Sex probe men commit suicide

[emad]

Gulf Daily News

LONDON: Thirty-two men have committed suicide following their arrests in connection with Britain's biggest probe into child pornography, a newspaper reported yesterday.

Many were family men who stood to lose their jobs and marriages if convicted of paedophile offences and could not cope with the shame of arrest, the mass circulation Daily Mail tabloid reported.

The newspaper said the men were among thousands of suspects held during Operation Ore, the British end of a US investigation launched in 2002 into a pay-per-vew child pornography website based in Texas.

So far 7,200 Britons have been identified, with 3,729 of them arrested, it added. Some 1,600 have been charged and 1,200 convicted, it added.

http://www.gulf-daily-news.com/Story.asp?Article=99533&Sn=WORL&IssueID=27277

[rkc3]

1. Child porn in Texas? The bastion of Christian morality? Say it ain't so.

[BUSHOUT]

33. Texas is a cesspool. God will visit awful disasters upon that land if

there is a God.

[Mist]

2. THIRTY-TWO?!?!

Thirty-two suicides? Is this for real?

[MarianJack]

4. If They're "Good God-fearin' Texas Republicans",...

than it must be art!

[Mr Creosote]

5. Unfortunately it is true

according to the BBC most of the suicides are amongst those who haven't even been charged with anything. Innocent until proven guilty? The police officer in charge of this investigation was repeatedly asked on the radio this morning to justify the public outing of these men but couldn't. But then in Grubby Bliar's Britain having no evidence against you doesn't matter.

[Turbineguy]

6. So much for

The Golden Thread

[AP]

7. That's sort of like blaming Clinton for "America's Most Wanted"

But I'd like to see more information before I make a judgment.

[Stella_Artois]

36. To be fair

These people are in the frame because their credit cards were used to pay for child porn and more often than not police later found such on their home computers. They may not be proved guilty as yet, but thats only because their trials have not come up yet. This is not a case of them being accused by a child or other adult that may result in the acusations being proved false.

The papers don't leak names of the accused, they leak names of the convicted who are on the child offenders register.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

39. Pray to God then that your Credit Card Number never gets hijacked

and used for nefarious purposes.

You could be in the Newspapers and Faux News before you got a bill to dispute the charges.

Oh, what a wonderful world.

[AliciaKeyedUp]

41. You left out a key point

It's not just the credit card number, it's finding evidence on your computer. The first can happen to anyone, but if you are surfing kiddie porn at home, then you need to be locked up.

[SemperEadem]

43. if you have it on your computer, then your CC hasn't been hijacked

nice try.

[rooboy]

10. Yes... there have been about 6 in Australia in the same investigation.

Once you're outed for this sort of stuff - especially when the UK tabloids publish your name and address - you're as good as dead anyway.

[BiggJawn]

12. Murkan press isn't much better..

They splash your face and name all over town when you're arrested, but after the charges are dropped they report that fact (if at all) on the back page.

[Sara Beverley]

21. So how many Americans are involved? Bet they won't suicide.

I bet $1 that some card-carrying Christian conservatives were among this group.

[Old Mouse]

17. Probably 32 prison suicides

the type that come with the assistance of other inmates.

[Florida_Geek]

3. Hey pediphiles,,,, I have Ciddie Porn just

give me your credit card number and mailing address </stupid off>

How stupid can you get.....

[manly]

9. how stupid can you get?

Stupid enough to elect George two times!

[davidinalameda]

8. hate to say it but that's 32 less preditors

these people really make me question my opposition to the death penalty

anyone who hurts a child is evil

[rooboy]

11. Many (maybe even most) of these people never touch kids.

But I do agree that it's pretty sick. In some of the cases where people were caught in Australia, the people concerned sought psychiatric help before the police turned up at their doors. So I don't know for sure, but some of them seem to know they have a big problem.

[tblue37]

23. They don't have to touch the kids themselves.

If they are providing a market for kiddie porn, then they are complicit when those who make the pictures and videos harm the children.

