Group seeks law to fight 'liberal bias' at colleges (Indiana)

[salin]

Group seeks law to fight 'liberal bias' at colleges

Students want Indiana Legislature to take action against leftist professors
By Steve Hinnefeld, Herald-Times Staff Writer
December 21, 2004

A debate over academic freedom on college campuses could reach the Indiana General Assembly in the 2005 session that starts next month.

The national organization Students for Academic Freedom is calling on lawmakers to adopt what it calls an academic bill of rights to protect students from indoctrination by leftist professors.

But Indiana University officials say they are leery of anything that involves the Legislature in telling professors how to teach their classes.

---snip---

Students for Academic Freedom, an offshoot of conservative activist David Horowitz's Center for the Study of Popular Culture, uses Web sites and other methods to expose what it deems liberal bias on campuses.

It's asking Indiana legislators to adopt the bill of rights in response to a dispute in which a Ball State University student accused a professor of promoting anti-war and anti-government views in the classroom.


more: (registration required)
http://www.heraldtimesonline.com/stories/2004/12/21/news.1221-HT-A1_PJR42837.sto?printf=1

Note - the story indicates that the "bill of rights" was written by Horowitz... and the story tries to make it sound benign... but then ties to the story of targeting specific professors on a website... and it gets more and more creep.

Folks, this trend of taking it to the legislature is troublesome on numerous fronts - and in Indiana the legislature (and governorship) just turned repub... so it could be "friendly." 1) It shows how emboldened these folks are becoming to try to use the laws to legislate their viewpoints. (remember when they liked small government? Guess that only applies when democrats are in power.) 2) Despite their language of seeking a free exchange of ideas - they are seeking to CHILL academic discourse. One of their complaints against a professor at Ball State is that he sponsors a peace group on campus... get it - they are going after non-mandatory activities.

[livinginphotographs]

1. "Students for Academic Freedom???!!!"

Their name is double-plus ungood.

[salin]

3. ironic name, eh? n/t

[DBoon]

8. "freedom is slavery"

eom

[drscm]

32. Typical Rightwing Wacko Doublespeak....

They will soon be working for the current administration who has redefined the English language to fit their policies: Clear Black Skies, Healthy Deforested Forests, Operation "Kill the" Iraqui(s)Freedom.

[HughBeaumont]

2. "We Run EVERYTHING, but Never Forget WE are the VICTIMS!"

Assholes. Unbelieveable.

[MemphisTiger]

11. very well put

They act like we are keeping them down but they run the congress, white house, supreme court, and most states. Yet, we are keeping them down. Give me a break

[Dyedinthewoolliberal]

100. You last three posters

have it right on the mark! I am reading a book by Thomas Franks called "What's the matter with Kansas? He points out exactly what you are saying. Even though the conservative right controls everything, they are always painting themselves as victims......

[salin]

101. heard a short bit on "Christian" (radical right) radio

that explained this mentality to me. It seems that for the conditions for the "End Times" to start is that Christians are under persecution for their beliefs. Thus the mentality of being besieged even when the "attack" is simply trying to prevent them from forcing their beliefs (by codifying them) on all others.

[tom_paine]

25. The same mentality of ALL Totalitarians

However, the image of a Nazi kicking a"Jewish Oppressor" to death in the yard of Auschwitz is for me (a Jew) and enduring image of the Bushevik mindset.

[clownskull]

4. Par For the course

This is just the beginning...

[Stuckinthebush]

5. Folks, if this happens then it is an ominous sign

Academic freedom for professors is sacrosanct. Once you start regulating how they teach, then it is all over for us liberals.

The question that these idiotic conservatives fail to ask is, "Why are so many professors liberal?" The answer is obvious if you are willing to see it. The more education one has, the more they are able to critically analyze their world. Academic discourse depends on critical analysis, therefore, the discourse in a classroom is naturally critical. A rigid, conservative liberal arts professor is not worth much. Sure, many of the math and engineering professors I have worked with are more conservative, but that is because their academic disciplines don't require the same type of analysis. The vast majority of individuals with Ph.D.s are progressive because they have been trained to be thinkers.

Attention other American Universities! Get ready for an influx of applications from Indiana academics.

