At Least 5 Dead, 2 Wounded In Nightclub Shooting (Dimebag Darrell Dead)

[Spoon]

At Least 5 Dead, 2 Wounded In Nightclub Shooting
Witnesses: Alleged Gunman Went Onto Stage, Fired Shots

POSTED: 10:32 pm EST December 8, 2004
UPDATED: 12:23 am EST December 9, 2004

COLUMBUS, Ohio -- At least five people died and two others were wounded after a shooting at a Columbus nightclub on Wednesday night, NBC 4 reported.

The shooting took place shortly after 10 p.m. at Alrosa Villa, located at 5055 Sinclair Road.

Two members of the heavy metal band Damageplan were reportedly shot and killed, including Dimebag Darrell, formerly with the band Pantera, NBC 4's David Wayne reported. The other band member's name was not released. The alleged gunman also died at the scene, Wayne reported.

Shortly after the band began playing its first song, a man reportedly ran onto the stage and began shooting, according to a witness who identified himself as Sean. Some members of the audience reportedly thought the man running onto the stage with a gun was part of the band's act, NBC 4's Erin Tate reported.

Witnesses said that several shots were fired at the band. Witnesses said that a bouncer at the club tackled the alleged gunman before that person was shot and killed. It was unclear as to whom shot the alleged gunman.

NBC 4 reported that of the surviving victims, one was in critical condition while the other was in fair condition. Several others were treated at the scene, suffering from various injuries.

Alrosa Villa is a popular north Columbus nightspot for young adults, featuring rock and heavy metal bands, NBC 4 reported.

According to the band's Web site, Damageplan was touring nationally. It performed in Buffalo, N.Y., on Tuesday night and had a concert scheduled in Flint, Mich., on Thursday.

Damageplan featured former Pantera artists Dimebag Darrell and Vinnie Paul. The pair were joined by vocalist Patrick Lachman and bassist Bobzilla, according to their Web site.

Watch NBC 4 and refresh nbc4i.com for additional information.

http://www.nbc4i.com/news/3983630/detail.html

[Fenris]

1. Holy fuck! Dimebag Darrell?

Shit. That's fucking bizarre.

[flamingyouth]

2. Wow - that's incredible

Holy shit. :wow:

[jayfish]

3. Rock In Peace, Darrell. -NT-

Jay

[MrSlayer]

4. Holy fucking shit.

I always liked to tease Pantera and "Diamond" Darell for their glam days but he was a hell of a guitar player. Metal will miss him.

[robre]

5. What do you think would happen if this guy was an Iraq war vet?

Don't those guys listen to like pantera and shit before they go on raids?

[SheepyMcSheepster]

97. i heard reported on the radio that the killer was a former marine. nt.

[robre]

117. wow

with 5 fatalities and that many woundings immediately made me think of military training

it takes a hardened man to just sit there and pump shots into an entertainers head at point blank range

[robre]

119. also, prepare for the hellstorm if they find out he went to iraq (n/t)

[SheepyMcSheepster]

120. evidentally he was discharged early from the military for some reason

i doubt he was in iraq.

[Rochambeau]

6. Damn ! I used to be fan of his guitars and the way he played on them.

RIP Dime ! Shit :evilfrown: :( :(

[Fenris]

7. His effects pedals are monsters.

Fun to mess with.

[rocktivity]

24. And so were his harmonics.

I asked how he acheived them in an interview (I'm a part-time rock journalist), and he got mad!

Where's my Vulgar Display Of Power album? I told the publicist it would sell at least half a million copies and named gave it Best Album of the year honor because it was "the album Metallica thought they made."

:headbang:
rocknation

[NJGeek]

50. RIP Dimebag Darrell

I learned guitar playing his riffs.. killer harmonics, crunchy chords. he was an innovative metal guitarist, wrote articles in Guitar World, a real "Guitarist's Guitarist". I never got into any of his new stuff, kind of outgrew metal altogether, but he will be missed by many.

what the hell was going on with him or that nut that shot him? very strange

[opiate69]

8. Holy-fuck....

R.I.P, Darrell... fuck....

[MrSlayer]

9. Kick for the headbangers.

A tragic day.

[Elidor]

10. What a tragedy

I'm dumbstruck. Killed by a disgruntled fan???

[flamingyouth]

11. I just read on a message board that Vinnie Paul is also dead

I don't know if it's true, but several people who claimed to be at the show said they saw him shot several times in the head.

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

12. Darrell and Vinnie...

Were brothers. Real, family-like brothers.

Sounds like someone took the Pantera split a little too seriously.

[flamingyouth]

14. Yeah, I know

Like I said, I'm not certain that it's true, and now the board I was on crashed due to heavy traffic. I can't imagine what kind of nut did this... horrible.

[CornField]

17. This is just horrible. nt

[Guaranteed]

28. He's not. He's fine, I'm hearing.

The people saying he's fine seem more credible, too.

[NIGHT TRIPPER]

13. That really Sucks- a band can be assaulted w a gun on stage these days?

Security is still that bad even with the terra and airport searches and all athat?

SO Sorry to hear about this.
Maybe clubs should use metal detectors at the door.

My deepest sympathy to the families of all who were shot tonight.


Pantera was a GREAT band.

RIP Darrel

and on edit:

RIP Vinnie


this is bad bad bad

[Viva_La_Revolution]

15. now I'm wondering...

Who's the gunman? Pantera connection? That would suck.

