and that's the young ones!) agree with the father-knows-best statement.
Canadians: 15% of the same group agree with the father-knows-best statement.

!!!!

Do have a read. It's fascinating, if depressing.

[ismnotwasm]

19. Yeah, it bites

You know what makes me sad? It goes like this;

I was browsing half priced books, picked some Sci-fi, found "SCUM Manifesto" by Valerie Solanas (with an introduction by Avital Ronell. It will be a proud coffee table top book right next to my third copy of C***, the others given to two of my daughters) Cruised by the psychology and philosophy sections and found "Answer to Job" by CG Jung. If I want to get pissed of at the Whole Idea of a Creator Deity by the patriarchy, I read Job. I've read parts of this work by Jung, but never the whole thing.

So, there I am, in book heaven, with limited time so I shoot over to science, always on the prowl for good physics books that attempt to explain the structure of the Universe in (very) lay terms that your non-math person can grasp. I look for women authors. (I spent a year reading only women authors in a variety of topics. A suggestion from the aforementioned "C***, by Inga Muscio, if I recall correctly)I look at every single title. I find one female author, and I think it has something to do with some sort of mysticism. Shit. Figures.

I know there are a lot of women out there as brilliant as Solanas without the killing rage. I know there are female Jung's out there, like Pinkola-Estes, who takes Jung to a new level. I know there are women physicists and chemists and biologists and astronomers and Economists and Farmers and Foresters fucking fighting for their place for publishing The Word every fucking day. And they're outnumbered and outgunned. And evidently, they don't sell books, at least not enough to trickle down to half priced books. I know for a fact they write them.

Recently, a quickly forgotten study showed that girls were catching up with boys in math. Much more publicized is the non-surprising news that Dora the Explorer is going to get tarted up. You know, pre teen. Needs lip gloss. Or even more publizised is that Barbie, being 50, is having to compete with BRATS, (if I never believed in American patriarchy, one look at those gawdawful dolls with convert me on the spot)Barbie better get her shit together. No more of this Doctor Barbie or Barbie runs for president crap. Barbie better take goddam pole dancing if she knows what's good for her.

I don't like Deities in general, Sci-fi(slash *sigh*)fantasy with Dragons or Swords or Sorcerers. Couldn't make it though "Mists of Avalon", which no doubt makes me a shitty feminist, but goddam it was boring (I admit to a metal statue of Athena with a long ass spear and shield. It's on my computer desk. It's fallen a couple of times, because I was fucking around with the computer and once I got nailed by the spear. Oh, and a small statue of Kali, and a medium sized wooden snake, a toy really, my daughter send from Afghanistan when she was stationed there) I'm not mystically inclined, but I feel you sister. I really, really do.

So how many of the worlds ills are a penis enlargement contest as the late, great George Carlin put it (only less politely)? The urge to conquer and destroy and kill and screw and all that? Go West Young Man and make sure there's brothels to ease your weary murdering soul? A very good question. And why shouldn't we call it "patriarchy"? It needs a fancy new word? Who the fuck is in control? Women who mistake sex for power? Or women who think men are really Not Entitled and it's All Boils Down to Simple Economics as in who's got the dough?

I'll check back in at the used bookstore. A couple in the Gender studies section are calling out to me. In general, I find that a really good gender studies book hates the patriachy too.