Attention Indiana residents! Get ready for an influx of useless degrees from unaccredited Indiana universities.

[salin]

9. Agreed on all fronts...

notice, however, they never make mention of the conservative institutios and departments such as the econ dept at U of Chicago, or the dept of Middle East studies at Princeton. Oh, no... academic "freedom" as defined by these jokers is only about promoting rigid, nonthinking, close eyes to conflicting evidence, conservatism.

[Stuckinthebush]

14. Have you experienced more hostile students lately?

The ones with their arms crossed in front of their chests? The ones that whisper to their friends in the back row when issues such as race, gender, and class are discussed? The ones that will regurgitate what they have written in their notes, but will not take a single step toward integrating the information into their already developed world view? The ones that are being told by FOX news and Ann Coulter that the "liberal" professors are dangerous?

These children are getting very little from their college education and I blame the conservative noise machine for helping to close their minds.

[salin]

16. No longer in that game

so I don't ecounter these students. However I have heard first hand accounts at to Indiana Us (IU and Purdue) and my alma mater (little conservative DePauw) that student views had grown increasingly anti-bush. In red state Indiana. Would guess that the Horowitz group would blame "lefties" on faculty - but Purdue (nor DePauw) do not have repututations for having a particular liberal faculty. Would guess instead that the influence of kids who actually have access to more media than fox (many chicago transplants at these Us and even the conservative Chicago Tribune has been critical of bushco policies (relatively speaking) since the Enron implosion era...

[Stuckinthebush]

17. That is good news, at least

If the anti-Bush trend can be generalized to other universities, then the noise from the Horowitz group could be just that - noise.

They are good at generating lots and lots of noise.

[theorist]

76. As a graduate student here at IU Bloomington, I'd have to agree.

Bloomington is a very liberal town for Indiana. It must be that the flagship state university is here. There is a very active chapter of the College Democrats, and Monroe County Dems do very well in local elections.

I have to admit, though, that I am in a science department, so I don't get to hear all the debates firsthand, but we rarely get any conservative speakers compared to the few liberals who are invited. Many of the scientists here are very nervous about the funding situation--especially the biologists.

I'm not too worried about Horowitz's little game. The current president of Indiana University is a real ballbreaker, so he'll make it clear to the new Governor that any attempted implementation of something the like the above legislation will be flatly ignored. It'll be great.

[BiggJawn]

98. Ah, but the new Governor is a real "Ball Breaker", too.

Martin Jische has brought a lot of money into Purdue, but when it comes to getting his expected state funding, he gets ignored and short-changed.
I don't see the state funding picture improving under "Our Bitch Mitch", even with Joe Micon pitching for Purdue in the statehouse.

And then there was that ludicrous "study" chaired by the former CEO of Reilly Tar and Chemical that said that both IU and PU needed to get out of the under-grad business and concentrate on Research. The kind of stuff that brings in corporate money...

[theorist]

103. From what I've read about Our Bitch Mitch,

he's exactly that--a bitch. He just came in on the coattails of **. Pres. Adam Herbert of IU is a bushite, but I don't think he'll go along with dismantling the basic tenets of academia. If he does, there will be a serious problem at this campus. It would be an interesting question to ask at the next public appearance he makes on campus.

[Rambis]

6. Zieg Heil

It is getting scary in this country folks in case you hadn't noticed.


"In Germany they came first for the Communists, and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist. Then they came for the Jews, and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Jew. Then they came for the trade unionists, and I didn't speak up because I was not a trade unionist. Then they came for the Catholics, and I didn't speak up because I was Protestant. Then they came for me, and by that time no one was left to speak up." Martin Neimoller

[underpants]

7. *GASP*"anti-war and anti-government views "

First of all-was this professor right about being anti-war? Answer:YES

Second, I thought being anti-government was a consrevative staple?
Answer:I am right again.

So apparently they want to limit freedom of speech/discussion. Doesn't sound very Amercan to me but then conservatives favored the crown not the revolutionaries.

[salin]

10. Indy Star also covers the story (with no registration)

http://www.indystar.com/articles/4/203781-8754-102.html

Appears to be the same story - though the biline is dropped. Anyone wanting to read the story without registering should check it out.