[rooboy]

28. Please don't insult me by suggesting that I'm defending the behavior.

The poster called them predators. They are sick, but it is wrong to automatically call these people predators.

[AliciaKeyedUp]

38. No it's not

They are predators. They provide a market for kiddie porn. That means they take advantage of little children. I can almost forgive murderers more easily.

I personally, can't muster a lot of sympathy. I'll do my best and pray for them. But if their type ever comes near my children, only heaven will help them.

[Megahurtz]

13. I hate to say it again, but

dudes like this need to get whacked......

seriously something wrong with the hormones tied to the brain.:crazy:

[George_S]

14. I'm against the death penalty...

... but like most people I have my exceptions.

Right wing whackos should get whacked.

[rooboy]

15. Or something seriously wrong with what happened to them as kids.

Tell me, at what age do they stop being victims and start being criminals? 8? 10? 15? 17?

I have as much contempt for the "kill 'em" crowd as I do for the act of pedophilia. It's just an excuse to do NOTHING about the mental illness that is the REAL problem.

[Megahurtz]

16. Just to clarify

just in case I'm being misunderstood, being whacked means removing their male genitals so they cannot hurt anyone again. Sometimes their out of place hormones along with other variables make wackos wonky.:crazy:
I'm not being cruel, but what are they???

[jellybelly]

20. what the...

I am more concerned about the little boys and girls who get raped everyday to fulfill the needs of these poor bastards who maybe, or maybe not were abused as kids.

[MrSlayer]

18. Good. That's what they deserve.

Harsh? Maybe. But that's what I think. These are some of the lowest forms of life on Earth. Murder can be justified but preying on children can never be excused.

[jellybelly]

19. Child porn lovers commit suicide

If they're guilty (which they obviously are, you don't commit suicide if you know there's a chance your name will be cleared) I hope they are rotting in hell.

[George_S]

24. Obviously?

And who said anything about anyone getting raped? If you take an innocent picture of your child in the tub, that's porn. People have been busted for it. If you send it to someone, they can get busted.

By your standards you and the person you sent it to deserve death.

[Sara Beverley]

22. Nothing about this in the mainstream. What happened with "Candyman"

Operation Candyman was the US arm of this investigation. Must be some pretty prominant people involved because the investigation has been swept under the carpet since 2003. Could Larry Flynt get the goods on who is involved and who has been charged? Shouldn't those proven guilty be put on the sexual predator list?

[Eugene]

25. The FBI bungled Operation Candyman.

If I recall correctly, Judges threw many
of the Operation Candyman cases out.
Many of the Candyman visitors turned
out to be innocent, or evidence of
guilt did not exist. The Candyman
site was was not all child porn.

Those who pleaded guilty early on are
still doing time. Those who faught
the charges where still free when
last I heard.

If Operation Ore casts as wide a net
as Candyman, these suspects should
be presumed innocent until proven guilty.

[KingoftheJungle]

26. Just for the sake of argument...

what if pedophilia is a genetically linked trait? Most of us agree that homosexuality appears to have a genetic basis, but why not pedophilia? Do you still believe these men would deserve the death penalty for attmpting to purchase child pornography if their deviant lusts were based on a geneticically determined anomoly? Why?

[C_eh_N_eh_D_eh]

29. Then it's a gene we can do without.

People who enjoy the violation of children (either as a spectator or as a participant) have no place in human society. Period.

See, the difference between a genetic predisposition toward homosexuality, and a predisposition toward sexual predation, is that the former involves urges that can be acted upon without harming anyone. If you feel attracted to people of the same gender as yourself, then you can feel free to pursue a homosexual relationship with another consenting person; no harm there to you or anyone else. But someone with the urge to rape women or molest children is a different story, because that urge *cannot* be fulfilled without hurting someone. Such a person must either repress their destructive urges, or risk being removed from society, in all senses of the word. Whether or not it's actually their fault is ultimately academic.

