Parents Protest Student Computer ID Tags

[rainbow4321]

http://www.lasvegassun.com/sunbin/stories/tech/2005/feb/10/021005227.html

The only grade school in this rural town is requiring students to wear radio frequency identification badges that can track their every move. Some parents are outraged, fearing it will take away their children's privacy.


The system was imposed, without parental input, by the school as a way to simplify attendance-taking and potentially reduce vandalism and improve student safety. Principal Earnie Graham hopes to eventually add bar codes to the existing ID's so that students can use them to pay for cafeteria meals and check out library books

Graham, who also serves as the superintendent of the single-school district, told the parents that their children could be disciplined for boycotting the badges - and that he doesn't understand what all their angst is about.

Each student is required to wear identification cards around their necks with their picture, name and grade and a wireless transmitter that beams their ID number to a teacher's handheld computer when the child passes under an antenna posted above a classroom door

[GiovanniC]

1. Big Brother Is Watching You

This is a very, very bad idea.

[Briarius]

3. There's no freedom there to start with

this is just automation on attendance. I don't understand the knee-jerk hate of RFID. It has the possibility in some circumstances for privacy abuse, but most people seem to blow it way out of proportion. They're not going to track your every move unless there's a reader every couple feet or so.

[Protagoras]

8. Perhaps the Knee-jerk hate comes from

the huge and obvious "POTENTIAL" for abuse that has been shown to be the standard operating procedure of our current administration.

Technology isn't evil. But it's application obviously can be. And we currently live in a place where if it can be twisted, it will be. Why should we be even more trusting today?

I see very little benefit in setting a precedence that allows further intrusions into my private space, but I see great risks...kinda like taking my life savings and gambling it all on the lottery...just doesn't seem like very good odds to me given what I've seen going on lately.

A great example of how this works is pacified compliance that I see growing every time I walk thru an airport. What at first seems intolerable eventually becomes commonplace...at which point you're able to ratchet everything up again. At some point you have to stop.

Liberty ebbs by degrees.

[Briarius]

12. How is this different in your opinion

from the teacher visually taking attendance, issuing hall passes, ect. If there's a hall monitor then how is this any different? The things are ugly though: http://www.incomcorporation.com/Default.htm

[Protagoras]

33. The difference is mainly the difference in the direction

of the slope. In one case it's humans interacting and taking personal responsibility in an established and common way that is relatively easy to note and limit.

In the other case we are depersonalizing people on both ends, and establishing a mindset in which it's acceptable to chip people and micro-track their movements. Sometimes it's not the thing in itself, but the thing it may become that you have to pay attention to.

Teachers taking attendance is part of their TEACHING. A computer tracking your movements is not. In fact, it's a very active step toward allowing teachers to abdicate a large part of their relational responsibility. If the teachers don't need to take an active interest in who is in their class, what do they need to take an interest in?

A better question is, where do we draw the line to stop intrusions into the micro-tracking of our lives? Yep there are grey areas, so which side do we want, as a culture, to err on?

[nolabels]

11. To fill in the gaps when they don't know where you are on camera

You fail to realize the other parallels that are encroaching and this is just another step. At the rate they are going with this technology they will have RFID to keep track of everything(part of the ownership society). My guess is (if we ever make it that far) is that they will plant these things deep in the cortex of someones brain at birth so they could not be removed very easy. Say 20 or so years from now they will have the computer capacity and technology to keep track 24/7 of most any person in the USA and not have to lift a finger.



Across London, these posters can be seen telling us all that we are 'Secure beneath The Watchful Eyes' of the Metropolitan Police. I cannot tell you how much better that makes me feel. The imagery is pure 1930's/1940's and conjurers up the 'Golden Age of Totalitarianism'.

Britain is already a Police State in so far as the means for total repression are already well and truly in place. As the poster indicates all too well, Britain is the nation most under surveillance on Earth, Echelon monitors our domestic communications, our Internet usage is logged for years due to the Draconian RIP Act, our locations detected via our mobile phones and logged, all for the apparatus of state to access on very low level authority. Civilians are not just deprived of any firearms, in reality we are forbidden to defend ourselves and our property with so much as a broom stick. Our right to trial by Jury faces abridgment, even our ancient protection of Habeas Corpus is now a dead letter under European extradition laws.
(snip)

http://www.samizdata.net/blog/archives/002285.html

[Briarius]

14. Paranoid much?

wow, where to begin

1. they will have RFID to keep track of everything(part of the ownership society) I'm assuming you're worried about corporate goons reading the tags on things you buy in your house. Max range for an active tag is 3m and the tags on things you buy aren't active, they're passive, meaning even less range. So unless you let them in, no worries on that. Besides they get more info cross-referencing your credit card number with what you buy along with those nice customer cards that lots of places use.
   
   
2. RFID implants deep in the cortex of someones brain :crazy: Since this would be a passive tag embedded in a very lossy medium (tissue is very lossy for RF), you'd just about have to have your head against the reader for the tag to work. Aside from that, this is a total straw man.
   