[neverforget]

12. freedom with their exception. Next will be outlawing liberals.

Fascism is on the march! I can hear the jackboots marching to burn the books and "re-educate" the "liberals".

[depakid]

13. How to best acomplish this?

First, we'll need to deal with those most disciminatory tests- the SAT's, the GRE's LSAT and MCATS. They weed out "conservatives."

Next, we'll need to pay professors commensurate with their value in the private sector. Not sure how to do this without raising taxes- Maybe we ought to float some bonds. Borrowing = Good.

Finally, we'll need to eliminate some disciplines from the curricula. Can't have sociology- that's for sure- can't have a bunch of leftist books, either- so we'll have to curtail English lit- especially lit criticism- because someone will surely mention derrida or :gasp: Foucalt.

Oh, man- this is already giving me a headache.

Let's just cut to the chase do away with colleges period and give out honorary far right loyalty degrees instead- that would be so much easier and less expensive....

[0007]

15. Gotta whip them pagan heathens into good right wingers, don't we?

William Bennett & Lynne Cheney made the circuit to most all Universities taking names and blackballing professors that weren't to their liking. So it doesn't indeed surprise me that working on those rowdy Indians is a priority.

[gnofg]

18. Horowitz and Bennett

Horowitz was very radical and Bennett was considering joining SDS in the sixties. They are now very conservative. I am always suspicious of people who are so radical because if and when they switch they go completely the opposite way. I always take it as they really have no firm foundation of principles and ethics and can never find a center.

[salin]

20. that is generous

I take it as opportunism and seeking "power"... nation moves right - and so do they... pure and simple cynics view.

[American Tragedy]

26. I dubbed this "Whittaker Chambers Syndrome" a few years ago in an essay

These are people who were once socialists or communists, and now have swung dramatically to the right. They have fragile, unstable belief systems and are driven to extremes, rather like the libertine personalities who suddenly become 'born again' Christians.

People like Horowitz have a distorted perception of the entire opposite side of the political spectrum. They have only known the most radical aspect of it and consider that to be indicative of all leftists, because they lack the capacity to judge beyond their own narrow range of experience.

[gnofg]

44. agree

They are weirdos and have essentially no belief system.

[placton]

84. Ole Karl said it best:

"religion is the opiate of the masses." Does quoting him make me a commie, too?

[ClarkUSA]

57. Same with Ken Blackwell

Young radicals often turn into old conservatives. The ego gratification, recognition from peers, payoffs in terms of acceptance...no real center,
as you said. Just peripheral gratification for most.

[RuleofLaw]

19. Same as in China

Why not call it what it is. a witch hunt of the intellectuals.

Most dictatorships do the same thing. Go after the intellectuals, the thinkers, the ones who can explain to the masses what is going on. Most people still revere a smart person and will listen to them. By going after the intellectuals, they are trying to silence the opposition and prevent critical thinking. Its a long term goal.

[brentspeak]

21. I have a question about David Horowitz

Who are the morons who take seriously the word of a man who proclaims it took him 25 YEARS to "figure out" he was on the wrong side of the political spectrum? If his prior politcs were so horrendously wrong as he says they were, wouldn't it take an otherwise intelligent person 25 minutes to figure it all out?

[gnofg]

22. Horowitz

The idiots are just that idiots. Horowitz on the other hand is just a weirdo. I believe he is a man who doesn't have a firm foundation underneath him Almost like an unloved child seeking approval.

[QC]

33. Horowitz is still a Stalinist at heart,

just like he was way back when. He might have changed his politics, but he still thinks like a Stalinist, still has the Stalinist's perspective on truth, etc.

[NJmaverick]

23. These are the kind of tactics we need to adapt

We need to become as ruthless and efficient as the repukes or this country will be destroyed. The scary thing is I am sure this is the kind of program Hitler would have approved of. Still we need to do what we can to eliminate right wing indoctrination be rush limbaugh, faux news and the rest of the right wing media.

[Canuckistanian]

24. Why don't they just start their own universities?

With courses like "Foreclosures 101", "Creation Science Physics" and "The Myth of World Hunger"?

I'll tell you why, because any graduate of that university would only be fit to start a radio talk show, that's why.