[rocktivity]

23. More likely a groupie connection

Some people take it personally when a band blows into town and samples the local talent.

Phil Anselmo's reaction to this will be interesting, to say the least.

:cry:
rocknation

[allalone]

16. I'm an old lady so don't know these guys, but

jeez, that's terrible. and wierd. sorry to all you fans

[shrike]

60. I never heard of these guys, either

But my condolences to the friends, family and fans of the victims.

[RedCon1]

18. Oh My God!!!

DimeBag Darrell is dead? I just found out like 2 minute ago and I'm dumbfounded. Darrell was one of my heros growing up as a kid. I used to read all of his articles in Gutar World magazine and spent countless hours annoying my neighbors and parents while learning his riffs. The man was practically a legend before he died. There can be no doubt about his legendary status now. Dimebag and Vinnie, your deaths will be mourned by millions. Rest in Peace.

[DS1]

44. Yeah, I remember tuning my E down to D to play 'Walk'

and others :evilfrown:

[RedCon1]

105. I remember when Cowboys From Hell premiered on MTV

And I thought, whoa, WTF is this all about? It was so different that I didn't have a frame of reference to draw a conclusion about it. G n'R was the same way. After you listened to it for a while, you knew it was taking things to the next level, setting the next standard so to speak.

[DS1]

123. Exactly!

I remember a friend of mine who introduced me to Metallica, Megadeth, GWAR, others, INSIST on playing Cowboys from Hell over and over again, at first I hated it. It grew on me, I learned it, loved it, played it over and over again myself.

Then I went to bootcamp and soon after MCT, pretty much disappeared from the civilized world for 4 months, Vulgar came out during that. I'll never forget waiting at Charlotte "International ( scoff )" Airport with a pocket full of cash, seeing Vulgar in a record shop, buying a walkman, batteries, headphones and that CD just to hear what was new. I couldn't believe what I was hearing, it was the greatest CD ever for me, better than Metallica, better than Megadeth, waaay better than Slayer, better than everything!

So, yeah :cry:

[Judi Lynn]

19. Here's the AP story.....

December 9, 2004

Last modified December 9, 2004 - 12:42 am



Man kills 4 at concert in Ohio club
Associated Press

COLUMBUS, Ohio - A man walked onstage in a crowded nightclub during a rock concert Wednesday night and opened fire, killing at least four people and wounding at least two others before he was shot to death by police, authorities said.

Members of the heavy metal band Damageplan had just begun their first song at the Alrosa Villa when the man opened fire on the band, initially shooting the guitarist, who went by the name "Dimebag Darrel," a witness said. According to the band's Web site, the guitarist and another member are formerly of the heavy metal band Pantera.

The witness, 22-year-old Chris Couch, said he was standing about 30 feet away from the stage when he noticed a man wearing a hooded sweatshirt and hockey jersey walk up to the stage, followed by a bouncer and another club employee.

The man in the jersey climbed onto the stage, started yelling and shot the guitarist five or six times at close range, Couch said. Couch said the gunman also shot a bouncer who pulled him off the musician.
(snip/...)

http://www.billingsgazette.com/index.php?id=1&display=rednews/2004/12/09/build/nation/75-shooting-concert.inc

[andino]

20. I just can't believe it

What would cause someone to do that?

[bluedonkey]

21. So sorry

My son just called me with the bad news.He listened to Pantera all the time and at first they scared the bjesus out of me,but they eventually grew on me.
What a loss!Hell of gifted guitarist.
This is so sad.Do we have to keep the musicians behind bullet proof glass to keep them safe?

[charlie]

22. Aw NOOOOOO

Jeezus fucking christ, not Dime.

I've long worried this day was coming. Now it's happened and we can't go back. Who's gonna ever get on a stage again without the fear of death by nutjob?

Shit. I can't believe he killed Dime. My god, am I depressed...

[SweetLeftFoot]

36. Music Goes On

While this is terrible news - I used to listen to Pantera back in the day - people dying so senselessly is always awful, but Monica Seles was stabbed playing tennis and that still goes on.

Music won't stop coz of this awful event.

[TheWebHead]

25. John Lennon was also murdered by a gunman on December 8

...1980

here's an apparent eyewitness account:


all i can say is holy crap!! that was such a freakin' nightmare... i don't ever want to be a part of anything like that again... i'm still shaking.... i don't even know what to say...

i was up close to the stage on the side where DBD was playing.... then i saw the guy jump out of the crwod onto the stage... he was yelling something about how "you broke up pantera.... you ruined my life.... what about phil??? he needs heroin money..." or something like that then i saw the gun and he shot DBD right in the head... when DBD went down he kept shooting... then he turned around for bobzilla then vinnie... teh hole time i thought it was part of the show... i had blood on me i was so close... i'm still freakin' out here...

after he turned around and kept shooting i was gone... i swear i almost crapped my pants... it was ####' crazy as ####... people were totally messed up outside... i was standing next to this one chick and she was crying and couldn't stop... she fell on the ground and it was like she was possesed or something... dude it was so kayotic its not even funny... the cops showed up and then people started sayin' that DBD was killed... then people started freaking out even more...

i can't belive this happend... its so crazy... its totally unreal and there's no way to describe how messed up i am right now...

http://discussions.elektra.com/wm-damageplan/messages/?msg=6249.1

[JaySherman]

26. Nothing is safe anymore, is it?! Maybe it is time to take the guns away.

Are Americans just flat-out insane or what? What compels people to do this kind of thing?! Can't even go to a rock concert anymore without having to worry about some lunatic with a gun shooting the place. I honestly don't know what side of the fence I stand on the gun argument anymore. Recently I've been of the conclusion that our government can't be trusted enough to merit disarming the American populace. But this kind of incident makes me wonder if, like a bunch of bad children, the guns shouldn't be taken away from the American people until they prove they're mature enough to use them again.