   
3. London cameras this is germane how?
   
   

[nolabels]

19. When they amp the war footing with a war on Iran come back and talk some..

Hell yea, :crazy:

But really, understanding what you are seeing and where it is going is what it is all about. At 46, a good portion of my life has been lived. The people at the helm running around in the white house have shown no sign of gearing down, so why should I and the rest of us crazies. (fire at will, I am being defensive)
(These post will probably be delete soon but I will write anyway)

Yea, everything is okay, no need to think about the $1,000.00 per capita that Bush just spent on a frivolous invasion of Iraq, or 9/11 or how these folks took over the government or thousands of others things that they are going to be screwing all of us over later with, yea, don't worry, be happy.

My brother always told me that shit too, I feared for him, but he is now passed away(long story).

My message, don't be stupid, wake up, look around and smell the coffee

ON Edit: Are you ready for the draft?

September 20, 2002
Chomsky on Loss of Civil Liberties
Always so clear in his analyses of the way things are, Chomsky almost sounds a note of hopefulness in an Interview with Noam Chomsky by Dimitriadis Epaminondas at Zmag.org. And hopefulness is not something you hear a lot of from Chomsky.

When Chomsky sounds a note of hope, you know it is based on a hard cold look at the facts and the processes that are at work.

Here's what he says in answer to the question "How far do you belive will the US sacrifice its basic civil liberties for a greater sense of security?"

It is doubtful that the current attack on civil liberties has much to do with security. In general, one can expect the state to use any pretext to extend its power and to impose obedience on the population; rights are won, not granted, and power will seek any opportunity to reduce them. The current incumbents in Washington are at an extreme of reactionary jingoism and contempt for democracy. The question we should ask, I think, is how far citizens will allow them to pursue their agendas. So far, they have been careful to target vulnerable populations, like immigrants, though the laws they have passed have much broader implications. My feeling is that popular commitment to the rights that have been won in hard struggle is too deep to allow the attack to proceed very far. -- Noam Chomsky July 3, 2002 Interviewed by Dimitriadis Epaminondas

The Bush administration, the representatives of the hardest core corporate ruling class, has been putting intense pressure on the population since it took over in December 2000. They are now amping up their war plans, their thirst for blood has has only been whetted by their exploits in Afghanistan. They are moving forward with their plans to attack Iraq -- plans that have been in place, in writing, since before the coup in December 2000.

So far most Americans have been able to proceed with their lives as though nothing had changed, even though the administration has told them the nation is at war. But as the administration moves inexorably forward with its war agenda, people will have to make more and more sacrifices. As the oligarchy increases its need for manpower to fight wars, it may try to institute a draft. Gradually more and more people will be affected directly by the war agenda. Eventually it will hit its limit and the people will resist. That moment could be approaching.

-- By David Cogswell
(snip)
http://www.davidcogswell.com/MediaRoulette/ChomskyLiberties.html

With another 4 years the possibilty of someone in another country blinking (provacation for war) will probably happen and then speaking against a draft will probably be mute. They want to scare you, so you do thier will. Denial of reality often brings reality into your lap, watch and see

[Briarius]

20. I know what I'm seeing

A start-up with connections to the school gets a sweetheart deal to implement it's new product. I agree how they went about getting the system and setting it up is shady. I agree the principal is a ass for not telling or listening to parents, but this isn't the end of freedom. More than likely with this bad PR, the company and idea are going under, but I don't see how this is worse than how the school system already is. There are lots of ways schools are inefficient and horrible. I see this ID system as something that will make teacher's lives easier, something that they generally need.
The world is a fucked-up, ugly place and it seems to be getting worse. I think we need to realize though that not everything is meant to be an attack on our freedoms. I'd wager the principal ran with the idea on good intentions. It just seems he has no PR skills and is very bad at explaining his position.

[nolabels]

24. Crazy people think everything is connected but................

in the world we are now living in they actually seem to be. Really this is all I was trying say. I was a bit acrimonious in the post above but for a minute there......... or forget it.

Most things are not meant to be evil, but evil or arrogant people turn them into them things

You say "The world is a fucked-up, ugly place and it seems to be getting worse." but many of us are like moths to a flame. I have learned to be careful with this place or the whole of any agenda in general. It can get you into down spiral to where you don't see forest because of the tree in the way. There is much still worth saving and you should enjoy what's out there while it's still there. I check out often from here and live like the others. It gives you perspective. We can only work with what we have and not from what we wish we had to work with

[GiovanniC]

15. My Concern Is For The Obvious Progression I See

We allow the cameras, then we get the automated radio ID monitors. From there we get GPS trackers to get a fix on people wherever they go anywhere in the world.

[GHOSTDANCER]

31. You ever heard of a little o thing called a satellite?

[atommom]

2. Is the school LEGALLY able to do this? Sounds like a job for the ACLU.

[meganmonkey]

4. "he doesn't understand what all their angst is about." !!!?!

OMG - how much Kool Aid did HE drink?!

