Need feedback from European travelers....

[jeffrey_X]

My wife and I are planning a 3.5 week trip to Europe this summer. We've got our initial itinerary sketched out, but wanted to get some feedback from experienced travelers or anyone who lives in Europe that can give some feedback.

Chicago --> London (Stay in Londdon for only 2 or 3 nights)
London --> Paris (Stay in Paris for about 6 nights)
Paris --> Barcelona (Stay in Barcelona for about 4 or 5 nights)
Barcelona --> Southern France (need some recommendations here. Stay in So. France about 3 or 4 nights)
Southern France --> Brussels (Stay only 1 or 2 nights)
Brussels --> Amsterdam (Spend about 5 nights here)
Amsterdam --> Chicago


Thoughts? Can we do this easily using Eurorail? Would appreciate any feedback or suggestions.

Thanks!!

[WolverineDG]

1. You might want to look at EasyJet

There are many low-cost carriers in Europe right now. My cousin & I used EasyJet last summer to fly London-Edinburgh-Amsterdam-London. We were very impressed with it. It is a low-cost, no-frill airline, & the earlier you buy your tix, the cheaper they are (ours came to less than $200/pp for the entire itenerary). Also, the planes left on time, arrived on time, & were full, but we never felt crowded. Bring your own food & drink if you like, because they don't do free drinks/food.

Right now, EasyJet is offering tix from London Luton (easy to get to) to Paris CDG for L20.99 (roughly $41/pp) in mid-June. :) www.easyjet.com There's even a calendar so you can see which days are cheaper to fly on.

Why such a short time in London? There's tons to see there. Amsterdam, I thought was nice, but really, we saw what we wanted to see in the 2 days we were there. Of course, your mileage may vary. :)

dg

[chascaz]

2. Take the train.

Brussels is very close to Amsterdam (and fairly close to Paris), it wouldn't make sense to take a plane. It only takes a couple of hours by train. As far as I know you can get from just about anywhere in Europe to anywhere else in Europe by train. There are lots of other towns to see around there too, like Antwerp. Trains (subways) are also the best way to get around town, when you're in Brussels or Amsterdam. I would say, use the train.

Peace - :)

[Lydia Leftcoast]

3. Take the train for these reasons:

1) Environmental. Taking a plane for a short hop is environmentally unconscionable. I know that there are all sorts of short-hop airlines in Europe, but really! It's just a couple hundred miles from London to Paris. When I read of people flying from Manchester to London or from Munich to Vienna, I just have to shake my head.

2) Trains provide downtown-to-downtown service, so you don't have to worry about baggage checks or security.

3) Trains let you watch the scenery go by and meet interesting people to talk to.

4) Check the terms of your Eurail Pass. I think some of them let you ride the EuroStar from London to Paris under the English Channel, which should be quite an experience.. (BTW, your EurailPass is not valid in England, although it should work in the other countries.)

5) Trains in other countries are so far superior to American trains that you'll weep in frustration that we can't have something like that here.

By the way, I'd also even out the time allotment for London and Amsterdam. London has the added advantage of letting you take some great day trips, like Shakespeare's home in Stratford or Canterbury or Salisbury Cathedrals or Oxford or Cambridge. It IS on the expensive side, though.

[spindrifter]

4. Unless you've been

to England before, I would also recommend spending more time there and less in Amsterdam. If the cost of lodging in London puts you off, think about staying somewhere else part of the time. There is so much in London to see and do--and if you get a chance, it is fun to go to York, Cambridge or Oxford. Brighton is another fun place, especially in the summer. While you are in the Netherlands you might visit Utrecht. Barcelona is a great place--you can easily visit other parts of Catalonia.

[jeffrey_X]

6. We have been to London before..

We spent 8 days just in London about 5 years ago.

[FM Arouet666]

5. Some ideas

Go to London then Paris then to south of France then to Barcelona. In So of France I liked Arles, and the coast. Monaco was a vulgar display of excess wealth, but worth a look. AiX in provence was over rated as was Avignon, but both are worth a look, especially Avignon. Marseille was a pit. Orange was interesting. So of France to Amsterdam via plane. Five nights in Amsterdam is a bit much unless you like the night life, especially the coffee bars.