Oh yeah, and I grew up listening to Pantera. Utterly depressed right now.

[RedCon1]

27. I don't think so.

People are murdered everyday in America. Why should the murder of a famous person be any more cause for disarmament than that of Joe Nobody? Disarmament would create way more problems than it would solve anyways, problems that would make this incident appear peaceful by comparison. This thread is about Dimebag but I knew it would turn into a thread about the second amendment.

[tinanator]

39. I'll tell you why

because that famous person might be John Lennon or Bobby Kennedy. Handguns should be EXTREMELY hard to purchase. Assault rifles should be IMPOSSIBLE. Anyone who thinks they need to arm up against the governments jack booted thugs is lacking the sense needed to realize without cop-killer bullets or better you have no chance against body armor equipped assailants. Of course any hope of reasonable legislation or a just society should long ago have been abandoned once the Bushcorp fascists siezed power, with a .22 handgun.

[skippythwndrdog]

53. Point by point..

Handguns are hard to purchase legally, if you are a criminal. Assault rifles are nearly impossible, expect to pay thousands of dollars for one and undergo a very thorough ATF background check. There is no such thing as "cop killer" bullets, and any decent rifle round will beat body armor. I'm sorry, but you are dead wrong here.

[skippythwndrdog]

55. This incident is merely one more that proves...

that gun prohibitions do nothing to deter criminals. They serve only to render the law-abiding defenseless. The law should immediately be reformed to allow for self-defense in places that serve liquor. The current law prohibits even bar employees from being armed. It is time to end the madness. It shouldn't matter where the armed person is, only if he is drinking.

[Swede]

61. Yeah,gun deaths will really plummet then.

Ths US should join the civilized world with strict gun control.

[slackmaster]

66. We already have strict gun control here

It's just not being adequately enforced.

[Megahurtz]

91. I wonder why not

Too many redneck Repukes have guns, and those people are nuts.

[Amigust]

98. Not everyone who shoots up people is already a hardened criminal

who would own a gun anyway. Your "gun prohibitions do nothing to deter criminals" comment is an either/or statement that doesn't consider the variations that exist in who commits gun violence.

Mexico, last time I heard, had a no guns law. And it subsequently means there is a lot more knife violence. But for those Mexicans who are not hardened criminals and blessed with enough money to own guns anyway, they certainly can't mow down as many people in a few seconds with a knife as they can with an automatic firearm.

[skippythwndrdog]

101. Evidently, you didn't understand.

The place where the shooting took place was a "victim zone", a place where firearms are prohibited by Ohio Law. Due to this prohibition, a criminal can enter KNOWING that there will be nobody who can stop him. Therefore, this prohibition did nothing to deter this criminal. You write of "automatic firearm(s)" I really don't see the connection, as they are next to impossible to acquire legally in the US.

[tinanator]

80. tell it to dimebag and the security cop

are you saying you have a chance with legally acquired weapons against a SWAT team or US troops? Your first sentence is ludicrous.
Criminals attempting to purchase handguns legally? THEY STEAL THEM!
Nothing I wrote was incorrect. I didnt even mention rifles, which I consider quite legitimate objects to own under the 2nd amendment.

[skippythwndrdog]

100. Pleae re-read, I think you went to quickly before.

[RedCon1]

109. I'll tell you why not

Because you're obviously expressing an opinion about a subject which you know very little about. You either fail to grasp the ramifications of a disarmed populace or you embrace them, either way, the reality you envision is nothing like the reality that would be created if you had your way. Balance yields civility. Lack of balance yields to nothing. Furthermore, body armor isn't all that you envision it to be. To say that one has "no chance" against an individual wearing body armor is to admit that you know nothing about the subject. BTW, I own body armor too. Finally, I really don't want to vote for a Republican for any reason but, when it comes down to it, I will vote for the second amendment over any party and a lot of Americans have done and will do the same.

[tinanator]

136. boy these 2nd amendment knee jerks can read but not comprehend

then they say Im the one with the impediment.
body armor schmody armor. An armory is NOT going to help you turn back the jack booted thugs of fascism. A warm handgun may be your best friend but it didnt do dimebag darrel a bit of good because his guitar wasnt loaded. Handguns are BULLSHIT, and so are assault rifles.
The manufacturers should be held accountable for their subsequent misuse and prohibited from building, selling, importing and exporting this garbage. Those are the criminals you are defending with unreasoning rhetoric and kneejerk "but you dont understands". I understand plenty, and my ONLY point was Bobby Kennedy and John Lennon died thanks to somebodys warm little handgun and GHWB seized power the same way. Gun nuts cant hide when the topic pops up, you just go berserk. If the 2nd amendment means what you think, wheres my H-bomb?