[American Tragedy]

27. Ever heard of Liberty University? Bob Jones?

[bloom]

30. They could go to the "Bush School"

if all they wanted was to make sure THEY were getting the conservative viewpoint in school.

http://bush.tamu.edu/

(There is also a creationist grad school near San Diego).

They want to get rid of critical thinking as it concerns politics, sociology, biology, or anything else - for everybody and replace it with "we must all follow the Republican line".

The suppression of intellectuals is one of the most frightening "movements" of our time.

I liked the one professors point that if all classes were going to be balanced or something - they would have to teach peace studies as part of military history/strategy classes. (That would be the day).

[tsuki]

94. It would be like Pensacola Christian University, non-accredited. They

must take over accredited schools. But the little red book...no.

[BurgherHoldtheLies]

28. More Republican Noise, just like the Merry Christmas hoopla.

This is all just nonsense to stir up the zealots and anger the Democrats. Ignore this crap that is blasting from the likes of Fox. They can't MAKE all of us watch Nascar, listen to country music, reject Harvard/Yale/Princeton and go to church.

when I start to get angry about some nonsense MSM story, I keep telling myself: They can't make me stupid. They can't make me stupid. They can't make me stupid.

[bloom]

31. I don't think it is just noise - because they are managing to intimidate

professors.

I'm afraid we might need a counter movement just to keep things as they are.


http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=5444

http://www.danielpipes.org/comments/2707

http://www.campus-watch.org/article/id/200

[BurgherHoldtheLies]

35. Where are these people's spines????

Seriously, what is all this cowering in a corner crap?!?!? The 'left' should stop being apologetic and defensive and just dismiss these idiots outright...use the 'elite' label to their advantage.

Instead of aspiring to the LOWEST denominator in this country, let's stop being apologetic for intelligence and reasoning. Let's get on the offense.

[bloom]

38. It is a sad day when

people have to speak up about free speech and (true) academic freedom.

But just like the ladies who were arrested for wearing t-shirts at a Bush* rally that said "Protect our Civil Rights" or something - I think the day is here. And it wouldn't hurt to support the people under seige.

[BurgherHoldtheLies]

43. I do support them but I am really starting to question some things.

For instance, this nonsense about the 'attack on Christmas' started on Fox and is now being picked up by CNN and MSNBC. This nonsense about 'liberal bias' in universities seems like more noise to me. It's a way to keep the zealots engaged in politics since the election is over while keeping Dems and social liberals on the defensive.

I think we should just get a classic Bill Murray smart-ass expression on all of our faces and dismiss these idiot noise-makers as not worthy of our consideration.

What it comes down to: There isn't a GOOD parent in this world that wouldn't give a limb to get their kid(s) into one of those Ivy League elite schools.

[bloom]

50. I think the Students for Academic Slavery

ARE like FOX stories in the way that something is made out of something that SHOULD be nothing.

I also think it is the Swift Boat Liars and cannot be passed off as having no effect.

Also - they are not just attacking Ivy League schools - but virtually any University - at least any public one.

[salin]

52. This isn't just about rhetoric

if it were, I would agree with you.

This is about trying to take it to the state house and enact LAW. That, is a much more bold proposition.

Because on the surface it is packaged "nicely" (sounds hard to fight, right? "Freedom" and all that jazz), the newly repub majority in the statehouse is likely to fall in line. There is fear of the mobilized limbaughish right on the local level in many parts of the state. (State wide races are another thing altogether, where moderate repubs are needed to get the $$ backing of the rockerfeller repubs who are the real power structure in the state.)

Last session a major player house repub (who never struck me as far right) was pushing for a constitutional ban to gay marriage (there is already a law on the books preventing gay marriage... but what the hey)... and he was quoted from the floor of the House as saying this was the SINGLE most important issue facing hoosiers. Not declining access to health care. Not continued job losses. Not the impact of increasing fuel costs on area farmers... but a constitutional amendment on an issue that was already settled by law.

This isn't about demonizing the ivys this is about legislating professors at Indiana U, Purdue U., Ball State U., Indiana State U., and a host of other colleges in the state.

