HAND-COUNTED PAPER BALLOTS!!!! [View All]

[Bill Bored]

OK, now that I've gotten your attention,

How many states or counties are poised to buy paperless DREs RIGHT NOW? And how do we stop them?

To the hand-counted-paper-ballots-true-believer contingent:

OK, so you want to go for the gusto and get rid of ALL the machines.
Great! But this will require either a LAW passed by a LEGISLATURE, or in some states, a REFERENDUM enacted by the PEOPLE. It also has to comply with existing Federal Law, such as HAVA. So it might behoove you to actually get a copy of HAVA and read it.

Now, let's say your state or county is ready to drop a crap-load of money on a paperless e-votin' system, a lot of which comes from Uncle Sam via HAVA, which says you have to make your voting system accessible to people with disabilities and you can't use punch cards anymore.

So now you have a few million bucks to spend on a voting system and you go shopping, what are your choices:

1. Disabled-accessible DREs, with or without a voter-verified paper audit "trail."

2. Paper ballots with a marking device that disabled voters can use.

3. Hand counted paper ballots, with a device similar to the one in 2 above for the disabled.

So presumably you want to use #3. That means you need machine-readable (e.g., Op Scan) ballots, because Op Scan ballots can be marked and read by a machine that the disabled community can use. This includes blind voters who can't SEE the paper to make the little check marks in the boxes on your non-machine-readable, hand-counted paper ballot. The machine can read the ballot to the voter audibly, it can mark the ballot for those who can't see it, or can't physically use a pen or pencil, and it can READ the marks back to the voter so they can verify their vote. I do not claim to be an expert on these devices, but this is generally how they work, and if not they should! It probably violates federal law (HAVA) if they don't.

So now you have the following:

Machine-readable/markable Paper Ballots with some form of reader/marker.

Your at least half-way to precinct count Op Scans already. Do you opt NOT to take the HAVA money and buy them? The only difference is in the counting method, which could be either by hand or by scanner, or by some combination that relies on random hand auditing, testing of the scanners, etc.

So unless you think hand counting would be made illegal by allowing Op Scans at the precinct, I don't see why it's so hard to compromise about the counting and auditing, which is simply a matter of mathematics. I.e., how much random manual auditing is necessary to rule out an incorrect count that affects the outcome of the election? Probably NOT 100% in most cases, but this is ALWAYS AN OPTION!!! You have RECOUNT LAWS to make it so. If they are bad laws, CHANGE THEM!

Now, by INSISTING on NO machines at all, you are not going to get anywhere because, as I understand it, you would be in violation of HAVA. You have to explain the subtleties of Vote Counting vs. Vote Casting to everyone you talk to, including legislators, activists for the disabled and ordinary people. And, I'll tell you what:

I'M NOT HEARING THIS FROM YOU GUYS!

All I'm hearing is "HAND COUNTED PAPER BALLOTS!"

Meanwhile, more paperless DREs are on the way because there are those who don't even get the fact that paperless machines are no damn good.

If you want hand counted paper ballots, you have to frame the debate in the contexts of HAVA, disabled voters and the potential for election fraud. So TRY IT! Maybe you'll LIKE IT, and maybe you can get what you want.

My basic point is this: ballots must be machine-readable because of HAVA. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

"Hand counted paper ballots", without specifying the TYPE of ballot (e.g., Op Scan) seems to violate the accessibility requirements of HAVA. It disenfranchises disabled voters.

If you are going to argue for a particular counting method or ballot type, try not to be so simplistic as to conveniently ignore existing law and existing voter groups who have been lobbying for independent access to the ballot for years and have finally gotten it. It's counter-productive and you will NOT get what you want.

Hope this helps. Now I'll go put on my flame-retardant suit. :)