[RedCon1]

137. It sounds like I comprehended your meaning just fine actually

I suspect that debate between the two of us over this subject will be futile. Regardless, I believe so strongly in the second amendment that I am compelled to engage in such a debate. Before I do so, I would extend an apology if I came off as an offensive "second amendment knee jerk." I realize I probably am a second amendment knee jerk; however, if it makes you feel better, I often defend the more traditional democratic values with equal rabidity.
That being said, having read a few articles about this gunman, I have come to the conclusion that he was probably mentally ill and on street drugs. My guess is he was an undiagnosed or, possibly diagnosed anti-social personality disorder with a strong possibility of delusional paranoia/grandiosity as well. I do not think the availability of hand guns had as much to do with this incident as did the unavailability of resources for treating such persons. This issue of casting mentally ill persons out onto the streets without proper stability is actually another of my "pet issues." As the resources for these highly vulnerable individuals continue to dry up, we will begin seeing more and more of these violent episodes. Those who think they are saving money by not funding programs for the mentally ill will come to realize the error of their frugality in time.
I think I provided you with logical reasoning already about the issue of the second amendment so I don't feel a need to go there again. If, however, you feel that I have failed to logically defend my position and you are inclined to continue this debate, please feel free to raise the issue again and we will continue from there. Otherwise, have a great weekend.

[slackmaster]

63. The shooter broke many laws

You cannot have a gun in any place that serves alcohol in Ohio.

Can't even go to a rock concert anymore without having to worry about some lunatic with a gun shooting the place.

Or a knife, or some other weapon. Have you ever seen the Rolling Stones movie Gimme Shelter? That happened in 1969. It's not just concerts, you are in some danger at any public venue.

But this kind of incident makes me wonder if, like a bunch of bad children, the guns shouldn't be taken away from the American people until they prove they're mature enough to use them again.

The problem with that idea is that once the government has the power to decide subjectively which of us is mature enough to have a gun, it will inevitably decide that nobody is mature enough. The OBjective system we have now (age 18 for long guns, 21 for handguns, no record of violent crime, etc.) is fine if properly enforced.

[RedCon1]

110. I'm relieved that other Democrats

defend the right to keep and bear arms. The constitution is clear, this right shall not be infringed upon. The second amendment balances things out nicely. Without it, we would quickly return to feudalism. I like my poor people well armed thank you very much.

[DoNotRefill]

102. Yup....and because of hate speech, we don't need the First Amendment...

either.

[SideshowScott]

29. God Damn it! Another life shortend by a bullet..RIP Dimebag

my musical tastes may have changed but i ALWAYS repected the gutiar playing of Dimebag Darrell..Saw them live about 4 years ago and he really did kick ass playing the gutiar.
this sucks....

[kitchen girl]

30. Not a heavy metal fan, but...

I'm very, very saddened to read this. Pretty freaked out, too. I live about a mile from the Alrosa and never even heard a siren last night. :wow:

My deepest condolences go out to everyone involved and to the band's many fans. Such a tragedy...

[semillama]

59. I live about a mile from there myself

I didn't notice any sirens, but then again you hear sirens fairly often around the major intersections.

[OhioChick]

31. Wow....What a Shock.....

RIP

[hollowdweller]

32. I've been to lots of concerts and I always worried about somebody doing

that. I remember seeing the Dead in 95 at Deer Creek in Indiana and they used metal detectors on us which I thought was odd. A few months later I heard that there was a death threat against Jerry. Also at this concert about 5000 people broke down the back fence and started crashing the concert. I can't imagine what he must have been thinking up there on stage. What was humorous was that they played Dire Wolf that night. The Chorus goes "Don't murder me. I beg of you don't murder me"

My wife was also attacked at a dead show in Buckeye Lake OH. Some nut came up behind her and slapped her and almost knocked her over. She was tripping and we had to work hard to convince her she wasn't dying;-)

[lies and propaganda]

96. this post did brighten my day n/t

[RedCon1]

113. Which Buckeye lake concert was it?

Was it with the Steve Miller Band or Sting or the Violent Femms? Those shows are legendary, esp. the SMB show IMHO. The Richfield Colliseum shows were something special too. You have to expect a certain amount of freaking out at a Dead show, ya know? At Soldier field, in the parking lot, some dude freaked out and started running over the tops of parked cars, leaping from one roof to the other, caving them in each time until he was "subdued." The cops drug him away kicking and screaming like a crazed animal. The trunk lid and roof of my car was crumpled. I felt bad for the guy, I recognized the trip. I think it's obvious that drugs, rock concerts, and guns don't mix though. Add a little schizophrenia or other major mental illness and look out, it's a recipe for mayhem.

[realisticphish]

33. I live in Columbus

and if it were not for Ministry playing right next door to me at the Newport, i would have been at the Alrosa :scared:

RIP Dimebag


:hippie: The Incorrigible Democrat

[Dukkha]

41. I've been to the Alrosa many times

I was there last year when Pigface performed. I couldn't believe it when I heard the news last night.

Dimebag Darrell was one the the greats in Metal. He will be missed

[goodboy]

84. columbus DU'er here too...didn't go to either show...I bet Ministry

kicked ass though.

[realisticphish]

85. o they did

it was the best concert ive ever been to...really. they played ALL my favorite songs, No W, New World Order, Thieves, Jesus Built My Hotrod, etc. they opened with No W, and a guy walked around on stage wearing a shrub mask; it was SO satisfying to see everythone flicking him off the whole time


:hippie: The Incorrigible Democrat

[goodboy]

93. right on. What's the next show you think you're going to?

I'll probably go see Hookah on New years eve at Promo.