[placton]

85. I disagree

Kerry ignored, in the long Democratic tradition, the obvious lies and bullshit of the Swift Boaters. We ignore this stuff at our peril - the masses figger "no answer means agreement"

[BurgherHoldtheLies]

88. Not ignore or apologize...just answer with indignation and contempt. nt

[tsuki]

95. Because they have to mob mentality, they can raise a group

to burn a cross quicker than one would believe.

[sandnsea]

51. Oh no, not true

That's what we said about Rush back in the 80's. That's what we said about creationism. Who's have thought pharmacists would refuse to fill birth control pills? Who'd have thought they'd take over CNN?? No, we laughed our way right into this mess I think. Time to fight this stuff, especially when they're talking about the legislature.

[BurgherHoldtheLies]

65. Fight with a condescending expression then.

I understand what you are saying and you have a point about not ignoring. But what I'm saying is that the Dems should counter these people on talk shows using intellectuals with smart-ass attitudes who put these idiots in their place. Bottom line: If the majority of people in Indiana want to force out the intellectuals, they will be left with sub-par public universities for their children. I'm sure that universities in California, New York, Pennsylvania, etc. would welcome the banished Indiana professors.

Also, the harder they try to control their young people, the more likely they will rebel. As much as the zealots think they can, they cannot control minds.

[salin]

66. Case in point

my fairly conservative brother in law, caught the cspan show (many months ago) with ORielly and Ivans... he thought Ivans (who can be snide) sounded intelligent and liked what she had to say (the populist that she is) and though ORielly sounded silly and increasingly shrill.

[BurgherHoldtheLies]

67. Yaaa! Calm, condescension against shrill, raving lunacy nt

[BiggJawn]

99. I understand.

I wonder if the Regents, Boards, etc. at our universities understand?

Purdue wants to attract more and better faculty. they have a program to double the amount of professorships, and get the profs actually in the lecture halls TEACHING, instead of pulling down their salaries while a $6-an-hour TA does the grunt work. (I'll believe that when I see it!)

The way I see it, these schools better get their shit together or they're going to start hearing "I'd LOVE to come to Purdue to teach, but not if your local mouthbreathers are going to burn me at the stake if I say the 'wrong' thing..."

Enough of that kind of response to invitations to join the faculty, and I could imagine some important people getting some phone calls.

[MisterP]

29. ah yes, the "Academic Freedom" gang outlawing teachers' opinion

wasn't that what they kept bawling political correctness would do?

[hippiechick]

34. Leftist Professors in Indiana ?

BWAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAAAAA !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



:hippie:

[BurgherHoldtheLies]

36. Laughable, isn't it. Much ado about NOTHING. Noise, noise, noise. nt

[WMliberal]

37. good luck finding intellectual conservatives to balance it.

like i've said before, I thought we had a decent mix at W&M, when liberals only outnumbered conservative professors about 3-1.

A population of conservative intellectuals (in the numbers needed to fulfill their goals) just doesn't exist. The more one is educated, the more likely they are to be liberal. Groups like this- although this is by far the funniest name I've ever heard- act like there's some class of people being denied jobs for being conservative...

[salin]

53. They want affirmative action in hiring of professors

who cares if the degrees are from lesser prestige U.s or that the research credentials are weak compared to other candidates... they must give equal opportunity to the conservative guy.

That is how we should frame this - pro affirmative action (how will it be judged... quotas in hiring and promotion?)

[WMliberal]

61. oh, of course. It's no different than their views on states' rights.

It'd be even more fun if they collectively support affirmative action in this case, but still oppose it in every other. More fun on top of that when they don't see what we mean when they think it's perfectly consistent.

[KansDem]

39. This statement about blew my mind!

Horowitz' criticism came after student Brett Mock complained to the group that professor George Wolfe used the course to advocate for nonviolent activism and did not fairly acknowledge military force as an alternative.

What! "Military force as an alternative?" To what??? These nutcases sound an awful lot like the "Give war a chance" nutcases that came out of the woodwork during the Iraq invasion...

[Bridget Burke]

47. If the students really want to understand "military force".....

They might find direct study more useful. Why accept what any professor says when real-world experience awaits?