This is creepy as hell. :wtf:

[Solly Mack]

5. Money

"This latest adaptation of radio frequency ID technology was developed by InCom Corp., a local company co-founded by the parent of a former Brittan student, and some parents are suspicious about the financial relationship between the school and the company. InCom plans to promote it at a national convention of school administrators next month.

InCom has paid the school several thousand dollars for agreeing to the experiment, and has promised a royalty from each sale if the system takes off, said the company's co-founder, Michael Dobson, who works as a technology specialist in the town's high school. Brittan's technology aide also works part-time for InCom. "

[Vladimir]

13. I'm shocked, shocked I tell ya!

Where does all this end anyhow - when we can track everyone 24/7? The idea is plainly ridiculous. I don't care how much it simplifies X,Y and Z (and I am a physicist, so hardly some technophobe), society has to draw a line on the issue of privacy somewhere. If I was a parent at that school, I would be removing my kid from it if at all feasible...

[Solly Mack]

16. I agree on all accounts...and I was just as "shocked"

[SoCalDem]

22. "Michael Dobson" ???? spawn of Focus in the Family's Dobson???

These groups are intricately intertwined, so it would not surprise me :)

Anyone know the names of the children of "Rev Dobson"???

[CanOfWhoopAss]

6. So what happens when the kids...

lose them? Who pays for the replacement?

What if kids swap them or take another kid's badge and does something bad so it appears someone else did it?

Is it clipped on or is it something worn around the neck that a kid could hang himself with. If a little kid can hang himself with window blinds why not these things?

What else can go wrong with this?

[Redneck Socialist]

7. Holy bags of poop

This is wrong on so many levels I don't know where to begin. Indoctrination begins early. Privacy? We don't need no stinking privacy!

[atreides1]

9. Excuse Me

He wants to add bar codes so that the students can pay for meals and to check out library books?

Does anyone else get the "Mark of the Beast", feeling?

Where are the "Xtians" to protest against this?

Just thought I'd bring it up.

[Redstone]

10. Do the parents own hammers?

If enough of them work the cards over and crush the chips, the school will give up.

(Or a nice big magnet oughta do it.)

Redstone

[atommom]

17. If my kids were in this school I'd have gotten the big magnet out

immediately! Oh, and raised holy hell about it too. :mad:

[Lugnut]

18. If one of those children were mine

I'd have a place for the superintendant to shove that transmitter.

[truthisfreedom]

21. a couple of seconds in the microwave should take care of those RFID chips.

fzzzzt!

[Nashyra]

23. I wonder if this will come up at the School Board Convention

in April. It is the National Convention for School Board members. Beleive me if this comes up in my district i will lead the fight against it. First and foremost parents should always be aware of any kind of major change going on at any school, especially at an elementary school. I don't know about the rule that kids must wear ID's on campus? Any visitor or adult must have an ID visible on an outside garment for safety reason. but kids? This guy is stepping way out of bounds IMHO and of course it will be interesting to ee if he attends this conference since he is also the superintendent>

[Minstrel Boy]

25. School RFID Plan Gets an F

School RFID Plan Gets an F

10:15 AM Feb. 10, 2005 PT

Parents of elementary and middle school students in a small California town are protesting a tracking program their school recently launched, which requires students to wear identification badges embedded with radio frequency, or RFID, chips.

School superintendents struck a deal with a local maker of the technology last year to test the system to track attendance and weed out trespassers.

But students and parents, who weren't told about the RFID chips until they complained, are upset over what they say are surreptitious tactics the school used to implement the program. They also question the ethics of a monetary deal the school made with the company to test and promote its product, using students as guinea pigs.

"This is not right for our kids," said Michele Tatro, whose daughter received a badge. "I'm not willing for anybody to track me and I don't think my children should be tracked, either."
http://www.wired.com/news/privacy/0,1848,66554,00.html?tw=wn_tophead_2

[Rainscents]

26. I hope they all stands to gether and bring this down!!!

[GHOSTDANCER]

27. They are protesting.... protesting in GW's America whahahaha good luck

They must like the taste of tear gas. They must like the shock from tasers. They must like billy clubs upside the head. They must like being herded around like cattle. They must like rubber bullet bruises. they must not know that the constitution is dead. They must be reading 10 year old history books.

Protesting.. ya right...

Didn't even tell them that they were being RFID'd... Fucking amazing

[NYC Liberal]

28. And if they don't wear the tags?

TASER 'EM!

(I'm not sure if that should be sarcastic or not...)

[Ian David]

29. When they do this, they create the next generation of liberal activists

Just wait until The Virginia Underwear Party of 2005, too!

[mudderfudder77]

30. If you send your kid to public school

then you shouldn't have a problem with the school doing everything in their power to monitor students. Whats the difference between this and a school with hall monitors? Once the child leaves the school the id tags are useless.

[CornField]

32. Hey -- sounds like easy skippin' to me!

Just have your friend stick your card in his backpack... you'll do the same for him next week. No fuss... no muss. Meet ya under the bleachers.