[realisticphish]

99. i just saw hookah last week

in the student union. im not sure, i was thinking about going to sevendust/bobaflex on sunday, but it all depends on money


:hippie: The Incorrigible Democrat

[rppper]

34. wow...i still can not believe it either.....

i grew up in and around the dallas area...i remember them from the pre-phil days....i won't go into any detail, but i have partaken with the brothers before...waaay back when...83 and 84....jeesh...i just saw damageplan in april during the earthday birthday concert they throw in orlando every year...what a fuckin' waste. not only the band, but the patrons too....dammit, this is the kind of bullshit you can expect from a society pummelled with fear and hatred daily and desensetized to the value of human life.

to many rock stars...good rock stars...cashing out as of late...

R.I.P. darrell and vinnie

[mark414]

35. holy shit Dimebag Darrell is dead?

what the fuck???? Dimebag Darrell CAN'T die he is too tough. Christ this is terrible...

Rest In Peace buddy...

[Renew Deal]

37. This is just sad.

And so fucking pathetic. Why would someone do that? These guys were doing what they loved, no matter how much they fucked up over the years. It's just too bad. I liked some Pantera stuff.

BTW, the bouncer deserves a raise.

[SheepyMcSheepster]

38. RIP Dimebag

fucking people are always screwing things up.

yesterday was john lennon's birthday was it not?

another great musician gone before his time.

[johnnie]

45. It was the anniversary of John's death yesterday n/t

[livinginphotographs]

40. That sucks.

I just heard about it this morning.

RIP Dimebag.

[Frogtutor]

42. Motive: Shooter blamed Damageplan for the breakup of Pantera (?)

I'm in Fort Worth, TX ; it's all over the radio here. Pantera originated locally in the D/FW area, so they're covering it really well. I heard that the shooter was yelling about Damageplan being the reason Pantera broke up...

[johnnie]

46. I'm in Ohio and they are reporting it all over also.

They say he went right after the guitarist and was shouting to him that he broke up Pantera.
This is madness.

[flamingyouth]

69. That is just completely insane

Not that killing four people isn't *ever* insane, but that makes no sense whatsoever.

At least he's dead so we won't have to endure his trial and subsequent parole hearings.

[Ripley]

43. Man, I remember that place.

I used to live in Columbus and only went to Alrosa Villa once to see Robin Trower (past his heyday...his new band sucked). This was in the 1980's. It was always a biker brawling joint. Can't believe it's still open for business. It was always known for drugs and guns.

[realisticphish]

52. its not that anymore

now its a pretty respectable rock club.


:hippie: The Incorrigible Democrat

[Ripley]

54. lol

Sorry. But it doesn't seem to be "a pretty respectable rock club" when five people were murdered during a show. I know what you meant tho.

[realisticphish]

57. touche

WAS a pretty respectable rock club ;)


:hippie: The Incorrigible Democrat

[mtnester]

118. My spot at the Alrosa back in the day

was sitting on top of the cigarette machine listening to a Godz or Rosie show....occaisionally a Mimi Rousseau show.

Anyone with a history around greater Columbus can now tell me how old I am...:)

[kitchen girl]

122. About as old as I am...

The Godz are rock & roll machines!!!!!

:headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :headbang:

Of course, now I'm a middle-aged broad who fondly refers to it as "the neighborhood heavy metal joint". I certainly hope it remains that way after this. :hi:

[mtnester]

124. Hah! I almost posted that line too..eom

[Frogtutor]

47. There are also some really weird rumors floating around

that this is all a hoax; like a publicity stunt put on by the band. Guess there's a conspiracy theory for everything, huh?

Sad

[realisticphish]

58. that would be one HELL of a stunt

since they would have to kill at least 2 fans, and bribe the CPD


:hippie: The Incorrigible Democrat

[NJ_Lib]

48. Poor DBD...

... What, it's not hard enough being a musician?... Now I have to worry everytime my boyfriend is on stage? He has a gig tonight and I will not sleep until about five when he walks in the door...

This is so fucked up... To shoot people dead over a band breakup is just insanity...

Ah, America... The land of opportunity...

[makhno]

49. Wow

These guys turned me on to metal when I was a kid. This is fucked up news to wake up to. :(

[Harlan James]

51. I Work At His Record Label...

Set up a bunch of events with these guys. In-stores, after concert meet and greets, that sort of thing.

Darrell was a very sweet guy who responded to the devotion of his fans with humility and genuine feeling. In him those who rarely find a voice in this world found one, and for many of them he was far more than just another rock star. For his economically poor and disenfranchised fans (and that is where his most dedicated fans came from, the ones who took up the banner of Damageplan when everyone else just slipped away) Darrell represented an American dream that they could understand and believe in.

This is very bad news.

[flamingyouth]

70. That's a really nice tribute to him - thanks

[AllyCat]

125. Stupid NPR report

played the dumb reporter saying something about this kind of thing "usually not happening at this type of concert". So, what is "this type of concert" and does that mean it happens at OTHER types of concerts?

I've really reached the end of my rope with NPR I think. Yesterday, they reported the soldier asking a question after Rummy's invitation to ask questions as "talking back" as opposed to expressing a view.

They are turning into a Repub noisemachine...

[Frogtutor]

56. A Dallas radio station employee is counted among the dead;

called Mayhem. Apparently, this guy was a huge fan, and was hired by the band as security (very BIG guy) after the station was cancelled. Rumor has it that he threw himself on Dimebag (now I'm hearing that it was Vinnie he threw himself on) trying to protect him right after the shooting started. The gunman turned on him next.