[KansDem]

63. This reminds me of a forum I attended shortly before the invasion...

Two speakers from the Kansas City-Iraq Task Force gave their views as to why the invasion was wrong (no WMDs, Saddam supported by US Administrations and gave him WMDs, etc). One speaker had actually toured (hiked) across a significant part of Iraq and stayed with the people...

Afterwards, there was a discussion. One young male student ranted on and on about how we (US) should go in a take out Saddam. He said he would be willing to enlist, but wanted to finish college first (I estimated he was about 18-20 years old as this forum took place on a community college campus). So apparently, with some of these students, war is an alternative so long as someone else does the "alternativizing."

[salin]

55. wasn't the class about nonviolence?

so students who don't agree with the p.o.v. don't have to take the course!

[DS1]

40. Leftism comes from learning history

IMO, so we should just bomb the libraries and be done with it.

[jukes]

41. why

don't they just go to Bob Jones "University" to learn the bigotry they already know?

[GOPBasher]

42. My God, they will stop at nothing.

[lovuian]

45. Going after the Colleges is the last bastion of Freedom

Its got to educate our children on Conservatism!!!

[salin]

70. Phylis Schaffley says: schools should not teach students

to think!

Seriously this was a big push of her org in the eighties... see teaching kids critical thinking was teaching them to disobey their parents....

[found object]

46. academic freedom defined

this link does a good job of describing academic freedom and the history of: http://www.rbs2.com/afree.htm

[Dr Batsen D Belfry]

48. I'll be sure to come down to Bloomington

and burn my diploma in front of the CHancellor's house when this happens.

This is utter bullshit. College is like cable tv. The students are paying to attend. If they don't like the politics, don't pay and don't attend.

DBDB

[salin]

56. or don't take a particular class... or join a particular student

group.

[shawn703]

49. Oh boo hoo

You don't hear us complain about the conservative bias in the military. They can have repuke professors when we can have progressive drill instructors.

[wpbpete78]

54. there are plenty of rightwing professors

Has anyone EVER had a leftist for Economics? My alma mater Northwood University is notoriously right wing.

[salin]

58. wouldn't call my father a "leftist"

but my late father was a Keynesian economist and a liberal. He was a WWII vet who was against the Vietnam war. But to todays radical right, he might have been considered a "leftist". Glad he is missing this particular saga (he passed a number of years ago.)

[tiredofthisstuff]

59. I Like The Pretty Lights!

Long since the days of my own self induced comas, have I searched for a way to emulate that very feeling. Well it looks like my search is over :-). All I need to do is except Jesus as my lord and savor, hate everybody, work to lessen constitutional rights, and play with myself. I feel that if I commit to these actions I will feel what these republicans feel (A Self Induced Coma)

[ProfessorGAC]

60. Unbelievable

This is particularly galling since my experience is that there is a fairly obvious and predictable dispersion of political thought on campus. The idea that there is a preponderance of liberal thought in academia is ridiculous.

It's definitely true that there is a majority status for liberals amongst academics, but it's not 10 to 1 or any such nonsense promoted in the media. That's just preposterous!

Besides, if a liberal professor is encouraging debate and thought, well that professor is doing his/her job. There's more than imparting knowledge. It's also a prof's job to impart critical thought processes. Agreeing with everything a professor says does little to encourage self-examination.

Lastly, waht is this ridiculous "indoctrination" thing. These are supposed to be COLLEGE STUDENTS! It would seem that they simply DON'T BELONG IN COLLEGE if they can be indoctrinated by the opinions of a professor in 4 hours per week. That would be indicative of having an incredibly weak mind, which means the issue is moot. These morons don't belong in college to begin with if that is the case.

We could eliminate this whole thing by raising the bar for admissions for middle class white people.

The Professor

[VegasWolf]

62. "Intellectual Conservatives" to balance. Isn't that term an oxymoron?

[ElaineinIN]

64. This hits home for me

as my husband teaches at one of the schools mentioned in this thread. My experience is that the academic community does tend to be more liberal -- we here may think this is a good thing. My husband is not a liberal-- I would call him a non-wacky liberterian--economically conservative, socially liberal, not an isolationist. Voted for * first time around; voted for Kerry this time. I know that we tend to group all Repubs around here as uniformly evil and stupid, but there are thoughtful people who just believe differently than we do on all issues. In general, most of the people he words with he has no problem with, even if they differ politically, although I will admit he has run into problems with some more liberal faculty who are more doctrinaire in their approach.

