OHIO: Judge refuses to back county in attempt to stop recount

[sled]

Judge refuses to back county in attempt to stop recount

http://www.cantonrep.com/index.php?Category=13&ID=196029&r=1

Saturday, December 4, 2004 COLUMBUS, Ohio (AP) — A federal judge on
Friday ruled against a county’s attempt to stop a presidential
election recount, likely setting the stage for a county-by-county
recount in the coming weeks.

The decision by U.S. District Judge Edmund Sargus denied the Delaware
County Board of Elections’ request to stop the recount. Sargus’ ruling
was a victory for candidates for the Green and Libertarian parties,
which requested the recount.

But Sargus also ruled against the third party candidates’ request for
the recount to begin immediately, before the official count is
certified Monday.

The effect of the ruling is that a recount will still occur but
probably won’t be over before Ohio’s electors meet Dec. 13th.

(snip)

[OKNancy]

1. Thanks for posting this

a little kick in the process.........

[clydefrand]

2. This is good!

"Requests for recounts will be filed immediately after Secretary of State Kenneth Blackwell certifies the results Monday, said John Bonifaz, a lawyer for the Boston-based National Voting Rights Institute representing Green Party candidate David Cobb and Libertarian Party candidate Michael Badnarik.

Bonifaz conceded the recount wouldn’t be done by Dec. 13 but could be done before the House and Senate formally declare the winner Jan. 6."


Also thought this point was interesting near the end of article: Yost thinks his workers are too exhausted and the cost too high for a recount. Maybe he wouldn't mind if some Du'ers came to count for him??? I'd be willing to help out. Anyone else? I think the cost will be much higher if there isn't a recount.

[martinolich]

5. ...I've already volunteered with the Cobb/Badnarik to recount!

..But I haven't heard from them yet...

[frustrated_lefty]

3. Grand.

We get to hear we won, but not on time, so we should "just get over it" for another four years.

[Branjor]

4. My misreading of this was telling....

<"just get over it" for another four years.

When I read the above, I inadvertently read it as "another four hundred years". Freudian slip. Shows how long this is beginning to feel like for me.

[AndyTiedye]

17. 400 Years Would Be Shorter Than The Last Time

we went into the Dark Ages.

[noclonyofthechimp]

6. The Dem party came up with the money for the Washington State

recount. Do you think that maybe they were waiting for this ruling and Katherine Blackwell to certify on Monday so that they could request AND help finance a county by county recount? :shrug:

[corbett]

25. Inner Circle Of Kerry Camp Waited For Votes To Be Certified

While it certainly makes life much more difficult to contest an election after all states have certified, it also adds an air of legitimacy to such a challenge. Remember the 36 days after the 2000 election when both camps lobbed volley after volley at each other, escalating from one hearing to another. Dubya looked super arrogant forming his transition team before he was certified the winner and Gore committed political suicide by bungling the situation.

Kerry knew that there was a very good chance that it would come to this in 2004. If he didn't, he wouldn't have asked the FEC to establish a limit for GELAC fundraising. He knew that Florida would certify for Bush no matter what because the First Brother is Governor (I live in Florida so I know) but also knew that he had a really good chance of winning Pennsylvania fair and square because Governor Rendell is a good man who supports fair elections.

In the big Electoral formula, then, Ohio was the wildcard among the swing states. Kerry knew that he could lose several of them but if he won Pennsylvania and Ohio, his success was a guarantee. Well, with Blackwell as Secretary Of State, Kerry knew that it would be very difficult to challenge until the vote was certified because he would have to sue county-by-county. By waiting until certification occurs, his hand is more difficult to use to prevail but also stronger because he genuinely can claim that his position was injured.

Washington state a a bit different but not too different. The main reason that the Democrats have requested another recount is not because they picked up several votes after the first recount but because several thousand votes were not counted. That assertion would have been much more difficult to prove without certification. Besides, when their second recount proves that the Democratic candidate won, they get their $1 million back.

[tblue37]

8. Remember that

a statewide recount in Florida, paid for by a newspaper consortium, showed that Al Gore really did win in 2000. But the fact that he won was deemed insignificant--especially because it was buried on newspapers' back pages on September 12, 2001.

Remember, too, that possession is 9/10 of the law. When it is proven that Kerry won Ohio (and probably other states, such as Florida, as well), it will be deemed insignificant, because "we already have a president," one who will have been sworn in and feted at great expense. The Republicans are well aware that a fait accompli is very difficult, perhaps impossible, to undo.

They are deliberately running out the clock.

In 2006 and 2008, the Democratic campaigns should emphasize that in the last three elections, and especially this one, it was Republicans who fought so hard to prevent verifiable voting and to avoid having all votes counted.

Campaign ads should ask incessantly, "What are they trying to hide?" and "Why are they so afraid of the votes of the American people?"

[Imperialism Inc.]

7. Awesome.

Thank you Cobb/Badnarik and thank you Kerry/Edwards for joining in!

[Pithy Cherub]

9. Excellent News! It's a beginning!

The time factor/pressures are of concern. Also at some point won't the suits in multiple counties have to be consolidated into one course of action? Especially if the next step is to get Federal relief from the set of electors chosen by the reptilian K. Blackwell?

[arwalden]

10. What Good Is A Recount If It Happens AFTER The Vote Is Certified??

Horse. Gone. Gate. Closed.