[Frogtutor]

73. Correction

The news is reporting that the 5th victim (who has not been officially identified pending family contact) was another member of the band. The local (Dallas) radio station is hearing rumors that it was Mayhem, an occasional employee of the station.

[Frogtutor]

62. Shooter was a local guy from Marionsville (sp?), OH

I'm getting all this from the radio, so I don't know the spellings, but apparently the shooter was a 25-year-old guy named Nathan Gale.

[charlie]

65. Marysville

The article at the top is being updated as details come in.

Also dead:

Nathan Bray
Erin Halk

[slackmaster]

67. Any word on Mr. Gale's eligibility to even have a gun yet?

The smart money is usually on "he had a lengthy criminal record".

[Ripley]

71. Doubt it.

Marysville is a very small rural town. I used to live there. Other than Honda, nothing but farms and hunters. What kind of gun did he use?

[flamingyouth]

74. I expect we'll also hear "he was a loner"

And had a history of mental problems.

[slackmaster]

77. That's so often true

"Pretty much kept to himself. Never bothered anyone. The neighborhood kids liked him."

OTOH most violent crimes are committed by people with a history of violent crime.

[RedCon1]

127. He played football for a minor league team

He also had a minor criminal record in Marysville Ohio, home of Ohio's infamous Buckeye penitentiary but he didn't have a serious criminal record. From what I have heard, he sounds a lot like an anti-social personality disorder. This is what one would expect from such am individual too. Sadly, with all of the cuts in funding for treatment of the mentally ill, we can expect to see more of this type of thing in the future. Here in Texas, they're throwing all but the worst mental cases right out on to the streets. You take one of these people and give them some street drugs and there's no telling what they're liable to do.

[kitchen girl]

129. One minor correction..

Marysville is the home of the Ohio Women's Reformatory. The "infamous Buckeye penitentiary" you mentioned was located in downtown Columbus. They tore it down and built an arena for the Blue Jackets hockey team. The gunman was wearing a Blue Jackets jersey, according to witnesses.

And here in Ohio, we've been witnessing the wonders of deinstitutionalization for many years now. It really sucks.

:hi:

[RedCon1]

132. Right, my bad

I was thinking about Mansfield, the wonderful correctional facility that has been called home by more than a few of my friends and acquaintances from the past. I left my home in Ohio for the Army in 1997 out of fear of becoming more intimately acquainted with the aforementioned residence for recidivists and rehabilitation. It appeared to me that guarding prisoners was the fastest growing job market in the state and that seemed like a pretty dismal economic situation to me. When I left, I was unaware of the deinstitutionalization situation. It's all too prevalent here in Texas though. They just put em' on some Haldol or whatever the pharmaceutical company happens to be giving away that month and then toss em' back on the street where, after failing as beggars, they inevitably turn to crime, very often of a violent nature. This guy seriously sounds like an anti-social personality disorder though, probably diagnosed as a Conduct Disorder or Defiant Oppositional Disorder at the very least as a kid. It's little surprise that he became a lineman for a football team and eventually killed.

[Frogtutor]

64. Hope ya'll don't mind my frequent "updates"...

They're just doing almost minute-by-minute coverage, so I'm passing on the tidbits I hear.

[Nevernose]

72. Please, by all means continue (n/t)

[SheepyMcSheepster]

81. please keep them coming. nt.

[Nevernose]

68. Dimebag killed on the anniversary of John Lennon's murder

Fucking bizarre.

I'm gonna go listen to Cowboys From Hell and feel pissed off.
:evilfrown:

[Nevernose]

75. $20 says the shooter was high on meth

I've got twenty bucks that says the coroner's report says the shooter was high on meth at the time.

[slackmaster]

78. Good bet

And that would legally disqualify him from buying or even possessing a gun.

[Ripley]

79. How's that?

Do you explain what recreational drugs you use when you go to purchase a gun? Did you take a drug test when you bought one? Just because someone is high on meth, doesn't mean they have a record.

[slackmaster]

90. I'm just saying it's a matter of law - mechanisms to enforce it are weak

Do you explain what recreational drugs you use when you go to purchase a gun?

In a word, yes.

On the federal paperwork there is a question that asks whether you are addicted to or an illegal user of illegal drugs. You have to answer Yes or No in writing.

Did you take a drug test when you bought one?

No. AFAIK neither the federal government nor any of the states require a drug test. But lying on that form is a federal felony that carries a 5-year prison sentence. My point here is, will this killer, if he was high on meth, be prosecuted for violating that law as well as the murders? Probably not.

Just because someone is high on meth, doesn't mean they have a record.

True enough, but it's still illegal for someone who uses meth without a prescription to possess a gun.

FWIW the San Diego County Sheriff did a study several years ago that showed that more than 70% of people booked into jail tested positive for meth.

[Nevernose]

107. If he hadn't had a gun, Dimebag would still probably be alive

Illegal drug use or not. So what if he had a gun illegally? He still had a gun, and a crackhead with a gun is still what killed those people. If he had NOT had a gun, he probably wouldn't have tried anything; if he had, the dmage would probably not have been as severe.

We can make all these laws controling who can and can't have a gun. It's stupid. Taking them away would work a hell of a lot better.

