Candidates Officially Request Ohio Recount

[Junkdrawer]

COLUMBUS, Ohio - With support from John Kerry (news - web sites)'s campaign, two third-party candidates for president officially asked on Tuesday for a recount in Ohio, the state that put President Bush (news - web sites) over the top in November.

The requests, mailed to all 88 counties, were expected to arrive by Wednesday.

....

The recount will probably not begin until next week because of a five-day waiting period to allow candidates time to arrange witnesses to the counting. Cobb, Badnarik and the Kerry camp gave permission for the recount to start before the five-day period. The Bush campaign did not waive the waiting period.


State law requires 3 percent of ballots to be counted by hand in each county, and then all ballots to be counted if the initial check turns up problems.



http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=694&ncid=703&e=1&u=/ap/20041208/ap_on_el_pr/ohio_vote

[spotbird]

1. Who picks which 3%?

This isn't really wort it if Blackwell has a say.

[Junkdrawer]

2. Someone tried to search Ohio law and they couldn't even find...

the 3% clause, much less the way the 3% is chosen.

[Junkdrawer]

3. Here's a link to the law page...

http://moritzlaw.osu.edu/electionlaw/procedures_recount_os.html

I can't find the law on this...

[Wordie]

9. It may not be a law, but it may be a regulation, or interpretation issued

by the SoS. As I understand it, in elections, the legislature establishes the law, which is sort of like the framework, and then the legislature grants the authority to the SoS, and election officials, to issue regulations and interpretations based on the law.

So, the answer may lie on the Ohio SoS site. Unfortunately, the OH SoS site tends to be very difficult to search, as it has most info in pdf form.

[Junkdrawer]

10. See post below - It has to be random by law...n/t

[Junkdrawer]

5. OK I finally found it...

Page 11:

(5) The board must randomly select as many whole precincts as necessary
in order to equal at least 3% of the total vote cast for the office, question, or issue
being recounted. The board then must manually recount the ballots for the
selected precincts.
(6) The board or the designated teams must recount the ballots from the
randomly selected precincts using automatic tabulating equipment.
(7) If the automatic tabulating equipment count of the ballots from the
randomly selected precincts does not match their manual count, a second manual
count of those ballots must be conducted. If the automatic tabulating equipment
count does not match the second manual count, all the ballots for the county must
be manually recounted. But, if, the automatic tabulating equipment count matches
the second manual count, the remainder of the ballots for the county must be
recounted and tallied using the automatic tabulating equipment.4


http://www.lsc.state.oh.us/analyses124/h0566-i.pdf

[Wordie]

12. That sounds like the machine count has to match the hand count exactly,

or else a full hand recount has to be done, although the law, as written, isn't explicit. Maybe that's where another interpretation comes in. And if Blackwell provides the interpretation, we can know how that will come out. :(

[Junkdrawer]

16. My worries are...

1.) How "random" does the random selection have to be?

2.) How much time expires between the random selection and the recount.

Remember: Counterfeiting ballots is relatively easy - ballots are designed to have no signatures.

[Wordie]

17. Does the law info you found establish any method for a random selection?

And thank you for locating the pdf file.

[pinkpops]

19. If the 3% is really required by law, and if it is to be chosen by some

random method, and if the random selection were to include electronic votes for which recounts are impossible ...
I would say they have a problem.

[proudtobeadem]

21. I saw in an article it is 3% of each county

if problems are found then they do the rest.

[Supersedeas]

32. how do you recognize a problem when scope is limited to 3%

who picked that arbitrary number anyways....

the more we learn about 'Merican democracy, the more petty and bureaucratic if becomes.

it sure doesn't look like freedom and fairness to me.

[Moderator]

4. Kick

:Kick:

[cmd]

6. Observing in my county

I don't know when, but will be on call next week for the hand recount. I'll keep you updated.

[highnooner]

8. How can they handcount touchscreen votes?

By noting the number of fingerprints on various parts of the screen?

[Junkdrawer]

11. ..and they've destroyed some of the only touch screen paper...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=203&topic_id=124621&mesg_id=124621

*someone* is covering their tracks...bigtime.

[Wordie]

14. LOL...probably as reliably accurate as any other method!

[cmd]

34. I'll be watching for chad etc., we use punch cards

I have no idea how the touch screen ballots will be verified. This is exactly why we are going through this exercise. We have to have proof that the election process is compromised before logical changes can be made.

[Wordie]

15. How wonderful! All of us can be proud that you represent DU! :)

[steely]

7. Rate this story

2.90 with 393 - up from 2.72 with 346

[nofurylike]

13. kick. rate it. n/t

[Gloria]

18. Cobb clip on Olbermann: great quote!!!!!!!!!

On Olbermann today...clip of Cobb saying that "There is a possibility that George W. Bush did not win Ohio. If that is the case, it would be a crime against democracy for George Bush to be sworn into office." (Direct quote from my tape!)

[lovuian]

24. Cobb is so right on!!! You are an American Hero

this guy is possibly going to save Democracy!!!

[Pachamama]

29. Can you say foreshadowing?

I smiled when I saw this...I made another donation to David Cobb...he needs the support right now and the money goes to the right cause...

:hi:

[bear425]

20. Thank you and rated...

You have given the news article Candidates Officially Request Ohio Recount a rating of 5.
Its current average rating is 2.97 with 542 vote(s).

[Gloria]

22. The part about the 3 percent makes me a bit nervous....

State law requires 3 percent of ballots to be counted by hand in each county, and then all ballots to be counted if the initial check turns up problems.

[VegasWolf]

23. AFT! n/t

[annabanana]

26. rated (must unfreep) n/t

[George_S]

28. 2.97 with 573 vote(s).

You have given the news article Candidates Officially Request Ohio Recount a rating of 5.
Its current average rating is 2.97 with 573 vote(s).

[saracat]

25. Headline SHOULD BE "Bush Bastards Refuse to Waive

Waiting Period on Recount"! And maybe I am stupid about this but what good does a 3% recount do? Just read why. Thanks!

[fshrink]

27. The riggers' goal will be

to obtain enough data to suggest a regression to the mean. This can be achieved way more easily on 3% than on the totality of the ballots. I'm pessimistic. All ballots should be counted by hand. Just like in any real democracy.

[Tripmann]

30. Good morning from europe kick

BOING......

You have given the news article Candidates a rating of 5.
Its current average rating is 2.88 with 765 vote(s).

[Sideways]

31. Another Kick From Europe

[RawMaterials]

33. kick from ohio

You have given the news article Candidates Officially Request Ohio Recount a rating of 5.
Its current average rating is 2.88 with 790 vote(s).

Back to article

[woodsprite]

35. The law said "whole precincts"

"The board must randomly select as many whole precincts as necessary
in order to equal at least 3% of the total vote cast for the office"

I didn't get from that line that they would be able to do 3% of each precinct. If they do whole precincts, maybe more anomalies will show up. I would think it would definitely be a better cross section than if they did 3% from each. I wish our guys got to have a say in what was chosen. Of course, can you see Blackwell if it's randomly chosen with everyone present and say a couple of Warren Co precincts show up }(

My choice for how *random* is done would be little slips of paper in a big bowl. Pass it around to each candidate and lawyer there until you totalled 3%. :)

[yorkiemommie1]

36. read and rated '5' n/t