My husband tries very hard to keep his personal views out of what he teaches... and he teachs in a subject area where they could come up from time to time. He emphasizes critical thinking... he wants them to be able to make a thoughtful arguement, and not just agree for no reason, even if it conflicts with his personal view.
I'm just guessing, but I'd bet my husband would be greatly against this, as, liberal or conservative, giving anyone the a "right" to have this or that is a bad thing, especially in mandating what it taught. Most professors are already walking a fine line on a lot of things --students sue all the time for a variety of things -- and this will just make it worse.

[salin]

69. Hi Elaine!

To my experience, there has always been a variety of views on campus.

My guess is that it would be increasingly difficult to be a moderate repub around b-ton, given the local takeover by the Bud Bernit and Scott Tibbs of the world. Funny things is that most actual repubs in the area are not knuckle draggers... but this little cabal is so virulent, and atrocious, that even locally it gets tempting to lump them all as ignorant and evil.... then I work the local polls with local repub precinct officials and remember - that most are decent folks who are pretty middle of the road.

per the university atmosphere, if I recall a number of folks jumped to the defense of the bschool professor who proclaimed that gay folks shouldn't be involved in businesses (or run them, or something along those lines)... there was a student protest of the prof and his website. Most academics that I know thought the prof was over the line and his views were awful, but they seemed to stop short of - and even defended against censorship. I think the final line (there was an initial reprimand, and then some back peddling when even the "liberals" decried academic freedom for the jerk) was that the prof had to affirm that these were his views and not endorsed by the U, and he may have been required to take items that crossed into the "hate" area off of his U owned website.

[ElaineinIN]

73. It varies...

While there are a number of views on campus, I think it really varies by Department. When I was in school at Boston U. there was a huge fight between the poli sci folks --home of Howard Zinn and Betty Zisk, a Quaker and American Green -- and the International Relations Dept., which had huge ties to various military, industrial, intel agentices, etc.. At IU, for example, I know that the Geography department is pretty much still Marxist while Central Eurasian studies is pretty convervative, being staffed in part by many Hungarians who left after 1956. Because the Departments are pretty much in charge of selecting who they hire, its easier for them to become homogenous, and you need to have a sense of the Department--or at least the chair and the hiring committee--when you interview.

I think you are right, though, that academic freedom is a rallying cry for all of them... unlike our current administration, it is easier for them to see that, at least in theory, tides turn and the minority can become the majority...and rules that benefit you now may burden you later!

As for Bloomington, my husband struggles. I think the vast majority of the Repubs in town are pretty moderate, and I think pretty highly of David Sabbaugh, but the party--like everywhere else--is being overrun by highly active, highly vocal knuckle draggers. But the Dems are pretty left too and some weren't particuarly interested in perceived "moderate" democrats during the primary. So most are in the middle, and the parties are at the fringes... sounds like a lot of the country!

[ElaineinIN]

87. One more thing...

Upon discussion of this thread, my husband makes the point that Indiana will never attract another well known academic, ever, if this passes.

[salin]

93. indeed!

they would get the Lilly bio money... and then get no new researchers to do the cutting edge work that is hoped to both forward science and to boost the region's economy.

[iamjoy]

68. What About The Conservative Bias In Churches?

seriously, for the time being (Dubya & Co want to change it) they can't directly endorse political candidates and remain tax exempt. But many of them are so obviously biased Conservative, they might as well just tell the parisioners to vote for Dubya when they spend weeks talking about abortion like it is the greatest moral violation ever, etc & then tell people to vote their religious morals

[underpants]

72. Now now there is no tax payer money going INTO* the churches

*it just never leaves, see the difference?

[iamjoy]

75. Good Point

but what about these so called faith based initiatives?

[underpants]

78. Faith based initiatives aren't really new it just that no one trusts W

Clinton actually started the faith based initiatives and one of the things they did was to relocate refugees. There are tons of refuges in the Shenandoah Valley of Va. for instance and a whole Russian enclave near Waynesboro (I think).