[slackmaster]

108. "Taking them away" (from everyone???) isn't an option

:shrug:

[Nevernose]

111. Why not?

Wouldn't we be a hell of a lot better off? Why does our country not only have an infatuation with guns, but an infatuation with shooting each other? We couldn't take away every gun in America, but we could prohibit the sale of any new ones. It would take a while, fifty years would be my thinking, but eventually the amount of gun violence would be negligible. It's a democracy; let's change the constitution.

There are a host of other options, as well, perhaps equivalent to taking guns away. I saw a .38 in a pawn shop a few months ago for $35. I've spent more money going to the movies than that. Saturday night specials continue to be a serious problem. It may sound elitist, but when we tack a $1000 fee onto the purchase of any firearm, the people buying guns will probably be a hell of a lot more responsible.

And speaking of responsibility: mandatory trigger locks, gun safes, and safety classes. Cut down on accidents and stolen firearms. The 15 year old hoodlums robbing old ladies didn't buy their guns, they stole them from someone irresponsible (why did you leave that gun in your nightstand when you weren't home? self-defense?). And why do we only have safety classes for CCW permits? Why doesn't every gun owner have to have one.

The argument always made is "we already have gun laws, they're just not enforced." While this is true to a certain extent, what we NEED is seriously stringent gun laws. Not laws that increase penalties after the fact (as death penalty studies show, possible punishment does not affect prevention), but laws that will prevent as much gun violence as possible. What we have now in the way of gun laws in most states and federally is a serious mish-mash of compromises between liberals and conservatives, and are thus largely ineefective.

Note that at least part of my argument has been devil's advocate: I myself am a gun owner, and I don't seriously think we have the slightest chance of taking away people's guns, but SOMEthing has got to be done about this aspect of our culture. Other people don't kill each other like we do, and other people aren't as in love with death and destruction. It seems to me like an illness.

[DoNotRefill]

114. Because prohibition never works, and the results are worse...

than the disease.

I'm sure they thought when they banned pot, heroin, and cocaine that the supply in the US would quickly be used up, and that drug abuse would become a thing of the past. Somehow, it didn't quite work out that way.

There are around 300 MILLION firearms total in the US now. Even if we made them all disappear (ignoring the civil liberty aspect of such a move) criminals would still get guns. They can import hundreds if not thousands of tons of drugs each year, they could bring in guns the same way. And guns don't get snorted and consumed like drugs do.

I can't understand how, given the current (mis)administration, ANY sane person could want the government to have an absolute monopoly on the use of force. It just doesn't compute.

[DoNotRefill]

115. It's not just elitist....

"Saturday night specials continue to be a serious problem. It may sound elitist, but when we tack a $1000 fee onto the purchase of any firearm, the people buying guns will probably be a hell of a lot more responsible."

It's classist and borderline racist, too. Even the terminology you use stems from racism. The term "Saturday Night Special" was originally "Saturday Night N*****town Special", and comes from the fact that even the poorest african-american could afford one.

I have a problem with saying "only rich people can exercise their rights". That's what your $1000 fee says, and it's intellectually no different than advocating a $1000 poll tax.

[slackmaster]

116. The Genie is out of the bottle

Wouldn't we be a hell of a lot better off?

If it was possible, perhaps we would. But the condition of "no guns at all" hasn't existed since about the year 1340. They're really not that hard to make, and they last hundreds of years when properly cared for. Someone, e.g. police and military, will always need them therefore there will always be a chance theirs will be stolen and diverted to criminals.

A philosophy of taking all guns away from everyone, or just from civilians, or even just all handguns, would make a person unelectable to national public office. Therefore it's a self-defeating position. Too many people out there, myself included, would never support a candidate for President or Congress or statewide office who expressed that extreme view.

Why does our country not only have an infatuation with guns, but an infatuation with shooting each other?

I don't believe that we do have an infatuation with shooting each other. We have a problem with violent crime, which includes criminal misuse of firearms.

It may sound elitist, but when we tack a $1000 fee onto the purchase of any firearm, the people buying guns will probably be a hell of a lot more responsible.

<sarcasm on> You may be on to something there, since more violent crime is committed by poor people than affluent ones. <sarcasm off>

And speaking of responsibility: mandatory trigger locks, gun safes, and safety classes. Cut down on accidents and stolen firearms.

You're preaching to the choir on gun safety. I don't know anyone who doesn't believe in it. But screw trigger locks. They're next to useless, and certainly of no value to someone like me who keeps his guns locked up in a 1,200 pound safe guarded by lions (well, cats; but they're very vicious cats).



Public policy should encourage safe storage without dictating to every individual how to store their own property. Tax breaks for gun safe purchases would be one way to do this. Education about the dangers of unsecured guns and the cleverness of even your own "good" kids who you are sure would never pick up and play with a gun can go a long way too.

And why do we only have safety classes for CCW permits? Why doesn't every gun owner have to have one.

I think gun safety should be taught in public schools. Even people who don't ever plan to own a gun can benefit from the training.

I myself am a gun owner, and I don't seriously think we have the slightest chance of taking away people's guns, but SOMEthing has got to be done about this aspect of our culture.

Your previous hyperbole is forgiven. :toast:

[sendero]

128. I was thinking...

... the same thing. Either that or he was drunk off his ass.

[Nevernose]

131. Drunks usually shoot their wives and neighbors;

It takes a real tweaker to walk up on stage and kill a rock star (assuming he wasn't mentally ill before he took the drugs, which would be a whole other story).