[DemoTex]

11. If the recount confirms suspicions of widespread voting fraud ...

And if Bu$h or Rove or Blackwell or Diebold (or all of the above) can be tied to that fraud, another gate is opened. Subverting the will of the people is treason; subverting it in time of war, as young Americans give their lives for a dubious cause, is double-damnable treason.

[Merlot]

15. Would it be better for bush to get in office

and then have fraud and treason charges brought against him as this blows wide open? I'd like to see that happen, it's the only way people and the media will believe this is all for real.

[AndyTiedye]

18. Charges Brought By Whom?

His all-Dominionist Department of Injustice?

The Republican Congress?

All those judges he appointed?

The soon-to-be-Dominionist-majority Supreme Court?

The checks and balances that kept our government sane for over
200 years are gone.

[beets]

21. ....Then what's left is civil disobedience of all stripes

What needs to be done needs to be done by Jan 6 or all that's left for us is agony or action.
I truly do not understand why we're wasting our time this way when so much hangs in the balance! Bush is sealing off the exits before he burns the place down.
We are an enemy to the entire world. As the senate and congress won't help us and would prefer fussing over the buffet table, then maybe the rest of the world will decide to cut off our money and take these decisions out of our hands, since we just can't seem to manage anything ourselves.

[DemoTex]

23. "Agony or action." I like that Beets.

Thanks. Welcome to DU.

[corbett]

27. Subverting the will of the people is treason

Well said!!!!

"Subverting the will of the people is treason; subverting it in time of war, as young Americans give their lives for a dubious cause, is double-damnable treason."

[corbett]

26. Several Advantages To Recount After Certification

While it certainly makes life much more difficult to contest an election after all states have certified, it also adds an air of legitimacy to such a challenge. Remember the 36 days after the 2000 election when both camps lobbed volley after volley at each other, escalating from one hearing to another. Dubya looked super arrogant forming his transition team before he was certified the winner and Gore committed political suicide by bungling the situation.

Kerry knew that there was a very good chance that it would come to this in 2004. If he didn't, he wouldn't have asked the FEC to establish a limit for GELAC fundraising. He knew that Florida would certify for Bush no matter what because the First Brother is Governor (I live in Florida so I know) but also knew that he had a really good chance of winning Pennsylvania fair and square because Governor Rendell is a good man who supports fair elections.

In the big Electoral formula, then, Ohio was the wildcard among the swing states. Kerry knew that he could lose several of them but if he won Pennsylvania and Ohio, his success was a guarantee. Well, with Blackwell as Secretary Of State, Kerry knew that it would be very difficult to challenge Ohio until the vote was certified because he would have to sue county-by-county. By waiting until certification occurs, his hand is more difficult to use to prevail but also stronger because he genuinely can claim that his position was injured.

Don't forget how the final opportunity to challenge the 2000 election was botched in the end when Gore had to preside over his own defeat as President of the Senate. Several members of the Congressional Black Caucus were ready to present evidence of fraud and racial disenfranchisement but they were all Representatives. Not a single member of the Senate backed them! This time around, the situation is different. By aligning all of the evidence in public first and by being a serving member of the Senate, Kerry is in a VERY strong position to challenge the election in open session in early January. There's one catch, though. If Ohio's Secretary of State Kenneth Blackwell still allows his electors to vote as if Bush won and Kerry's challenge is successful, Congress could decide to ignore Ohio's results altogether. If that were to happen, neither candidate would meet the threshold of 270 electoral votes. In theory, the House of Representatives would decide the winner and we all know which man they'd choose.

The trick, then, is to correct some of the other states between now and then so that Kerry approaches or passes 270 without Ohio. At the top of the list are Florida, Nevada and New Mexico. The second two have active recounts underway and the evidence of fraud in Florida grows every day.

In conclusion, while not the easy path, there is a logic behind pursuing victory in this roundabout way. Don't forget, Kerry is a lawyer who knows how to win. With Edwards at his side, these two men know how to show grace under pressure and keep their cool while live fire is all around them.

[KoKo]

12. Thanks....Wondered why Cliff Arneback didn't file his lawsuit yesterday

though. I can't find any information on the site as to why they didn't file. It was a request that they immediately start the recount, according to what he said on C-Span's Washington Journal on Thursday. He said they decided to delay the filing from Thursday to Friday, but there's no news.

[lonestarnot]

14. I am wondering same thing.

I know all i's dotted and t's crossed is a must, but something else in the air.

[lonestarnot]

13. Same old same old

Damn! I hate those people! 2000 all over again!

[beets]

16. Anybody know how delay in recount until after certification

and incompletion before electors meet 12-13 will effect the recount effort especially (as expected) Kerry will prevail? Would this timing in some way dismiss recount result? Is this a snake in the grass?

[AndyTiedye]

19. Yes. They Are Running Out the Clock

The only effect this will have will be to erode Booosh's "mandate" a bit,
and to prove that the election was stolen again.

Republicans control the state government in Ohio, so there is no way
they will allow it to go to Kerry, regardless of what the recounts say.

[beets]

20. But that's downright irrational!

Mewling despair! You mean the Ohio reps can legally steal the election????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

[proud_Kucitizen]

22. prosecutor may be refusing to count Delaware county anyway.

That is what was one of the speakers at the statehouse suggested.

Also, that Shelby county has said it already discarded the votes so nothing to count.

[lovuian]

24. wonder why the Republicans are worried??? They Won or did they

They obviously don't want to know the truth!!!