W is using them to supplant the social service network now in place only you will have to adopt the religion (Baptist preferably) in order to receive any services.

[phusion]

71. These paragraphs sum up the group's motivations...

"Just last month, Horowitz wrote an article in an online journal accusing the head of the Ball State University's center for peace and conflict studies of supporting terrorism.

Horowitz' criticism came after student Brett Mock complained to the group that professor George Wolfe used the course to advocate for nonviolent activism and did not fairly acknowledge military force as an alternative."

Those of us in the universities need to stop this group from advancing their fascist agenda. Start organizing now...

[tsuki]

96. Naming, attacking, naming, attacking...it is hit and run.

[janx]

74. It's Indiana's turn now, eh?

We just went through this in Colorado. All they need is a network of fundamentalist college students and some local politicians to make this a real pain in the neck.

And it's not completely over here, though they didn't pass the law they wanted to pass initially. Higher education is still being watched.

I like to think of this as the David Horowitz movement. These stories crop up as being state concerns, but don't believe it--it's national.

[BurgherHoldtheLies]

77. It'll be tough to pull this crap in Ivy League/NE/WCoast blue states. nt

[salin]

79. I dunno... Ward Connerly started his schtick

with the University of California system. Private schools like Stanford started getting even more of the cream of the crop because the ensuing climate on UC campuses were perceived to be so hostile.

[BurgherHoldtheLies]

80. Public universities lose the smart and rich kids. Dumbasses. nt

[salin]

81. why do you think U of Mich fought so hard in court?

They are one of the few public schools that compete with the ivys of the U world.

[janx]

82. Don't be too sure.

It's easier to pull it off in any of the state schools. Colorado is not that red. The only necessary ingredients are those I listed in my post, above.

Believe me, I saw it happen here. A local politician or two can really raise a stink in the state legislature and the state college system. And state colleges and universities are among some of the best we have.

What really angers me is that anyone teaching in higher ed who is any good is not going to inject his/her politics into the minds of students. His/her job is to teach the subject matter and critical thinking methods, period.

[iconoclastNYC]

83. Sell fear of a one party state.

Is this not something that we leverage the get the nonthinking population to taking a deeper look at the Right's move slide to one-party state fascism?

If we had an O'Reily, Limbaugh or Hannity this would be something they'd be screaming about.

If it was the left trying to purge Universities of Right Wing thought, they'd be hammering us with it.

I hope Air America picks this up. I have a feeling "Unfiltered" might pick this up.

[imaginary girl]

86. I am an instructor at an Indiana college. Geez, am I in for it!

[rodeodance]

89. best warch your step! (this is no way to live)

[IHeart1993]

90. I attended St. Mary's College in Indiana...

....as an undergraduate. For those who don't know, that's the women's college across the street from Notre Dame. Anyway, SMC is very liberal. My senior year, I even took a class called Issues in Sustainablily II. (This was in the Spring 2002 semester, BTW). The class introduced me to alterative media. That should be a required course for all majors. More conservativism would kill classes like that.
But then again, SMC is a liberal arts college.

Liberal arts :think:

[SemperEadem]

91. students, without a degree, are not qualified to tell a professor

who does have degrees, what they may or may not teach. If they have such a problem with what they're being taught, they need to attend Bob Jones University.. or Falwell's university. In fact, Falwell should give them free tuition to attend, if they're that upset over what they're being taught.

If their panties are in such a twist, why aren't they in Iraq? Why aren't they in the military?

[tsuki]

97. Can you imagine a student complaining @ Falwell or Bob Jones?

[maxsolomon]

92. i smell a david horowitz

and it ain't a good smell

[Hobarticus]

102. Is this the Anti-Frivilous Lawsuit Party?

If I were a professor in Indiana, and this came down the pike, I'd leave.

[salin]

104. Mark my words... it goes down the pike - and lots of Vitas are being

revised and issues of the Chronicle of Higher Education job postings scoured...

[Redleg]

105. Fucking David Whore-o-witz. I'll rip out his eyes and piss on his brain.

This shit scares me. I am a professor- I am a liberal, I try to steer away from politics but my values inform my teaching.