I know it sounds cruel and heartless. It is, but that's the way the world is sometimes. I believe there are certain traits in humanity that we absolutely must either repress or excise if we're ever to move forward, and sexual sadism is one of the big ones.

[CoffeeCat]

27. Typical of perpetrators...

It's so typical of perpetrators to commit suicide. I can't tell you how many times I've heard of child molesters who killed themselves when their victims came forward. They didn't even wait to be charged with a crime or for a trial to happen.

Make no mistake, if these guys were looking at child pornography, they were engaging in child molestation if they had access to children. My guess is that these men knew that the truth about their lives would come crashing down upon them very soon.

The denial these men live in is so thick--it's almost unbelievable. The denial serves to protect them against the pain of what they endured as a child--and also the crimes that they act out against children. When that denial is broken--it's like a ton of bricks hitting their psyche.

I'm glad that law enforcement is rooting out these insidious crimes against children. I hope to God some of the children in the pictures can be identified and helped. They are truly the real victims in this story. If they are not healed--many of them will become perpetrators themselves.

So sad--from every angle.

[oscarmitre]

30. But is there a causal link?

Interesting. In my experience - admittedly limited - paedophiles tend to use pornography - not child porn but the XXX stuff - to seduce their victims. Most paedophiles also deny they're doing anything wrong, they rationalise that they were doing the child a favour or they were seduced by the victim. As I said, defensive rationalisation. Some of the worst offenders are actually quite defiant and will use taxpayers money to defend themselves or appeal against sentence (google Robert "Dolly" Dunn) a notorious convicted Australian paedophile.

Perhaps these possessors of child porn aren't so much paedophiles as porn addicts. Of course the industry should be busted wide open, the makers/purveyors of this stuff should hit the can for many years, international laws should be standardised (it's not against the law in Thailand to possess child porn, it is illegal to trade in it though. People who use it should be dealt with but I doubt if they're the people we really want behind bars. I'll be interested to read anything that links use of child porn with activities against children.

[imenja]

32. Why read child porn if they don't have tendencies toward pedophilia?

Whose else would be aroused by child porn but a pedophile? The rest of us would be horrified at the sight of it. Whether or not the person has acted on his fantasies is another question, but to even imagine something like that is dangerously perverse.

[lovuian]

31. This has to say Men are quite sick!!! Incredible Evil here!!!

I mean 7200 thats alot of sick SOB's!!!

[George_S]

40. Men? Give it time.

Davis' Apology Sheds No Light on Sterilizations in California
Lack of an inquiry into the state's ambitious eugenics effort and its 20,000 victims angers some historians and disabled advocates.

By Aaron Zitner
Times Staff Writer
Copyright 2003 Los Angeles Times
March 16, 2003

WASHINGTON -- To make amends for a state program that sterilized 7,600 people against their will, North Carolina's governor created a panel last year to probe the history of the effort, interview survivors and consider reparations.

In Oregon, then-Gov. John Kitzhaber last year apologized in person to some of the 2,600 people sterilized there, and he created an annual Human Rights Day to commemorate the state's mistake. On the day Virginia Gov. Mark R. Warner apologized, Jesse Meadows and other victims unveiled a roadside marker.

"It felt pretty good to be there, even though it was so late," said Meadows, 80.

Some historians and advocates for the disabled had a mixed reaction to the apology issued Tuesday by Gov. Gray Davis for California's policy, the most aggressive in the nation, which sterilized an estimated 20,000 mentally disabled people and others from 1909 through the 1960s.

http://www.geocities.com/madelinefelkins/CAeugenics.htm

Hitler started with the Gays:

Paragraph 175 (1999)