Or you could fly Chicago to Amsterdam, take the eurorail to Paris, fly to Nice, drive around provence, then drive into Barcelona. Take a train to Madrid, then to London and leave from there. Just a thought, I just did the Amsterdam/train to Paris/fly to Nice/drive Provence/fly back to Paris trip and it was easy. Barcelona, Madrid, and London are all great cities. The train is easy and so is driving. Brussels is interesting but not enough to detour for unless you have a specific interest.

I would alter the recommendations depending on your interests; night life, art, architecture, how much you want to spend etc.

[jeffrey_X]

7. Great info...

Thank you.

We were trying to do the whole trip by train if that is possible. We were hoping to do a couple of train trips late at night so we wouldn't need a hotel room and save some $$$. Not sure if that is a good idea or not.

[FM Arouet666]

8. Probably a good idea

I have always taken day trains, but you could take a long trip, say So of France to Amsterdam. First class is bit more but seems safer. You have to be aware of your surroundings in train stations, especially Spain and Italy. Lots of pic pockets and Gypsies, but it is generally safe.

If you want to save cash look for B&Bs, you can find some great deals. I had a huge apartment with a kitchen in Madrid for real cheap. However, in Paris you should stay in a hotel, very few B&Bs and what few they have are dives. Amsterdam is another great place for cheap accommodations. I stayed with a local couple who ran a B&B in a nice area of town. So of France was a bit more difficult, they had B&Bs and boutique hotels, but they were not cheap. Same with Monaco, I would spend a day there, but stay outside of the country, the prices are outrageous.

Another money saving tip is to go shoulder season, Spring or Fall, instead of Summer. I hate Europe in summer, way too many people and it's too hot. I usually go May, or Sept/Oct. The rain can get you, but the prices are better and your not in a sea of humanity.

Anyway, have a blast.

[Obamarama]

9. I would skip Brussels and extend the Southern France stay...

Brussels, quite frankly, is a dump. My partner and I trained in from Paris for a day trip, concerned that we were cutting ourselves short. As it turned out, we couldn't get back on the return train quickly enough.

The only thing really worth seeing in Brussels is the Grand Place, but other than that, it struck us as a filthy, rough-around-the-edges city. We were quite shocked to discover this. We figured that as the capital of Belgium AND the EU, it would be pretty cosmopolitan and interesting.

The Grand Place is ringed with over-priced tourist trap restaurants on the surrounding streets, complete with barkers trying to lure you in. Once you're a few blocks in any direction from the Grand Place, it just looks dingy and threadbare.

My recommendation would be to spend that time in the South of France and skip Brussels altogether.

[jeffrey_X]

10. Thanks for the tips...

We are now thinking about going to Bruges and not Brussels en route to Amsterdam.

Any thoughts on Bruges?

[Obamarama]

11. Bruges is a beautiful city, as is Ghent also. eot

[yy4me]

12. Sounds great and I agree with the poster who suggests that

you bypass Brussels. Except for the core of the old town ,it's just another big city. Brugge is beautiful, full of wonderful sights and great food. We found all of Belgium to be beautiful---except as mentioned above. Unless you will be traveling to Haarlem or other small towns outside of Amsterdam, 5 days there is too long there. I'd stay in the south of France another day, go to Brugge for 2 days, then off to Amsterdam and surrounds. In the south of France, Aix-en-provence, Arles or Avignon are great. You will be able to find fantastic food, reasonable hotels and guest houses. The Popes' Palace in Avignon is a great "must see", the amphitheater in Arles could still house gladiators. Aix is lovely too. Just find your rooms early in the day, then see the sights. Tourist offices really will help you find a room if you cannot. I think all of your plans work with Eurail but check the length of time your pass covers. Big cities have their own transit systems for small $$$. I found that the Eurail passes were expensive but probably not for as long a trip as yours. Check out www.fodors.com, www.tripadvisor.com and www.ricksteves.com. Great info available on all of them. I'd sell my soul for 3.5 weeks to take a trip like yours. Have fun, pack light. You can get anything there, laundromats abound, and wear dark colors. (hides a multitude of sins.) ATM's work with 4 NUMBER(not letters) pins, 24 hours a day everywhere.