[sendero]

135. You.....

.... got a point there my friend :)

[RealLiberal4U]

76. Sad n/t

[trillian]

82. My daughter called me about this last night.

She and her husband were in a state because they knew people who were there, In fact my son in law was supposed to be there. He plays drums in a couple of Columbus bands and he knew one of the bands playing there last night. This morning they are still trying to get details but feel they would have heard if their friends were on the casualty list.

[judaspriestess]

83. SHIT DAMNIT NOOOOOOO

Back in 94 I saw Pantera at a small venue in San Antonio, it was a pre-release show for Far Beyond Driven, it was unadvertised and tix were $10 bucks. I got to go backstage and I smoked a ***** with Pantera. It was awesome, I still have the backstage pass. That was one of the six times I saw them.


DAMN IT, I JUST SAW THAT SAME SHOW ABOUT A MONTH AGO HERE IN VEGAS, THEY ARE TOURING WITH SHADOWS FALL.

NO, NO, NO, NO..........
THIS WAS MY FIRST TIME SEEING DAMAGE PLAN.

What the fuck is wrong with people. I know people were pissed about Pantera breaking up but to go to this extreme?
I am so lucky I got to see dimebag with damageplan.
Rest in Peace man.

[Frogtutor]

86. Is the press conference over, or going on now?

I don't know what timezone it was supposed to be; I would think the radio station would broadcast it live, if possible, though...

[Frogtutor]

87. The Edge (Dallas rock station) has already put together a

live memorial broadcast for tonight. It will be from Vinnie's strip club, called The Clubhouse, in Dallas. I went to the Clubhouse's web site (which really doesn't have anything on it), and they have Dimebag's name as "Dimebag DAVE"; how stupid is that? I mean, this place was their major hangout, you'd think they could get his name right...The Edge is playing Pantera right now...

[Im_Your_Huckleberry]

88. my guess is he wouldn't have wanted to go out any other way.

well, except maybe old age.

[Frogtutor]

89. They're asking radio listeners to NOT go to Dimebag and wife's house;

Apparently, they're being swamped with people. The family has asked to be left alone, and given their privacy, no disrespect toward fans intended.

[Harlan James]

94. Tower Records In Dallas Now Has A Remembrance Book To Sign

Tower Records in Dallas hosted a huge instore for Damageplan when the record came out. They have now set up a remembrance book for people to sign.

Tower is located at 3707 Lemmon Avenue, Dallas 75219

[Megahurtz]

92. This is unbelievably crazy

And so, so sad.
Do we have to watch our backs now everytime we go to a club?
Does anybody know what this guy's reason for doing this was?
Why are they keeping this quiet?
Somebody must know something?

[genieroze]

95. WTF

:wtf:

[ellie]

103. That is absolutely terrible

What the fuck is wrong with people?

[judaspriestess]

104. Also at the Vegas Damage Plan show

there was this dude in particular standing in front of me and my boyfriend and he was yelling shit like:
"dude where the fuck is Phil" "Pantera" "Bring back fucking Phil" and other crap I can't remember. Point is there were apparantely alot of pissed off people about Pantera breaking up.
I've been listening to Cowboys from Hell which I had not heard in a while.
I love the song from Damage Plan "Fuck You"

[rocktivity]

106. Portrait of the young murderer as a mysteriously discharged Marine

DIMEBAG's Killer Had Quick Temper, Served In Marines

:headbang:
rocknation

[Chovexani]

112. RIP Dimebag

This fucking sucks. :cry:

[cedahlia]

121. This is so awful

I am so stunned right now. We have a Guitar magazine with Dimebag on the cover that's been sitting on our kitchen table for a couple weeks now...I've passed by it several times and thought that I should put it away with the rest of mr. cedahlia's Guitar magazines. Think I'll leave it alone for now. :(

Ugh...this is just so bad, I can't even wrap my head around it.

RIP Darrell, and all the other victims of this senseless disgusting act.

[libpunkmom]

126. My mom talked to Mr Abbott

this morning. (Old family friends) The entire family is just in horrible shape right now. Mr. Abbott says that Vinnie wasn't hurt (physically). Mr Abbott said that he was amazed at how many fans his son had, he also said that it made him realize that more than just family and friends would always remember Darrell. I will be flying home for the funeral.

[Withywindle]

130. I've been speechless all day...

...How horrifying.

I'm not going to go off on a rant about guns....if I ranted I guess it would be about our culture of violence and no impulse control and why so many people don't seem to have that kind of switch in their brains that makes most people realize it is never never never ever ever OK to take someone's life over some stupid fucking GRUDGE, because you are not just hurting THEM, you're devastating everyone who's ever loved that person. It would also be about how many people in this country have serious and dangerous mental problems and never ever see anything resembling treatment.

RIP, Dimebag Darrell. Condolences to his family and friends and fans.


Alrosa Villa? I went there a couple times when I was in college in Ohio. Saw Nick Cave there, of all people. They had popcorn machines then, and foosball.

[L.A.dweller]

133. OK, OK. Let's all calm down here...

The distraught emotions here don't warrant the comparisons of this
to the shooting of John Lennon.
But maybe that's another thread.

[charlie]

134. You oughta wrap that admonishment in something airtight

and stow it in a cool and dark place where it'll stay fresh. Then you'll be all set for the day a thread pops up where people do make comparisons to the shooting of John Lennon.

[Imagevision]

138. Guns don't kill people?...