There is an ethereal, poetic, bold and unforgettable moment in "Paragraph 175" where a concentration camp survivor, one who seems to be getting a bit slow and senile in his old age, talks briefly of "The Singing Forest." This is his heart- stopping and devastating description of the sounds prisoners made while being tortured in the camps. It is a harrowing and indescribable moment in film. Truly a lucid yet expressive instant in cinema that will overwhelm the viewer with an emotional reaction of deep sorrow and heart-wrenching empathy. It is not that the incident being related is a fresh insight to the horrors that occurred at concentration camps. So much has been related that we understand the repugnance of it all. Rather, it is a bold and vivid moment because the teller of the story is so unique. Through an aged and slowed existence, a memory, the sorrowful beauty of that memory, and the poignant recollection of the teller, glides through to light on our consciousness on wings of gossamer. It becomes they saddest of songs, the most beautiful of poems, the most honest of moments. It transcends. It is light.

The title of "Paragraph 175" refers to the law in Nazi Germany that made homosexuality an illegal act. Although this film barely scratches the surface on the story of homosexuals in concentration camps in WWII, it does open a door to a deep and troubling history that we, as gay men and lesbians, must explore and remember. Sidelined with a hatred equal to, albeit nowhere near as rampant as, the persecution of Jews, homosexuals were considered criminals and antisocials who were not welcome in the Third Reich's new world order. Many of them perished in the camps.

Here, a researcher, Dr. Klaus Muller, takes on the monumental task of trying to interview the surviving men and women who were persecuted in Nazi Germany under "Paragraph 175." This is an extremely difficult and arduous task because not only are the subjects considerably old, they are from a different time, a vastly different generation, where discussions of such things do not come easily. This is in addition to the troubling and difficult notion of having these wonderful older gentleman and ladies dredge up severely painful and complex emotional memories that they would much rather be allowed to forget. It adds up to an almost insurmountable obstacle for a historian.

This film, with it's wonderful insight to the history of Berlin in the 20's, the rise of Hitler and the onset of WWII, somehow does find it easy to capture some moments of these octogenarians discussing their playful dalliances and early love affairs. There is even some knowledge and memories imparted of the early "athletic" clubs and "naturists" movements of pre-Hitler Germany. But when it comes time to discuss the moments and memories of surviving the most horrific of crimes against man, these wonderful, brave, and beautiful people cannot seem to find the words to truly express themselves. Sadly, there is a sense of shame which is obvious in their failed recollections. And while we, as modern gay men and lesbians, certainly understand these feelings, we cannot begin to truly comprehend them. Nor can we find the words to somehow make them magically go away.

http://www.filethirteen.com/reviews/paragraph175/paragraph175.htm

Seeing the posts here about the promotion of death for what sometimes amounts to thought crimes, we are not not far removed from Hitler. Give it time. Maybe you will be on the list eventually.

[bunkerbuster1]

34. Use of the world "Sex" in headline speaks volumes

You'd think they'd refer to it as a "Violence" probe, but no... gotta sell them papers.

Now THAT'S truly sick.

[DemBones DemBones]

37. "Perversion" is a better description. "Child sex" sounds

too much like NAMBLA propaganda.

Pedophiles are sick bastards, and the sickness is most likely either genetic or learned at an early age, but they still must be controlled.

[bunkerbuster1]

42. nah. "perversion" carries way too much baggage.

ironically, the word "perversion" has become perverted.

[sherilocks]

35. Blair gov't link alleged in 2003 child-sex scandal (old article)

Blackout in Britain
Alleged Pedophiles Helm Blair's War Room


A child-sex scandal that threatened to destroy Tony Blair's government last week has been mysteriously squashed and wiped off the front pages of British newspapers. Operation Ore, the United Kingdom's most thorough and comprehensive police investigation of crimes against children, seems to have uncovered more than is politically acceptable at the highest reaches of the British elite. In the 19th of January edition of The Sunday Herald, Neil Mackay sensationally reported that senior members of Tony Blair's government were being investigated for paedophilia and the "enjoyment" of child-sex pornography:

<snip>


http://www.counterpunch.org/james01292003.html