Some in U.S. want a pope who will consider female and married clerics

[emad]

Posted on Fri, Apr. 15, 2005

Some in U.S. want a pope who will consider female and married clerics

BY PAUL NUSSBAUM

Knight Ridder Newspapers


PHILADELPHIA - (KRT) - With a growing shortage of priests and continuing fallout from the sex-abuse scandal, many American Catholics believe the next pope should reconsider the ban on married priests and female priests.

At the same time, Catholic leaders are awaiting a Vatican document outlining whether homosexuals should continue to be admitted to the priesthood.

"The pressures are building up," said Dean Hoge, a sociology professor at the Catholic University of America and author of "The Future of Catholic Leadership." "Priests are saying, `We can't go on like this,' and the people are saying, `Don't we count?' The laity is unhappy, the priests are unhappy, the bishops are unhappy."

Change would have to come from the Vatican, which showed little interest under Pope John Paul II or his predecessors in revamping the rules of the priesthood. The issue now falls to John Paul's successor.

http://www.kansascity.com/mld/kansascity/news/nation/11402433.htm

[oldtime dfl_er]

1. it's just ludicrous that women can't be Catholic priests

the whole rationale behind women not being able to be priests is no different from the Rapture business -- made-up bs for the sake of worldly profit (power, etc). It's amazing to me that we aren't beyond this kind of intentional misinterpretation. Humans are so stupid.

www.cafepress.com/blackoutbush

[Javaman]

2. They can hope all they want, but it ain't going to happen...

With rumors of a more conservitive pope, it's a pipe dream at best.

[grumpy old fart]

3. Like Opus Dei cares what the U.S. laity thinks...

The world is going fundie, and to hell in a handbasket also....

[Patiod]

4. And where exactly are US priests going to come from?

No women, now no homosexuals (there goes a large percent, and I'm being sincere, not snarky), no married men, an aging "priest workforce" and a rapidly declining number of new vocations.

At first, you're going to see one priest as pastor of several parishes, but what then? Imported priests? Offshoring somehow?

I wonder if these population forces are going to move the Church, however unwillingly, into more "quasi-ordinations" - making married men into "deacons" who will take over a lot of the functions of parish priests. This way they will have married priests, but they won't have to either admit it or support them.

[cap]

7. the priests are going to come from extremely conservative

Catholic families...

With faith-based initiatives, the priests will become the "landed gentry" and well-connected with the "movers and the shakers" of the
community especially in rural areas. People will see this as a means
of social mobility since the old industries and education no longer
guarantee improvement in one's lot in life.

[JerseygirlCT]

9. I believe "imported" priests are already quite a reality

here in the US.

[pelagius]

10. The Church does have married priests!

They're ordained ministers from other churches (Anglican and Orthodox, mostly) who convert to Catholicism. They can keep their families and ministries. But if you start out Catholic, you're out of luck!

[youspeakmylanguage]

13. Simple solution: The church will import more priests...

...most likely from the areas of the globe where Catholicism is growing.

[LostinVA]

15. Some will be married

There are quite a few married RC priests in the US. Episcopalian priests who are married already and convert to Catholicism, for example. The Church is just really quiet about it.

[megatherium]

16. they're already ordaining married men as priests.

The trick is to become an Episcopalian priest first, or a Lutheran minister, then become Roman Catholic. If you're already married, they'll still ordain you a Roman Catholic priest, and you are allowed to have sexual relations with your wife (but if she happens to pass away, you're not allowed to remarry). There are already hundreds of these priests serving in the US church.

Importing priests would be tough: there are shortages in other places too, such as Latin America.

[Bob3]

5. "Don't we count?"

"The laity is unhappy, the priests are unhappy, the bishops are unhappy"

Sorry no you don't count. Your job is to obey the head of the church and the Curia without question. The papacy became even more autocratic under John Paul II and, barring a bloody unlikely miracle, that won't change.

[cap]

6. the hierarchy wont care...

they have sold their parishioners to Bush for 3 pieces of gold (aka faith-based initiatives)

[robcon]

8. Surveys show a huge majority of Catholics favor the changes.

After all, for about 1,000 yers, until about 1100 A.D, married poriests were more common than unmarried priests. And the ordination of women is also favored.

[LisaM]

11. I'm guessing they will put in a conservative but very old Pope

who won't be there long - change will start behind the scenes - as it simply MUST - I cannot bring myself to even go to church now, but I still consider myself a Catholic and always will - and that within a few years, we will have another new Pope who will move the church to a more progressive place in a studied manner. I could be wrong, but that's my intuition. I think that if nothing else, "The Da Vinci Codes" did the church a huge favor (whether they think so now or not) by exposing the absolute cancer that is Opus Dei.

[Patiod]

12. Why must change come?

I was listening to an interview with a priest who basically said that the guys in seminary went one of two ways: the more rigid, uptight, conservatives started their climb up the political ladder, and the more humanistic, "feeling" type guys ended up as parish priests and pastors. So the conservatives self-select into the hierarchy.

Other than lack of vocations, what's the impetus to change? Maybe lay people withholding cash (see Boston), but that's all I can think of. The current system rewards only those who hold tightly to the traditional values and disdain change, so where are change-makers going to come from?

[LisaM]

21. I think it will come because it has to

The fundamentalist will be the ones to split off.

[LostinVA]

17. Honestly? I doubt change will come. I think the US Church

And probably the Canadian, and maybe Western European Churches will split off. I know alot of conservative Hispanic immigrants are coming into the US, but that won't change this. Most Catholics I know (including most of my family), are quite liberal. My Mother has started going to a Unitarian church, because of the anti-woman, anti-gay stance of the Church.

[pelagius]

18. We see many, many former Roman Catholics...

...come into the Episcopal Church for those reasons or because of divorce and remarriage issues. Lots of former "Call to Action" people in my ECUSA congregation.

[LostinVA]

14. Five out of Seven priests I knew well were gay

Seriously. I taught CCD for just about six years, and five of seven were. And yes, I am sure of it. I'm gay myself, have excellent gaydar, and years of working closely with them gave me the opportunity to talk to them about it. Most entered the priesthood because they did have a call to do it, but they also felt it was the only place for them:: they "couldn't" marry because that wouldn't be fair to the woman, and they couldn't have a BF, because then they would go to Hell.

[NashVegas]

19. Can We PLEASE NOT Tie the Celibacy Issue to Child Abuse?

I'm sorry, but I'm just so fucking sick of this. My turn to rant: people who use the sexual abuse scandal to push for a social agenda that includes married, openly homosexual, and female priests should just be taken out back and shot at dawn. Same goes for those who want to blame it on homosexuals and wants the church to force them out.

For the first two groups, there is a perfectly good, medical argument out there for discarding celibacy: its effects on the prostate gland.

Use it. If you want to effect a chance that will impact millions of people, stop using those whose lives have already been rocked enough.

[LostinVA]

20. I 100% agree with you

There are many, many wonderful priests in the Catholic Church. And, being celibate doesn't cause someone to rape ANYONE, child or adult. Being a sociopath does. Excuse my language, but all celibacy does is make you whack off alot.

[maxsolomon]

22. i'm getting very weary of "Some Say"

that aside, i could give a fuck if the ghost of the roman empire dies out in america from its own retarded anachronistic stupidity.

yes i was raised catholic.

[davhill]

23. I've heard that John Paul I

was leaning toward married priests and a larger role for nuns in the church. Unfortunately he only lasted a few weeks before he was replaced by the more conservative Polish John Paul II.